The WikiLeaks Vindication of George W. Bush

[Neotrotsky]

Like it or not, the Soviets defeated the Nazis.

The Soviets killed 20 times as many Nazis we did. The Nazis were the bigger threat at the time than the Soviets

Your point to the original question is still not addressed. As a side not, Stalin killed more people than Hitler, but we digress.....
Bigger threat ?- equal at least. All we cared at that point was dividing them. Together, the West would not have stood a chance


Politics and war require at times (no matter who is in power) "Machiavellian" maneuvers.

Your poor attempt to make one seem somehow "illegitimate" and another not by ignoring it, does not work.

Fact is, the US did not give a shit about Eastern Europe. The Nazis were in control of France, Norway, Netherlands, Belgium and were threatening England

We needed the Soviets to take out the Nazi Army so that we could save the countries we cared about

Again, you are only restating my point albeit with rather loose historical time line.

At the time of the Nazi invasion into Poland that caused England to declare war on Germany, the Soviets were invading Poland from the other side.
Germany did not have France, Norway etc at that time.

So again, using your "moral" compass- Britain should have declared war on the Soviets as well. Why did Britain not declare war on the Soviets? Because- today's enemy could be tomorrow's friend- when it comes to war.

My original point stands and your inability/refusal to defend your position is the same

 

[uscitizen]

Didn't Hitler origionally have an agreement with Russia to share some of the conquered land?

 

[Neotrotsky]

Didn't Hitler origionally have an agreement with Russia to share some of the conquered land?

Soviets - yes Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact


On 17 September the Red Army invaded eastern Poland, violating the 1932 Soviet–Polish Non-Aggression Pact, and occupied the Polish territory assigned to it by the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. This was followed by co-ordination with German forces in Poland.


They invaded around the same time. Of course had we (Britain) declared war on both, Britain and her allies would have never won against them.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov–Ribbentrop_Pact

 

[uscitizen]

Lets not forget Chamberlain either.

 

[Neotrotsky]

Lets not forget Chamberlain either.

I hear you! If he had his way then most of us would not be here. The ones remaining would all be speaking German.

 

[DiveCon]

Strange how many only seem to remember the final excuse for invading Iraq which did not exist till after we had been there a year or so.
Liberation, Bring them democracy.

whats really strange is how some dont realize they were the same before the invasion, if you actually read the SOTU address concerning Iraq

 

[(R)IGHTeous 1]

Strange how many only seem to remember the final excuse for invading Iraq which did not exist till after we had been there a year or so.
Liberation, Bring them democracy.

Bush talked of liberating Iraq at length all the time, usually every time he brought up WMDs too.

You people really must live in some wacky, alternate universe or something, it's starting to become the only explanation for BS like this.

 

[DaGoose]

Strange how many only seem to remember the final excuse for invading Iraq which did not exist till after we had been there a year or so.
Liberation, Bring them democracy.

Bush talked of liberating Iraq at length all the time, usually every time he brought up WMDs too.

You people really must live in some wacky, alternate universe or something, it's starting to become the only explanation for BS like this.

C'mon. Quit being so stupidly naive. Iraq posed no threat to anyone and the weapons inspectors said he was cooperating fully.

Liberating Iraq? Even the citizens didn't want us there. In 2004 Iraqi insurgents ambushed and killed four American contrators and, to the cheers of the crowd, dragged their bodies around and hung them from a bridge.

That sure sounds like they were happy to be liberated by Americans.

"After the attack, a jubilant crowd of civilians, none of whom appeared to be armed, gathered to celebrate, dragging the bodies through the street and hanging two of them from the bridge. Many of those in the crowd were excited young boys who shouted slogans in front of television cameras."

U.S. citizens, soldiers killed in Iraq attacks / LJWorld.com

Now go peddle your bullshit somewhere else.

 

[DiveCon]

Strange how many only seem to remember the final excuse for invading Iraq which did not exist till after we had been there a year or so.
Liberation, Bring them democracy.

Bush talked of liberating Iraq at length all the time, usually every time he brought up WMDs too.

You people really must live in some wacky, alternate universe or something, it's starting to become the only explanation for BS like this.

C'mon. Quit being so stupidly naive. Iraq posed no threat to anyone and the weapons inspectors said he was cooperating fully.

Liberating Iraq? Even the citizens didn't want us there. In 2004 Iraqi insurgents ambushed and killed four American contrators and, to the cheers of the crowd, dragged their bodies around and hung them from a bridge.

That sure sounds like they were happy to be liberated by Americans.

"After the attack, a jubilant crowd of civilians, none of whom appeared to be armed, gathered to celebrate, dragging the bodies through the street and hanging two of them from the bridge. Many of those in the crowd were excited young boys who shouted slogans in front of television cameras."

U.S. citizens, soldiers killed in Iraq attacks / LJWorld.com

Now go peddle your bullshit somewhere else.

are you that stupid that you think what you posted showed HE was naive?

 

[DiveCon]

George W. Bush's Third State of the Union Address - Wikisource

And tonight I have a message for the brave and oppressed people of Iraq: Your enemy is not surrounding your country -- your enemy is ruling your country. And the day he and his regime are removed from power will be the day of your liberation.

and that is just a SMALL excerpt

 

[(R)IGHTeous 1]

DaGoose wrote:

C'mon. Quit being so stupidly naive. Iraq posed no threat to anyone and the weapons inspectors said he was cooperating fully.

YET AGAIN:AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - Leading Iraqi Scientist Says He Lied to U.N. Inspectors - NYTimes.com
Iraq to Allow U.N. Inspectors To Resume Weapons Search - The Tech
HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO BEATS THESE FACTS? Why can't you people just support us winning, and 25 million people actually having a shot @ a life now? Why? Do your own lives suck THAT bad?

Liberating Iraq? Even the citizens didn't want us there. In 2004 Iraqi insurgents ambushed and killed four American contrators and, to the cheers of the crowd, dragged their bodies around and hung them from a bridge.

Nice try again, bringing up isolated, freak incidents involving insurgents, and the minority Saddam loyalists who supported them does little to help your lack of a case. I could just as easily pull up polls showing Iraqis happier and more optimistic bout their futures now than under Saddam, and stories of kids waving at our troops, and running up to them and handing them flowers. Get real.

 

[DaGoose]

George W. Bush's Third State of the Union Address - Wikisource

And tonight I have a message for the brave and oppressed people of Iraq: Your enemy is not surrounding your country -- your enemy is ruling your country. And the day he and his regime are removed from power will be the day of your liberation.

and that is just a SMALL excerpt

DaGoose wrote:

C'mon. Quit being so stupidly naive. Iraq posed no threat to anyone and the weapons inspectors said he was cooperating fully.

YET AGAIN:AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - Leading Iraqi Scientist Says He Lied to U.N. Inspectors - NYTimes.com
Iraq to Allow U.N. Inspectors To Resume Weapons Search - The Tech
HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO BEATS THESE FACTS? Why can't you people just support us winning, and 25 million people actually having a shot @ a life now? Why? Do your own lives suck THAT bad?

Liberating Iraq? Even the citizens didn't want us there. In 2004 Iraqi insurgents ambushed and killed four American contrators and, to the cheers of the crowd, dragged their bodies around and hung them from a bridge.

Nice try again, bringing up isolated, freak incidents involving insurgents, and the minority Saddam loyalists who supported them does little to help your lack of a case. I could just as easily pull up polls showing Iraqis happier and more optimistic bout their futures now than under Saddam, and stories of kids waving at our troops, and running up to them and handing them flowers. Get real.

You two can spout off all you want but it still would not bring back the 4000 (plus) American soldiers who died for no good reason.

Bush waged war on a nation who was absolutely no threat to us or anyone else.

Like rightwinger posted......

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

Major strategic blunder

It's just too bad so many American soldiers had to pay for that blunder.

 

[DiveCon]

George W. Bush's Third State of the Union Address - Wikisource

And tonight I have a message for the brave and oppressed people of Iraq: Your enemy is not surrounding your country -- your enemy is ruling your country. And the day he and his regime are removed from power will be the day of your liberation.

and that is just a SMALL excerpt

DaGoose wrote:


YET AGAIN:AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - Leading Iraqi Scientist Says He Lied to U.N. Inspectors - NYTimes.com
Iraq to Allow U.N. Inspectors To Resume Weapons Search - The Tech
HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO BEATS THESE FACTS? Why can't you people just support us winning, and 25 million people actually having a shot @ a life now? Why? Do your own lives suck THAT bad?

Liberating Iraq? Even the citizens didn't want us there. In 2004 Iraqi insurgents ambushed and killed four American contrators and, to the cheers of the crowd, dragged their bodies around and hung them from a bridge.

Nice try again, bringing up isolated, freak incidents involving insurgents, and the minority Saddam loyalists who supported them does little to help your lack of a case. I could just as easily pull up polls showing Iraqis happier and more optimistic bout their futures now than under Saddam, and stories of kids waving at our troops, and running up to them and handing them flowers. Get real.

You two can spout off all you want but it still would not bring back the 4000 (plus) American soldiers who died for no good reason.

Bush waged war on a nation who was absolutely no threat to us or anyone else.

Like rightwinger posted......

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

Major strategic blunder

It's just too bad so many American soldiers had to pay for that blunder.

both you and rightwinger are completely wrong

 

[DaGoose]

George W. Bush's Third State of the Union Address - Wikisource



and that is just a SMALL excerpt

DaGoose wrote:


YET AGAIN:AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - AFTEREFFECTS - GERM WEAPONS - Leading Iraqi Scientist Says He Lied to U.N. Inspectors - NYTimes.com
Iraq to Allow U.N. Inspectors To Resume Weapons Search - The Tech
HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO BEATS THESE FACTS? Why can't you people just support us winning, and 25 million people actually having a shot @ a life now? Why? Do your own lives suck THAT bad?


Nice try again, bringing up isolated, freak incidents involving insurgents, and the minority Saddam loyalists who supported them does little to help your lack of a case. I could just as easily pull up polls showing Iraqis happier and more optimistic bout their futures now than under Saddam, and stories of kids waving at our troops, and running up to them and handing them flowers. Get real.

You two can spout off all you want but it still would not bring back the 4000 (plus) American soldiers who died for no good reason.

Bush waged war on a nation who was absolutely no threat to us or anyone else.

Like rightwinger posted......

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

Major strategic blunder

It's just too bad so many American soldiers had to pay for that blunder.

both you and rightwinger are completely wrong

Feel free to tell WHY the statements below are wrong either individually or collectively. (Of course you can always give me a personal attack and neg me too. That seems to be your style.)

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

 

[DiveCon]

You two can spout off all you want but it still would not bring back the 4000 (plus) American soldiers who died for no good reason.

Bush waged war on a nation who was absolutely no threat to us or anyone else.

Like rightwinger posted......

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

Major strategic blunder

It's just too bad so many American soldiers had to pay for that blunder.

both you and rightwinger are completely wrong

Feel free to tell WHY the statements below are wrong either individually or collectively. (Of course you can always give me a personal attack and neg me too. That seems to be your style.)

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

as if it will be worth it

the war on terror was NOT abandoned
the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others
we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected
the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time
it was the POST invasion period that was messed up
the last three are just as wrong as the above

 

[DaGoose]

both you and rightwinger are completely wrong

Feel free to tell WHY the statements below are wrong either individually or collectively. (Of course you can always give me a personal attack and neg me too. That seems to be your style.)

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

as if it will be worth it

the war on terror was NOT abandoned
the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others
we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected
the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time
it was the POST invasion period that was messed up
the last three are just as wrong as the above

Wow. I'm impressed. You CAN disagree without personal attacks and negging someone!!

the war on terror was NOT abandoned

(Not totally but what would have happened had we applied the same force looking for Bin Laden?)

the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others

(Really? I'd love to hear the reasons that would justify the deaths of over 4000 American soldiers.)

we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected

(Imagine that.)

the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time

(Then why the need for the surge?)

it was the POST invasion period that was messed up

(No, it was invading in the first place.)

the last three are just as wrong as the above

(All of the assessments turned out to be wrong. I can post links if you like.)

 

[DiveCon]

Feel free to tell WHY the statements below are wrong either individually or collectively. (Of course you can always give me a personal attack and neg me too. That seems to be your style.)

Abandoning the war on terror to attack Iraq was wrong
The reasons for invading Iraq were wrong
The threat from Iraq did not justify an invasion
Not getting a proper alliance was wrong
The number of troops dedicated to the invasion were inadequate
The assessment of the political situation in Iraq was wrong
The assessment of the Iran/Iraq/Saudi balance of power was wrong
The assessment of the vulnerability of US troops was wrong

as if it will be worth it

the war on terror was NOT abandoned
the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others
we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected
the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time
it was the POST invasion period that was messed up
the last three are just as wrong as the above

Wow. I'm impressed. You CAN disagree without personal attacks and negging someone!!

the war on terror was NOT abandoned

(Not totally but what would have happened had we applied the same force looking for Bin Laden?)

the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others

(Really? I'd love to hear the reasons that would justify the deaths of over 4000 American soldiers.)

we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected

(Imagine that.)

the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time

(Then why the need for the surge?)

it was the POST invasion period that was messed up

(No, it was invading in the first place.)

the last three are just as wrong as the above

(All of the assessments turned out to be wrong. I can post links if you like.)

links from reliable unbiased sources?
post them

 

[DaGoose]

as if it will be worth it

the war on terror was NOT abandoned
the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others
we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected
the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time
it was the POST invasion period that was messed up
the last three are just as wrong as the above

Wow. I'm impressed. You CAN disagree without personal attacks and negging someone!!

the war on terror was NOT abandoned

(Not totally but what would have happened had we applied the same force looking for Bin Laden?)

the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others

(Really? I'd love to hear the reasons that would justify the deaths of over 4000 American soldiers.)

we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected

(Imagine that.)

the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time

(Then why the need for the surge?)

it was the POST invasion period that was messed up

(No, it was invading in the first place.)

the last three are just as wrong as the above

(All of the assessments turned out to be wrong. I can post links if you like.)

links from reliable unbiased sources?
post them

Oh boy, here we go again. I know what will happen........

1) I will post links

2) You will "pooh pooh" them and call them biased

3) I will ask you to challenge the facts regardless of the source

4) You will get mad again, make personal attacks and "neg rep" me just because you can't refute anything

What the hell...........Here's one.........

"A presidential commission said Thursday that "the intelligence community was dead wrong in almost all of its prewar judgments" on Iraq's arsenal."

USATODAY.com - Iraq weapons assessments 'dead wrong,' Bush told

Stand by for more.

 

[DiveCon]

Wow. I'm impressed. You CAN disagree without personal attacks and negging someone!!

the war on terror was NOT abandoned

(Not totally but what would have happened had we applied the same force looking for Bin Laden?)

the reasons for invading Iraq were and are valid
some not as valid as others

(Really? I'd love to hear the reasons that would justify the deaths of over 4000 American soldiers.)

we DID find SOME WMD, just not the STOCKPILES that were expected

(Imagine that.)

the numbers were valid, they got it done and in rather short time

(Then why the need for the surge?)

it was the POST invasion period that was messed up

(No, it was invading in the first place.)

the last three are just as wrong as the above

(All of the assessments turned out to be wrong. I can post links if you like.)

links from reliable unbiased sources?
post them

Oh boy, here we go again. I know what will happen........

1) I will post links

2) You will "pooh pooh" them and call them biased

3) I will ask you to challenge the facts regardless of the source

4) You will get mad again, make personal attacks and "neg rep" me just because you can't refute anything

What the hell...........Here's one.........

"A presidential commission said Thursday that "the intelligence community was dead wrong in almost all of its prewar judgments" on Iraq's arsenal."

USATODAY.com - Iraq weapons assessments 'dead wrong,' Bush told

Stand by for more.

uh, that doesnt prove your case
the intel WAS dead wrong
the stockpiles didnt exist

 

[DiveCon]

and btw, stop bitchin and whining about a neg rep
it makes you look like a pussy