Which 9/11 conspiracy do you believe? ((improved))

[slackjawed]

I have been through this so many times....It just baffles me that I am the ONLY one who knows what happened on 911.

I will review this yet again, let it stand as a testament to my patience and good nature.

Years ago space aliens bent on taking over the world visited earth. Sort of that is, because these aliens have no mass, they have no bodies, they exist as bodiless entities. Because of this indisputable fact, they abducted some humans to use as breed stock to create a race of themselves that possessed bodies, and therefore could take over our world. Unfortunately, the aliens abducted several midgets, and Elvis. Elvis was pretty much worthless as breed stock due to years of drug use and hard living damaging his dna. The midgets were used to create a bodied breed of aliens, midgets with evil little space alien brains. The aliens were unaware of their mistake, until one day during a lucid moment, Elvis informed them he wasn't a giant, that most humans were his size.

Well, the aliens were both disappointed and pissed beyond belief. The evil space alien council of elders decided right away to use the midgets to abduct a bunch of normal size humans to take over the world, of course they decided that the little evil midgets they had created would be perfect for the job.

The passengers on the planes in NYC and Wash Dc, as well as Shanksville were not killed in the respective crashes, they had already been beamed aboard the alien spaceship. That's right folks, the planes were empty of passengers when they crashed.
Evil little midgets killed a few witnesses and some winos, scattering a few body parts around the crash sites to create a diversion from reality.

The passengers that were abducted are now on the alien planet being bred into a race of evil aliens with the bodies of normal sized people. The facts are indisputable, based on my expert investigation;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...stigation-reveals-what-happened-on-911-a.html

The big 64 dollar question is how long does it take to breed a race of normal sized humans with alien minds.

How long do we have before they take over the world???????????


Indisputable evidence here;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/73624-prepare-for-your-new-midget-masters.html

and here;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/104670-911-commission-report-is-correct.html

and commentary here;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...uthers-on-usmb-real-truther-or-wanna-bes.html

and here;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...th-movement-manipulates-the-mentally-ill.html

and here;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...-headquarters-for-truther-movement-found.html

Is this fiction or prophecy? ;
http://www.usmessageboard.com/consp...un-obama-issues-executive-order-breaking.html

 

[psikeyhackr]

Lost me on trying to compare the CN Tower with the WTC. Two total differently designed buildings.

Some people are easy to lose. I never said anything about thermite.

The CN Tower is not a building. It has very little empty space thoutghout its structure.

The point was that the CN Tower EXPOSES how the supporting material must be distributed in order to hold up its own weight and withstand the wind while this is completely hidden to the outside view of the World Trade Center. But the constant width of the WTC toward the top means it presents a much greater WIND LOAD to the structure then the CN Tower.

Comprehending the absurdity of 9/11 obviously requires too much thinking for some people.

It is curious that I have yet to find this subject in the Science & Technology section.

Aren't skyscrapers Technology? Isn't physics Science?

Aren't conspiracy theories for idiots. Aren't 19 Islamofascists guided by a man in a cave a conspiracy?

9/11 is the Piltdown Man Incident of the 21st century.

psik

 

[psikeyhackr]

Okay...with me so far? No? Well have an adult explain government 101 to you and maybe you'll learn something.

Anyway, the only shot at a new investigation into 9/11 is by court order. So it would behoove the "movement" to go through the courts to do this since their elected officials will get less-than-nowhere; both due to politics and the reality that the Commission report and the other investigations were 100% right.

So yes, you need to go to court. Too bad you don't have any evidence, facts, real experts, credible witnesses, logic, or even an attorney willing to take your bullshit case.

Well I am not in any movement and it should have been self evident to anyone over the age of 12 with a functioning brain that a airliners could not destroy buildings THAT BIG THAT FAST.

Grade school kids all over the world should be laughing at the United States.

So at this point 9/11 is even more of an educational problem than a legal problem.

That appears to be part of the problem with European culture. They think man made laws are more important than reality. (White Americans are Europeans) Can't even figure out that Europe is not a continent. No water separating it from the land area called Asia. So reality is whatever it is DEFINED to be. Can't understand that reality is more important than words.

But when do Christians mention that LOGOS is related to LOGIC?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdTOY-giMy4[/ame]

psik

 

[SFC Ollie]

Okay...with me so far? No? Well have an adult explain government 101 to you and maybe you'll learn something.

Anyway, the only shot at a new investigation into 9/11 is by court order. So it would behoove the "movement" to go through the courts to do this since their elected officials will get less-than-nowhere; both due to politics and the reality that the Commission report and the other investigations were 100% right.

So yes, you need to go to court. Too bad you don't have any evidence, facts, real experts, credible witnesses, logic, or even an attorney willing to take your bullshit case.

Well I am not in any movement and it should have been self evident to anyone over the age of 12 with a functioning brain that a airliners could not destroy buildings THAT BIG THAT FAST.

Grade school kids all over the world should be laughing at the United States.

So at this point 9/11 is even more of an educational problem than a legal problem.

That appears to be part of the problem with European culture. They think man made laws are more important than reality. (White Americans are Europeans) Can't even figure out that Europe is not a continent. No water separating it from the land area called Asia. So reality is whatever it is DEFINED to be. Can't understand that reality is more important than words.

But when do Christians mention that LOGOS is related to LOGIC?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdTOY-giMy4[/ame]

psik

So you are saying Vulcans did it?

 

[psikeyhackr]

So you are saying Vulcans did it?

Like I said:

Some people are easy to lose.

psik

 

[candycorn]

Okay...with me so far? No? Well have an adult explain government 101 to you and maybe you'll learn something.

Anyway, the only shot at a new investigation into 9/11 is by court order. So it would behoove the "movement" to go through the courts to do this since their elected officials will get less-than-nowhere; both due to politics and the reality that the Commission report and the other investigations were 100% right.

So yes, you need to go to court. Too bad you don't have any evidence, facts, real experts, credible witnesses, logic, or even an attorney willing to take your bullshit case.

Well I am not in any movement and it should have been self evident to anyone over the age of 12 with a functioning brain that a airliners could not destroy buildings THAT BIG THAT FAST.

Grade school kids all over the world should be laughing at the United States.

So at this point 9/11 is even more of an educational problem than a legal problem.

That appears to be part of the problem with European culture. They think man made laws are more important than reality. (White Americans are Europeans) Can't even figure out that Europe is not a continent. No water separating it from the land area called Asia. So reality is whatever it is DEFINED to be. Can't understand that reality is more important than words.

But when do Christians mention that LOGOS is related to LOGIC?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdTOY-giMy4[/ame]

psik

I enjoyed your humorous post.

Quick question...what is the cut off where an airliner can destroy a building? 500 feet? 600 feet? Surely you just didn't pull that one out of your ass, right?

 

[slackjawed]

There is no evidence, no matter how convincing, that will ever be accepted by the 9/11 "Truth" Movement's hardcore evangelists. The irony is that the people who claim to be searching for the truth are so willing to ignore evidence and react angrily to those with conflicting evidence and testimony.

A bigger irony is that if there is a conspiracy, twoofers with their deluge of disinformation are doing more than anyone else to help cover it up.

 

[Fizz]

Aren't 19 Islamofascists guided by a man in a cave a conspiracy?

thanks for showing us all what a fucking idiotic moron you are.

where are you getting information that the 9/11 hijackers were guided by someone in a cave?

 

[LA RAM FAN]

All due respect to the other thread, but I think the options in the OP were poorly presented. And that's why I didn't vote.

I'd like to collect a more basic tally, to see the real demographic of this forum in regards to this topic, the greatest crime in U.S. history.

Have at it, and may the discussion continue here... Hopefully with far more civility, ... but if not, I (we) will be glad to continue bringing the same weaponry to the battlefield that coincidence theorists tend to instigate with.

yeah this is a better poll.i did not like the one before so i did not vote either.The second one is the accurate one.it was a joint venture pulled off by the CIA/MOSSAD. Thats the most accurate staement ever,the people that defend the official version of the governments are coincidence theorists. all ther ramblings are countered in david ray griffins book DEBUNKING THE 9/11 DEBUNKING,an answer to popular mechanics and other defenders of the official conspiracy theory.the subtitle of that book hits the nail right on the head that the governments version is a conspiracy THEORY.

 

[psikeyhackr]

I enjoyed your humorous post.

Quick question...what is the cut off where an airliner can destroy a building? 500 feet? 600 feet? Surely you just didn't pull that one out of your ass, right?

It is not just destroyed a building, it is TOTALLY DESTROYED a building.

I would be inclined to go with MASS not height. If the mass of the building is more than 100 times the mass of the plane it is time to be EXTREMELY SKEPTICAL if the destruction is total.

The planes were less than 200 tons. The buildings were more than 400,000 tons.

So the planes were less than one half of one tenth of ONE PERCENT of the mass of the buildings they supposedly TOTALLY DESTROYED. There is a video of a ground zero worker saying he never found so much as a whole telephone. Have you heard about the filing cabinets? Shouldn't there have been lots of filing cabinets in two HUGE skyscrapers. There was usually at least one in almost every office in places I have worked.

These documentary excerpts reveal only one filing cabinet to have been found.
No doors, no phones, no computers, and no doorknobs:

LiveLeak.com - How does a Metal Filing Cabinet at the WTC Melt and doesn't burn the paper inside?

Things happened to those buildings which make it laughable that people believe the planes and fire could have caused. It also means they have not researched crap with the internet but come to sites like this and argue. It tends to show they refuse to think.

psik

 

[candycorn]

I enjoyed your humorous post.

Quick question...what is the cut off where an airliner can destroy a building? 500 feet? 600 feet? Surely you just didn't pull that one out of your ass, right?

It is not just destroyed a building, it is TOTALLY DESTROYED a building.

I would be inclined to go with MASS not height. If the mass of the building is more than 100 times the mass of the plane it is time to be EXTREMELY SKEPTICAL if the destruction is total.

The planes were less than 200 tons. The buildings were more than 400,000 tons.

So the planes were less than one half of one tenth of ONE PERCENT of the mass of the buildings they supposedly TOTALLY DESTROYED. There is a video of a ground zero worker saying he never found so much as a whole telephone. Have you heard about the filing cabinets? Shouldn't there have been lots of filing cabinets in two HUGE skyscrapers. There was usually at least one in almost every office in places I have worked.

These documentary excerpts reveal only one filing cabinet to have been found.
No doors, no phones, no computers, and no doorknobs:

LiveLeak.com - How does a Metal Filing Cabinet at the WTC Melt and doesn't burn the paper inside?

Things happened to those buildings which make it laughable that people believe the planes and fire could have caused. It also means they have not researched crap with the internet but come to sites like this and argue. It tends to show they refuse to think.

psik

File cabinet, picture frame, other pieces of furniture. All in tact.

Elevator parts; larger than a phone.

You're debunked and dismissed.

Check please.

 

[psikeyhackr]

I enjoyed your humorous post.

Quick question...what is the cut off where an airliner can destroy a building? 500 feet? 600 feet? Surely you just didn't pull that one out of your ass, right?

It is not just destroyed a building, it is TOTALLY DESTROYED a building.

I would be inclined to go with MASS not height. If the mass of the building is more than 100 times the mass of the plane it is time to be EXTREMELY SKEPTICAL if the destruction is total.

The planes were less than 200 tons. The buildings were more than 400,000 tons.

So the planes were less than one half of one tenth of ONE PERCENT of the mass of the buildings they supposedly TOTALLY DESTROYED. There is a video of a ground zero worker saying he never found so much as a whole telephone. Have you heard about the filing cabinets? Shouldn't there have been lots of filing cabinets in two HUGE skyscrapers. There was usually at least one in almost every office in places I have worked.

These documentary excerpts reveal only one filing cabinet to have been found.
No doors, no phones, no computers, and no doorknobs:

LiveLeak.com - How does a Metal Filing Cabinet at the WTC Melt and doesn't burn the paper inside?

Things happened to those buildings which make it laughable that people believe the planes and fire could have caused. It also means they have not researched crap with the internet but come to sites like this and argue. It tends to show they refuse to think.

psik

File cabinet, picture frame, other pieces of furniture. All in tact.

Elevator parts; larger than a phone.

You're debunked and dismissed.

Check please.

For all I know that upper picture is from your basement.

Buildings that size would have hundreds of thousands of items that should have been all over and easy to find. Your concept of debunking in idiotically shallow.

You have two 110 story office buildings.
You don't find a desk.
You don't find a chair.
You don't find a telephone, a computer.
The biggest piece of a telephone I found was half of a keypad,
and it was about this big:
(makes a shape with his hand about 4 inches in diameter)
The building collapsed to dust.

9-11 Research: Eyewitness Accounts

I have seen the video of that guy but I haven't found it yet.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSueQsVsk_M[/ame]

There you go.

psik

 

[candycorn]

It is not just destroyed a building, it is TOTALLY DESTROYED a building.

I would be inclined to go with MASS not height. If the mass of the building is more than 100 times the mass of the plane it is time to be EXTREMELY SKEPTICAL if the destruction is total.

The planes were less than 200 tons. The buildings were more than 400,000 tons.

So the planes were less than one half of one tenth of ONE PERCENT of the mass of the buildings they supposedly TOTALLY DESTROYED. There is a video of a ground zero worker saying he never found so much as a whole telephone. Have you heard about the filing cabinets? Shouldn't there have been lots of filing cabinets in two HUGE skyscrapers. There was usually at least one in almost every office in places I have worked.



LiveLeak.com - How does a Metal Filing Cabinet at the WTC Melt and doesn't burn the paper inside?

Things happened to those buildings which make it laughable that people believe the planes and fire could have caused. It also means they have not researched crap with the internet but come to sites like this and argue. It tends to show they refuse to think.

psik

File cabinet, picture frame, other pieces of furniture. All in tact.

Elevator parts; larger than a phone.

You're debunked and dismissed.

Check please.

For all I know that upper picture is from your basement.

Buildings that size would have hundreds of thousands of items that should have been all over and easy to find. Your concept of debunking in idiotically shallow.

You have two 110 story office buildings.
You don't find a desk.
You don't find a chair.
You don't find a telephone, a computer.
The biggest piece of a telephone I found was half of a keypad,
and it was about this big:
(makes a shape with his hand about 4 inches in diameter)
The building collapsed to dust.

9-11 Research: Eyewitness Accounts

I have seen the video of that guy but I haven't found it yet.

psik

You should try leaving your basement from time to time.

The photographs were from PBS's series "Rebuilding America". Google it and try to learn something.

 

[eots]

no black box but they did find the terrorist passport and bandanna and the body of john O'Neil

 

[Fizz]

no black box but they did find the terrorist passport and bandanna and the body of john O'Neil

so?

 

[psikeyhackr]

You should try leaving your basement from time to time.

The photographs were from PBS's series "Rebuilding America". Google it and try to learn something.

All you need to do is look at pictures of ground zero hours after the buildings were destroyed to know those pictures are too trivial to matter. What happened to those buildings required far too much energy too have been done by a gravitational collapse.

This is physics and all you can come up with is psychological bullshit.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSueQsVsk_M[/ame]

psik

 

[Fizz]

What happened to those buildings required far too much energy too have been done by a gravitational collapse.

says who?

 

[slackjawed]

What happened to those buildings required far too much energy too have been done by a gravitational collapse.

says who?

Yes, please provide mathematical proof of your statement.

 

[slackjawed]

I know this is old news, but here is where the ideots free-fall delusions are debunked.



from;
Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy Theories and Controlled Demolition - Free Fall



" In every photo and every video, you can see columns far outpacing the collapse of the building. Not only are the columns falling faster than the building but they are also falling faster than the debris cloud which is ALSO falling faster than the building. This proves the buildings fell well below free fall speed. That is, unless the beams had a rocket pointed to the ground.

Just look at any video you like and watch the perimeter columns.

Deceptive videos stop the timer of the fall at 10:09 when only the perimeter column hits the ground and not the building itself. If you notice, the building just finishes disappearing behind the debris cloud which is still about 40 stories high.

Below is a more accurate graphic using a paper written by Dr. Frank Greening which can be found at: http://www.911myths.com/WTCREPORT.pdf

The paper takes the transfer of momentum into account. Like a billiard ball being hit by another on a pool table, each floor transferred its momentum to the next as represented below. The more weight, the less resistance each floor gave.

The time required to strip off a floor, according to Frank Greening, is a maximum of about 110 milliseconds = 0.110 seconds. It is rather the conservation of momentum that slowed the collapse together with a small additional time for the destruction of each floor.

Below are calculations from a physics blogger...

When I did the calculations, what I got for a thousand feet was about nine seconds- let's see,
d = 1/2at^2
so
t = (2d/a)^1/2
a is 9.8m/s^2 (acceleration of gravity at Earth's surface, according to Wikipedia), [He gives this reference so you can double check him.]
d is 417m (height of the World Trade Center towers, same source)
so
t = (834m/9.8m/s^2)^1/2 = 9.23s
OK, so how fast was it going? Easy enough,
v = at
v = (9.8m/s^2 x 9.23s) = 90.4m/s
So in the following second, it would have fallen about another hundred meters. That's almost a quarter of the height it already fell. And we haven't even made it to eleven seconds yet; it could have fallen more than twice its height in that additional four seconds. If the top fell freely, in 13.23 seconds it would have fallen about two and one-half times as far as it actually did fall in that time. So the collapse was at much less than free-fall rates.


Let's see:
KE = 1/2mv^2
The mass of the towers was about 450 million kg, according to this. Four sources, he has. I think that's pretty definitive. So now we can take the KE of the top floor, and divide by two- that will be the average of the top and bottom floors. Then we'll compare that to the KE of a floor in the middle, and if they're comparable, then we're good to go- take the KE of the top floor and divide by two and multiply by 110 stories. We'll also assume that the mass is evenly divided among the floors, and that they were loaded to perhaps half of their load rating of 100lbs/sqft. That would be
208ft x 208ft = 43,264sqft
50lbs/sqft * 43264sqft = 2,163,200lbs = 981,211kg
additional weight per floor. So the top floor would be
450,000,000 kg / 110 floors = 4,090,909 kg/floor
so the total mass would be
4,090,909 kg + 981,211 kg = 5,072,120 kg/floor
Now, the velocity at impact we figured above was
90.4m/s
so our
KE = (5,072,120kg x (90.4m/s)^2)/2 = 20,725,088,521J
So, divide by 2 and we get
10,362,544,260J
OK, now let's try a floor halfway up:
t = (2d/a)^1/2 = (417/9.8)^1/2 = 6.52s
v = at = 9.8*6.52 = 63.93m/s
KE = (mv^2)/2 = (5,072,120kg x (63.93m/s)^2)/2 = 10,363,863,011J
Hey, look at that! They're almost equal! That means we can just multiply that 10 billion Joules of energy by 110 floors and get the total, to a very good approximation. Let's see now, that's
110 floors * 10,362,544,260J (see, I'm being conservative, took the lower value)
= 1,139,879,868,600J
OK, now how much is 1.1 trillion joules in tons of TNT-equivalent? Let's see, now, a ton of TNT is 4,184,000,000J. So how many tons of TNT is 1,139,879,868,600J?
1,139,879,868,600J / 4,184,000,000J/t = 272t

Now, that's 272 tons of TNT, more or less; five hundred forty one-thousand-pound blockbuster bombs, more or less. That's over a quarter kiloton. We're talking about as much energy as a small nuclear weapon- and we've only calculated the kinetic energy of the falling building. We haven't added in the burning fuel, or the burning paper and cloth and wood and plastic, or the kinetic energy of impact of the plane (which, by the way, would have substantially turned to heat, and been put into the tower by the plane debris, that's another small nuclear weapon-equivalent) and we've got enough heat to melt the entire whole thing.

Remember, we haven't added the energy of four floors of burning wood, plastic, cloth and paper, at- let's be conservative, say half the weight is stuff like that and half is metal, so 25lbs/sqft? And then how about as much energy as the total collapse again, from the plane impact? And what about the energy from the burning fuel? You know, I'm betting we have a kiloton to play with here. I bet we have a twentieth of the energy that turned the entire city of Nagasaki into a flat burning plain with a hundred-foot hole surrounded by a mile of firestorm to work with. - Schneibster edited by Debunking 911

Let me make this clear, I don't assume to know what the ACTUAL fall time was. Anyone telling you they know is lying. The above calculation doesn't say that's the fall time. That was not its purpose. It's only a quick calculation which serves its purpose. To show that the buildings could have fallen within the time it did. It's absurd to suggest one can make simple calculations and know the exact fall time. You need a super computer with weeks of calculation to take into account the office debris, plumbing, ceiling tile etc.. etc... Was it 14 or was it 16? It doesn't matter to the point I'm making, which is the fall times are well within the possibility for normal collapse. Also, the collapse wasn't at free fall as conspiracy theorists suggest."

 

[candycorn]

You should try leaving your basement from time to time.

The photographs were from PBS's series "Rebuilding America". Google it and try to learn something.

All you need to do is look at pictures of ground zero hours after the buildings were destroyed to know those pictures are too trivial to matter. What happened to those buildings required far too much energy too have been done by a gravitational collapse.

This is physics and all you can come up with is psychological bullshit.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSueQsVsk_M[/ame]

psik

I love that part... "this is physics". No, it's a bunch of opinions. Am I skiing the kiddie slopes this morning?

Actually you said there were no filing cabinets. I showed you filing cabinets.
Actually you said there was nothing larger than a phone. I showed you objects larger than a phone.

Care to go for the tri-fecta?