The results of Bidenomics

[DialogDiplomat]

GDP growth is currently at 5.2% - historically high. Unemployment (U3) is currently at 3.7% - historically low. The stock market is currently at an all time high - historically...record breaking. Pandemic-related (supply shock) inflation is now getting under control as a result of interest rate hikes from the central bank. Economists are now saying we will get a soft landing out of inflation as opposed to a recession. Here in FL where I live, there are 176 infrastructure projects queued up and backed by $8.1B in funding from Biden's historic infrastructure bill to build and repair roads, bridges, public transport, ports, airports, clean water, etc. This will ensure economic prosperity for the next several years during the building phase at the very least.

And yet if I talk to any of my republican voter friends, most tend to disregard all of the economic data mentioned above and instead declare - without any supporting facts or data - that we're actually in the worst economy in 50 years. So with that, I'm curious what republican/libertarian voters here on this board think about the economy?

Here are the facts one more time. 5.2% GDP. 3.7% unemployment. Record high stock market. Solid growth in output. Solid stability in the labor market. Solid value in investment. And as things like the Infrastructure bill and the CHIPs Act play out, there are solid economic prospects for the future for years to come.

I'm going to add in some historical jobs numbers as well, since Joe Biden was also VP in the Obama administration. Quite literally all private sector job growth in the 21st century happened under democratic presidents. The numbers below are from BLS databases (B tables on seasonally adjusted private sector jobs).

Clinton - 2000 to 2001: 1.4M jobs created
W Bush - 2001 to 2009: 373k jobs lost
Obama - 2019 to 2017: 11.8M jobs created
Trump - 2017 to 2021: 2.1M jobs lost
Biden - 2021 to 2023: 12.8M jobs created

GDP expansion and the labor market are some of the most commonly cited data points used by economists to explain the economy. So there is the data for the 21st century.

Putting all of this together, what do republican/libertarian voters of this site make of all of this and Bidenomics? I'm interested in hearing about how you think the economy is doing today, and what data it is you're looking at that leads you to that conclusion. Also curious in what you have to say about the current state of GDP, the labor market, and the stock market. Also curious about what you think about jobs results in the 21st century.

GDP data: https://www.bea.gov/news/2023/gross...-corporate-profits-preliminary-estimate-third
Unemployment rate data: Employment Situation Summary - 2023 M11 Results
Historical jobs data: Establishment data series from the monthly B Tables : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

 

[pknopp]

The worse thing to point out to show a good economy is the stock market. The stock market was doing well even when the majority of the country was doing poorly.

A president doesn't actually get credit or blame for the actions of the Fed.

The one exception to that IMO is Obama renominating Bernanke who failed miserably and continued to do the wrong thing.

 

[DialogDiplomat]

Which kookbot were you before you became this one looneybin??

No bots here. I'm just looking for direct engagement on facts about the economy. I'm looking to understand what sort of data republican/libertarian voters look at in order to determine how well the economy is doing. The reason for this is that there seems to be a significant gap between the republican interpretation, and actual economic data.

 

[Mac1958]

The Trumpsters have to deny and dismiss all of that because cult.

However, economies don't belong to Presidents. There are too many conflicting domestic and global macroeconomic currents that play into it, and they play out over years.

Part of this is the end stage of what so profoundly benefitted the economy during Trump's term: Trillions in economic stimulus and artificially low interest rates, mostly between 2009 and 2020.

Presidents get too much credit and too much blame for this stuff.

 

[DialogDiplomat]

The worse thing to point out to show a good economy is the stock market. The stock market was doing well even when the majority of the country was doing poorly.

A president doesn't actually get credit or blame for the actions of the Fed.

The one exception to that IMO is Obama renominating Bernanke who failed miserably and continued to do the wrong thing.

I generally agree with you. The only reason I mention the stock market at all is because during the Trump admin it was something that was often touted by republican voters. So I mention it here now because those same republican voters are saying the economic sky is falling.

Me personally, I don't view the stock market as a good indicator of the economy. To me, it is more of a forward-looking point that is purely speculative.

 

[Moonglow]

No bots here. I'm just looking for direct engagement on facts about the economy. I'm looking to understand what sort of data republican/libertarian voters look at in order to determine how well the economy is doing. The reason for this is that there seems to be a significant gap between the republican interpretation, and actual economic data.

The GOP members here have an agenda of, ignorance is bliss.

 

[Godboy]

GDP growth is currently at 5.2% - historically high. Unemployment (U3) is currently at 3.7% - historically low. The stock market is currently at an all time high - historically...record breaking. Pandemic-related (supply shock) inflation is now getting under control as a result of interest rate hikes from the central bank. Economists are now saying we will get a soft landing out of inflation as opposed to a recession. Here in FL where I live, there are 176 infrastructure projects queued up and backed by $8.1B in funding from Biden's historic infrastructure bill to build and repair roads, bridges, public transport, ports, airports, clean water, etc. This will ensure economic prosperity for the next several years during the building phase at the very least.

And yet if I talk to any of my republican voter friends, most tend to disregard all of the economic data mentioned above and instead declare - without any supporting facts or data - that we're actually in the worst economy in 50 years. So with that, I'm curious what republican/libertarian voters here on this board think about the economy?

Here are the facts one more time. 5.2% GDP. 3.7% unemployment. Record high stock market. Solid growth in output. Solid stability in the labor market. Solid value in investment. And as things like the Infrastructure bill and the CHIPs Act play out, there are solid economic prospects for the future for years to come.

I'm going to add in some historical jobs numbers as well, since Joe Biden was also VP in the Obama administration. Quite literally all private sector job growth in the 21st century happened under democratic presidents. The numbers below are from BLS databases (B tables on seasonally adjusted private sector jobs).

Clinton - 2000 to 2001: 1.4M jobs created
W Bush - 2001 to 2009: 373k jobs lost
Obama - 2019 to 2017: 11.8M jobs created
Trump - 2017 to 2021: 2.1M jobs lost
Biden - 2021 to 2023: 12.8M jobs created

GDP expansion and the labor market are some of the most commonly cited data points used by economists to explain the economy. So there is the data for the 21st century.

Putting all of this together, what do republican/libertarian voters of this site make of all of this and Bidenomics? I'm interested in hearing about how you think the economy is doing today, and what data it is you're looking at that leads you to that conclusion. Also curious in what you have to say about the current state of GDP, the labor market, and the stock market. Also curious about what you think about jobs results in the 21st century.

GDP data: https://www.bea.gov/news/2023/gross...-corporate-profits-preliminary-estimate-third
Unemployment rate data: Employment Situation Summary - 2023 M11 Results
Historical jobs data: Establishment data series from the monthly B Tables : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

I believe that 72% of these jobs are just jobs being returned to after COVID. I mean, its not like anyone can point to something that Biden did to create jobs. Right?

 

[22lcidw]

GDP growth is currently at 5.2% - historically high. Unemployment (U3) is currently at 3.7% - historically low. The stock market is currently at an all time high - historically...record breaking. Pandemic-related (supply shock) inflation is now getting under control as a result of interest rate hikes from the central bank. Economists are now saying we will get a soft landing out of inflation as opposed to a recession. Here in FL where I live, there are 176 infrastructure projects queued up and backed by $8.1B in funding from Biden's historic infrastructure bill to build and repair roads, bridges, public transport, ports, airports, clean water, etc. This will ensure economic prosperity for the next several years during the building phase at the very least.

And yet if I talk to any of my republican voter friends, most tend to disregard all of the economic data mentioned above and instead declare - without any supporting facts or data - that we're actually in the worst economy in 50 years. So with that, I'm curious what republican/libertarian voters here on this board think about the economy?

Here are the facts one more time. 5.2% GDP. 3.7% unemployment. Record high stock market. Solid growth in output. Solid stability in the labor market. Solid value in investment. And as things like the Infrastructure bill and the CHIPs Act play out, there are solid economic prospects for the future for years to come.

I'm going to add in some historical jobs numbers as well, since Joe Biden was also VP in the Obama administration. Quite literally all private sector job growth in the 21st century happened under democratic presidents. The numbers below are from BLS databases (B tables on seasonally adjusted private sector jobs).

Clinton - 2000 to 2001: 1.4M jobs created
W Bush - 2001 to 2009: 373k jobs lost
Obama - 2019 to 2017: 11.8M jobs created
Trump - 2017 to 2021: 2.1M jobs lost
Biden - 2021 to 2023: 12.8M jobs created

GDP expansion and the labor market are some of the most commonly cited data points used by economists to explain the economy. So there is the data for the 21st century.

Putting all of this together, what do republican/libertarian voters of this site make of all of this and Bidenomics? I'm interested in hearing about how you think the economy is doing today, and what data it is you're looking at that leads you to that conclusion. Also curious in what you have to say about the current state of GDP, the labor market, and the stock market. Also curious about what you think about jobs results in the 21st century.

GDP data: https://www.bea.gov/news/2023/gross...-corporate-profits-preliminary-estimate-third
Unemployment rate data: Employment Situation Summary - 2023 M11 Results
Historical jobs data: Establishment data series from the monthly B Tables : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

If it is so good, then balance the budget. 1.7 trillion dollars for 2023. See what happens to those fudged numbers.

 

[pknopp]

I generally agree with you. The only reason I mention the stock market at all is because during the Trump admin it was something that was often touted by republican voters.

As did Democrat voters under Obama.

So I mention it here now because those same republican voters are saying the economic sky is falling.

Me personally, I don't view the stock market as a good indicator of the economy. To me, it is more of a forward-looking point that is purely speculative.

It's corrupt.

 

[Moonglow]

2024 is looking to be better and prices are expected to deflate.

 

[Rambunctious]

I keep cash at my home because I don't like using debit or credit cards... I use to grab a 20 dollar bill and I could buy coffee and breakfast and still have enough for lunch... now I take 40 with me and its gone by the time I get home... if I lived paycheck to paycheck that would really sting...

 

[DialogDiplomat]

I believe that 72% of these jobs are just jobs being returned to after COVID. I mean, its not like anyone can point to something that Biden did to create jobs. Right?

I can point to something. Biden invoked the Defense Production Act which compelled the pharmaceutical industry to ramp up vaccine production such that 100 million doses could be delivered within Biden's first 100 days. That goal was acheived with time to spare, and the result was that the pandemic was brought to a halt and the economy was able to fully reopen. In fact, it reopened so quickly that we had inflationary issues to deal with.

Beyond that, we also got the historic infrastructure bill, the CHIPs act, etc...

Trump could have invoked the Defense Production Act himself and done the same, but he chose not to. Instead, Trump chose to spend his remaining months in office trying to overthrow democracy and seize power. Therein lies the difference between these two presidents and their approach to the economy. One implemented policy that would help Americans. The other used the power of the White House to try to seize power, while allowing a public health crisis to smolder.

 

[pknopp]

2024 is looking to be better and prices are expected to deflate.

I got Pepper Steak and rice and a Coke at the Chinese restaurant at the mall the other day. (Food court).

$25 for my wife and I. They were advertising for help. $16 an hour. Prices aren't really going to come down.

Businesses have learned to promote faux shortages at that. Item cost $2.00. Claim shortages, run price to $3.50 and then come down to $3.25 and say prices are falling.

 

[1srelluc]

 

[Godboy]

I can point to something. Biden invoked the Defense Production Act which compelled the pharmaceutical industry to ramp up vaccine production such that 100 million doses could be delivered within Biden's first 100 days. That goal was acheived with time to spare, and the result was that the pandemic was brought to a halt and the economy was able to fully reopen. In fact, it reopened so quickly that we had inflationary issues to deal with.

Beyond that, we also got the historic infrastructure bill, the CHIPs act, etc...

Trump could have invoked the Defense Production Act himself and done the same, but he chose not to. Instead, Trump chose to spend his remaining months in office trying to overthrow democracy and seize power. Therein lies the difference between these two presidents and their approach to the economy. One implemented policy that would help Americans. The other used the power of the White House to try to seize power, while allowing a public health crisis to smolder.

I asked you about him creating jobs, then you fillibustered with a bunch of stuff that isnt about jobs.

 

[1srelluc]

The EBT/SSD crowd (the bulk of dem voters) don't care what stuff costs.

 

[DialogDiplomat]

I asked you about him creating jobs, then you fillibustered with a bunch of stuff that isnt about jobs.

You asked me about creating jobs and I gave you three policies that directly result in creating jobs. I'm not sure how else to respond to your question than to directly answer it.

Once again, Biden invoked the Defense Production Act to compel big pharma to ramp up vaccine production. That policy is what brought the pandemic to a halt and all of the jobs that were lost as a result. I also pointed out how Trump could have done the same thing, but chose not to. I then gave you two additional job creating policies. I even highlighted the impact of the Infrastructure bill in my home state of FL in terms of job creation.

Have you no response to this?

 

[DialogDiplomat]

The EBT/SSD crowd (the bulk of dem voters) don't care what stuff costs.

This is great, but what do you have to say about 5.2% GDP growth and 3.7% unemployment? This is the question to you.

 

[Rambunctious]

 

[DialogDiplomat]

We don't buy oil from Russian anymore. That was ended in 2022 after the invasion of Ukraine began. That said, you can make an argument that oil is traded on a market, so therefore our participation in the market may indirectly benefit Russia, since they also participate in the same market. But to your points, we're not importing Russian oil.

Regarding Iran, we haven't sent any money to Iran. I can only assume here since you didn't clarify what you're talking about that you're referring to money that was freed up through the lifting of economic sanctions. But even there, that was already Iran's own money, and those funds have strings attached to them such that they can only be used for humanitarian purposes.

Side note: US oil production is currently at a record high at 13M barrels per day. Also, we're not only an energy exporter again, but our net exports are at a record high as well at 5.94 quads.

Here again, there is a gap between republican understanding and the actual facts.