Which 9/11 conspiracy do you believe? ((improved))

[JiggsCasey]

All due respect to the other thread, but I think the options in the OP were poorly presented. And that's why I didn't vote.

I'd like to collect a more basic tally, to see the real demographic of this forum in regards to this topic, the greatest crime in U.S. history.

Have at it, and may the discussion continue here... Hopefully with far more civility, ... but if not, I (we) will be glad to continue bringing the same weaponry to the battlefield that coincidence theorists tend to instigate with.

 

[candycorn]

All due respect to the other thread, but I think the options in the OP were poorly presented. And that's why I didn't vote.

I'd like to collect a more basic tally, to see the real demographic of this forum in regards to this topic, the greatest crime in U.S. history.

Have at it, and may the discussion continue here... Hopefully with far more civility, ... but if not, I (we) will be glad to continue bringing the same weaponry to the battlefield that coincidence theorists tend to instigate with.

The real crime that involves the US Government is that the bulletproof 9/11 Commission's reccomendations have not been installed to make this country safer.

There is no evidence that points to any US Government involvement during or before the fact.

 

[JiggsCasey]

All due respect to the other thread, but I think the options in the OP were poorly presented. And that's why I didn't vote.

I'd like to collect a more basic tally, to see the real demographic of this forum in regards to this topic, the greatest crime in U.S. history.

Have at it, and may the discussion continue here... Hopefully with far more civility, ... but if not, I (we) will be glad to continue bringing the same weaponry to the battlefield that coincidence theorists tend to instigate with.

The real crime that involves the US Government is that the bulletproof 9/11 Commission's reccomendations have not been installed to make this country safer.

There is no evidence that points to any US Government involvement during or before the fact.

I'm sorry, but you're just wrong.

There is an abundance of evidence of precisely that ... everything from the Phoenix Memo to never detaining Mehmood Ahmed for questioning, to NORAD's evasiveness about the war game simulations and their blatant timeline discrepancies.

 

[psikeyhackr]

There are too many anomalies involving physics for it to be possible that the official conspiracy theory is true.

The simple question is: Can a normal airliner weighing less than 200 tons TOTALLY DESTROY a skyscraper weighing more than 400,000 tons in less than TWO HOURS, and what data about the plane and building is necessary to definitively answer the question?

Skyscrapers must hold themselves up and withstand the wind. How can even reasonably accurate cost estimates for a skyscraper be made without knowing how much steel and how much concrete is going where?

So how is it after NINE YEARS the nation that put men on the Moon can't tell the entire world the TONS of STEEL and TONS of CONCRETE that were on every level of buildings designed before 1969? And consider how much better computers have gotten since 1969.

But now this involves all of the engineering schools in the country and therefore it involves the educational system of the entire country. Look at how mass must be distributed in a tall structure:

Here is a video of something demonstrating the principle:
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGxBJ34MgiI[/ame]

At 0:43 the video really shows how the top to bottom distribution has to change. Could the top 15% of that by height crush the rest? The entire concept is RIDICULOUS!

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBzLhy3Q7sY[/ame]

Now the World Trade Center LOOKED the same all of the way up but that simply means the wind was a much bigger problem for the WTC than for the CN Tower. The CN Tower got much thinner toward the top so the wind resistance was greatly reduced. But the WTC would have needed proportionately more steel toward the bottom to handle the wind load. The distribution just is not obvious from the outside as it is in the CN Tower.

9/11 is the Piltdown Man Incident of the 21st century. But the 9/11 Religion must be maintained to preserve the Holey Official Conspiracy Theory.

psik

 

[candycorn]

All due respect to the other thread, but I think the options in the OP were poorly presented. And that's why I didn't vote.

I'd like to collect a more basic tally, to see the real demographic of this forum in regards to this topic, the greatest crime in U.S. history.

Have at it, and may the discussion continue here... Hopefully with far more civility, ... but if not, I (we) will be glad to continue bringing the same weaponry to the battlefield that coincidence theorists tend to instigate with.

The real crime that involves the US Government is that the bulletproof 9/11 Commission's reccomendations have not been installed to make this country safer.

There is no evidence that points to any US Government involvement during or before the fact.

I'm sorry, but you're just wrong.

There is an abundance of evidence of precisely that ... everything from the Phoenix Memo to never detaining Mehmood Ahmed for questioning, to NORAD's evasiveness about the war game simulations and their blatant timeline discrepancies.

Okay, take your evidence and file suit in federal district court.

People sue the government every day and win. Whats stopping you?

Put up or shut the *bleep* up.

 

[candycorn]

The real crime that involves the US Government is that the bulletproof 9/11 Commission's reccomendations have not been installed to make this country safer.

There is no evidence that points to any US Government involvement during or before the fact.

I'm sorry, but you're just wrong.

There is an abundance of evidence of precisely that ... everything from the Phoenix Memo to never detaining Mehmood Ahmed for questioning, to NORAD's evasiveness about the war game simulations and their blatant timeline discrepancies.

Okay, take your evidence and file suit in federal district court.

People sue the government every day and win. Whats stopping you?

Put up or shut the *bleep* up.

I guess she shut the *bleep* up. Refreshing.

 

[eots]

brining a criminal case against the perpetrators of 9/11 is vastly more difficult task than suing someone and before that could be done a true investigation would be required.. criminal murder cases can often take many years to bring to justice

 

[JiggsCasey]

Okay, take your evidence and file suit in federal district court.

People sue the government every day and win. Whats stopping you?

Oh, I dunno. Perhaps the 30-40 million dollars required to pull it off?

Put up or shut the *bleep* up.

Classic con man bloviation.

"Shut your mouth, and let us keep you safe!"

You're officially irrelevant. Run along now, clown.

I guess she shut the *bleep* up. Refreshing.

Sorry if seven hours seemed too long for you. ... I don't spend every waking hour on here like you do, captain indignant.

 

[FRAGO 242]

If I had to take a shot at it I'd say it's MIHOP...

 

[candycorn]

Okay, take your evidence and file suit in federal district court.

People sue the government every day and win. Whats stopping you?

Oh, I dunno. Perhaps the 30-40 million dollars required to pull it off?

Can you cite a source where it would cost 30-40 million dollars to "pull it off" as you say?

Put up or shut the *bleep* up.

Classic con man bloviation.

"Shut your mouth, and let us keep you safe!"

You're officially irrelevant. Run along now, clown.

So...you're admitting you don't have any real evidence. Hmmph...wow imagine my shock. If you had the evidence you swear you have, you'd be in front of a judge, not debating it on an obscure message board. Face it, you're going nowhere and you know it. That must really suck.

I guess she shut the *bleep* up. Refreshing.

Sorry if seven hours seemed too long for you. ... I don't spend every waking hour on here like you do, captain indignant.

Yes you do; you're just legendarily ineffective and all talk. Nothing will EVER come from your "evidence" on anything. It won't on JFK, it won't on Mr. Wellstone, and it won't on 9/11. And whatever crazy-koo-koo theory you latch on to next will be just another waste of time on your part.

I LOVE IT!!!​

 

[eots]

okay, take your evidence and file suit in federal district court.

People sue the government every day and win. Whats stopping you?

oh, i dunno. Perhaps the 30-40 million dollars required to pull it off?

can you cite a source where it would cost 30-40 million dollars to "pull it off" as you say?


So...you're admitting you don't have any real evidence. Hmmph...wow imagine my shock. If you had the evidence you swear you have, you'd be in front of a judge, not debating it on an obscure message board. Face it, you're going nowhere and you know it. That must really suck.

i guess she shut the *bleep* up. Refreshing.

sorry if seven hours seemed too long for you. ... I don't spend every waking hour on here like you do, captain indignant.

yes you do; you're just legendarily ineffective and all talk. Nothing will ever come from your "evidence" on anything. It won't on jfk, it won't on mr. Wellstone, and it won't on 9/11. And whatever crazy-koo-koo theory you latch on to next will be just another waste of time on your part.

i love it!!!​

if these endeavorers for truth are indeed a waste of time..what would you call this moronic drivel you spew forth upon it ?...time we well spent?...how sad for you

 

[psikeyhackr]

The laws of physics need to be decided in court?

ROFL

Why is the CN Tower shaped like this?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBzLhy3Q7sY[/ame]

What does that tell us about how the steel and concrete had to be distributed in the WTC towers?

But the towers did not get narrower toward the top like that structure. Therefore they had much more of a WIND LOAD problem to deal with. The designers knew that before construction was started. So is the court going to demand accurate information on the distributions of steel and concrete in the towers?

Our engineering schools should have provided the verdict on this more than eight years ago. There is no way airliners could cause that much destruction that fast. And that includes the fires.

psik

 

[JiggsCasey]

So much for civility. Very well then.

Can you cite a source where it would cost 30-40 million dollars to "pull it off" as you say?

Can you deny that the 9/11 Commission cost $14 million? Considering it was vastly inadequate, I'd say double or triple that amount. You know, like your heroes spent investigating Bill Clinton's oval office throating.

Standard federal investigation fare, and you'd know that if you had one inkling of what you were ever talking about.

So...you're admitting you don't have any real evidence. Hmmph...wow imagine my shock. If you had the evidence you swear you have, you'd be in front of a judge, not debating it on an obscure message board. Face it, you're going nowhere and you know it. That must really suck.

Wrong again, Bush League concubine. I've admitted no such thing. Now, you can pretend the argument hasn't been presented over and over again and stick your fingers in your ears and yell "nah! nah! nah!" in a circle as many times as you like. It's what people like you do.

Unfortunately, coincitard, that doesn't change the score. Argue against the evidence presented, or do yourself the favor of STFU.

 

[candycorn]

So much for civility. Very well then.

Can you cite a source where it would cost 30-40 million dollars to "pull it off" as you say?

Can you deny that the 9/11 Commission cost $14 million? Considering it was vastly inadequate, I'd say double or triple that amount. You know, like your heroes spent investigating Bill Clinton's oval office throating.

So I'm guessing you just made up that $30-$40 million dollar figure? How very expected from you.

The fact of the matter is that anybody can file suit in federal district court and take their chances. People sue the Federal Government every day and they win quite often. Any judgment that the twoofers could obtain would be a landmark since, to date, the entire movement is a sad joke by any measurement.

Face it, if you had evidence, you'd be before a judge. You don't so you're here changing quotes and acting like a fucking idiot; in other words, you're acting like a truther.

It makes me laugh that after 9 tractionless years of chasing your tail, you decide that it is in your best interest to keep doing so.

I LOVE IT!

 

[candycorn]

The laws of physics need to be decided in court?

ROFL

Why is the CN Tower shaped like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBzLhy3Q7sY

What does that tell us about how the steel and concrete had to be distributed in the WTC towers?

But the towers did not get narrower toward the top like that structure. Therefore they had much more of a WIND LOAD problem to deal with. The designers knew that before construction was started. So is the court going to demand accurate information on the distributions of steel and concrete in the towers?

Our engineering schools should have provided the verdict on this more than eight years ago. There is no way airliners could cause that much destruction that fast. And that includes the fires.

psik

No, you need a judgment to get a new investigation.

I hate to speak of reality to truthers but here is the deal. See, in the US, two political parties run the show. Neither party wants to re-open an investigation into 9/11 because it would expose a shortcoming of it's own party to some extent. There is also the landmark 9/11 Commission report that is 100% correct on all major facts of the event so there is no need to re-open the case.

Okay...with me so far? No? Well have an adult explain government 101 to you and maybe you'll learn something.

Anyway, the only shot at a new investigation into 9/11 is by court order. So it would behoove the "movement" to go through the courts to do this since their elected officials will get less-than-nowhere; both due to politics and the reality that the Commission report and the other investigations were 100% right.

So yes, you need to go to court. Too bad you don't have any evidence, facts, real experts, credible witnesses, logic, or even an attorney willing to take your bullshit case.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Lost me on trying to compare the CN Tower with the WTC. Two total differently designed buildings.

So now i have to ask just what is the theory now if the planes didn't do it? Are we back to sideways burning nanothermite or pre-planted demolitions of some other type? Maybe the painted on thermite.

How about the buildings started to fail exactly where the planes hit and any explosives that would have been planted couldn't have lasted that long without going off. Like as soon as the planes hit.

The Official reports have all the main points right. There is no evidence to suggest otherwise. At least no credible evidence.

 

[candycorn]

Lost me on trying to compare the CN Tower with the WTC. Two total differently designed buildings.

So now i have to ask just what is the theory now if the planes didn't do it? Are we back to sideways burning nanothermite or pre-planted demolitions of some other type? Maybe the painted on thermite.

How about the buildings started to fail exactly where the planes hit and any explosives that would have been planted couldn't have lasted that long without going off. Like as soon as the planes hit.

The Official reports have all the main points right. There is no evidence to suggest otherwise. At least no credible evidence.

No silly, the thermite was on the plane..it ran all over the place then was detonated by the fairy dust that the perps left in ash trays through out the building.

I'm tired of explaining this to you.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Lost me on trying to compare the CN Tower with the WTC. Two total differently designed buildings.

So now i have to ask just what is the theory now if the planes didn't do it? Are we back to sideways burning nanothermite or pre-planted demolitions of some other type? Maybe the painted on thermite.

How about the buildings started to fail exactly where the planes hit and any explosives that would have been planted couldn't have lasted that long without going off. Like as soon as the planes hit.

The Official reports have all the main points right. There is no evidence to suggest otherwise. At least no credible evidence.

No silly, the thermite was on the plane..it ran all over the place then was detonated by the fairy dust that the perps left in ash trays through out the building.

I'm tired of explaining this to you.

I forgot about the fairy dust, sorry.

 

[JiggsCasey]

So much for civility. Very well then.

Can you cite a source where it would cost 30-40 million dollars to "pull it off" as you say?

Can you deny that the 9/11 Commission cost $14 million? Considering it was vastly inadequate, I'd say double or triple that amount. You know, like your heroes spent investigating Bill Clinton's oval office throating.

So I'm guessing you just made up that $30-$40 million dollar figure? How very expected from you.

And I'm guessing that because you can't deny the cost of the original Kean Commission, and you can't deny it was woefully inadequate, as admitted by Kean and Hamilton themsevles, thus, by proxy, you can't deny a legitimate investigation wouldn't cost at least double.

The fact of the matter is that anybody can file suit in federal district court and take their chances. People sue the Federal Government every day and they win quite often. Any judgment that the twoofers could obtain would be a landmark since, to date, the entire movement is a sad joke by any measurement.

Correction, simplistic tool: Anyone can file suit. Not anyone can secure subpoena power, or fund the commissioners and investigators required to pull it off. It has to be financed, either by the government, or a private entity with deep pockets. You clearly have zero idea how our judicial system works, not that that's any surprise to anyone here.

Face it, if you had evidence, you'd be before a judge. You don't

Wrong again, arrogant ass. The evidence is overwhelming, from the failure to question Mehmood Ahmed, to the put options on the NYSE to NORAD's war game drills, to the White House's obstruction of justice.

You can repeat it to yourself 1000 times if you like, but it does nothing for your laughable denial scheme.

so you're here changing quotes and acting like a fucking idiot; in other words, you're acting like a truther.

What's your own excuse then for how YOU enter the fray and act? Different when you do it, I understand. Situational ethics is the hallmark of the whiney coincitard.

It makes me laugh that after 9 tractionless years of chasing your tail, you decide that it is in your best interest to keep doing so.

Irony here. DUCY? Especially considering you clowns have been doing exactly that defending the worst president in U.S. history for 8 years, yourselves.

This is what happens when your heroes control the justice system. Never mind the multiple whistle-blowers, and the commissioners themselves admitting their own investigation was a farce.

I LOVE IT!

Of course you do. Because pro-war jingoists like you get off on U.S. military might and injustice, and your heroes' fraudulent goals towards vaporizing brown people who pray funny. You do the same thing when you perpetuate WMD fraud and defend Blackwater murderers to no end.

It's at the very crux of your modern crusade.

You wouldn't understand what constitutes an indictment if it smacked you in the face over and over again.

You are easily the most obnoxious tool on this sub-forum.

 

[candycorn]

And I'm guessing that because you can't deny the cost of the original Kean Commission, and you can't deny it was woefully inadequate, as admitted by Kean and Hamilton themsevles, thus, by proxy, you can't deny a legitimate investigation wouldn't cost at least double.

Nice try at diversion. Whenever I hook a twoofer with their own words, they all start to squirm.

Tell us why you can't file a suit in court if you supposedly have the evidence already? We've dismissed your ridiculous claim of a 30-40 million dollar threshold so that can't be it.

Correction, simplistic tool: Anyone can file suit. Not anyone can secure subpoena power, or fund the commissioners and investigators required to pull it off. It has to be financed, either by the government, or a private entity with deep pockets. You clearly have zero idea how our judicial system works, not that that's any surprise to anyone here.

You said you have the evidence already...what investigators do you need loser? Oh, thats right, you ain't got shit--and you know it which is why now you're working 24/7 in the excuse factory explaining why there is no way you can bring your "evidence" to court.

So whats the game plan...5000 more posts here meaning zilch or are you going to put your money where you mouth is or put your "evidence" in front of a judge?

See dumbass; you're thinking of a trial and calling people before the judge to hear evidence, producing star testimony, etc...

You don't need to do any of that. According to you, you have the evidence already. So you just need to submit it to the judge and let him or her consider the evidence and rule.

Once a finding is made then we get into all of the crap you mentioned above but we don't need to worry about that; you'll be thrown out of court and ridiculed from the bench. I imagine you're a scared little boy who never was successful at anything so what would another public humiliation hurt, Jiggs?

Wrong again, arrogant ass. The evidence is overwhelming,

Again, you say the evidence is overwhelming so you don't need to hire investigators, empanel a commission, etc...

from the failure to question Mehmood Ahmed, to the put options on the NYSE to NORAD's war game drills, to the White House's obstruction of justice.

Wow, sounds like you have a lot of acronyms there; that'll be sure to impress the judge...too bad you don't have the cajones to do anything about it. Poor jiggs...so helpless on all fronts.

You can repeat it to yourself 1000 times if you like, but it does nothing for your laughable denial scheme.

Lashing out at your betters isn't doing you and good...it hasn't for 9 years and won't for the next 90. Poor jiggs; total failure on every level. It does make me laugh though...

Of course you do. Because pro-war jingoists like you get off on U.S. military might and injustice, and your heroes' fraudulent goals towards vaporizing brown people who pray funny. You do the same thing when you perpetuate WMD fraud and defend Blackwater murderers to no end.

It's at the very crux of your modern crusade.

You wouldn't understand what constitutes an indictment if it smacked you in the face over and over again.

You are easily the most obnoxious tool on this sub-forum.

And you're the most hilarious I haven't put on ignore yet. I do like how you characterize our Islamic friends though; I would never say such a thing but I guess when you're positively fucked in the head as you are; you'll say anything to get just a little attention from your betters.

Poor jiggs. You could have made something of your life at one point. Too late no I guess