We should treat guns like we treat cars! Yeah!

[M14 Shooter]

Bullshit
If you take a car from the dealership to your house, you are on public property.

If you DRIVE the car. Thats operation/use.

That's transportation, not operation/use.

No.. you TRANSPORT it.
And, in your car, in, say, your trunk, you are not carrying it - you are, inarguably, transporting it.

This is a stupid weak argument. The whole analogy is dumb. A car isnt a gun. Their use is very different. Their place in society is very different.

So... you disagree with those that believe that guns shoudl be treated the same as cars.

If you park the car, it must be registered. If you push the car, it must be registered.

On public property. Push it into your barn, and there's no need to register it.

Guns arent much different.

So you agree then that if we treat guns just as we treat cars, you do not need to register a gun that is used/stored on private propoerty.

 

[konradv]

Just about every rabid gun owner I've ever talked to, seems to have delusions of stopping some imaginary crime with their gun and them being a hero.

Just about every rabid gun grabber I've ever talked to seems to have delusions of making society safe by removing our Constitutionally Protected Right to Bear Arms.
Bystander with gun stops Palm Bay bank robbery

Moving the goalposts. Scratch a "gunner" and all of a sudden "licensing" becomes "grabbing".

 

[Wry Catcher]

Did anyone miss that this idiot also wants to end the licensing of hunters?

lolol

I doubt he's an idiot, I suspect his vocation - at least his advocation - is guns and he's scared to death THEY will come and take his toys or livelihood away.
Clearly he doesn't give one shit about those who will suffer as a result of gun violence.

 

[M14 Shooter]

The village that I work in has an ordinance that you cannot have an unregistered motor vehicle on your property.
Bye-bye.

Good to see you are happy to maintain your irrelevance.

I proved that if you treat guns like cars, then passing laws against the owning of either unregistered guns perfectly fits the analogy.

You did not. You made a claim, one that you have now shown to be true, and one that is, put softly, less than comprehensive.

So your entire premise is shot down.

Not so. See above.

Keep in mind people, this poster is the one who thinks felons should be able to buy guns by not having to be subjected to a background check.

This is a lie, and one of your favorites.

In short, he's an idiot.

Says the liar.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Did anyone miss that this idiot also wants to end the licensing of hunters?
lolol

Not only a liar, but a liar with an active fantasy life.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Did anyone miss that this idiot also wants to end the licensing of hunters?

lolol

I doubt he's an idiot, I suspect his vocation - at least his advocation - is guns and he's scared to death THEY will come and take his toys or livelihood away.
Clearly he doesn't give one shit about those who will suffer as a result of gun violence.

I haven't read any fear in M14's post, a simple question with a comparison.


It's certainly not him in this thread who's trying to make an intellectual debate turn into an emotional diatribe.

 

[Bern80]

Several times over the last several weeks, several people have presented an argument to the effect that ‘we require licenses and registration for cars, so we should do the same for guns’.

To this, I habitually respond:
-You don’t need a license to buy or own a car, or to operate it on private property
-You don’t need to register a car to own it or operate it on private property
-You don’t need a license to transport a car, nor register a car that you transport
-The only time you need a license is to operate a car on public property
-the only time you need to register a car is to operate it on public property

SO... if we have the same requirements for guns as we do for cars, as these posters gleefully suggest, the only time you need a license or register a gun is if you use it on public property.

This never receives a response.

Gov't shouldn't register (tax) vehicles.
Gov't shouldn't register (tax) guns.

Now you're moving the goalposts. That's totally screwy, IMO. You can't run an advanced civilization like that.

Why exactly does an advanced society require that the government collect a fee to do certain things (i.e. drive, carry a gun, hunt, fish, build, etc.)? All government is doing is putting a rubber stamp on these things. We have rules that drivers, for example must abide by. You can't speed. You can't drive wrecklessly, etc. Government lincensure of anything is meaningless. You can take away government's ability to collect a license fee and distribute licenses and keep everything else the same. I'm a hunter for example. Every year I have to buy a license to hunt whatever it is I want to hunt or fish. Does the piece of paper in my wallet change the fact that I can only keep so many fish? No. Does a little card in my pocket change the fact that I can't pass someone on a double yellow line legally? No. Licensure is simply a gov't money grab. Nothing more.

 

[The Rabbi]

Boy I hope so.

Just about every rabid gun owner I've ever talked to, seems to have delusions of stopping some imaginary crime with their gun and them being a hero.



Perhaps since we are comparing guns to cars, we should discuss mental competency tests to insure potentially unstable gun buyers aren't able to obtain access to a gun.
I'd like to see some minimum mental standards for firearms possession implemented.

People with mental conditions are already prohibitedmfrom purchasing or legally owning firearms.

Not so.
The language is 'adjudicated mentally defective." Someone who has had himself committed for depression is still eligible.

 

[Chris]

Since anywhere between the gun shop and your home is public property you seem to have undermined your own argument.

 

[Nosmo King]

Gov't shouldn't register (tax) vehicles.
Gov't shouldn't register (tax) guns.

Now you're moving the goalposts. That's totally screwy, IMO. You can't run an advanced civilization like that.

Why exactly does an advanced society require that the government collect a fee to do certain things (i.e. drive, carry a gun, hunt, fish, build, etc.)?

Auto fees are collected to pay for maintaining the roads and the safety personnel who patrol them. Building permits and fees are to keep unsafe buildings from ever being built so rescue forces don't have to rush in after a collapse or unwarranted fire. Hunting and fishing license provide the funding to maintain wildlife environments and pay for the needed research to manager wildlife.

Have you lived here long?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Did anyone miss that this idiot also wants to end the licensing of hunters?

lolol

I doubt he's an idiot, I suspect his vocation - at least his advocation - is guns and he's scared to death THEY will come and take his toys or livelihood away.
Clearly he doesn't give one shit about those who will suffer as a result of gun violence.

I haven't read any fear in M14's post, a simple question with a comparison.

It's certainly not him in this thread who's trying to make an intellectual debate turn into an emotional diatribe.

Or bring up hed herrings in an attempt to avoid the issue.

You either agree with the idea that we should treat guns the same way we treat cars, or you don't. If you agree with the idea, then you necessarily agree with the points I made rerarding the conditions under which you can require licensing and registration for guns; if you do not agree with the idea, then all you need to do say so.

 

[The Rabbi]

Since anywhere between the gun shop and your home is public property you seem to have undermined your own argument.

Get it delivered by a licensed carrier

Illegal

 

[The Rabbi]

If you DRIVE the car. Thats operation/use.

That's transportation, not operation/use.

No.. you TRANSPORT it.
And, in your car, in, say, your trunk, you are not carrying it - you are, inarguably, transporting it.

So... you disagree with those that believe that guns shoudl be treated the same as cars.

If you park the car, it must be registered. If you push the car, it must be registered.

On public property. Push it into your barn, and there's no need to register it.

Guns arent much different.

So you agree then that if we treat guns just as we treat cars, you do not need to register a gun that is used/stored on private propoerty.

I dont think guns ought to be registered at all. In fact, I think virtually every gun law is stupid and a waste of time.

 

[Nosmo King]

I doubt he's an idiot, I suspect his vocation - at least his advocation - is guns and he's scared to death THEY will come and take his toys or livelihood away.
Clearly he doesn't give one shit about those who will suffer as a result of gun violence.

I haven't read any fear in M14's post, a simple question with a comparison.

It's certainly not him in this thread who's trying to make an intellectual debate turn into an emotional diatribe.

Or bring up hed herrings in an attempt to avoid the issue.

You either agree with the idea that we should treat guns the same way we treat cars, or you don't. If you agree with the idea, then you necessarily agree with the points I made rgearding the conditions under which you can require licensing and registration for guns; if you do not agree with the idea, then all you need to do say so.

I think guns should be registered for the same reasons I think cars should be registered. To prevent the unauthorized sale of stolen guns or cars.

But I do not agree with the premise you propose. Private property vs. public property.

Cars are not like guns in that cars are operated by a person within the car. guns are operated by someone who could be standing on private property while he pulls the trigger, but the shot could travel unsupervised across property lines and impact someone else's private property.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Since anywhere between the gun shop and your home is public property you seem to have undermined your own argument.

Get it delivered by a licensed carrier

Illegal

:roll:
Lets take this slowly. Yes/no is all that is necessary
Do you need a license to buy a car?
Do you need a license to own a car?
Do you need a license to drive your car on private property?

 

[M14 Shooter]

I haven't read any fear in M14's post, a simple question with a comparison.

It's certainly not him in this thread who's trying to make an intellectual debate turn into an emotional diatribe.

Or bring up hed herrings in an attempt to avoid the issue.

You either agree with the idea that we should treat guns the same way we treat cars, or you don't. If you agree with the idea, then you necessarily agree with the points I made rgearding the conditions under which you can require licensing and registration for guns; if you do not agree with the idea, then all you need to do say so.

I think guns should be registered for the same reasons I think cars should be registered. To prevent the unauthorized sale of stolen guns or cars.

False premise - registration prevents nothing of the sort.
But.. if you believe that guns should be treated like cars, then you belive than the only guns that need to be registered are those used on public property.

But I do not agree with the premise you propose. Private property vs. public property.

Then you disagree with the premise that guns should be treated like cars as all of the restrictions regarding cars are related to use on public property.
If so, I am sure that YOU will be sure to mention this whenever someone brings it up.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Get it delivered by a licensed carrier

Illegal

:roll:
Lets take this slowly. Yes/no is all that is necessary
Do you need a license to buy a car?
Do you need a license to own a car?
Do you need a license to drive your car on private property?

I don't understand why people are bringing up the law in terms of guns anyways.

You're simply asking if guns should be handled lawfully the same as cars, nothing about what the current gun laws are.

 

[Nosmo King]

Or bring up hed herrings in an attempt to avoid the issue.

You either agree with the idea that we should treat guns the same way we treat cars, or you don't. If you agree with the idea, then you necessarily agree with the points I made rgearding the conditions under which you can require licensing and registration for guns; if you do not agree with the idea, then all you need to do say so.

I think guns should be registered for the same reasons I think cars should be registered. To prevent the unauthorized sale of stolen guns or cars.

False premise - registration prevents nothing of the sort.
But.. if you believe that guns should be treated like cars, then you belive than the only guns that need to be registered are those used on public property.

But I do not agree with the premise you propose. Private property vs. public property.

Then you disagree with the premise that guns should be treated like cars as all of the restrictions regarding cars are related to use on public property.
If so, I am sure that YOU will be sure to mention this whenever someone brings it up.

No. I own a gun and I think it should be registered. Fro my own safety, and the safety of the general public. If my gun was stolen, I would like to recover it if possible. If the gun was registered, I could then prove my ownership.

The use and operation of my gun on private or public property is not a defining issue. If my shot goes from my private property and smashes into the side of your house (your private property), the fault cannot be wiped away by my claim that I was using my gun on private property and therefore I should not register it. Not anymore than if my parking brake fails and my car drifts onto the public street or across it and into your private property.

Either way, my car should be registered. If only to get it back if it's stolen and someone tries to sell it.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Illegal

:roll:
Lets take this slowly. Yes/no is all that is necessary
Do you need a license to buy a car?
Do you need a license to own a car?
Do you need a license to drive your car on private property?

I don't understand why people are bringing up the law in terms of guns anyways.

You're simply asking if guns should be handled lawfully the same as cars, nothing about what the current gun laws are.

Actually, I am simply noting that when I illustrate the effect of treating guns like cars, those that advocate the positions that we do so have little to say about it.

One can only surmise that they agree with the points I made and are OK with the idea that gun owners can only be licensed and guns can only registered pursuant to use of those gun on public property.

 

[IndependntLogic]

Several times over the last several weeks, several people have presented an argument to the effect that ‘we require licenses and registration for cars, so we should do the same for guns’.

To this, I habitually respond:
-You don’t need a license to buy or own a car, or to operate it on private property
-You don’t need to register a car to own it or operate it on private property
-You don’t need a license to transport a car, nor register a car that you transport
-The only time you need a license is to operate a car on public property
-the only time you need to register a car is to operate it on public property

SO... if we have the same requirements for guns as we do for cars, as these posters gleefully suggest, the only time you need a license or register a gun is if you use it on public property.

This never receives a response.

I own a gun. No problem with people owning guns. I don't think guns laws are the solution to our problem - and only a fool would say the USA doesn't have a gun violence problem.
I think our problem stems from enforcement. You may be able to own a car under all those circumstances but you can't sell it - and that's a good thing - otherwise the illegal sale of stolen cars would run amok.
The FBI says on their website that the single largest source of illegal gun sales is
"home dealers". Anyone with a clean record can get a license to deal arms and have less than a 1% chance that they will ever be given so much as a glance by any kind of regulatory agency whatsoever. Apparently there are an awful lot of people who licenses to deal and sell off the books. Shocking to anyone?
So laws are only deterrents but if there is no enforcement, they're not even that.

Oh, and I would have no problem with registration and licensing prior to gun ownership. It could waived for those of us who received training in the military but I've seen idiots at the range point a weapon at others with the safety off while they were "chatting"! Lucky they don't blown their own danm foot off. I think a day at a range with a pro would benefit a lot of people and prevent a huge number of accidental deaths.

I'm not really sure how this addresses the topic.
Perhaps you could clarify?

Sure. You use the car analogy to support the argument there should be no registration, licensing etc... of guns. I disagree.

Simple yes or no question: Do we have a gun violence problem in America?
I would say yes.
Gun advocates love to say that gun laws don't deter gun violence. I disagree. I would contend that it is the lack of enforcement and also that many of the laws / sentences are inadequate.
I would also contend that it is necessary to register guns as this chain of information is one of the most common devices used to solve murders.
I would also like to see mandatory training as I've see and read about people who have no business being anywhere near a gun.
Finally, I would like to see a huge increase in ATF manpower so that the source of so many illegally sold weapons (home dealers) could be stemmed.

Oh and someone said something about the mentally ill. If someone has been diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia etc... it seems like common sense not to give them a weapon.

The biggest problem with your analogy of the cars is that no one buys a car for the purpose of hiding it in their garage. Even if they did, it would virtually impossible to kill someone with a parked car. Whereas people kill people with guns in their homes all the time. Husbands kill wives, a vet just got shot by some idiot who was arguing over football at a party, kids shoot themselves etc... Haven't heard of anyone getting pissed off and driving over someone in their garage.