The Existence of God Almighty

[AVG-JOE]

I speak as a Muslim.

Apart from what I said in the opening post, I also say that God Almighty's greatness is obvious. It is not hidden in anything.

If the evidence that you care to consider points your heart toward The God of Abraham, as defined in The Torah, The New Testament and The Koran, that would be your business.

I disagree with your conclusions but I understand the attraction.

Beer? ​

 

[Mindlight]

Christians and Muslims are both monotheistic and since we out vote you the burden of proof is on you. I note you make no case and provide no proofs that God does not exist

There's no burden of proof on me regarding the non-existence of your gawds.

I've already provided the proofs your gawds are inventions of mankind. Prove I haven't

Anyone who reads your posts in this OP knows that you have provided no arguments beyond a vague reference to the spaces between stars not demonstrating symetry. This does not really constitute an argument as symetry is not a precondition for evidence of intelligent design.

I hear a lot of "no" and a lot of anger against Christians. So you may have some personal reasons to dislike Christians but there are no factual proofs in what you say.

That confused, inane and incoherent rambling was as pointless as your usual triple. There is no precondition for evidence of supernatural design because there is simply no evidence for supernatural (magical) design.

no one has argued that God created anything through supernatural means. God
ordained the natural law. He understands it far more than you or I. What seems supernatural to you is simply God using the law He created.

While you may be entirely comfortable with imposing your beliefs in the supernatural, I feel sorry for young people being subjected to such indoctrination. They’ll be in for quite a shock when they end up in actual college biology and learn that their earlier indoctrination to evolution being controversial was a fraud when it’s just a basic part of standard biology education. Christians who accept evolution often say that one of the bigger sources of atheism occurs when students are raised fundamentalist then go to college and learn that evolution and geology aren’t conspiratorial fairytales, just obvious conclusions from massive datasets.

A great many Christians adopt a Theistic Evolutionary position so again no argument here against the existence of God. Indeed the Catholic School system teaches this in the USA.

 

[Derideo_Te]

I have made the same argument. Somehow, the universe came to exist. Either it was created by an outside entity, or it got here all by itself. I find the second theory to be extremely improbable.

Both of your options are improbable. The Laws of Physics tell us that matter can neither be created nor destroyed therefore the Universe has always existed. Logically that makes the most sense of all.

 

[Mindlight]

I have made the same argument. Somehow, the universe came to exist. Either it was created by an outside entity, or it got here all by itself. I find the second theory to be extremely improbable.

Both of your options are improbable. The Laws of Physics tell us that matter can neither be created nor destroyed therefore the Universe has always existed. Logically that makes the most sense of all.

Matter can be neither created or destroyed by any observable natural process and indeed this would contradict the principle of conservation of energy.

But if what is seen was created out of what is unseen as the bible says by an External Actor who was capable of this. There is no way that the laws of Physics can account for such an intervention nor explain it.

However the second law of thermodynamics (Entropy) seems to imply that the universe is dissappating from a more concentrated beginning which fits the idea of there having been a beginning.

 

[Derideo_Te]

I have made the same argument. Somehow, the universe came to exist. Either it was created by an outside entity, or it got here all by itself. I find the second theory to be extremely improbable.

Both of your options are improbable. The Laws of Physics tell us that matter can neither be created nor destroyed therefore the Universe has always existed. Logically that makes the most sense of all.

Matter can be neither created or destroyed by any observable natural process and indeed this would contradict the principle of conservation of energy.

But if what is seen was created out of what is unseen as the bible says by an External Actor who was capable of this. There is no way that the laws of Physics can account for such an intervention nor explain it.

However the second law of thermodynamics (Entropy) seems to imply that the universe is dissappating from a more concentrated beginning which fits the idea of there having been a beginning.

We can observe only a tiny fraction of the Universe. We have no idea what is happening in the other 90% plus. Another big bang could be forming beyond our horizon. Another could even be exploding somewhere else in the Universe right now and we would have no idea that it was happening.

You can embrace the concept of your "creator" doing something "unseen" but not that the Universe is mostly "unseen" from our limited perspective? If you could travel to the edge of the Universe as we know it today what would you see if you looked back at Earth? Would it be part of the Cosmic Background Radiation? What would you see looking in the other direction? Would it be empty space or would it be more billions more stars and galaxies similar to what we see all around us?

 

[Avatar4321]

Proof of God is in His acts. He acts today as He has in the past. He speaks today as He has in the past. He calls prophets and reveals His will to men as He has in the past. He heals the sick. He raises the dead. He calms the troubled heart. He provides food for the hungry and clothes for the naked. He speaks peace to the soul.

he fulfills the promises He has made with the House of Israel. He gives wisdom to those that ask of Him.

He is real. He lives you. And you don't have to take my word for it. Because of Jesus Christ you can go to the Father and ask to know God for yourself. You can learn the truth from the spirit

Re: your heavy handed proselytizing. Enough already.

you're the one voluntarily coming to these threads. I've explained to you how you can know God. If you don't want to talk about God or learn to get to know Him it seems rather odd to stick around

Proof of God is in His acts. He acts today as He has in the past. He speaks today as He has in the past. He calls prophets and reveals His will to men as He has in the past. He heals the sick. He raises the dead. He calms the troubled heart. He provides food for the hungry and clothes for the naked. He speaks peace to the soul.

he fulfills the promises He has made with the House of Israel. He gives wisdom to those that ask of Him.

He is real. He lives you. And you don't have to take my word for it. Because of Jesus Christ you can go to the Father and ask to know God for yourself. You can learn the truth from the spirit

god is real said the old man,, and I believe him because ,why would Santa lie to me

the fact that you are talking to a man who died a long time ago should probably induce you to give some credence to what he says

 

[Avatar4321]

Proof of God is in His acts. He acts today as He has in the past. He speaks today as He has in the past. He calls prophets and reveals His will to men as He has in the past. He heals the sick. He raises the dead. He calms the troubled heart. He provides food for the hungry and clothes for the naked. He speaks peace to the soul.

he fulfills the promises He has made with the House of Israel. He gives wisdom to those that ask of Him.

He is real. He lives you. And you don't have to take my word for it. Because of Jesus Christ you can go to the Father and ask to know God for yourself. You can learn the truth from the spirit

Re: your heavy handed proselytizing. Enough already.

you're the one voluntarily coming to these threads. I've explained to you how you can know God. If you don't want to talk about God or learn to get to know Him it seems rather odd to stick around

Proof of God is in His acts. He acts today as He has in the past. He speaks today as He has in the past. He calls prophets and reveals His will to men as He has in the past. He heals the sick. He raises the dead. He calms the troubled heart. He provides food for the hungry and clothes for the naked. He speaks peace to the soul.

he fulfills the promises He has made with the House of Israel. He gives wisdom to those that ask of Him.

He is real. He lives you. And you don't have to take my word for it. Because of Jesus Christ you can go to the Father and ask to know God for yourself. You can learn the truth from the spirit

god is real said the old man,, and I believe him because ,why would Santa lie to me

the fact that you are talking to a man who died a long time ago should probably induce you to give some credence to what he says

 

[Hollie]

Proof of God is in His acts. He acts today as He has in the past. He speaks today as He has in the past. He calls prophets and reveals His will to men as He has in the past. He heals the sick. He raises the dead. He calms the troubled heart. He provides food for the hungry and clothes for the naked. He speaks peace to the soul.

he fulfills the promises He has made with the House of Israel. He gives wisdom to those that ask of Him.

He is real. He lives you. And you don't have to take my word for it. Because of Jesus Christ you can go to the Father and ask to know God for yourself. You can learn the truth from the spirit

Re: your heavy handed proselytizing. Enough already.

you're the one voluntarily coming to these threads. I've explained to you how you can know God. If you don't want to talk about God or learn to get to know Him it seems rather odd to stick around

Proof of God is in His acts. He acts today as He has in the past. He speaks today as He has in the past. He calls prophets and reveals His will to men as He has in the past. He heals the sick. He raises the dead. He calms the troubled heart. He provides food for the hungry and clothes for the naked. He speaks peace to the soul.

he fulfills the promises He has made with the House of Israel. He gives wisdom to those that ask of Him.

He is real. He lives you. And you don't have to take my word for it. Because of Jesus Christ you can go to the Father and ask to know God for yourself. You can learn the truth from the spirit

god is real said the old man,, and I believe him because ,why would Santa lie to me

the fact that you are talking to a man who died a long time ago should probably induce you to give some credence to what he says

I just can't help but note that you use your religion like a bloody truncheon.

More to the point, you shouldn't react with such anger and vitriol when your specious claims to partisan gawds are rejected as being absent evidence and completely subjective.

Your claims to having communications with some alleged spirit world is fine for those like you with a predisposition for a particular configuration of gawds. However, you really shouldn't expect others to immediately discard the standards of reason and rationality and blindly accept your version of theism replete with contradictory and outrageous Claims by your religions inventor.

 

[Avatar4321]

Anger? The only one angry is you my friend. I'm quite happy. It just seems like a complete waste of time to go discuss religion with people and then complain about them talking about religion

one day the time will come when you face something that you realize is beyond your ability and I hope you will remember that you Heavenly Father loves you and that you can always call upon Christ

 

[Avatar4321]

Oh and I've never asked anyone to blindly believe me. I've invited you to ask for yourself. You e chosen not to

 

[Darkwind]

I am speaking from the Islamic perspective.

The proof that God exists is His act. Like footprints indicate a walker, His act indicates His existence. The rain that comes from the sky, the constellations of the Zodiac and the vast pathways above you in the sky point to the existence of a unique Almighty God.

Rain is what happens when solar radiation heats the earth and atmosphere. Moisture evaporates and rises forming clouds, when there's enough water droplets get too big to stay suspended in the air and fall to the earth as rain.

Constellations are only constellations from here. They're only shapes from our perspective. Move a light-year left or right and they vanish. So it's like looking at a random dumping of rocks on the ground, if you try hard enough you could make shapes/constellations out fo the rocks too. Kick and scatter the rocks and the constellations vanish.

Your evidence for God is simply your own ignorance of reality.

A more idiotic reply could not be made.

The science is well understood on what causes rain. Yet, you don't seem to think that a 'Creator' wouldn't understand the process needed to create rain. Or that a "Creator" would not understand that existence has to exist within a specific framework.

Simply because we understand some of the science does not disprove the existence of a Divine Creator.

You need to take a class in critical thinking.

 

[sealybobo]

When one believes in God, if he holds earth in his hand, it turns to gold. When one believes in God, if he holds a burning firebrand in his hand, it won't burn him.

There are people who believe in God. It's not like those who say, I believe in God, and actually think they believe in God.

The truth is that most intelligent people, if not brainwashed/guilted into believing first and given enough evidence would not believe in god. Not just their god but any god.

If you knew enough facts, history and science you'd realize that human beings made up god long before Abraham. Maybe 100,000 years ago. We were a very superstitious species smart enough to contemplate our existence. But all we did was make stories up on this premise. "Something must have made us".

Ever see the Cosmos? There are 2. The old one and the new one. Both are amazing. You MUST watch both. You know how people say you have to read the bible before you decide there is no god? Well you have to watch the Cosmos before you decide there is a god.

This week PBS had a documentary on early Christianity. How all the "Disciples" of Jesus were nothing more than Jews trying to start a new sect within Christianity. They told about how Greek Pagens visited the Jewish synagogs and liked the community and beauty of the singing and they wanted to join, but being Jewish was very difficult. First of all we didn't want to get circumsized. So Peter, Paul, John, etc. are just guys who started a new cult. And they competed/argued that their way is the right way not the others. That's why we have the Gospels according to FILL IN THE BLANKS. Then once it caught on, it was REQUIRED to be a Christian. Basically forced on us by rulers. So beyond telling us believe or go do hell, they also said believe or DIE.

God never talked to anyone ever. Know why? Because god doesn't exist. We need to stop believing ancient fairytales. Jesus was a good guy and Mohammad didn't talk to god. Neither did George Bush.

Oh yea, and if you watch the Cosmos you will see how religion and our ignorant ancestors have held us back thousands of years. They tell a story about ancient civilizations who figured out the earth was round long before Columbus. What happened to those cultures and the knowledge they retained? They were destroyed.

Great modern day example of how dumb mankind is. Instead of exploring space, how much money did we spend on the cold war with Russia? Imagine where we would be if we spent all that money on exploring space instead of all the nuclear bombs we built? We would have a space station on Mars. This earth isn't going to last forever. If we want mankind to live forever, we better get our heads out of our asses.

First step is to stop being brainwashed. There is no god. If there is a "creator", he doesn't give a fuck about you. You are so small in the cosmos that's like saying you care about a pebble of sand on the beach.

Religion is how they control us. If we are dumb enough to believe that shit then we really aren't that evolved yet are we.

 

[sealybobo]

I am speaking from the Islamic perspective.

The proof that God exists is His act. Like footprints indicate a walker, His act indicates His existence. The rain that comes from the sky, the constellations of the Zodiac and the vast pathways above you in the sky point to the existence of a unique Almighty God.

Rain is what happens when solar radiation heats the earth and atmosphere. Moisture evaporates and rises forming clouds, when there's enough water droplets get too big to stay suspended in the air and fall to the earth as rain.

Constellations are only constellations from here. They're only shapes from our perspective. Move a light-year left or right and they vanish. So it's like looking at a random dumping of rocks on the ground, if you try hard enough you could make shapes/constellations out fo the rocks too. Kick and scatter the rocks and the constellations vanish.

Your evidence for God is simply your own ignorance of reality.

A more idiotic reply could not be made.

The science is well understood on what causes rain. Yet, you don't seem to think that a 'Creator' wouldn't understand the process needed to create rain. Or that a "Creator" would not understand that existence has to exist within a specific framework.

Simply because we understand some of the science does not disprove the existence of a Divine Creator.

You need to take a class in critical thinking.

Even 100,000 years ago our primitive ancestors said, "there must be a creator". So I don't think that argument will ever end.

But as for god coming and talking to Adam then Abraham and then Moses and then Jesus and then Mohammad and then Joseph Smith? Anyone buying that shit is just brainwashed.

I was watching the original Cosmos and it explained how life started 40 million years ago and we all come from the same place. Trees, plants, animals, all came from the same life. Started off a fungus or bacteria, evolved into single cell, then multi cell, then developed teeth and eyes and started having sex and started walking on land and branched off into plants, birds, fish, dinosaurs and every other animal on earth.

Science basically knows how and when life started. Oh yeah, and the old Cosmos said life started here and the new one suggests a comet brought life here. Anyways, we don't know everything but we know Christianity and Jew and Muslim is all made up.

Unless you think god planted a giraffe seed and a dog seed and a human seed and a rose seed and a dinosaur seed and different seed for every other animal on the planet, even the ones that have gone extinct.

Or if we put the time of the big bang to today on a 12 month calendar, life started in October and humans finally evolved at 11:59 pm on the last day of the year. We are such a young primitive species. We know so little.

The churches have been fooling us and holding us back for thousands of years. Time to stop that.

 

[sealybobo]

I speak as a Muslim.

One who believes in God cannot lie, cannot cheat, cannot do wrong to anyone.

Then one who believes in God cannot be a Muslim.

Simple as that.

That's ridiculous. Originally someone made up the Jewish religion. But they all argued constantly about what that meant, what it took to go to heaven. There were competing sects. Then a new sect came out of the Jewish religion and it was Christianity. Who knows what was fact and what was fiction. Bottom line is that 11 guys went around convincing very uneducated and superstitious people that the Messiah came and went about 50 years. ago. They told pretty much the same story they tell today that we/you buy. A lot of "Christians" were non jews who wanted to join a church but didn't want to get circumsized and instead of having to jump through a lot of hoops like it takes to be jewish, we came up with a dunking or "baptism".

It was easy to come up with this new religion. In fact the Old Testament foretold of a coming Messiah.

Oh, and they all thought that god/Jesus was going to return in their lifetime. Fast forward 2015 years later and we're still waiting.

Peter, Paul, Luke, John. They all argued over the details. This is why today we have Baptists, Catholics, Lutherans.

Oh yea, and Martin Luther was crazy. He believed suffering was the way to get close to god. Feel like Jesus did on the cross. He would sleep in the cold and whip himself so he had bloody scars. Imagine his disappointment when he died and realized he wasted all that time on something that doesn't even exist. He swallowed some story that someone told him and he let it rule his life. Why don't you do that? Why don't you whip yourself or sleep in the cold to worship Jesus?

We need to let this God thing go. Does not exist. Sorry.

 

[sealybobo]

“Change is always one generation away. So if we can plant the seeds of doubt in our children, religion will go away in a generation, or at least largely go away. And that’s what I think we have an obligation to do.”
.

The Soviet Commies said a similar thing- they said they would parade the last Christian on TV. LOL. I was In Poland with a church mission when the evil empire of atheistic communism collapsed. Noone there believed in the false promises and evil realities of that false atheistic ideology and I could see the fruit of those shabby thinkers Marx and Lenin. Not even the guys in the party believed in this rubbish and I witnessed to them too before and after the collapse. You atheists keep killing us and persecuting us and yet we have never been stronger. There is nothing honest about atheism. It is a denial of reality not an affirmation.

Don't equate us scientific thinkers with commies.

I don't believe god will go away completely either. People are too superstitious, wishful thinking and us atheists can't prove god doesn't exist.

But no doubt the more science we learn, the less likely a god exists. When you understand how old and big the universe is, you sort of realize how silly man made religion is. Completely unnecessary. I know it makes you feel good and I know you don't want to go to hell for doubting so I/we know it is difficult for you to grasp.

Don't label us with Marx and Lenin. It makes you sound stupid. They had wacky political ideologies. They had AN AGENDA. Us Atheists just want reason and logic to prevail. For example we are destroying this planet because our citizens are greedy stupid theists. No coincidence. And every technological advancement including cures have come from science. Stop with the commy talk you dumb old brainwashed fart. LOL.

Follow these rules: Test ideas by experiments and observations. Build on those ideas that pass the test. Reject the ones that fail. Follow the evidence wherever it leads, and question everything.

If you do this you will start experiencing cognitive dissonance.

Actually there is little difference between the scientific materialism of the Commies and that of modern Liberal Progressive Atheists so if that is the way you want to differentiate yourself you fail. The main differences are that Commies would kill Christians for their faith while your strategy appears to be an attempt at ridicule and marginalisation. Also the Commies did not have a clue about economics and were fraudulent and corrupt while most modern Liberal Progressive atheists are better behaved when it comes to money. The abortion rate was higher among Commie atheists than Liberal Progressive atheists ironically. The biggest difference today with the Liberal Progressive Atheists is sexual perversion. The Commies would put queers to death while you play happy families with gay marriages.

Russians are commies still right? Are they killing Christians today? Is there a Russian Holocust going on right now against Christians? Then shut the fuck up.

 

[Mindlight]

“Change is always one generation away. So if we can plant the seeds of doubt in our children, religion will go away in a generation, or at least largely go away. And that’s what I think we have an obligation to do.”
.

The Soviet Commies said a similar thing- they said they would parade the last Christian on TV. LOL. I was In Poland with a church mission when the evil empire of atheistic communism collapsed. Noone there believed in the false promises and evil realities of that false atheistic ideology and I could see the fruit of those shabby thinkers Marx and Lenin. Not even the guys in the party believed in this rubbish and I witnessed to them too before and after the collapse. You atheists keep killing us and persecuting us and yet we have never been stronger. There is nothing honest about atheism. It is a denial of reality not an affirmation.

Don't equate us scientific thinkers with commies.

I don't believe god will go away completely either. People are too superstitious, wishful thinking and us atheists can't prove god doesn't exist.

But no doubt the more science we learn, the less likely a god exists. When you understand how old and big the universe is, you sort of realize how silly man made religion is. Completely unnecessary. I know it makes you feel good and I know you don't want to go to hell for doubting so I/we know it is difficult for you to grasp.

Don't label us with Marx and Lenin. It makes you sound stupid. They had wacky political ideologies. They had AN AGENDA. Us Atheists just want reason and logic to prevail. For example we are destroying this planet because our citizens are greedy stupid theists. No coincidence. And every technological advancement including cures have come from science. Stop with the commy talk you dumb old brainwashed fart. LOL.

Follow these rules: Test ideas by experiments and observations. Build on those ideas that pass the test. Reject the ones that fail. Follow the evidence wherever it leads, and question everything.

If you do this you will start experiencing cognitive dissonance.

Actually there is little difference between the scientific materialism of the Commies and that of modern Liberal Progressive Atheists so if that is the way you want to differentiate yourself you fail. The main differences are that Commies would kill Christians for their faith while your strategy appears to be an attempt at ridicule and marginalisation. Also the Commies did not have a clue about economics and were fraudulent and corrupt while most modern Liberal Progressive atheists are better behaved when it comes to money. The abortion rate was higher among Commie atheists than Liberal Progressive atheists ironically. The biggest difference today with the Liberal Progressive Atheists is sexual perversion. The Commies would put queers to death while you play happy families with gay marriages.

Russians are commies still right? Are they killing Christians today? Is there a Russian Holocust going on right now against Christians? Then shut the fuck up.

Russians are not commies now. You appear to have missed the collapse of the Soviet Union and the changes that followed.

 

[sealybobo]

“Change is always one generation away. So if we can plant the seeds of doubt in our children, religion will go away in a generation, or at least largely go away. And that’s what I think we have an obligation to do.”
.

The Soviet Commies said a similar thing- they said they would parade the last Christian on TV. LOL. I was In Poland with a church mission when the evil empire of atheistic communism collapsed. Noone there believed in the false promises and evil realities of that false atheistic ideology and I could see the fruit of those shabby thinkers Marx and Lenin. Not even the guys in the party believed in this rubbish and I witnessed to them too before and after the collapse. You atheists keep killing us and persecuting us and yet we have never been stronger. There is nothing honest about atheism. It is a denial of reality not an affirmation.

Don't equate us scientific thinkers with commies.

I don't believe god will go away completely either. People are too superstitious, wishful thinking and us atheists can't prove god doesn't exist.

But no doubt the more science we learn, the less likely a god exists. When you understand how old and big the universe is, you sort of realize how silly man made religion is. Completely unnecessary. I know it makes you feel good and I know you don't want to go to hell for doubting so I/we know it is difficult for you to grasp.

Don't label us with Marx and Lenin. It makes you sound stupid. They had wacky political ideologies. They had AN AGENDA. Us Atheists just want reason and logic to prevail. For example we are destroying this planet because our citizens are greedy stupid theists. No coincidence. And every technological advancement including cures have come from science. Stop with the commy talk you dumb old brainwashed fart. LOL.

Follow these rules: Test ideas by experiments and observations. Build on those ideas that pass the test. Reject the ones that fail. Follow the evidence wherever it leads, and question everything.

If you do this you will start experiencing cognitive dissonance.

Actually there is little difference between the scientific materialism of the Commies and that of modern Liberal Progressive Atheists so if that is the way you want to differentiate yourself you fail. The main differences are that Commies would kill Christians for their faith while your strategy appears to be an attempt at ridicule and marginalisation. Also the Commies did not have a clue about economics and were fraudulent and corrupt while most modern Liberal Progressive atheists are better behaved when it comes to money. The abortion rate was higher among Commie atheists than Liberal Progressive atheists ironically. The biggest difference today with the Liberal Progressive Atheists is sexual perversion. The Commies would put queers to death while you play happy families with gay marriages.

Russians are commies still right? Are they killing Christians today? Is there a Russian Holocust going on right now against Christians? Then shut the fuck up.

Russians are not commies now. You appear to have missed the collapse of the Soviet Union and the changes that followed.

So the only commies are liberal Americans now? You guys are so stupid.

Hey, every theist should be required to watch the Cosmos. Not just the new one but the old one too. It explains everything a person needs to know in order to realize that there is no god. Christians say, "you have to read the bible before you can say you don't believe". The truth is, you need to watch the Cosmos before you read the bible because it explains the history of man and religion. When you know the history you know that they made up god AND they use god to hold us back.

Did you know 2500 years ago the Greeks figured out that the earth is not the center of the universe? We aren't even at the center of the Milky Way Galaxy. They figured out that all the stars were other suns. They were not Neptune, Venus, Zeus, Hercules, etc. That's what primitive ancient superstitious man believed. The Greeks discovered science. So why/how did all this knowledge disappear? The Mystics, Religious and Superstitious squashed all that knowledge. Then later these stupid humans decided that there is only one god not many. Instead of realizing there is no god, they went from many gods to 1. The Jews, Christians & Muslims would rule for the next 2000 years.

Every time a society is free to think, it never goes well for god. In a free society like ancient Greece or America today, we see science is flourishing because we/they are/were free to think.

And today religion can't squash free thinking and science, so they have tried to embrace science and pretend that they didn't hold us back intellectually for thousands of years.

Religion is an evil thing. It is a lie. I don't care what charitable works it does. That's like saying a slave master is good because he feeds his slaves once a day. BFD. Imagine where we would be today without religion. Instead of just now reaching Mars, maybe we would have already colonized Mars. But no. Instead we have an arms race with Russia for 50 years. We built how many nuclear bombs?

I have very little confidence in the human race. Until I see it shed the delusions of religion that is.

 

[sealybobo]

I am speaking from the Islamic perspective.

The proof that God exists is His act. Like footprints indicate a walker, His act indicates His existence. The rain that comes from the sky, the constellations of the Zodiac and the vast pathways above you in the sky point to the existence of a unique Almighty God.

Rain is what happens when solar radiation heats the earth and atmosphere. Moisture evaporates and rises forming clouds, when there's enough water droplets get too big to stay suspended in the air and fall to the earth as rain.

Constellations are only constellations from here. They're only shapes from our perspective. Move a light-year left or right and they vanish. So it's like looking at a random dumping of rocks on the ground, if you try hard enough you could make shapes/constellations out fo the rocks too. Kick and scatter the rocks and the constellations vanish.

Your evidence for God is simply your own ignorance of reality.

A more idiotic reply could not be made.

The science is well understood on what causes rain. Yet, you don't seem to think that a 'Creator' wouldn't understand the process needed to create rain. Or that a "Creator" would not understand that existence has to exist within a specific framework.

Simply because we understand some of the science does not disprove the existence of a Divine Creator.

You need to take a class in critical thinking.

You need to watch the original Cosmos and understand where this "Divine Creator" concept came from. It came from our ancient ancestors who were superstitious and ignorant. First they thought all the stars were gods. Then they came up with the one god concept. Today the one god theory rules. But it is just a theory, unless of course you believe god talked to Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Noah. Do you really believe that? Then you are dumb.

In ancient Greece, some philosophers (Aristarchus of Samos, Thales of Miletus, Anaximander, Theodorus of Samos, Empedocles, Democritus) freely pursue scientific knowledge, while others (Plato, Aristotle, and the Pythagoreans) advocate slavery and epistemic secrecy.

Aristarchus lived 300 years before Christ was supposedly sent here to earth by himself on a suicide mission. Ari discovered science, reason and logic. But then like every other scientific free thinker, he was tried for hearsay by the church. Plato and the Pythagoreans decided that this knowledge should be kept from the masses. So for another few thousands of years, us stupid humans would continue to believe in superstition, mysticism and religion and religion would hold back science. For that religion can go to hell and kiss my ass. I don't care if you are a good hearted Christian, Muslim or Jew. Your religion is the root of all evil imo.

 

[Mindlight]

The Soviet Commies said a similar thing- they said they would parade the last Christian on TV. LOL. I was In Poland with a church mission when the evil empire of atheistic communism collapsed. Noone there believed in the false promises and evil realities of that false atheistic ideology and I could see the fruit of those shabby thinkers Marx and Lenin. Not even the guys in the party believed in this rubbish and I witnessed to them too before and after the collapse. You atheists keep killing us and persecuting us and yet we have never been stronger. There is nothing honest about atheism. It is a denial of reality not an affirmation.

Don't equate us scientific thinkers with commies.

I don't believe god will go away completely either. People are too superstitious, wishful thinking and us atheists can't prove god doesn't exist.

But no doubt the more science we learn, the less likely a god exists. When you understand how old and big the universe is, you sort of realize how silly man made religion is. Completely unnecessary. I know it makes you feel good and I know you don't want to go to hell for doubting so I/we know it is difficult for you to grasp.

Don't label us with Marx and Lenin. It makes you sound stupid. They had wacky political ideologies. They had AN AGENDA. Us Atheists just want reason and logic to prevail. For example we are destroying this planet because our citizens are greedy stupid theists. No coincidence. And every technological advancement including cures have come from science. Stop with the commy talk you dumb old brainwashed fart. LOL.

Follow these rules: Test ideas by experiments and observations. Build on those ideas that pass the test. Reject the ones that fail. Follow the evidence wherever it leads, and question everything.

If you do this you will start experiencing cognitive dissonance.

Actually there is little difference between the scientific materialism of the Commies and that of modern Liberal Progressive Atheists so if that is the way you want to differentiate yourself you fail. The main differences are that Commies would kill Christians for their faith while your strategy appears to be an attempt at ridicule and marginalisation. Also the Commies did not have a clue about economics and were fraudulent and corrupt while most modern Liberal Progressive atheists are better behaved when it comes to money. The abortion rate was higher among Commie atheists than Liberal Progressive atheists ironically. The biggest difference today with the Liberal Progressive Atheists is sexual perversion. The Commies would put queers to death while you play happy families with gay marriages.

Russians are commies still right? Are they killing Christians today? Is there a Russian Holocust going on right now against Christians? Then shut the fuck up.

Russians are not commies now. You appear to have missed the collapse of the Soviet Union and the changes that followed.

So the only commies are liberal Americans now? You guys are so stupid.

Hey, every theist should be required to watch the Cosmos. Not just the new one but the old one too. It explains everything a person needs to know in order to realize that there is no god. Christians say, "you have to read the bible before you can say you don't believe". The truth is, you need to watch the Cosmos before you read the bible because it explains the history of man and religion. When you know the history you know that they made up god AND they use god to hold us back.

Did you know 2500 years ago the Greeks figured out that the earth is not the center of the universe? We aren't even at the center of the Milky Way Galaxy. They figured out that all the stars were other suns. They were not Neptune, Venus, Zeus, Hercules, etc. That's what primitive ancient superstitious man believed. The Greeks discovered science. So why/how did all this knowledge disappear? The Mystics, Religious and Superstitious squashed all that knowledge. Then later these stupid humans decided that there is only one god not many. Instead of realizing there is no god, they went from many gods to 1. The Jews, Christians & Muslims would rule for the next 2000 years.

Every time a society is free to think, it never goes well for god. In a free society like ancient Greece or America today, we see science is flourishing because we/they are/were free to think.

And today religion can't squash free thinking and science, so they have tried to embrace science and pretend that they didn't hold us back intellectually for thousands of years.

Religion is an evil thing. It is a lie. I don't care what charitable works it does. That's like saying a slave master is good because he feeds his slaves once a day. BFD. Imagine where we would be today without religion. Instead of just now reaching Mars, maybe we would have already colonized Mars. But no. Instead we have an arms race with Russia for 50 years. We built how many nuclear bombs?

I have very little confidence in the human race. Until I see it shed the delusions of religion that is.

You missed the point - twice in fact!

There is no difference between a modern American atheist and a Commie when it comes to the scientific materialism you swear by. The difference has to do with Commies being murderers and modern Liberals sexual perverts.

The Cosmos is indeed an amazing thing. Its patterns and power and beauty point to an Intelligent and powerful artist.

The Christian monasteries were what preserved knowledge through the dark ages after the barbarian pagan invasions had destroyed so much. It was medieval European Christendom that laid the foundations for the modern scientific enterprise not least with the assumption that the Cosmos is intelligible because it has an intelligent Designer. We have surpassed the ancient Greeks in every way.

I agree that the building of a space faring civilisation would be a better way to spend resources than on futile wars. But the Cold War was not won by Star Fleet but rather by people waking up to the evil that was atheistic Communism and by a steadfast determination by leaders like the pope, Reagan and Thatcher to oppose it.

 

[sealybobo]

Don't equate us scientific thinkers with commies.

I don't believe god will go away completely either. People are too superstitious, wishful thinking and us atheists can't prove god doesn't exist.

But no doubt the more science we learn, the less likely a god exists. When you understand how old and big the universe is, you sort of realize how silly man made religion is. Completely unnecessary. I know it makes you feel good and I know you don't want to go to hell for doubting so I/we know it is difficult for you to grasp.

Don't label us with Marx and Lenin. It makes you sound stupid. They had wacky political ideologies. They had AN AGENDA. Us Atheists just want reason and logic to prevail. For example we are destroying this planet because our citizens are greedy stupid theists. No coincidence. And every technological advancement including cures have come from science. Stop with the commy talk you dumb old brainwashed fart. LOL.

Follow these rules: Test ideas by experiments and observations. Build on those ideas that pass the test. Reject the ones that fail. Follow the evidence wherever it leads, and question everything.

If you do this you will start experiencing cognitive dissonance.

Actually there is little difference between the scientific materialism of the Commies and that of modern Liberal Progressive Atheists so if that is the way you want to differentiate yourself you fail. The main differences are that Commies would kill Christians for their faith while your strategy appears to be an attempt at ridicule and marginalisation. Also the Commies did not have a clue about economics and were fraudulent and corrupt while most modern Liberal Progressive atheists are better behaved when it comes to money. The abortion rate was higher among Commie atheists than Liberal Progressive atheists ironically. The biggest difference today with the Liberal Progressive Atheists is sexual perversion. The Commies would put queers to death while you play happy families with gay marriages.

Russians are commies still right? Are they killing Christians today? Is there a Russian Holocust going on right now against Christians? Then shut the fuck up.

Russians are not commies now. You appear to have missed the collapse of the Soviet Union and the changes that followed.

So the only commies are liberal Americans now? You guys are so stupid.

Hey, every theist should be required to watch the Cosmos. Not just the new one but the old one too. It explains everything a person needs to know in order to realize that there is no god. Christians say, "you have to read the bible before you can say you don't believe". The truth is, you need to watch the Cosmos before you read the bible because it explains the history of man and religion. When you know the history you know that they made up god AND they use god to hold us back.

Did you know 2500 years ago the Greeks figured out that the earth is not the center of the universe? We aren't even at the center of the Milky Way Galaxy. They figured out that all the stars were other suns. They were not Neptune, Venus, Zeus, Hercules, etc. That's what primitive ancient superstitious man believed. The Greeks discovered science. So why/how did all this knowledge disappear? The Mystics, Religious and Superstitious squashed all that knowledge. Then later these stupid humans decided that there is only one god not many. Instead of realizing there is no god, they went from many gods to 1. The Jews, Christians & Muslims would rule for the next 2000 years.

Every time a society is free to think, it never goes well for god. In a free society like ancient Greece or America today, we see science is flourishing because we/they are/were free to think.

And today religion can't squash free thinking and science, so they have tried to embrace science and pretend that they didn't hold us back intellectually for thousands of years.

Religion is an evil thing. It is a lie. I don't care what charitable works it does. That's like saying a slave master is good because he feeds his slaves once a day. BFD. Imagine where we would be today without religion. Instead of just now reaching Mars, maybe we would have already colonized Mars. But no. Instead we have an arms race with Russia for 50 years. We built how many nuclear bombs?

I have very little confidence in the human race. Until I see it shed the delusions of religion that is.

You missed the point - twice in fact!

There is no difference between a modern American atheist and a Commie when it comes to the scientific materialism you swear by. The difference has to do with Commies being murderers and modern Liberals sexual perverts.

The Cosmos is indeed an amazing thing. Its patterns and power and beauty point to an Intelligent and powerful artist.

The Christian monasteries were what preserved knowledge through the dark ages after the barbarian pagan invasions had destroyed so much. It was medieval European Christendom that laid the foundations for the modern scientific enterprise not least with the assumption that the Cosmos is intelligible because it has an intelligent Designer. We have surpassed the ancient Greeks in every way.

I agree that the building of a space faring civilisation would be a better way to spend resources than on futile wars. But the Cold War was not won by Star Fleet but rather by people waking up to the evil that was atheistic Communism and by a steadfast determination by leaders like the pope, Reagan and Thatcher to oppose it.

The Christian monesteries only preserved and passed on the history and knowledge they wanted you to have. Fact is, religion has been fighting logic for thousands of years. Prostitution isn't the oldest profession, religion is.

Ancient Greeks like Aristarchus knew too much and wanted to teach people science/logic/truth but religion couldn't have that. You can't believe the bible and science. This is why a lot of scientists are atheists. Religion doesn't hold up to the scientific method. You say god talked to you? Prove it. Can't? Then why would we believe a 2000 year old story when we know just how dumb they were back then and when we know how religion fought with all the scientists back then? Tried them for heresy.

We have surpassed the ancient Greeks despite religion. It was the age of enlightenment that got us to where we are. Religion basically embraced science because it had no other choice.