War on The Rich: Dumbest Idea in History of Man

[Darkwind]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

The propaganda is the belief that wealth should be equally distributed in society.

It is class warfare to deliberately seek to harm one group of people out of greed and envy. People who are in want are people who are striving to be more than they are. Or they used to be. Until the mentality such as yours comes along and eliminates the need for people to strive to be better.

Rather they have it handed to them through false prophecy of compassion than to hunger to be better.

 

[rightwinger]

The wealth of any nation is finite. The more of it the rich concentrate in their own hands, the less there is left for everyone else.

Wrong! Wealth is NOT finite, it is infinite. People generate wealth through their labor, creativity, talents, etc. This is your key problem, the failure to understand wealth is not finite. When you believe such a fallacy, it causes you to think the wealthy should only become so wealthy else the poor can never become wealthy. It makes you believe there is only so much wealth and the wealthy have it all.

The truth is, wealth is generated, so wealth is limitless. Now the people who are wealthy in a nation, especially a free market economy nation like our own, generally got wealthy because they were smart with their money, were successful at free market capitalism, and had the drive, motivation and ambition to succeed. Many came from abject poverty to become wealthy. Seems to me, the really "smart" person might want to listen to them, learn from them, try to emulate them and find out about how they were successful.

Just total opposite of what you want to do.

How can wealth be infinite. Is the annual GDP number 'infinity'?

A nation can only generate so much wealth per year; the more of it the Rich keep, the less for the rest of us.

Without the rich, you will not receive your welfare check. So quit complaining.

It is the workers who create wealth, not the rich
The rich control available wealth and decide where it will go

 

[NYcarbineer]

So you want to listen to the Rich, I posted a quote from Andrew Carnegie.

Hey, I can appreciate Carnegie and what he's saying, money isn't everything. I personally know very wealthy people who benevolently give massive amounts of their fortunes to various philanthropic causes. That's the great thing about having lots of really wealthy people around, the money flows generously.

What I can't figure out is why your stupid ass wants to make this the enemy?

It's the Rich who made the not-rich the enemy.

It wasn't the working class who moved the work to China, was it?

 

[Darkwind]

The wealth of any nation is finite. The more of it the rich concentrate in their own hands, the less there is left for everyone else.

A proven lie.

It's mathematically impossible to divide a pie into pieces that then add up to a sum bigger than the original pie.

It is NOT mathematically impossible to grow a pie that can then be cut into more and more pieces.

Otherwise, we would all be scraping and fighting for the original 1000 ounces of gold.

Wealth is created, and created wealth grows a larger pie.

This HAS BEEN PROVEN.

 

[Darkwind]

So you want to listen to the Rich, I posted a quote from Andrew Carnegie.

Hey, I can appreciate Carnegie and what he's saying, money isn't everything. I personally know very wealthy people who benevolently give massive amounts of their fortunes to various philanthropic causes. That's the great thing about having lots of really wealthy people around, the money flows generously.

What I can't figure out is why your stupid ass wants to make this the enemy?

It's the Rich who made the not-rich the enemy.

It wasn't the working class who moved the work to China, was it?

That is like saying that the athlete made the nerd because the nerd can't perform and therefore the athlete should have their hamstrings cut.

 

[Darkwind]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

Yes, propaganda. There's no problem with wealth distribution. There is a problem with people who think wealth is finite. As you admit here, wealth is genertated. Therefore, not finite. And yes, the so-called "middle class" actually generate more wealth than any other group just through their sheer numbers. The poor tend to not generate as much wealth, but that's generally why they are poor. Now maybe they are just not motivated, maybe they are downright lazy, or maybe they've been convinced wealth is finite and it's not their fault, and nothing can be done for them because they are just poor.

Our system is not flawed in any way. Again, our system has created more millionaires and billionaires than any system ever devised by man. If not, give me an example of one that tops it? Good luck with that!

If wealth is infinite, why do you people like you complain so much about wealth redistribution?

If wealth is in infinite supply, why would you care who gets how much? Why would care that a government program gives the poor some of that wealth if it is coming from an infinite source?

Everyone complains about the theft of what has been earned.

When I put out the effort, YOU do not get the credit.

 

[rightwinger]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

The propaganda is the belief that wealth should be equally distributed in society.

It is class warfare to deliberately seek to harm one group of people out of greed and envy. People who are in want are people who are striving to be more than they are. Or they used to be. Until the mentality such as yours comes along and eliminates the need for people to strive to be better.

Rather they have it handed to them through false prophecy of compassion than to hunger to be better.

Nobody is asking to take money away from rich people and give it to the poor. What we are asking is why does our government continue economic policies that ensure more wealth is distributed at the top. These policies were supposed to result in more jobs and a rising economic tide that benefitted everyone
Those policies did not work.....why do we continue them?

 

[occupied]

The wealth of any nation is finite. The more of it the rich concentrate in their own hands, the less there is left for everyone else.

A proven lie.

It's mathematically impossible to divide a pie into pieces that then add up to a sum bigger than the original pie.

I know the argument that he is making and the flaw is that liquid assets are the essential part of wealth that grows the economy. Theoretically there is no end of wealth but there is a definite limit to economic activity and it is all based on how much wealth is allowed to flow through the economy and how much personal debt is dragging it down.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

The propaganda is the belief that wealth should be equally distributed in society.

It is class warfare to deliberately seek to harm one group of people out of greed and envy. People who are in want are people who are striving to be more than they are. Or they used to be. Until the mentality such as yours comes along and eliminates the need for people to strive to be better.

Rather they have it handed to them through false prophecy of compassion than to hunger to be better.

That's a strawman because there are very very very very very few people who demand that wealth be equally distributed.

It's class warfare to seek to harm one group out of greed?

So if a big corporation is viable and profitable as is, but seeks for example to move jobs overseas to make the corporation even more profitable,

which in the process will harm a great number of Americans currently holding those jobs,

that is class warfare, correct?

 

[rightwinger]

So you want to listen to the Rich, I posted a quote from Andrew Carnegie.

Hey, I can appreciate Carnegie and what he's saying, money isn't everything. I personally know very wealthy people who benevolently give massive amounts of their fortunes to various philanthropic causes. That's the great thing about having lots of really wealthy people around, the money flows generously.

What I can't figure out is why your stupid ass wants to make this the enemy?

It's the Rich who made the not-rich the enemy.

It wasn't the working class who moved the work to China, was it?

They have made working class Americans the enemy. It is not the rich who are being portrayed as greedy and selfish....it is the workers
We have the GOP to thank

 

[jknowgood]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

Yes, propaganda. There's no problem with wealth distribution. There is a problem with people who think wealth is finite. As you admit here, wealth is genertated. Therefore, not finite. And yes, the so-called "middle class" actually generate more wealth than any other group just through their sheer numbers. The poor tend to not generate as much wealth, but that's generally why they are poor. Now maybe they are just not motivated, maybe they are downright lazy, or maybe they've been convinced wealth is finite and it's not their fault, and nothing can be done for them because they are just poor.

Our system is not flawed in any way. Again, our system has created more millionaires and billionaires than any system ever devised by man. If not, give me an example of one that tops it? Good luck with that!

Our system has all but stopped creating middle-class wealth, the part that allows poor people through hard work and dedication to level up is not currently working as it should. Something about the great recession short-circuited it. It's far too easy to blame poor people for being lazy than to look at the structural flaws that keep people where they are in spite of any amount of diligence. The high cost of a quality education is one such barrier along with the millstone of debt that accompanies it. Flat wages are another problem, if a rising tide raises all boats than wages would have been keeping pace with the cost of living but they have not. The trouble is that you are looking too much at the people who started the race to the top at the finish line instead of the bottom.

What the middle class has lost is the ability to build generational wealth and move up the economic ladder over time. It now takes two salaries to break even. If you are lucky and healthy, you can retire somewhat comfortably
But the days where you could expect to be more successful than your parents are gone

You nailed it on the head. Now who is in charge?

 

[occupied]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

The propaganda is the belief that wealth should be equally distributed in society.

It is class warfare to deliberately seek to harm one group of people out of greed and envy. People who are in want are people who are striving to be more than they are. Or they used to be. Until the mentality such as yours comes along and eliminates the need for people to strive to be better.

Rather they have it handed to them through false prophecy of compassion than to hunger to be better.

Nobody is asking to take money away from rich people and give it to the poor. What we are asking is why does our government continue economic policies that ensure more wealth is distributed at the top. These policies were supposed to result in more jobs and a rising economic tide that benefitted everyone
Those policies did not work.....why do we continue them?

Those policies worked as intended, just not as advertised to the voters.

 

[NYcarbineer]

The wealth of any nation is finite. The more of it the rich concentrate in their own hands, the less there is left for everyone else.

A proven lie.

It's mathematically impossible to divide a pie into pieces that then add up to a sum bigger than the original pie.

I know the argument that he is making and the flaw is that liquid assets are the essential part of wealth that grows the economy. Theoretically there is no end of wealth but there is a definite limit to economic activity and it is all based by how much wealth is allowed to flow through the economy and how much personal debt is dragging it down.

A most fundamental principle of the study of economics is scarcity, not infinite supply.

What he is claiming thus defies the most fundamental principle of economics.

 

[NYcarbineer]

So you want to listen to the Rich, I posted a quote from Andrew Carnegie.

Hey, I can appreciate Carnegie and what he's saying, money isn't everything. I personally know very wealthy people who benevolently give massive amounts of their fortunes to various philanthropic causes. That's the great thing about having lots of really wealthy people around, the money flows generously.

What I can't figure out is why your stupid ass wants to make this the enemy?

It's the Rich who made the not-rich the enemy.

It wasn't the working class who moved the work to China, was it?

They have made working class Americans the enemy. It is not the rich who are being portrayed as greedy and selfish....it is the workers
We have the GOP to thank

Starting with unions. It's greed if the workers want a bigger share of the wealth produced by an industry, and yet,

it's somehow good, according to these apologists for the wealthy, if the rich owners of the industry get to keep as big a share as they can.

In fact, these apologists are all for taking away every bit possible of the ability of the workers to fight for a bigger share.

 

[occupied]

The wealth of any nation is finite. The more of it the rich concentrate in their own hands, the less there is left for everyone else.

A proven lie.

It's mathematically impossible to divide a pie into pieces that then add up to a sum bigger than the original pie.

I know the argument that he is making and the flaw is that liquid assets are the essential part of wealth that grows the economy. Theoretically there is no end of wealth but there is a definite limit to economic activity and it is all based by how much wealth is allowed to flow through the economy and how much personal debt is dragging it down.

A most fundamental principle of the study of economics is scarcity, not infinite supply.

What he is claiming thus defies the most fundamental principle of economics.

Anyone who hasn't had a crisis of confidence in our economic system by now is just not paying attention.

 

[Darkwind]

Looks to me like the class war is over, the rich won.

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

The propaganda is the belief that wealth should be equally distributed in society.

It is class warfare to deliberately seek to harm one group of people out of greed and envy. People who are in want are people who are striving to be more than they are. Or they used to be. Until the mentality such as yours comes along and eliminates the need for people to strive to be better.

Rather they have it handed to them through false prophecy of compassion than to hunger to be better.

That's a strawman because there are very very very very very few people who demand that wealth be equally distributed.

It's class warfare to seek to harm one group out of greed?

So if a big corporation is viable and profitable as is, but seeks for example to move jobs overseas to make the corporation even more profitable,

which in the process will harm a great number of Americans currently holding those jobs,

that is class warfare, correct?

absolute fallacy. Seeking to minimize expenditures cannot in any way be equated with envious targeting of one class of people for greed and expansion of power of another.

This is not a equation of which benefits the most people.but a function of using a government to intentionally harm people. Last time I looked, that was illegal.

Let us not pretend that support of taking from the richest of of stems from any altruistic motivation. It stems from hate and greed of power and yes, the enrichment of those who promote such nonsense.

 

[rightwinger]

Again... This is the kind of propaganda you believe when you think wealth is finite.

Propaganda? If decrying the sorry state of wealth distribution is propaganda then what is your cheerleading for a flawed system that clearly leaves so many in want? Look at the reality of things, sure there is wealth being generated but not by wage earners. We do not have a perfect system, it is not a class war to examine the flaws and attempt to address them.

Yes, propaganda. There's no problem with wealth distribution. There is a problem with people who think wealth is finite. As you admit here, wealth is genertated. Therefore, not finite. And yes, the so-called "middle class" actually generate more wealth than any other group just through their sheer numbers. The poor tend to not generate as much wealth, but that's generally why they are poor. Now maybe they are just not motivated, maybe they are downright lazy, or maybe they've been convinced wealth is finite and it's not their fault, and nothing can be done for them because they are just poor.

Our system is not flawed in any way. Again, our system has created more millionaires and billionaires than any system ever devised by man. If not, give me an example of one that tops it? Good luck with that!

Our system has all but stopped creating middle-class wealth, the part that allows poor people through hard work and dedication to level up is not currently working as it should. Something about the great recession short-circuited it. It's far too easy to blame poor people for being lazy than to look at the structural flaws that keep people where they are in spite of any amount of diligence. The high cost of a quality education is one such barrier along with the millstone of debt that accompanies it. Flat wages are another problem, if a rising tide raises all boats than wages would have been keeping pace with the cost of living but they have not. The trouble is that you are looking too much at the people who started the race to the top at the finish line instead of the bottom.

What the middle class has lost is the ability to build generational wealth and move up the economic ladder over time. It now takes two salaries to break even. If you are lucky and healthy, you can retire somewhat comfortably
But the days where you could expect to be more successful than your parents are gone

You nailed it on the head. Now who is in charge?

Americans are some of the hardest working and productive workers on earth. What has happened to their wealth?
A serious health issue can still destroy your wealth, even if you have insurance. Almost everyone will become seriously ill at some point in their lives
Education used to be a gimme to generate more wealth. But the days of getting a career building job after college are gone

 

[Darkwind]

So you want to listen to the Rich, I posted a quote from Andrew Carnegie.

Hey, I can appreciate Carnegie and what he's saying, money isn't everything. I personally know very wealthy people who benevolently give massive amounts of their fortunes to various philanthropic causes. That's the great thing about having lots of really wealthy people around, the money flows generously.

What I can't figure out is why your stupid ass wants to make this the enemy?

It's the Rich who made the not-rich the enemy.

It wasn't the working class who moved the work to China, was it?

They have made working class Americans the enemy. It is not the rich who are being portrayed as greedy and selfish....it is the workers
We have the GOP to thank

Starting with unions. It's greed if the workers want a bigger share of the wealth produced by an industry, and yet,

it's somehow good, according to these apologists for the wealthy, if the rich owners of the industry get to keep as big a share as they can.

In fact, these apologists are all for taking away every bit possible of the ability of the workers to fight for a bigger share.

You confuse share with ownership.

Do the employees own the business? No. Do the Employees share the risk of lost wages if the economy turns down? Do the employees pay back the costs they incur to business through their theft of material goods and time?

 

[Darkwind]

The wealth of any nation is finite. The more of it the rich concentrate in their own hands, the less there is left for everyone else.

A proven lie.

It's mathematically impossible to divide a pie into pieces that then add up to a sum bigger than the original pie.

I know the argument that he is making and the flaw is that liquid assets are the essential part of wealth that grows the economy. Theoretically there is no end of wealth but there is a definite limit to economic activity and it is all based on how much wealth is allowed to flow through the economy and how much personal debt is dragging it down.

Its more complicated than that, but in essence, as long as no entity interferes with or hampers growth, wealth is grown and infinite.

 

[occupied]

So you want to listen to the Rich, I posted a quote from Andrew Carnegie.

Hey, I can appreciate Carnegie and what he's saying, money isn't everything. I personally know very wealthy people who benevolently give massive amounts of their fortunes to various philanthropic causes. That's the great thing about having lots of really wealthy people around, the money flows generously.

What I can't figure out is why your stupid ass wants to make this the enemy?

It's the Rich who made the not-rich the enemy.

It wasn't the working class who moved the work to China, was it?

They have made working class Americans the enemy. It is not the rich who are being portrayed as greedy and selfish....it is the workers
We have the GOP to thank

Starting with unions. It's greed if the workers want a bigger share of the wealth produced by an industry, and yet,

it's somehow good, according to these apologists for the wealthy, if the rich owners of the industry get to keep as big a share as they can.

In fact, these apologists are all for taking away every bit possible of the ability of the workers to fight for a bigger share.

It's not the only double standard they labor under, they blow huge holes in budgets giving hand-outs to the wealthy with no demonstrable economic benefit while trying to destroy social programs that have solid stabilizing benefits to society.