What is really killing the A-10 Off

Discussion in 'Military' started by Daryl Hunt, Aug 4, 2017.

  1. Ringel05
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    Ringel05 Diamond Member

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    The Scorpion is impressive except for one major flaw, unlike the A-10 the Scorpion is very vulnerable in a high risk combat environment same as the Tucano. Great CAS planes in a low risk combat environment.
     
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  2. Daryl Hunt
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    Daryl Hunt Gold Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    With the coming of the net bag of tricks the grunts have, the A-10 flying below 15k is no longer able to handle low altitude attacks and expect to get out of it. The A-10 is dying a slow, spiraling death due to age. By 2025, there won't be enough air worthy ones to justify keeping it in the inventory. If a serious replacement were to be built, it would have to have all the neat toys and end up costing at least 85 mil. Low altitude attacks just aren't worth the cost. The difference between a serious replacement of the A-10 and the AT-6A or A-29 buys a hell of a lot of cheaper AS type weapons that can be carried by the fighters, bombers and ACs makes it not worth the cost of the replacement for the A-10.

    Now, take a cheap attack bird, it just might be justified. My pick would be the AT-6A since it already has all the neat toys from the A-10 incorporated into it. And you will need to add some of the F-15E toys as well since the A-10 can't terrain follow like the F-15E can. You can keep the cost down to about 20 mil and do those missions that the others can't do (actually, the F-15E can do it as well but costs 110 mil a copy).

    The A-10 can't survive in a high threat anymore than an AT-6A can. If we got into it with a country that is well equipped then neither could survive a down in the dirt flight. But at night, overcast sky, and just nasty weather where the threat is low, then either can do the mission.

    I have a saying. ICUUCMe. I see you, you can see me. There is a reason that Spec Ops almost soley uses the AC-130 for cover. It flies and operates at a higher altitude so only SAMS can reach it and they are very capable of taking out the sam before the sam can get off a shot and do it cheaply and accurately. They need cover from their little friends (fighters). But they can hit within feet of their targets 100% of the time with cheap weapons like the 25, 30, 105mm guns. When DSII was started, in order to land those choppers in the valley, it was the AC-130 that fired the first shots enabling Spec Ops to start taking out the entrenched defenders in the hills. But we didn't hear about that since it was "Classified". When it's time to take out the Tanker Trucks, the A-10 gets the dangerous job but the real killing is done by the AC-130. The A-10 gives the enemy something to shoot at but bags a truck each pass. The problem is, after only a couple of passes, the A-10 has to get a drink. The AC just orbits one time to get his mission done and can move on to his next assignment. The AC just moves from target to target until all threats or targets are destroyed. But if push comes to shove, the AC can stick around for hours and make things blow up. The AT--6A or the A-29 could do the same mission as the A-10 on the tanker truck because your real mission is to be seen and then flit away and do it on the cheap side. But the wholesale damage is being done by one lone AC. The enemy has no idea that the AC is in the area and you want to keep it that way. They have no idea that the real death isn't coming from the A-10 or AT-6A or any other attack bird. All they know is that they are dying quickly. Strange, but, if cost is no object, a Buff could replace the AC in the same mission and get the same results using JDAMs.

    The Marines proved this with the OV-10Ds recently. If you were to build new OV-10s and put in the new toys, then it's much better than either the AT-6A or the A-29. But it will cost about 8 mil more per copy. The AT-6A and the A-29 would have costs about 12 mil per copy (adding the new toys and it's going to be 20 mil, while the OV-10D+ would cost about 28 mil. While the OV-10 would be more versatile, is it worth the extra 8 mil? The Military doesn't think so.

    Now, would you place the serious A-10 replacement in harms way (in the weeds) at 85 mil a copy? Not hardly. The loss of even one pays for at least 3 AT-6As and A-29s doing the same job. Remember, there are fewer than 180 flyable A-10s left. And as their air frames crack, there will be less and less every year. You can replace the wings, the Avionics, the Gun, and everything else but it all has to attach to the air frame one way or another. Unless they restart from scratch the A-10s manufacturing line (the originals were built for 12 mil but would cost about 85 mil today to build) we need to take a good look at alternatives.
     
  3. Manonthestreet
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    Manonthestreet Platinum Member Supporting Member

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    We a
    Not being built for high risk.....neither are the others......being built for what you are currently fighting
     
  4. Ringel05
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    Ringel05 Diamond Member

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    I just woke up and have not had my first cup of coffee yet...... And you actually think I'm going to read all of that. Give it to my adjutant, he'll brief me later.
     
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  5. Ringel05
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    Ringel05 Diamond Member

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    Racists and political hacks? :dunno:

    Yeah but what happens if that scenario changes over night........? We lose a lot of pilots. Ever hear of "preparing for all contingencies" or "having the right tool for the job"? It only partially matters what we're current;y fighting the tool has to be prepared to deal with any situation in it area of operation.
     
  6. Manonthestreet
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    Manonthestreet Platinum Member Supporting Member

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    Preparing for all contingencies includes low end conflict......evem in high end when the situation gets fluid you arent going to encounter impenetrable AA fire. Now I might not build em in the same quantity though the scorpion with its modularity can fill more than one role.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2017 at 10:49 AM
  7. Ringel05
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    Ringel05 Diamond Member

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    You don't work for Textron or any of it's affiliates/partners do ya? Just asking........
     
  8. Manonthestreet
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    Manonthestreet Platinum Member Supporting Member

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    Lame........
     
  9. Ringel05
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    Ringel05 Diamond Member

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    Oh shit, grow a funny bone will ya........ :rolleyes:
     
  10. Daryl Hunt
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    Daryl Hunt Gold Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Sorry about that. Next time I will type slower and use smaller words.
     

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