when conservatives rock out about oil

[JiggsCasey]

Where's you link to the source of that piece?

ooops.

right in the post, cool guy... not that you couldn't find it with a simple Google search. But why analyze known data when you can just punt to unfalsifiable claim like you do!?

 

[Oddball]

Yeah...After you edited the post.

From the latently produced link:

The 40-page report is full of data gathered from (nondescript) government and private sources but makes no recommendations.

Riiiiiight....They report on a report, yet don't source it at all.

Pardon me....My bullshit detector just went off and I need to go reset it.

 

[JiggsCasey]

Yeah...After you edited the post.

From the latently produced link:

The 40-page report is full of data gathered from (nondescript) government and private sources but makes no recommendations.

Riiiiiight....They report on a report, yet don't source it at all.

Pardon me....My bullshit detector just went off and I need to go reset it.

Pathetic... So everyone is lying. It's all a big conspiracy.

But lemme guess: when Dick Cheney hides US energy policy from the American people all the way to the Supreme Count, that's for our own good, right? Conservative situational ethics, for the WIN!!!

Again, where is the oil? Where are the proven reserves off our shores, at what amount?

I know it's hard for you to come to terms with, but:

You.... dont... know... what... you're.... talking... about...

You're like an obedient studio audience member at Huckabee's little variety show.

 

[Mr. H.]

Jiggy, I'm curious - what is your opinion of the over 500,000 oilwells in this country which on average produce 2 to 3 barrels of oil per day? Can't you see the rationale behind collective contribution?

The big selling point for ethanol as an example was that "every gallon of ethanol is one less gallon of oil to import". Domestic oil production has the same effect.

The message of "drill here, drill now" is the production of American energy, reduction in imports, creation of jobs, reduction of trade imbalances, energy security.

Sustainable? No. But why should that concept negate the effectiveness of discovering and producing even one barrel of additional oil here in the U.S.?

 

[Oddball]

Yeah...After you edited the post.

From the latently produced link:

The 40-page report is full of data gathered from (nondescript) government and private sources but makes no recommendations.

Riiiiiight....They report on a report, yet don't source it at all.

Pardon me....My bullshit detector just went off and I need to go reset it.

Pathetic... So everyone is lying. It's all a big conspiracy.

But lemme guess: when Dick Cheney hides US energy policy from the American people all the way to the Supreme Count, that's for our own good, right? Conservative situational ethics, for the WIN!!!

Again, where is the oil? Where are the proven reserves off our shores, at what amount?

I know it's hard for you to come to terms with, but:

You.... dont... know... what... you're.... talking... about...

You're like an obedient studio audience member at Huckabee's little variety show.

If they're not at least shading their "findings", if not outright lying, why not source the whole report, rather than just pull out a few passages from it?

I know enough about business to know that if there weren't viable and useful reserves off the coast, there'd be neither any need for a drilling moratorium nor oil companies interested in drilling.

But I guess little nuances of substance like that escape the committed Malthusian declinist ideologue, huh?

 

[JiggsCasey]

Jiggy, I'm curious - what is your opinion of the over 500,000 oilwells in this country which on average produce 2 to 3 barrels of oil per day? Can't you see the rationale behind collective contribution?

The big selling point for ethanol as an example was that "every gallon of ethanol is one less gallon of oil to import". Domestic oil production has the same effect.

The message of "drill here, drill now" is the production of American energy, reduction in imports, creation of jobs, reduction of trade imbalances, energy security.

Sustainable? No. But why should that concept negate the effectiveness of discovering and producing even one barrel of additional oil here in the U.S.?

Because growth is based on EROEI, or energy returned on energy invested... If you have to build infrastructure all over the place for separate little kiddie pools, you're going to lose money.

What matters are centralized, massive pools of proven reserves. Like Ghawar in Saudi (clearly dying) and Cantarell in Mexico (almost dead).

 

[JiggsCasey]

If they're not at least shading their "findings", if not outright lying, why not source the whole report, rather than just pull out a few passages from it?

I know enough about business to know that if there weren't viable and useful reserves off the coast, there'd be neither any need for a drilling moratorium nor oil companies interested in drilling.

But I guess little nuances of substance like that escape the committed Malthusian declinist ideologue, huh?

In other words, you can't allude to where the oil is in any significant amount. Just lean on nuance and unfalsifiable claims regarding your distant memory. Should support your thesis going forward.

 

[Oddball]

I know bullshit when I smell it....I also know how owners of profitable businesses operate.

Now, can you 'splain why there'd be companies interested in exploration and a need for a moratorium on drilling, if the reserves were as minuscule as claimed?

 

[Mr. H.]

Jiggy, I'm curious - what is your opinion of the over 500,000 oilwells in this country which on average produce 2 to 3 barrels of oil per day? Can't you see the rationale behind collective contribution?

The big selling point for ethanol as an example was that "every gallon of ethanol is one less gallon of oil to import". Domestic oil production has the same effect.

The message of "drill here, drill now" is the production of American energy, reduction in imports, creation of jobs, reduction of trade imbalances, energy security.

Sustainable? No. But why should that concept negate the effectiveness of discovering and producing even one barrel of additional oil here in the U.S.?

Because growth is based on EROEI, or energy returned on energy invested... If you have to build infrastructure all over the place for separate little kiddie pools, you're going to lose money.

What matters are centralized, massive pools of proven reserves. Like Ghawar in Saudi (clearly dying) and Cantarell in Mexico (almost dead).

What matters, and what has worked for over 100 years, is cumulative production - currently 7 to 8 million barrels of oil per day in the U.S. Every barrel contributes, even production from wells that make 1 barrel per day. And yes, a one barrel per day well can be profitable at $70/barrel.

As to infrastructure "all over the place" - the half million wells I mentioned may consist of groups of a few wells to a few hundred wells. The oil is pumped into storage tanks that are drained by tank trucks that take it to a central facility and from there via pipeline to a refinery or another larger receiving facility.

This "all or nothing" notion to energy policy has been killing us for decades. Do we honestly need to jump head first into a "green" renewable/sustainable economy at the risk of destroying our ability to continue finding and producing hydrocarbons?

This is what gets me about the green crowd- total commitment to a singular agenda without regard to the contribution of an industry that has contributed so much to our economy, security, and quality of life for over 100 years.

 

[JiggsCasey]

I know bullshit when I smell it....

As do I. And you reek of it.

Now, can you 'splain why there'd be companies interested in exploration and a need for a moratorium on drilling, if the reserves were as minuscule as claimed?

You won't be weaseling out of this exchange by punting to another unfalsifiable question while ignoring my own very falsifiable question. Where are the reserves off our shores? In what amount?

Further, exploration is not drilling. There's barely any oil off our shores, as numerous seismological studies have indicated, including the one you're somehow "sure" is lying to us all.

Just face it. You ignore the data, and you pretend it's all fraudulent as it suits your paranoid self... Your argument is bankrupt.

 

[Oddball]

Now, can you 'splain why there'd be companies interested in exploration and a need for a moratorium on drilling, if the reserves were as minuscule as claimed?

You won't be weaseling out of this exchange by punting to another unfalsifiable question while ignoring my own very falsifiable question. Where are the reserves off our shores? In what amount?

Further, exploration is not drilling. There's barely any oil off our shores, as numerous seismological studies have indicated, including the one you're somehow "sure" is lying to us all.

Just face it. You ignore the data, and you pretend it's all fraudulent as it suits your paranoid self... Your argument is bankrupt.

So, you have no answer as to why energy producers would waste millions of dollars and irretrievable time and effort, drilling in places where there's little to no chance of turning a buck....Speaking of ignoring facts.

Didn't think so.

 

[Oddball]

And speaking of "punting to the unfalsifiable" where's the full text and sourcing for that goofy Florida report?

Hmmmmmm?

 

[The Infidel]

This... No doubt.

But also, cons usually don't seem to have a clue about just how minuscule our off-shore reserves are, no matter how much data they are shown. All they think they know is that if we just keep drilling holes in the ground, God will put more oil down there.

Cons won't admit there's a serious (and widening) global supply problem. They just demand that we keep feeding the beast for a system based on a myth: "infinite" growth. Environmental factors be damned.

This is exactly why it is a HUGE waste of time to even respond to this kind post....

All you have to say is how dumb "cons" are... with NO PROOF to back yourselves up. (plus.. last time I checked.... carbon life forms are still dying all around us, but dont let facts get in the way of a stupid story)

Plus, when us "cons", or is it "neo-cons" or zionists, or "racists"... suggest we start building nuclear power plants all you dumbasses do is say we have no good ideas!

I say drill baby drill!!!!! And if ya dont like that... too freeking bad! Walk to work and and freese to death for all I care.

Die dumbasses die!!!

 

[JiggsCasey]

What matters, and what has worked for over 100 years, is cumulative production - currently 7 to 8 million barrels of oil per day in the U.S. Every barrel contributes, even production from wells that make 1 barrel per day. And yes, a one barrel per day well can be profitable at $70/barrel.

As to infrastructure "all over the place" - the half million wells I mentioned may consist of groups of a few wells to a few hundred wells. The oil is pumped into storage tanks that are drained by tank trucks that take it to a central facility and from there via pipeline to a refinery or another larger receiving facility.

This "all or nothing" notion to energy policy has been killing us for decades. Do we honestly need to jump head first into a "green" renewable/sustainable economy at the risk of destroying our ability to continue finding and producing hydrocarbons?

This is what gets me about the green crowd- total commitment to a singular agenda without regard to the contribution of an industry that has contributed so much to our economy, security, and quality of life for over 100 years.

Within 5-10 years, you're not gonna have much of a choice. So you'd better start investment in renewables now, while there is (fiat) money to invest.

As for EROEI, which you summarily ignored, I'll put it to you this way, and hopefully you'll understand how it relates to growth:

You have a continent, and I have a continent. Exploration reveals that your continent "might contain as much as" a trillion barrels of sweet, light crude, while mine has proven reserves of 250 billion. My find is centrally located in 2 or 3 big pools, not far from the shore and distribution points. Your finds are sprinkled over hundreds of locations, from deep under water to far, far inland, requiring infrastructure and permits for each and every location. Worse, your finds are so far under bedrock and salt formations, that the recoverable total with any semblance of a slightly positive EROEI is somewhere around 10-15%. Worse still, your supply routes are hindered by civil unrest and sabotage. Now then, who's oil industry (and, thus, who's economy) is going to prosper? Yours or mine?​

I don't believe some people have a solid grasp of just how much the exploration models, infrastructure, extraction and refinery and distribution costs affect EROEI. Your "cumulative" factor is moot if it costs 1:1 to get the stuff to market. Even 2:1 or 3:1 is NOT SUSTAINING GROWTH for our economic paradigm predicated upon 7% expansion each year.

The fact of the matter is, they have not found a significant pool of light crude anywhere on God's green Earth in over 30 years. A lot of kiddie pools, but nothing abundant so as to keep up with skyrocketing demand. That shortfall is going to be 10 million barrels per day for our species, as confirmed by the IEA, the EIA, the Joint Chiefs, Total Oil, and our own Dept. of Energy.

 

[JiggsCasey]

This is exactly why it is a HUGE waste of time to even respond to this kind post....

All you have to say is how dumb "cons" are... with NO PROOF to back yourselves up.

Well, the PROOF backing up how dumb they are is in the video in the original post. The lyrics to the song, and the dumb obedient crowd that claps to it, all sure that there's plenty of oil here, when there is not.

Plus, when us "cons", or is it "neo-cons" or zionists, or "racists"... suggest we start building nuclear power plants all you dumbasses do is say we have no good ideas!

Actually, that's not what we say. Get our position correct, and you'd have a leg to stand on, angry little straw man champion.

When what we actually say in the face of hollow nuclear claims is "where is the uranium?" That's growing ever more scarce too, and doesn't even meet 60% of current global demand, let alone an expanded industry for it.

I say drill baby drill!!!!! And if ya dont like that... too freeking bad! Walk to work and and freese to death for all I care.

And there, in a nutshell, is the simple, inhumane mind of the con. As long as you have your gun and your SUV, to hell with everyone else.

Your heroes can drill all they like. They can also go bankrupt doing so, and play their part ramping up the inevitable prices at the pump.

Either way, you people will learn what's at stake here. Even now, while the evidence is all around us, from the geo-strategy, to the global economics, to the geology, to the secrecy of domestic energy policy, to the price at the pump, you guys remain in denial. Everyone comes around sooner or later. ....

Light ... crude... is... running... out. Deal with it.

Die dumbasses die!!![/FONT

Gosh, why do you wish this for your own ideologues?

 

[Oddball]

And there, in a nutshell, is the simple, inhumane mind of the con. As long as you have your gun and your SUV, to hell with everyone else.

Your heroes can drill all they like. They can also go bankrupt doing so, and play their part ramping up the inevitable prices at the pump.

Either way, you people will learn what's at stake here. Even now, while the evidence is all around us, from the geo-strategy, to the global economics, to the geology, to the secrecy of domestic energy policy, to the price at the pump, you guys remain in denial. Everyone comes around sooner or later. ....

Light ... crude... is... running... out. Deal with it.

There it is in a nutshell...The "mind" (for lack of a better term) of the Malthusian declinist.

If we were truly running out, the commodity prices would be skyrocketing...But we aren't and they aren't....That's the economics of it, Skippy.

 

[The Infidel]

This is exactly why it is a HUGE waste of time to even respond to this kind post....

All you have to say is how dumb "cons" are... with NO PROOF to back yourselves up.

Well, the PROOF backing up how dumb they are is in the video in the original post. The lyrics to the song, and the dumb obedient crowd that claps to it, all sure that there's plenty of oil here, when there is not.

Plus, when us "cons", or is it "neo-cons" or zionists, or "racists"... suggest we start building nuclear power plants all you dumbasses do is say we have no good ideas!

Actually, that's not what we say. Get our position correct, and you'd have a leg to stand on, angry little straw man champion.

When what we actually say in the face of hollow nuclear claims is "where is the uranium?" That's growing ever more scarce too, and doesn't even meet 60% of current global demand, let alone an expanded industry for it.

I say drill baby drill!!!!! And if ya dont like that... too freeking bad! Walk to work and and freese to death for all I care.

And there, in a nutshell, is the simple, inhumane mind of the con. As long as you have your gun and your SUV, to hell with everyone else.

Your heroes can drill all they like. They can also go bankrupt doing so, and play their part ramping up the inevitable prices at the pump.

Either way, you people will learn what's at stake here. Even now, while the evidence is all around us, from the geo-strategy, to the global economics, to the geology, to the secrecy of domestic energy policy, to the price at the pump, you guys remain in denial. Everyone comes around sooner or later. ....

Light ... crude... is... running... out. Deal with it.

Die dumbasses die!!![/FONT

Gosh, why do you wish this for your own ideologues?

SHIT..... LETS ALL JUST COMIT SUICIDE!

 

[JiggsCasey]

There it is in a nutshell...The "mind" (for lack of a better term) of the Malthusian declinist.

If we were truly running out, the commodity prices would be skyrocketing...But we aren't and they aren't....That's the economics of it, Skippy.

LOL. How can you even say that with a straight face? Price IS skyrocketing.... hello? ... 300% in 10 years?

You ARE paying attention to the longterm, big picture here, yes? Or is it just that anything that doesn't happen over-night isn't happening?

Again, once more... Where is the oil off our shores? In what proven reserve total? Are we not consuming 20 million barrels per day, just here in the U.S. alone?

 

[Oddball]

The price is much more reflective of a grossly inflated currency....The USD isn't worth but 1/10th what it was in the 1950s, if that much.

Inflation adjusted Gasoline Prices

Now, where's the sourcing for that dippy Florida report?

 

[JiggsCasey]

SHIT..... LETS ALL JUST COMIT SUICIDE![/FONT]

Well, you guys can. Help yourselves.