The Russia-Ukraine Conflict Can Only be Settled Through Negotiation

[Seymour Flops]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

Sure, pre-existing borders should be Zelensky's opening position. But Zelensky and his cheerleaders in the U.S. need to face the fact that Putin will never accept a humiliating defeat. Why should he? He's not dying in this war, and niether are any of his loved ones. Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

NATO is unlikely to commit troops to defend a non-member. If they were going to to that, they would have done so already. If the U.S. decides to act alone, he has little reason to fear the Newly Woke U.S. Army. Sending crying t-girls to fight the Russian army would be tantamout to lining them up against the wall and shooting them.

We need a president who can carrot and stick both sides to the table and give each side face-saving ways out of this. The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

 

[1srelluc]

"Face-saving" is easy with this one.....Turn off the money spigot and tell the EU that this one is on them. Bye.

 

[Polishprince]

This is why this kind of thing like the Ukraine-Russian Federation War never happened during the reign of the Trumpster.

He knew how to make deals. As a professional deal-maker, his classic text "The Art of the Deal" is still studied by millions in the deal making business.


Biden doesn't have any interest in peace, and wouldn't know how to achieve it if he did. Liberalism is based on the idea of "Scarcity" rather than plenty, and disorder and war are the necessary results of liberalism as the parties have to fight for limited resources.

It isn't a coincidence that the biggest wars in US history, WW1 and WW2 were started under the ultraliberal Wilson and Roosevelt administrations.

 

[Donald H]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

Sure, pre-existing borders should be Zelensky's opening position. But Zelensky and his cheerleaders in the U.S. need to face the fact that Putin will never accept a humiliating defeat. Why should he? He's not dying in this war, and niether are any of his loved ones. Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

NATO is unlikely to commit troops to defend a non-member. If they were going to to that, they would have done so already. If the U.S. decides to act alone, he has little reason to fear the Newly Woke U.S. Army. Sending crying t-girls to fight the Russian army would be tantamout to lining them up against the wall and shooting them.

We need a president who can carrot and stick both sides to the table and give each side face-saving ways out of this. The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

And that goes to show that you don't understand the situation be begin with!
If this discussion can happen without the usual spamming, I might explain further. I'm just not going to be a part of the childish bullshit any longer.

Ask me if you want to know the reason why you're blowing smoke.

 

[Baron]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

Sure, pre-existing borders should be Zelensky's opening position. But Zelensky and his cheerleaders in the U.S. need to face the fact that Putin will never accept a humiliating defeat. Why should he? He's not dying in this war, and niether are any of his loved ones. Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

NATO is unlikely to commit troops to defend a non-member. If they were going to to that, they would have done so already. If the U.S. decides to act alone, he has little reason to fear the Newly Woke U.S. Army. Sending crying t-girls to fight the Russian army would be tantamout to lining them up against the wall and shooting them.

We need a president who can carrot and stick both sides to the table and give each side face-saving ways out of this. The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

Don't be naive.
Negotiations are impossible until the last Ukrainian or Russian are alive.
Both Putin and Zelensky clean up former Russia from its native population
The most possible outcome could be empty nuclear desert after Russia/Ukraine get nuked

 

[Lemmi]

Here's a thought, let's let Ukraine and Russia fight it out for another 20 years or so. About the same amount of time we spent in Afghanistan making the world safe for democracy. That should keep the arms dealers happy for awhile.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

the only way the conflict can end is if our corrupt military steps in and arrests the criminals in washington and the operatives in NATO and zelensky who are all trying to start world war 3 because russia is off the dollar.we need military tribunals but they are corrupt so it wont happen.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

Sure, pre-existing borders should be Zelensky's opening position. But Zelensky and his cheerleaders in the U.S. need to face the fact that Putin will never accept a humiliating defeat. Why should he? He's not dying in this war, and niether are any of his loved ones. Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

NATO is unlikely to commit troops to defend a non-member. If they were going to to that, they would have done so already. If the U.S. decides to act alone, he has little reason to fear the Newly Woke U.S. Army. Sending crying t-girls to fight the Russian army would be tantamout to lining them up against the wall and shooting them.

We need a president who can carrot and stick both sides to the table and give each side face-saving ways out of this. The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

Biden had to read from note cards when meeting with foreign leaders because he had no fucking idea what’s going on. Unless Xi steps up, there’s no one else the 2 sides will take seriously

 

[luiza]

The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

Have always thought that this was the big moment for the Kardashians . BTW , Z is not even welcome at the table . A little brainless runt now expendable by the US and Russia .

 

[Seymour Flops]

And that goes to show that you don't understand the situation be begin with!
If this discussion can happen without the usual spamming, I might explain further. I'm just not going to be a part of the childish bullshit any longer.

Ask me if you want to know the reason why you're blowing smoke.

I'll read anything on the topic that you care to post. Dramatic buildup not needed.

 

[toomuchtime_]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

Sure, pre-existing borders should be Zelensky's opening position. But Zelensky and his cheerleaders in the U.S. need to face the fact that Putin will never accept a humiliating defeat. Why should he? He's not dying in this war, and niether are any of his loved ones. Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

NATO is unlikely to commit troops to defend a non-member. If they were going to to that, they would have done so already. If the U.S. decides to act alone, he has little reason to fear the Newly Woke U.S. Army. Sending crying t-girls to fight the Russian army would be tantamout to lining them up against the wall and shooting them.

We need a president who can carrot and stick both sides to the table and give each side face-saving ways out of this. The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

So are you saying that the US should still be a British colony because nothing is worth fighting for or that the US should still allow slavery because nothing is worth fighting for or the Nazis should have been allowed to rule Europe because nothing is worth fighting for or that the Communists should have been allowed to conquer the world because nothing is worth fighting for or that Putin should be allowed to ravage eastern Europe because nothing is worth fighting for?

 

[toomuchtime_]

"Face-saving" is easy with this one.....Turn off the money spigot and tell the EU that this one is on them. Bye.

70 House Republicans voted in favor of an amendment to the country's annual defense bill that would have cut off all US military aid to Ukraine.

"Notwithstanding any provision of this or any other Act, no federal funds may be made available to provide security assistance to Ukraine," reads the one-sentence amendment, one of the dozens offered by hard-right Republicans that lawmakers voted on over the course of Thursday evening.

The amendment easily failed by a 358-70 margin, with all Democrats and a majority of Republicans opposing the measure.

Here are the 70 House Republicans who voted to cut off all US military aid to Ukraine

While Rep. Matt Gaetz's amendment was voted down by a wide bipartisan margin, it offered greater clarity around GOP support for Ukraine aid.

www.businessinsider.com

No one in America is listening to you.

 

[toomuchtime_]

This is why this kind of thing like the Ukraine-Russian Federation War never happened during the reign of the Trumpster.

He knew how to make deals. As a professional deal-maker, his classic text "The Art of the Deal" is still studied by millions in the deal making business.


Biden doesn't have any interest in peace, and wouldn't know how to achieve it if he did. Liberalism is based on the idea of "Scarcity" rather than plenty, and disorder and war are the necessary results of liberalism as the parties have to fight for limited resources.

It isn't a coincidence that the biggest wars in US history, WW1 and WW2 were started under the ultraliberal Wilson and Roosevelt administrations.

Here's what Trump says he did to prevent the invasion during his term in office.

"I thought he might do it," Trump continued. "Look, I talked to him. I said, 'If you do it, there's going to be hell to pay. It's going to be a catastrophe. Don't do it.'"

Putin initially did not believe Trump would take any action, according to Trump, but he pushed back: "I told him I was going to do something. He said, ‘No, no, no, you will not do that.’ I said, 'I will, Vladimir, I will do it. I'm going to do it.'"

Trump, also a 2024 presidential candidate, said Putin believed "maybe 10%" of what he was saying, but that 10% was "all you needed" to stop the invasion from happening. "It was only after I left [office] that you started hearing about this," he added.

Trump claims conversation with Putin delayed Russian invasion of Ukraine: ‘Don’t do it'

Former President Donald Trump said during an exclusive Fox News interview that a conversation he had with Vladimir Putin delayed Russia's invasion of Ukraine for years.

www.foxnews.com

According to Trump, it was just that easy.

 

[Seymour Flops]

So are you saying that the US should still be a British colony because nothing is worth fighting for or that the US should still allow slavery because nothing is worth fighting for or the Nazis should have been allowed to rule Europe because nothing is worth fighting for or that the Communists should have been allowed to conquer the world because nothing is worth fighting for or that Putin should be allowed to ravage eastern Europe because nothing is worth fighting for?

Why, no.

I said none of that.

Are you reponding to the poster you meant to repond to?

 

[Seymour Flops]

Here's what Trump says he did to prevent the invasion during his term in office.

"I thought he might do it," Trump continued. "Look, I talked to him. I said, 'If you do it, there's going to be hell to pay. It's going to be a catastrophe. Don't do it.'"

Putin initially did not believe Trump would take any action, according to Trump, but he pushed back: "I told him I was going to do something. He said, ‘No, no, no, you will not do that.’ I said, 'I will, Vladimir, I will do it. I'm going to do it.'"

Trump, also a 2024 presidential candidate, said Putin believed "maybe 10%" of what he was saying, but that 10% was "all you needed" to stop the invasion from happening. "It was only after I left [office] that you started hearing about this," he added.

Trump claims conversation with Putin delayed Russian invasion of Ukraine: ‘Don’t do it'

Former President Donald Trump said during an exclusive Fox News interview that a conversation he had with Vladimir Putin delayed Russia's invasion of Ukraine for years.

www.foxnews.com

According to Trump, it was just that easy.

It wasn't easy at all. In order to have Putin be willing to heed Trump's warning, Trump had to avoid publicly excoriating Putin. He even praised Putin in public, so long as Putin kept his hands off Ukraine. Trump had to put up with a lot of childish ridicule for that, but it kept the peace by allowing Putin to save face.

Biden came in doing the opposite. He excoriated Putin in public, while giving Putin exactly what he wanted with the Nordstream Pipeline. We see the results of that speak loudly and carry a small stick approach.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Why, no.

I said none of that.

Are you reponding to the poster you meant to repond to?

You are saying restoring the territorial integrity of Ukraine and enforcing international and ending Russian imperialism is not worth fighting for; the rest follows from that.

 

[Seymour Flops]

You are saying restoring the territorial integrity of Ukraine and enforcing international and ending Russian imperialism is not worth fighting for; the rest follows from that.

It's not worth Americans fighting for, that's for sure. When are we going to learn to stay out of European conflicts? Many of our ancestors left that continent and the UK to get away from that nonsense.

"Enforcing international" what? International law? We have our own dadgum laws that are going unenforced, like the law that says that it is a crime to shoot up children every weekend, even in Chicago. If you're concerned threats to territorial integrity, look no further than our own southern border.

I get Ukraine's desire to fight when invaded. I get that Zelensky has an ego just like Puting does and doesn't want to compromise. But neither Putin nor Zelensky are out dying, and they're not getting letters notifying them that their sons and daughters are dying.

Zelensky can compromise or he can continue to bask in the adoration of American politicians and soak up money from the American taxpayer while his country is a slow-motion train wreck. He's making his choice very clear.

 

[JohnDB]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

Sure, pre-existing borders should be Zelensky's opening position. But Zelensky and his cheerleaders in the U.S. need to face the fact that Putin will never accept a humiliating defeat. Why should he? He's not dying in this war, and niether are any of his loved ones. Only fear of a counter-invation of Russia by the U.S. and NATO that would lead to Putin's own death will force him to accept that kind of defeat.

NATO is unlikely to commit troops to defend a non-member. If they were going to to that, they would have done so already. If the U.S. decides to act alone, he has little reason to fear the Newly Woke U.S. Army. Sending crying t-girls to fight the Russian army would be tantamout to lining them up against the wall and shooting them.

We need a president who can carrot and stick both sides to the table and give each side face-saving ways out of this. The only way to do that with large egos like Putin's and Zelensky's if for someone with an even larger ego to lead the talks.

You have not really understood this war at all. Or the main players. The USA is not a main player in this war. Sure it hogs all the media spotlight....but it's not a principal in the backing of Ukraine. It's a facilitator for NATO....nothing more.

Poland is a whole other story. They want a pound of Russian flesh. They want their territories back from western Belarus. Moldova wants their land back as well and dissidents tossed out.

And any reward of Ukranian land being awarded to Russia is going to encourage more Russian expansion through military action. And that rewarding of Russia is only going to incite Moldova, Poland, Finland and others to begin their own war with Russia.

Russia needs a complete exit from ALL Ukrainian lands including Crimea. There will be no peace otherwise.
I'm not saying this because I am a Zelinski fan or side with Ukraine....but because of the realities of the situation. Water, mining, and people....those are the things being fought over.

The only successful negotiations are going to be over children kidnapped by Russia and the amount of reparations Russia is going to pay and the fortifications of the border complete with troop counts and etc. Anything else is going to be a disaster and unsuccessful.

 

[Blaster]

Maybe we can promote peace instead of war.

 

[postman]

The negotiation cannot be successful if it is Ukraine insisting on nothing less that a return to the pre-invasion border. Not if they stick to that, and anything else is a deal killer. That would mean more killing of thousands of Ukrainians and and Russians.

What you leave out is that Putin is a powercrazed madman at this point. Trying to return Russia to it's former Soviet Union glory, where it enslaved half of eastern europe. Using his system of oligarchs and FSB (former
KGB, which he lead) to limit or even terminate with extreme prejudice any political opponents. Negotiations
falling short of Ukraines complete surrender wouldn't be the victory that Putin needs.