The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate

[Hollie]

The only thing between Palestinians and their rights is Israel's guns.

The only thing between Arab Palestinians and their "rights" is the acceptance of equivalent Jewish rights and peace treaties with the neighbors. A people who refuse to make agreements with their neighbors is, by definition, not capable of Statehood.

The Palestinians are at peace with all their neighbors.

Except the neighbors they're trying to kill.

 

[MartyNYC]

Israel was established on outright robbery.
This is a picture of a Palestinian couple (the man in the wheelchair (Abu Samir) and his wife next to him) standing outside a building that was Abu Samir's family home in Ijzim village, Haifa, before the Nakba. The property is now inhabited by an Israeli couple who appear in the same picture.

You utterly fail to understand the context here, which is: the need for the reclamation of the Jewish homeland precisely because it was taken from the Jewish people.

Not by the Palestinians. You need to take that up with the foreign invaders who expelled you.

Who are the foreign invaders of Jews’ ancient homeland?

 

[Shusha]

P F Tinmore

Why is it funny to expect that sovereignty comes with responsibility as well as rights?

I never said it didn't.

No, you just laughed at the post which suggested that Arab Palestinians have responsibilities as well as rights.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore

Why is it funny to expect that sovereignty comes with responsibility as well as rights?

I never said it didn't.

No, you just laughed at the post which suggested that Arab Palestinians have responsibilities as well as rights.

Because it was a stupid post. A mere speculation.

 

[RoccoR]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Maybe I misread your intention as well!

Why is it funny to expect that sovereignty comes with responsibility as well as rights?

I never said it didn't.

No, you just laughed at the post which suggested that Arab Palestinians have responsibilities as well as rights.

Because it was a stupid post. A mere speculation.

(COMMENT)

(Ω) What did you find humorous? (Just so we all can have a laugh...)​

(Ω) What did you find stupid? (Just so we all can learn something...)​

(Ω) What did you find speculative? (Just so we all can better support our opinions - or → refute your conjecture...)​

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Maybe I misread your intention as well!

Why is it funny to expect that sovereignty comes with responsibility as well as rights?

I never said it didn't.

No, you just laughed at the post which suggested that Arab Palestinians have responsibilities as well as rights.

Because it was a stupid post. A mere speculation.

(COMMENT)

(Ω) What did you find humorous? (Just so we all can have a laugh...)​

(Ω) What did you find stupid? (Just so we all can learn something...)​

(Ω) What did you find speculative? (Just so we all can better support our opinions - or → refute your conjecture...)​

Most Respectfully,
R

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

 

[MartyNYC]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Maybe I misread your intention as well!

Why is it funny to expect that sovereignty comes with responsibility as well as rights?

I never said it didn't.

No, you just laughed at the post which suggested that Arab Palestinians have responsibilities as well as rights.

Because it was a stupid post. A mere speculation.

(COMMENT)

(Ω) What did you find humorous? (Just so we all can have a laugh...)​

(Ω) What did you find stupid? (Just so we all can learn something...)​

(Ω) What did you find speculative? (Just so we all can better support our opinions - or → refute your conjecture...)​

Most Respectfully,
R

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

Palestinians named for many places except palestine...

 

[RoccoR]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Knowledge is telling the past. Wisdom is predicting the future.
......................................................................................W. Timothy Garvey
But the best prediction of future events and the path the Arab Palestinians will take come from the past and the history of those events.

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

GTD Search Results
Terrorist Incidents by HAMAS
(Excluding Rocket Attacks)​

(COMMENT)

If we study the progress the Arab Palestinians made in the Gaza Strip, after the unilateral withdrawal by Israeli Forces, is to look at what the Arab Palestinians did between 2005 and 2007. In addition to the terrorist attacks noted in the chart, rocket attacks increased from 488 in 2005 to 2,427 in 2007. HAMAS (the de facto government) expended much of its resources in its development of the Izz ad-Din Abd al-Qassam Brigades.

We will never know how many lives were saved, and how many attacks were aborted as a result of Israeli counter-terrorism operations and the countermeasures put in place by Israeli military, police and security personnel. But as a result of today's overall effort, we see almost no suicide bombers (although there are calls for them) and a significant reduction in the more conventional rocket and mortar fire. And we see a shift to an entirely different kind of weaponry, from generations long since past.

(∑) Speculation, I don't think so. I think it is reasonable to assume, given the history of criminal behaviors by the Arab Palestinians, both by independents (non-state actors) and government-sponsored (state actors), that represent a shift in tactics to exploit new security vulnerabilities.


Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Knowledge is telling the past. Wisdom is predicting the future.
......................................................................................W. Timothy Garvey
But the best prediction of future events and the path the Arab Palestinians will take come from the past and the history of those events.

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

View attachment 359155
GTD Search Results
Terrorist Incidents by HAMAS
(Excluding Rocket Attacks)​

(COMMENT)

If we study the progress the Arab Palestinians made in the Gaza Strip, after the unilateral withdrawal by Israeli Forces, is to look at what the Arab Palestinians did between 2005 and 2007. In addition to the terrorist attacks noted in the chart, rocket attacks increased from 488 in 2005 to 2,427 in 2007. HAMAS (the de facto government) expended much of its resources in its development of the Izz ad-Din Abd al-Qassam Brigades.

We will never know how many lives were saved, and how many attacks were aborted as a result of Israeli counter-terrorism operations and the countermeasures put in place by Israeli military, police and security personnel. But as a result of today's overall effort, we see almost no suicide bombers (although there are calls for them) and a significant reduction in the more conventional rocket and mortar fire. And we see a shift to an entirely different kind of weaponry, from generations long since past.

(∑) Speculation, I don't think so. I think it is reasonable to assume, given the history of criminal behaviors by the Arab Palestinians, both by independents (non-state actors) and government-sponsored (state actors), that represent a shift in tactics to exploit new security vulnerabilities.


Most Respectfully,
R

When did the Palestinians ever have the freedom to be responsible?

 

[MartyNYC]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Knowledge is telling the past. Wisdom is predicting the future.
......................................................................................W. Timothy Garvey
But the best prediction of future events and the path the Arab Palestinians will take come from the past and the history of those events.

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

View attachment 359155
GTD Search Results
Terrorist Incidents by HAMAS
(Excluding Rocket Attacks)​

(COMMENT)

If we study the progress the Arab Palestinians made in the Gaza Strip, after the unilateral withdrawal by Israeli Forces, is to look at what the Arab Palestinians did between 2005 and 2007. In addition to the terrorist attacks noted in the chart, rocket attacks increased from 488 in 2005 to 2,427 in 2007. HAMAS (the de facto government) expended much of its resources in its development of the Izz ad-Din Abd al-Qassam Brigades.

We will never know how many lives were saved, and how many attacks were aborted as a result of Israeli counter-terrorism operations and the countermeasures put in place by Israeli military, police and security personnel. But as a result of today's overall effort, we see almost no suicide bombers (although there are calls for them) and a significant reduction in the more conventional rocket and mortar fire. And we see a shift to an entirely different kind of weaponry, from generations long since past.

(∑) Speculation, I don't think so. I think it is reasonable to assume, given the history of criminal behaviors by the Arab Palestinians, both by independents (non-state actors) and government-sponsored (state actors), that represent a shift in tactics to exploit new security vulnerabilities.


Most Respectfully,
R

When did the Palestinians ever have the freedom to be responsible?

The palestinians? Named for the British Mandate, called palestine, a European imperialist, colonialist entity that ceased to exist in 1948 with Israeli statehood. Not very authentic.

 

[MartyNYC]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Maybe I misread your intention as well!

Why is it funny to expect that sovereignty comes with responsibility as well as rights?

I never said it didn't.

No, you just laughed at the post which suggested that Arab Palestinians have responsibilities as well as rights.

Because it was a stupid post. A mere speculation.

(COMMENT)

(Ω) What did you find humorous? (Just so we all can have a laugh...)​

(Ω) What did you find stupid? (Just so we all can learn something...)​

(Ω) What did you find speculative? (Just so we all can better support our opinions - or → refute your conjecture...)​

Most Respectfully,
R

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

Welcome To Palestine! Feel the love?

 

[RoccoR]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: You cannot use that as an excuse.

When did the Palestinians ever have the freedom to be responsible?

(COMMENT)

The Arab Palestinians were offered numerous opportunities to become involved in self-governing institutions. Each time the Jewish Agency was offered an opportunity, the Arab Higher Committee was offered the same opportunity. You cannot blame the Israelis for the land grab by the Arab League (Jordan and Egypt in particular). Even today, the Arab Palestinians have the "responsibility to establish an effective and corrupt-free government" in Ramallah and Gaza; they just lay back and whine that it is too hard to do. With each passing day that the general population allows the criminal activity to run the government, is an example and demonstration of the Arab Palestinian People's lack of responsible action.

Right now, the Arab Palestinians have a chance to come to an agreement that might lead to a state that is hugely well developed and sound. Yet, they would ignore the opportunity yet again, and would rather say goodbye to a significant swath of territory. The Israelis, once they annex territory, will not give it back. And the Arab Palestinians will have no one to blame but themselves.


Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

When did the Palestinians ever have the freedom to be responsible?

They were free to not fire rockets from Gaza.

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: Knowledge is telling the past. Wisdom is predicting the future.
......................................................................................W. Timothy Garvey
But the best prediction of future events and the path the Arab Palestinians will take come from the past and the history of those events.

She speculates that the Palestinians would not be responsible with freedom and responsibility. I don't know why she would say that.

View attachment 359155
GTD Search Results
Terrorist Incidents by HAMAS
(Excluding Rocket Attacks)​

(COMMENT)

If we study the progress the Arab Palestinians made in the Gaza Strip, after the unilateral withdrawal by Israeli Forces, is to look at what the Arab Palestinians did between 2005 and 2007. In addition to the terrorist attacks noted in the chart, rocket attacks increased from 488 in 2005 to 2,427 in 2007. HAMAS (the de facto government) expended much of its resources in its development of the Izz ad-Din Abd al-Qassam Brigades.

We will never know how many lives were saved, and how many attacks were aborted as a result of Israeli counter-terrorism operations and the countermeasures put in place by Israeli military, police and security personnel. But as a result of today's overall effort, we see almost no suicide bombers (although there are calls for them) and a significant reduction in the more conventional rocket and mortar fire. And we see a shift to an entirely different kind of weaponry, from generations long since past.

(∑) Speculation, I don't think so. I think it is reasonable to assume, given the history of criminal behaviors by the Arab Palestinians, both by independents (non-state actors) and government-sponsored (state actors), that represent a shift in tactics to exploit new security vulnerabilities.


Most Respectfully,
R

That ducks my post.

 

[RoccoR]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: The hell it does.

That ducks my post.

(COMMENT)

They (Arab Palestinians) have freedom and responsibility NOW to run, manage, and maintain an effective and fair government. Yet they left Fahtah and HAMAS run things. They simply don't have the capacity or willingness to do the right thing.

That is not ducking the question, it is right on target.


Most Respectfully,
R

 

[MartyNYC]

Welcome To Palestine!

Another Brutal Crackdown by Hamas in Gaza. Beatings & Arrests of Rights Defenders, Journalists, Demonstrators Reflect Systematic Practice.

Another Brutal Crackdown by Hamas in Gaza | Human Rights Watch

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: You cannot use that as an excuse.

When did the Palestinians ever have the freedom to be responsible?

(COMMENT)

The Arab Palestinians were offered numerous opportunities to become involved in self-governing institutions. Each time the Jewish Agency was offered an opportunity, the Arab Higher Committee was offered the same opportunity. You cannot blame the Israelis for the land grab by the Arab League (Jordan and Egypt in particular). Even today, the Arab Palestinians have the "responsibility to establish an effective and corrupt-free government" in Ramallah and Gaza; they just lay back and whine that it is too hard to do. With each passing day that the general population allows the criminal activity to run the government, is an example and demonstration of the Arab Palestinian People's lack of responsible action.

Right now, the Arab Palestinians have a chance to come to an agreement that might lead to a state that is hugely well developed and sound. Yet, they would ignore the opportunity yet again, and would rather say goodbye to a significant swath of territory. The Israelis, once they annex territory, will not give it back. And the Arab Palestinians will have no one to blame but themselves.


Most Respectfully,
R

The Arab Palestinians were offered numerous opportunities to become involved in self-governing institutions.

And they all started with surrender.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Why are we mixing what happened until the creation of Israel with what happened after and today?

Why allow P to drag this thread to anything about the conflict, instead of staying before 1949?

This truly belongs in the "Who are the Palestinians" thread.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

RE: The NEWER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

BLUF: You cannot use that as an excuse.

When did the Palestinians ever have the freedom to be responsible?

(COMMENT)

The Arab Palestinians were offered numerous opportunities to become involved in self-governing institutions. Each time the Jewish Agency was offered an opportunity, the Arab Higher Committee was offered the same opportunity. You cannot blame the Israelis for the land grab by the Arab League (Jordan and Egypt in particular). Even today, the Arab Palestinians have the "responsibility to establish an effective and corrupt-free government" in Ramallah and Gaza; they just lay back and whine that it is too hard to do. With each passing day that the general population allows the criminal activity to run the government, is an example and demonstration of the Arab Palestinian People's lack of responsible action.

Right now, the Arab Palestinians have a chance to come to an agreement that might lead to a state that is hugely well developed and sound. Yet, they would ignore the opportunity yet again, and would rather say goodbye to a significant swath of territory. The Israelis, once they annex territory, will not give it back. And the Arab Palestinians will have no one to blame but themselves.


Most Respectfully,
R

The Arab Palestinians were offered numerous opportunities to become involved in self-governing institutions.

And they all started with surrender.

How's that working out for the size of a future state?

 

[MartyNYC]

Welcome To Palestine! Authorities crush dissent