The Oslo murderer

[alexa]

This guy is rolling out not as primarily a fundamentalist Christian, or anything that looks like America's right wing.

He was essentially a neo-Nazi who saw the influx of Muslims in Norway as a threat to their culture and democracy. He also fostered hate towards jews and blacks...but was concerned with Islam at this time because Norway has had such a massive influx of them and it has become a primary cultural influence in a very short period of time.

But other people who are concerned about this viewed him as an extremist. This isn't the way the majority of people who are concerned about the encroachment of Islam in western society feel. I am concerned about Islam..but I have no problem with semitic peoples in general. I don't care if our country changes color to brown, white, yellow...or if the primary religion in the country changes from Christianity to Buddhism, Hindu, Jew....it's the political and physical oppression of Islam that is the problem.

But of course I would never advocate acts of terrorism, especially against our own people, wtf is up with that??? Where does this mentality come from? And why is it spreading? I'm sorry, but I honestly think it's the pervasive attitude that terrorism is ok in some cases (middle east) if people are intimidated enough by the *threat* of freedom and democracy. We have people on this site who regularly support the use of terrorism based upon their view that it's reasonable retaliation against the west. Of course it makes sense that nuts are going to take that and run with it....

Anyway, check this out:

"
One day I had a friend request on Facebook from Anders Breivik. There wasn't anything odd about that: when I was a member of SD I was magnetically attractive to everyone who called himself a nationalist: both those for whom it was a game, and the real extremists. Those were, in fact, the people who drove me away from the party. A machine of hate propaganda pumped through my feed on Facebook. There were YouTube clips of massacre victims, demands that all the "fucking *******" should get out of the country, and far more horrible things."

Norway attacks: Breivik was my friend on Facebook. I've seen what fed his hatred | Camilla Ragfors | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

I have not heard anyone discussing him as a neo nazi

from your own article

I don't think that the hot-blooded nationalists who push this line in the name of the Sweden Democrats, on Facebook and elsewhere on the net, have understood the consequences. But Anders Breivik was one of them.
-snip

Everyone who is critical of aspects of our immigration policies must wake up and realise what their endless talk about dangers and hatred can lead to. Even though no one wanted to fuel this terrible act in Norway, that's what they actually did. And there are more people out there who are looking for reasons to justify their actions by being able to refer to what "others" have written, above all on the net.

There are two things we learned on Friday afternoon. One: extremists are found in all groups, and all are at least as dangerous. Two: hatred breeds hate. Never help to spread it unless you are ready to take the consequences. Did anyone – even you people who hate me for everything else, and belong to the far right – did anyone, even you, really want something this terrible to happen? Surely everyone can see this could never work to anyone's advantage.

Norway attacks: Breivik was my friend on Facebook. I've seen what fed his hatred | Camilla Ragfors | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

His point is about people being responsible on the web for the hate they promote. AB's own manifesto contains work by Melanie Phillips, Daniel Pipes, Mark Styne. Are you suggesting they are neo nazi's?

I could not believe the sort of thing I started coming in contact with when I came on the web. I have a hunch about what may have happened.

The BNP who were pretty neo nazi, turned around after 9/11. Opportunism allowed them to go after Muslims instead of Jews and Blacks, whom their hatred towards was not giving much back in the form of votes. Almost overnight they changed from being Jew hating anti zionist party to become what they used to refer to as the most pro Israeli party in the UK. Off they went to the US in search of funds and seemed to meet up with anti Muslim pro Israelis who then started providing the funds and they started the ant Muslim rhetoric against Muslims in the UK, aided and abetted by Melanie Phillips articles, who always just, only just, kept her distance. I have been on forums where zealous pro Israelis have backed the BNP seemingly unaware that under their jumpers all the old timers had Hitler tattoos and the sort.

Then along comes the EDL, even worse as it proves to be just violence and football thugs. But the EDL becomes ever more pro Israel on it's marches. Although they are understandably claiming no relationship he was clearly impressed by them

http://www.channel4.com/news/edl-in-full-control-of-breiviks-norwegian-cell

Now I believe that somewhere within this disgusting make up of hatred there seems to have been a coming together between some just Muslim haters who were also pro Israeli in the States and people who originally had a neo nazi mentality from Europe.

The message from your article is that we should all take care of our hate. We should all take care not to demonise any particular people.

Just as we should not believe every member of far right parties are the same as him, people should get their act together and stop blaming all Muslims for 9/11 ...or god alone knows where that eventually will go.

 

[CitizenPained]

I think he killed because he's nutter and that his views were just a focus point or vehicle for his insanity.

So in reality, he's no different than Muslims that do the same thing.

Name the Christian Country like Iran or Saudi Arabia that Executes Homosexuals, has Mainstream Religious Leaders who Advocate for Terrorism Against the West, and who not only Advocate for this crap, they Teach it to Children as a Matter of Law.

I'll be here.



peace...

Uganda.

DING DING DING!! I get smart points!

 

[AllieBaba]

Uganda's erstwhile leader is a psychopath, and his policies are not Christian, but tribal.

 

[strollingbones]

o come on allie....we can speculate ..cant we?

i mean there was a whole bunch of speculators that said it was muslims etc

so let's speculate on this christians motives and how this reflects on all christians


which is doesnt

 

[CitizenPained]

It's a majority Christian state. No one is saying that Christianity advocates death (though early Nazarenes had no problem ushering the death of Hellenistic society and civilization). Just pointing out that people kill in the name of the Christian god, too.

Can't handle it? Find a tiny unpopular religion that exercises no control over any governmental force in the world and is completely in harmony with their local ruling government. Those are about the only ones that aren't guilty of bigotry or xenophobia at one point or another.

The only religion that I can think of that fits that description are the Druze - a Muslim sect - who advocate being loyal to their government.

 

[AllieBaba]

Nobody said they didn't kill in the name of Christianity.

Just said the numbers don't compare. And they don't. And a variety of different idealogies and groups who kill and are incidentally Christian is NOT the same as a worldwide movement, that is Islam, that kills in the name, specifically, of ISLAM.

The psychopath in Uganda says he's Christian, but he has been denounced by Christian leaders everywhere. We can't even get Sunni to denounce bin Laden. Do you see the difference, puppet?

 

[strollingbones]

come on allie....we all know christians are all about killing.....i am speculating here

 

[CitizenPained]

Clearly you don't know much about the politics of Bin Laden. He's not revered by Sunnis worldwide, and he's had some clashes. And Sunnism isn't without its own conflicts - there is much debate over the status of hadith. Look at what Iran was just a generation ago.

My friend's parents live in Saudi Arabia. They're very Western underneath all that garb.

And Turkey is actually very liberal for a Muslim state. And it supports the war on terrorism.

So don't lump everyone in the same group and make sweeping generalizations about billions of people. Xenophobia doesn't look good on anyone.

 

[CitizenPained]

We can't even get Sunni to denounce bin Laden. Do you see the difference, puppet?

Sunni is not a uniform movement any more than traditional Judaism is.

I see no puppet. Just an ignorant internet hack who hates Muslims. Your attitude is not very Christian.

 

[strollingbones]

allie is talking about another poster...sunni...


damn allie...using psychopath and sunni right next to each other?

 

[AllieBaba]

We can't even get Sunni to denounce bin Laden. Do you see the difference, puppet?

Sunni is not a uniform movement any more than traditional Judaism is.

I see no puppet. Just an ignorant internet hack who hates Muslims. Your attitude is not very Christian.

You're a troll.

What was your name before?

 

[Dot Com]

Reminds me of the right-wing, christian militia in Michigan that Nepolitano busted up last year

 

[strollingbones]

We can't even get Sunni to denounce bin Laden. Do you see the difference, puppet?

Sunni is not a uniform movement any more than traditional Judaism is.

I see no puppet. Just an ignorant internet hack who hates Muslims. Your attitude is not very Christian.

well shes got you there allie.....

 

[AllieBaba]

allie is talking about another poster...sunni...


damn allie...using psychopath and sunni right next to each other?

I know, what was I thinking...

 

[strollingbones]

on a serious note...he can only get 21 years

i am glad the deathcount has lowered

 

[Ravi]

on a serious note...he can only get 21 years

i am glad the deathcount has lowered

Well, there was some talk that not everyone at the camp was a Norwegian citizen so perhaps some other jurisdiction will also be charging him with murder.

 

[AllieBaba]

What's unChristian about standing against a movement that is violent and oppressive?

I don't see a problem.

My language, however, that's a problem from a Christian standpoint. I'll own that.

 

[mal]

So in reality, he's no different than Muslims that do the same thing.

Name the Christian Country like Iran or Saudi Arabia that Executes Homosexuals, has Mainstream Religious Leaders who Advocate for Terrorism Against the West, and who not only Advocate for this crap, they Teach it to Children as a Matter of Law.

I'll be here.



peace...

Uganda.

DING DING DING!! I get smart points!

According to human rights organisations, about 500,000 homosexuals live in Uganda out of a total population of 31 million.[3] Existing laws criminalise homosexual behavior with prison sentences lasting up to 14 years. These laws are remnants of British colonialism designed to punish what colonial authorities deemed unnatural sex among local Ugandan people.[4][5] Although many societies in Africa and elsewhere view homosexuality as a decadent practice imported by outsiders, it existed before European colonisation, often varying in practice depending on individual cultures. In some, male homosexuality was age-stratified, similar to ancient Sparta and Athens where warriors purchased boys as brides, common when women were not available, or manifested as fleeting encounters as in prostitution.[6]

Do the Muslim Countries in Africa Execute Homosexuals?...



peace...

 

[AllieBaba]

The whole situation in Uganda is tribal, NOT Christian. The tribal whackjob who is in power has decided he's Christian now, but he's crazy and his whole viewpoint is based upon TRIBAL tradition, not Christian tradition.

 

[mal]

The whole situation in Uganda is tribal, NOT Christian. The tribal whackjob who is in power has decided he's Christian now, but he's crazy and his whole viewpoint is based upon TRIBAL tradition, not Christian tradition.

Of course... But don't tell a Liberal that.



peace...