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My language reveals that I live in a country with a beautiful thing called a First Amendment Right, MOTHERFUCKER!Your language reveals that you are a child. Grow up and stop disgracing the uniform. Act like a grown man.
Then what reason do you suppose you have to thank me? I certainly don't owe you any thanks.Mike,
Thank you for serving our country.....and when I tell you (or anyone else) that, I am NOT being "patronizing", or saying "better you than me", because I have been there, done that.
So you compromised your safety and your future to accommodate some anonymous junior who probably would be pulled in at some point, anyway. Didn't you have anything to live for? A wife? A girl who loved you? Your mother? Someone who would be anguished if you were killed or crippled. How would you explain your action to them?I joined up in 1962, before I went to college, so by the time things heated up in Vietnam, I had finished my active obligation, and was still in the Reserve. I could have avoided Vietnam; all I had to do was not re-up and apply for OCS. I could have let some kid with less experience do the fighting (and maybe the dying) for me, but you know what-after all I've been through, I am damn glad I didn't, and I'd do it again. I'd do it again, because it would not have felt right to do otherwise, not to me.
There were some extremists in the protest movement who voiced such opinions. But that level of protest didn't begin until news of My Lai and other atrocities started leaking and the public began to realize there was no justifiable reason for our presence in Vietnam.Some call me a "war criminal" for that. Some say I "must love war".
I don't know about peace at any price but as far as Vietnam was concerned we should have gotten out of there much sooner.Bullshit. I hate war, but there's something I hate more-the idea of "peace at any price". So go ahead and call me an "indoctrinated militarist", or whatever else you damn well choose; I don't care, and I've been called worse. I know what I was fighting for, and I don't need or want anyone else telling me how I "should" feel about it.
By the way, I am a 'three-time volunteer", but I am no hero, never thought I was, or wanted to be. I am a survivor. You want heroes, go look on the Wall; you can find their names right there.
It's clear you're just an ignorant troll. I neither like nor dislike 'vets'. 'Verts' is a huge group of persons, some likeable and some not- some honourable and some not.It's obvious you dislike vets.
Unlike you, I judge people as individuals. Some people are honourable and some are not. Some wars are justified and some are not. Some actions are acceptable and some are not.
You, however, attack me via negrep for judging men for their own characters and actions instead of painting with a broad brush
Warrior102 said:Hi, you have received -7 reputation points from Warrior102.
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Move to Vietnam chimp
Regards,
Warrior102
Note: This is an automated message.
Interesting that you bring up VietNam
Thankfully you live in a country where you're allowed to voice your pitiful points of view.
For now. We'll see how long that lasts. Today, America sets up 'Free Speech Zones' for dissenters- implying that the rest of the nation, outside that little area, is not a Free Speech zone.Too bad Americans have to tolerate folks like you.
Yes, too bad there are people to demand the truth and hold this nation to a higher standard...
You are filth
Believe that you will; you don't matter anyway
I really, really dislike Memorial Day. Not because I hate the military (not true), nor because I don't think soldiers can't be heroes (also not true), but because I hate the spewing of jingoistic "all soldiers are heroes and they protect our freedom," by all parts of the political spectrum. Now, I want to make it clear that I do not believe soldiers can't be heroes; for example, I consider JFK to be one of the greatest men this country has seen, partly because of his actions in the military. What I am asking, is why all soldiers are automatically heroes? They certainly don't all earn it (US soldiers 'killed Afghan civilians for sport and collected fingers as trophies' | World news | The Guardian). And don't say it is because they are protecting our freedom, because frankly, they aren't right now. There were wars where they were, but our current conflicts are not intended to protect us.
Then what reason do you suppose you have to thank me? I certainly don't owe you any thanks.Mike,
Thank you for serving our country.....and when I tell you (or anyone else) that, I am NOT being "patronizing", or saying "better you than me", because I have been there, done that.
So you compromised your safety and your future to accommodate some anonymous junior who probably would be pulled in at some point, anyway. Didn't you have anything to live for? A wife? A girl who loved you? Your mother? Someone who would be anguished if you were killed or crippled. How would you explain your action to them?I joined up in 1962, before I went to college, so by the time things heated up in Vietnam, I had finished my active obligation, and was still in the Reserve. I could have avoided Vietnam; all I had to do was not re-up and apply for OCS. I could have let some kid with less experience do the fighting (and maybe the dying) for me, but you know what-after all I've been through, I am damn glad I didn't, and I'd do it again. I'd do it again, because it would not have felt right to do otherwise, not to me.
There were some extremists in the protest movement who voiced such opinions. But that level of protest didn't begin until news of My Lai and other atrocities started leaking and the public began to realize there was no justifiable reason for our presence in Vietnam.
I do not regret serving in Vietnam. I do not consider that service a burden. My job was to "protect the innocent, convince the undecided, and kill the rest", and I did the best I could, as did the magnificent men it was my privilege to command. I only regret that I could not bring each and every one of them safely home, to their loved ones, that we were not allowed to finish the job, and that America disgraced herself by cutting and running, with victory within our grasp. Just as I am not a hero, I am not a victim either.
The "war lover" refrain came mainly from the many thousands of protesters who burned their draft cards and simply refused to go.
I don't know about peace at any price but as far as Vietnam was concerned we should have gotten out of there much sooner.Bullshit. I hate war, but there's something I hate more-the idea of "peace at any price". So go ahead and call me an "indoctrinated militarist", or whatever else you damn well choose; I don't care, and I've been called worse. I know what I was fighting for, and I don't need or want anyone else telling me how I "should" feel about it.
If you know what you were fighting for you should have written to Robert MacNamara, the architect of the Vietnam "police action," and told him. Because he wrote a book at the end of his career, The Fog Of War, in which he clearly admits there was no good reason for our presence there to begin with. Perhaps you could have enlightened him.
By the way, I am a 'three-time volunteer", but I am no hero, never thought I was, or wanted to be. I am a survivor. You want heroes, go look on the Wall; you can find their names right there.
I've never seen The Wall. But I have seen many pictures of it and the only thought it brings to my mind is the terrible waste it represents. It is a monument that for all intents and purposes should have prevented George W. Bush from effectively perpetrating his arrogant crime. The reason it didn't is most Americans prefer to think in terms of heroes rather than brave and willing victims.
I'm not sour on the military. The military is necessary for the defense of the Nation. I am sour on the persistent misuse of our military. I am sour on the ease with which our clearly corrupt government gets away with engaging in unnecessary military aggressions and callling them "wars" in an obvious effort to conflate their reality and purpose with those of WW-II. And I'm sour on the tendency of far too many Americans to believe that simply wearing a uniform qualifies as heroism.I am sorry you became sour on the military Mike
Not so. Because between 1936 and WW-II there was nothing to compare with the war crime that was the invasion of Iraq. There was nothing to compare with the war crime called Vietnam. There was not the wholly unnecessary invasion of Grenada. And there was nothing to compare with the unnecessarily protracted and redundantly enacted fighting in Afghanistan. None of these so-called "wars" serve any purpose other than enrichment of the Military Industrial Complex -- which didn't exist prior to WW-II.[...]but guess what, in 1936 I am sure you could have founds folks saying same and along came ww2.
Where are these wars? As far as I can recall the United States has not been at war since 1945.
Please be more specific about where these situations are and why our troops are at risk there. I know we have military bases all over the world but I don't know why. I do know that a similar policy led to the destruction of Ancient Rome. I also know that one of our nation's most serious problems is the fact that its citizens have largely ignored the warning issued by former President Eisenhower about what then was an emerging Military Industrial Complex but which has since evolved into a massively powerful oligarch.[...]and I know from experience there are at lest 6-7 other spots on the globe where American forces are at risk
I have no idea what all of that means.[...]in uniform and I am not going to split hairs on whether the guys hand I shake was/is an infantryman or a remf/pogue, I never do..... Just because you've spun out doesn't make the statement true or not.
It is what it is and we are all part of the same hypocrisy, some just seem to handle it better.
Not so. Because between 1936 and WW-II there was nothing to compare with the war crime that was the invasion of Iraq. There was nothing to compare with the war crime called Vietnam. There was not the wholly unnecessary invasion of Grenada. And there was nothing to compare with the unnecessarily protracted and redundantly enacted fighting in Afghanistan. None of these so-called "wars" serve any purpose other than enrichment of the Military Industrial Complex -- which didn't exist prior to WW-II.
Where are these wars? As far as I can recall the United States has not been at war since 1945.
Then what reason do you suppose you have to thank me? I certainly don't owe you any thanks.Mike,
Thank you for serving our country.....and when I tell you (or anyone else) that, I am NOT being "patronizing", or saying "better you than me", because I have been there, done that.
So you compromised your safety and your future to accommodate some anonymous junior who probably would be pulled in at some point, anyway. Didn't you have anything to live for? A wife? A girl who loved you? Your mother? Someone who would be anguished if you were killed or crippled. How would you explain your action to them?I joined up in 1962, before I went to college, so by the time things heated up in Vietnam, I had finished my active obligation, and was still in the Reserve. I could have avoided Vietnam; all I had to do was not re-up and apply for OCS. I could have let some kid with less experience do the fighting (and maybe the dying) for me, but you know what-after all I've been through, I am damn glad I didn't, and I'd do it again. I'd do it again, because it would not have felt right to do otherwise, not to me.
There were some extremists in the protest movement who voiced such opinions. But that level of protest didn't begin until news of My Lai and other atrocities started leaking and the public began to realize there was no justifiable reason for our presence in Vietnam.
The "war lover" refrain came mainly from the many thousands of protesters who burned their draft cards and simply refused to go.
I don't know about peace at any price but as far as Vietnam was concerned we should have gotten out of there much sooner.Bullshit. I hate war, but there's something I hate more-the idea of "peace at any price". So go ahead and call me an "indoctrinated militarist", or whatever else you damn well choose; I don't care, and I've been called worse. I know what I was fighting for, and I don't need or want anyone else telling me how I "should" feel about it.
If you know what you were fighting for you should have written to Robert MacNamara, the architect of the Vietnam "police action," and told him. Because he wrote a book at the end of his career, The Fog Of War, in which he clearly admits there was no good reason for our presence there to begin with. Perhaps you could have enlightened him.
By the way, I am a 'three-time volunteer", but I am no hero, never thought I was, or wanted to be. I am a survivor. You want heroes, go look on the Wall; you can find their names right there.
I've never seen The Wall. But I have seen many pictures of it and the only thought it brings to my mind is the terrible waste it represents. It is a monument that for all intents and purposes should have prevented George W. Bush from effectively perpetrating his arrogant crime. The reason it didn't is most Americans prefer to think in terms of heroes rather than brave and willing victims.
I really, really dislike Memorial Day. Not because I hate the military (not true), nor because I don't think soldiers can't be heroes (also not true), but because I hate the spewing of jingoistic "all soldiers are heroes and they protect our freedom," by all parts of the political spectrum. Now, I want to make it clear that I do not believe soldiers can't be heroes; for example, I consider JFK to be one of the greatest men this country has seen, partly because of his actions in the military. What I am asking, is why all soldiers are automatically heroes? They certainly don't all earn it (US soldiers 'killed Afghan civilians for sport and collected fingers as trophies' | World news | The Guardian). And don't say it is because they are protecting our freedom, because frankly, they aren't right now. There were wars where they were, but our current conflicts are not intended to protect us.
Hmmm... another military and veteran hater. What a shocker.
So where did you learn to hate the military? You grow up in a hippie commune? You live in San Franqueerco? You join and got your pussy ass washed out? You a butt boy? What? What did soldiers or the military every do to you other than fight for your rights and your freedom to make you HATE them? ... you fucking rotten piece of dog shit... you make me fucking SICK.
I really, really dislike Memorial Day. Not because I hate the military (not true), nor because I don't think soldiers can't be heroes (also not true), but because I hate the spewing of jingoistic "all soldiers are heroes and they protect our freedom," by all parts of the political spectrum. Now, I want to make it clear that I do not believe soldiers can't be heroes; for example, I consider JFK to be one of the greatest men this country has seen, partly because of his actions in the military. What I am asking, is why all soldiers are automatically heroes? They certainly don't all earn it (US soldiers 'killed Afghan civilians for sport and collected fingers as trophies' | World news | The Guardian). And don't say it is because they are protecting our freedom, because frankly, they aren't right now. There were wars where they were, but our current conflicts are not intended to protect us.
Hmmm... another military and veteran hater. What a shocker.
So where did you learn to hate the military? You grow up in a hippie commune? You live in San Franqueerco? You join and got your pussy ass washed out? You a butt boy? What? What did soldiers or the military every do to you other than fight for your rights and your freedom to make you HATE them? ... you fucking rotten piece of dog shit... you make me fucking SICK.
Someone's mad. Notice I never said I hated the military... reading through my post might have cleared that up for you. I actually think the military is a great thing, because it allows us to protect ourselves (and others, if the situation calls for it). However, I'm not going to regard someone as a hero just because they do a dangerous job. I'll respect them, as I will anyone else, but to be a hero you must actively do good in the world. And no, the current military is not protecting our freedom. People in Iraq and Afghanistan have absolutely no potential to truly harm the US.
I really think you should take a break from rage... I'm not sure why you're calling me "dog shit," "butt boy," and calling me a pussy. I'm not trying to enflame, just trying to bring up a point I believe is quite valid and relevant. What are you, 10 years old?
Wrong.People in Iraq and Afghanistan have absolutely no potential to truly harm the US.
Really? I've negged you, AND I attack you out here in the fora.Just exposing the cowards who attack me behind the scenes because I judge men as individuals.Is that why you post every neg rep you get?
Really? I've negged you, AND I attack you out here in the fora.Just exposing the cowards who attack me behind the scenes because I judge men as individuals.Is that why you post every neg rep you get?
I think the actual reason is you're just a sissy bedwetter.