Third Marysville Student dies.

[WinterBorn]

We only put companies out of business if they were willfully negligent. Or if the public simply stops buying. We do not prosecute the employees who broke no laws.

No, we don't. HEck, we've put companies out of business out of pure politics.

And I'm good with that, honestly. You need to make examples out of people.

Like Arthur Anderson. Totally put those assholes out of business and threw a few of their execs in jail on frivilous charges because they certified Enron and other bad actors were solvant when they weren't.

You make an example out of a few gun dealers, and the rest of them are going to massively improve their behavior.

No. If you try to prosecute a gun dealer who has broken no laws, the case will be either thrown out or overturned.

Prosecute the shrinks who failed to report psychos.

 

[WinterBorn]

We only put companies out of business if they were willfully negligent. Or if the public simply stops buying. We do not prosecute the employees who broke no laws.

No, we don't. HEck, we've put companies out of business out of pure politics.

And I'm good with that, honestly. You need to make examples out of people.

Like Arthur Anderson. Totally put those assholes out of business and threw a few of their execs in jail on frivilous charges because they certified Enron and other bad actors were solvant when they weren't.

You make an example out of a few gun dealers, and the rest of them are going to massively improve their behavior.

Oh, and what Arthur Anderson did was not "frivolous". The committed crimes. They were prosecuted for it. That is how the system works. It is not some revenge based method for crazies to circumvent the Bill of Rights.

 

[tinydancer]

And why would we avenge the 20,000+ suicides? Those people chose to end their life. And the gun was only a tool. They could have died another way. Taking guns away will not change the suicide rates by any significant measure.

I don't advocate taking anything away but I don't think that statement is true. Having a gun handy makes the act doable in seconds, impulsively. Not having one requires setting up the hanging, acquiring the narcotics, or however one might set the scene. A firearm requires no prep at all, and therefore there's no reflection time. It's instant.

For true a moment.

 

[JoeB131]

[

No. If you try to prosecute a gun dealer who has broken no laws, the case will be either thrown out or overturned.

Prosecute the shrinks who failed to report psychos.

I like my idea better. Prosecuting assholes trying to sell fear is better than prosecuting a medical professional that is trying to help.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, and what Arthur Anderson did was not "frivolous". The committed crimes. They were prosecuted for it. That is how the system works. It is not some revenge based method for crazies to circumvent the Bill of Rights.

Uh, no, they really didn't.

Unanimous Supreme Court overturns Andersen conviction - May. 31 2005

The Supreme Court Tuesday unanimously threw out the conviction of accounting firm Arthur Andersen, a symbolic victory for a nearly defunct company torn apart in a document-shredding case involving the fallen energy giant Enron.

In a 9-0 opinion, the justices concluded that "jury instructions at issue simply failed to convey the requisite consciousness of wrongdoing." Chief Justice William Rehnquist wrote the opinion, saying, "Indeed, it is striking how little culpability the instructions required."

Of course, by that point, the company was out of business and thousands of people lost their jobs.

They didn't break any laws, but they were persecuted because they needed to hang the Enron Debacle on someone other than Enron. Which I'm completely fine with. A nice warning to other accounting firms that want to "cook the books".

 

[WinterBorn]

[

No. If you try to prosecute a gun dealer who has broken no laws, the case will be either thrown out or overturned.

Prosecute the shrinks who failed to report psychos.

I like my idea better. Prosecuting assholes trying to sell fear is better than prosecuting a medical professional that is trying to help.

You mean the medical professional that KNEW their patient was dangerous and did not follow thru and put their name in the database? The gun seller gets federal approval before selling the gun. The feds depend on those medical professionals to be competent enough to do what is required.

And your "idea" is still your fantasy, no one else's.

 

[JoeB131]

You mean the medical professional that KNEW their patient was dangerous and did not follow thru and put their name in the database? The gun seller gets federal approval before selling the gun. The feds depend on those medical professionals to be competent enough to do what is required.

And your "idea" is still your fantasy, no one else's.

Again, let's put forth the indictments and see how it plays.

I would truly love to put the guy who sold Joker Holmes a gun up on the stand and then drag Holmes in as a rebuttal witness.

That would be... amusing.

 

[WinterBorn]

Oh, and what Arthur Anderson did was not "frivolous". The committed crimes. They were prosecuted for it. That is how the system works. It is not some revenge based method for crazies to circumvent the Bill of Rights.

Uh, no, they really didn't.

Unanimous Supreme Court overturns Andersen conviction - May. 31 2005

The Supreme Court Tuesday unanimously threw out the conviction of accounting firm Arthur Andersen, a symbolic victory for a nearly defunct company torn apart in a document-shredding case involving the fallen energy giant Enron.

In a 9-0 opinion, the justices concluded that "jury instructions at issue simply failed to convey the requisite consciousness of wrongdoing." Chief Justice William Rehnquist wrote the opinion, saying, "Indeed, it is striking how little culpability the instructions required."

Of course, by that point, the company was out of business and thousands of people lost their jobs.

They didn't break any laws, but they were persecuted because they needed to hang the Enron Debacle on someone other than Enron. Which I'm completely fine with. A nice warning to other accounting firms that want to "cook the books".

The business was ruined because an accounting firm lives and dies by the trust of their clients. Arthur Anderson's actions destroyed that trust. And shredding documents relating to the Enron debacle was criminal. Arthur Anderson employees knew that Enron was cooking the books and they helped. A gun dealer has no way of knowing their customer is mentally unbalanced. You simply want a convenient scape-goat while ignoring those actually responsible.

BTW, since you have derailled the thread, have you found anyone who said the kid involved in the Marysville shooting was crazy? Did the kid buy a gun to do the shooting?

 

[WinterBorn]

You mean the medical professional that KNEW their patient was dangerous and did not follow thru and put their name in the database? The gun seller gets federal approval before selling the gun. The feds depend on those medical professionals to be competent enough to do what is required.

And your "idea" is still your fantasy, no one else's.

Again, let's put forth the indictments and see how it plays.

I would truly love to put the guy who sold Joker Holmes a gun up on the stand and then drag Holmes in as a rebuttal witness.

That would be... amusing.

I'm sure it would. I would love to see any evidence that Holmes acted crazy when he bought the gun. I would love to see a prosecutor try and prove the gun seller had any way of knowing he was dangerous.

But that will never happen. Because a prosecutor is not going to try to indict someone who broke no laws and have federal approval for the gun sale.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Newsflash, the 2nd Amendment isn't going away, and we're not going to disarm this country.

Newsflash, 60% of American households don't have guns for them, and we are tired of being terrorized by the small minority of gun nuts compensating for tiny dicks.

Lol ! Boy, haven't heard that one before.

Anyway, you can think you're being terrorized all you want, but there are over 300 million firearms in this country, so good luck trying to get them.

300 million guns, most of them held by a few million nuts.

At least 65 million private gun owners. A few million? try again.

Only 39 percent of American homes have guns in them. However many people that may be, it is ONLY 39 % of the homes in America that have guns. Think about that.

And we're being held hostage by that minority.

 

[WinterBorn]

Newsflash, 60% of American households don't have guns for them, and we are tired of being terrorized by the small minority of gun nuts compensating for tiny dicks.

Lol ! Boy, haven't heard that one before.

Anyway, you can think you're being terrorized all you want, but there are over 300 million firearms in this country, so good luck trying to get them.

300 million guns, most of them held by a few million nuts.

At least 65 million private gun owners. A few million? try again.

Only 39 percent of American homes have guns in them. However many people that may be, it is ONLY 39 % of the homes in America that have guns. Think about that.

And we're being held hostage by that minority.

At least you used an accurate number.

 

[JoeB131]

The business was ruined because an accounting firm lives and dies by the trust of their clients. Arthur Anderson's actions destroyed that trust. And shredding documents relating to the Enron debacle was criminal. Arthur Anderson employees knew that Enron was cooking the books and they helped. A gun dealer has no way of knowing their customer is mentally unbalanced. You simply want a convenient scape-goat while ignoring those actually responsible.

Except the Supreme court found later that the charges were bogus and never should have been brought.

IT's a nice legal question.

MOral question- no problem. Anderson didn't do due diligence, and a lot of people lost a lot of money.

Moral question on gun stores that sell to guys like Loughner and Holmes and Lanza - they didn't do due dillgence, and people FUCKING DIED!!!!

 

[JoeB131]

I'm sure it would. I would love to see any evidence that Holmes acted crazy when he bought the gun. I would love to see a prosecutor try and prove the gun seller had any way of knowing he was dangerous.

But that will never happen. Because a prosecutor is not going to try to indict someone who broke no laws and have federal approval for the gun sale.

Until they do it. Come on, guy, I've been through enough audits to know that no matter how diligent you are, someone will ALWAYS find a mistake.

 

[WinterBorn]

The business was ruined because an accounting firm lives and dies by the trust of their clients. Arthur Anderson's actions destroyed that trust. And shredding documents relating to the Enron debacle was criminal. Arthur Anderson employees knew that Enron was cooking the books and they helped. A gun dealer has no way of knowing their customer is mentally unbalanced. You simply want a convenient scape-goat while ignoring those actually responsible.

Except the Supreme court found later that the charges were bogus and never should have been brought.

IT's a nice legal question.

MOral question- no problem. Anderson didn't do due diligence, and a lot of people lost a lot of money.

Moral question on gun stores that sell to guys like Loughner and Holmes and Lanza - they didn't do due dillgence, and people FUCKING DIED!!!!

They did exactly what was required. They requested permission to sell the gun. The feds gave them permission. And all of that was based on what was in the database used to restrict the sales of guns. Your medical professionals did not report the information they had.

But lets get back to the OP, shall we?

Anyone say the kid in Marysville was crazy? I mean, you claim everyone in the crazy people's life knows it. Anyone say anything about this one?

And did this kid buy the gun he used??

Stick with this shooting rather than falling back on the tired old arguments that have been so thoroughly debunked or refuted as laughably insane.

 

[WinterBorn]

I'm sure it would. I would love to see any evidence that Holmes acted crazy when he bought the gun. I would love to see a prosecutor try and prove the gun seller had any way of knowing he was dangerous.

But that will never happen. Because a prosecutor is not going to try to indict someone who broke no laws and have federal approval for the gun sale.

Until they do it. Come on, guy, I've been through enough audits to know that no matter how diligent you are, someone will ALWAYS find a mistake.

Ok, then start auditing and find a mistake. That is not what you have been advocating. You have been calling for gun sellers to be jailed when they committed no crime.

 

[JoeB131]

Ok, then start auditing and find a mistake. That is not what you have been advocating. You have been calling for gun sellers to be jailed when they committed no crime.

I advocate holding people who aid and abet murderers morally responsible.

They sold guns to killers. Most of them do this knowingly. They've fought against any attempt to improve background checks, waiting periods or reducing the deadliness of the weapons they sold.

That makes them co-conspirators.

 

[WinterBorn]

Ok, then start auditing and find a mistake. That is not what you have been advocating. You have been calling for gun sellers to be jailed when they committed no crime.

I advocate holding people who aid and abet murderers morally responsible.

They sold guns to killers. Most of them do this knowingly. They've fought against any attempt to improve background checks, waiting periods or reducing the deadliness of the weapons they sold.

That makes them co-conspirators.

But you don't hold the medical professional (who makes the background checks ineffective) responsible for their negligence?

You have yet to explain how the gun dealer is to determine the mental stability of their customers. Until you do that you rants are getting sillier.

Now....about the Marysville shooting......

Anyone say the kid in Marysville was crazy? I mean, you claim everyone in the crazy people's life knows it. Anyone say anything about this one?

And did this kid buy the gun he used??

 

[JoeB131]

But you don't hold the medical professional (who makes the background checks ineffective) responsible for their negligence?

You have yet to explain how the gun dealer is to determine the mental stability of their customers. Until you do that you rants are getting sillier.

I still the orange hair should have been a dead giveaway...

 

[WinterBorn]

But you don't hold the medical professional (who makes the background checks ineffective) responsible for their negligence?

You have yet to explain how the gun dealer is to determine the mental stability of their customers. Until you do that you rants are getting sillier.

I still the orange hair should have been a dead giveaway...

So hair color is a definite indicator of insanity? lol Too funny.

Now....about the Marysville shooting......

Anyone say the kid in Marysville was crazy? I mean, you claim everyone in the crazy people's life knows it. Anyone say anything about this one?

And did this kid buy the gun he used??

 

[JoeB131]

You're like one of those retarded kids who keeps slamming his head into the wall until he get attention.