The € EURO thread

[Trajan]

Watch through the day and tomorrow. Sometimes there's a delayed reaction.

Or they could just sell the news.

well, they got a pop yesterday, you were right, but, I am not sure if its greece or bernbanks subtle op. twist or QE3 ruminations.....

 

[JimBowie1958]

Nigel Farage: "Listen! The Whole Thing's a Giant Ponzi Scheme!" - YouTube

 

[Trajan]

that it is....

 

[Trajan]

run run , the sky is falling!!!!!!



Mario Monti: we have a week to save the eurozone

Italian prime minister warns that there is no room for failure in talks between single currency's big four countries


Mario Monti: we have a week to save the eurozone | Business | The Guardian

 

[KissMy]

Spain should go bankrupt because over 2/3rds of their debt is external, owed to other countries.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Greek finance minister Vassilis Rapanos rushed to hospital after fainting | Mail Online

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view...-euro-apocalypse-as-crisis-spreads-to-Germany

 

[KissMy]

The Telegraph: IMF help would set the eurozone on the road to fiscal and political union – let’s not encourage it

Viewed collectively, the 17 nations that make up the eurozone are still one of the two richest regions in the world, and on many other measures of economic success – balance of trade, overall size of budget deficit and national debt relative to GDP – they beat the US by a country mile. A visitor from Mars, looking at the aggregate data, would declare the eurozone a model economy.

That it is ripping itself apart, without any obvious solution in sight, is, to put it mildly, a major curiosity. Riches, it seems, cannot buy harmony. In an editorial comment this week on the G20 summit, the German financial daily Handelsblatt put it like this: “It is rather hypocritical when the Americans and the British, whose own mountains of debt have reached a high point, try to lecture the Europeans… At a time when the budget deficits of the US and Great Britain are about 8 per cent, the eurozone members have almost managed to bring their deficits as a whole down to 3 per cent.”

 

[Trajan]

The Telegraph: IMF help would set the eurozone on the road to fiscal and political union – let’s not encourage it

Viewed collectively, the 17 nations that make up the eurozone are still one of the two richest regions in the world, and on many other measures of economic success – balance of trade, overall size of budget deficit and national debt relative to GDP – they beat the US by a country mile. A visitor from Mars, looking at the aggregate data, would declare the eurozone a model economy.

That it is ripping itself apart, without any obvious solution in sight, is, to put it mildly, a major curiosity. Riches, it seems, cannot buy harmony. In an editorial comment this week on the G20 summit, the German financial daily Handelsblatt put it like this: “It is rather hypocritical when the Americans and the British, whose own mountains of debt have reached a high point, try to lecture the Europeans… At a time when the budget deficits of the US and Great Britain are about 8 per cent, the eurozone members have almost managed to bring their deficits as a whole down to 3 per cent.”

At a time when the budget deficits of the US and Great Britain are about 8 per cent, the eurozone members have almost managed to bring their deficits as a whole down to 3 per cent.”

whose numbers are they using?

 

[JimBowie1958]

The Telegraph: IMF help would set the eurozone on the road to fiscal and political union – let’s not encourage it

Viewed collectively, the 17 nations that make up the eurozone are still one of the two richest regions in the world, and on many other measures of economic success – balance of trade, overall size of budget deficit and national debt relative to GDP – they beat the US by a country mile. A visitor from Mars, looking at the aggregate data, would declare the eurozone a model economy.

That it is ripping itself apart, without any obvious solution in sight, is, to put it mildly, a major curiosity. Riches, it seems, cannot buy harmony. In an editorial comment this week on the G20 summit, the German financial daily Handelsblatt put it like this: “It is rather hypocritical when the Americans and the British, whose own mountains of debt have reached a high point, try to lecture the Europeans… At a time when the budget deficits of the US and Great Britain are about 8 per cent, the eurozone members have almost managed to bring their deficits as a whole down to 3 per cent.”

What is curious about it? They are using a one-size-fits-all currency when there are three very different economic zones to Europe: Northwestern, Mediteranean, and former Soviet states. Each of them have very different needs and should have their own monetary union with its own currency, or else back the Euro with PMs or some basket of commodities whose redeemed components would be determined at the time by the state.

 

[KissMy]

The Telegraph: IMF help would set the eurozone on the road to fiscal and political union – let’s not encourage it

Viewed collectively, the 17 nations that make up the eurozone are still one of the two richest regions in the world, and on many other measures of economic success – balance of trade, overall size of budget deficit and national debt relative to GDP – they beat the US by a country mile. A visitor from Mars, looking at the aggregate data, would declare the eurozone a model economy.

That it is ripping itself apart, without any obvious solution in sight, is, to put it mildly, a major curiosity. Riches, it seems, cannot buy harmony. In an editorial comment this week on the G20 summit, the German financial daily Handelsblatt put it like this: “It is rather hypocritical when the Americans and the British, whose own mountains of debt have reached a high point, try to lecture the Europeans… At a time when the budget deficits of the US and Great Britain are about 8 per cent, the eurozone members have almost managed to bring their deficits as a whole down to 3 per cent.”

At a time when the budget deficits of the US and Great Britain are about 8 per cent, the eurozone members have almost managed to bring their deficits as a whole down to 3 per cent.”

whose numbers are they using?

List of World’s Largest Creditor and Debtor Nations

Since 2006 The International Monetary Fund’s Balance of Payment statistics have been uploaded into a neat online database accessible through its website. Among country balance of payments figures, the database also features the “Net International Investment Position” of a country, which is defined as the difference between foreign assets that domestic residents own and domestic assets held by foreign entities. Here are the most recent (2010) rankings. Note that the 2011 rankings are still in the process of being calculated.

2010 Country NIIP (Net International Investment Position) statistics by the IMF. NIIP is defined by a country’s total domestically owned assets minus its foreign owned assets. All figures have been adjusted to nominal US dollars.

It is no surprise that the most indebted country, the United States, takes the bottom of the list. Its NIIP means the value of its domestically owned assets is less than its liabilities to foreign investors. We see Spain, Greece, Italy, and Portugal on the list of negative NIIPers as well. Japan, China, and Germany are effectively the countries with the largest NIIP. Countries with a positive NIIP are considered to be creditor nations, while those with a negative NIIP are debtor nations. For everyday investors, the NIIP of a country promises to be a leading indicator of a country’s overall fiscal responsibility. Diversifying holdings in both creditor and debtor nations could help spread a portfolio’s risk over time.

Note that Germany and Switzerland have been acting as the main Eurozone creditors by maintaining a large and positive NIIP. Investors should keep the NIIP figures in mind when measuring the creditworthiness of a country and its businesses. Ultimately, the terms of trade will be determined by those nations that are willing to lend out their capital. Debtor nations will be the ones stuck with the credit card bill.

 

[Trajan]

depressing....

 

[JimBowie1958]

depressing....

Only if you let yourself think about it....

Sorry, trying to be positive here.

 

[KissMy]

What The Mother Of All Central Banks Says About The Financial System

...be prepared to lower your expectations.

The world is now five years on from the outbreak of the 2008 financial crisis that started with the implosion of two major U.S. investment banks — Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers. Yet, the global economy is still unbalanced and seemingly becoming more so as interacting weaknesses continue to amplify each other.

The goals of balanced growth, balanced economic policies and a safe financial system still elude us. In advanced economies at the center of the financial crisis, high debt loads continue to drag down recovery. Monetary and fiscal policies still lack a comprehensive solution to short-term needs and long-term dangers. And despite the international progress on regulation, the condition of the financial sector still poses a threat to stability....

Here are some takeaways from that 214 page report on the global banking system going forward.

- Private banks need to recognize losses.
- Monetary easing more controversial than before.
- This crisis is not over.
- Shadow banking system ungovernable and growing.

 

[tigerbob]

Creeping death creeps a little faster...

EU unveils its vision for the future of monetary union

European authorities have unveiled their vision for the future, which gives them much greater powers.

It includes the creation of a European treasury, which would have powers over national budgets.

European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso said it was "a defining moment for European integration".

The 10-year plan is designed to strengthen the eurozone and prevent future crises, but critics say it will not address current debt problems.

This week, some markets fell sharply on fears that leaders at the EU summit on Thursday and Friday would fail to agree immediate measures to try to stem the current crisis, which has now engulfed five eurozone members.

Spain is negotiating the terms of loans worth up to 100bn euros for its banks, and the new Greek government wants to ease the terms of its huge bailout.

The governor of the Bank of England, Sir Mervyn King, expressed concern about the recent response of European authorities.

"I am pessimistic. I am particularly concerned because over two years now we have seen the situation in the euro area get worse and the problem being pushed down the road," he said, while appearing at a parliamentary hearing.

BBC News - EU unveils its vision for the future of monetary union

 

[Trajan]

so, is it me or are they just creating an all encompassing bigger 'fail' yet to come?

 

[tigerbob]

so, is it me or are they just creating an all encompassing bigger 'fail' yet to come?

If it is you, it's you and Sir Mervyn King.

 

[Trajan]

so the marketeers bubbled up a +2% rally based on...what again?

Markets Cheer Europe Plan,





Await Details

Markets Cheer Europe Plan, Await Details - WSJ.com

 

[Trajan]

BERLIN—Germany's parliament ratified the euro zone's permanent bailout fund late Friday, as well as rules that enshrine German-style budget discipline in euro-zone countries and most other European Union members, despite widespread criticism of Chancellor Angela Merkel upon her return from a European summit where she made major concessions on support for Spain and Italy.

German Lawmakers Ratify Bailout Fund - WSJ.com

right, this will last as long as Greek working day if it ever gets leveraged at all.

 

[Toro]

Some points to remember.

- The eurozone has no problem working if there is a mechanism to transfer money from the north to the south on a permanent basis.

- Breaking the daisy chain between government debt and bank debt substantially mitigates existential risk.

Today's deal - in theory - satisfies both of these axioms, at least partly. So it's no wonder that risk assets rallied. This is EuroTARP to some extent.

Of course, the devil is in the details. Whether it passes or not remains to be seen.

 

[Trajan]

Updated July 2, 2012, 8:01 p.m. ET

Bond Rift Divides Merkel Coalition

BERLIN—The increasingly radical measures needed to tame the euro-zone debt crisis are leading to a growing rift within German Chancellor Angela Merkel's governing coalition.

Ms. Merkel's junior partner, the pro-business Free Democratic Party, is angry about the mounting hints in Berlin that Germany might ultimately agree to collective debt issuance by euro-zone governments, known as euro bonds.

more at-

Bond Rift Divides Merkel Coalition - WSJ.com

and Greece wants their deal redone...big time...


frankly ,little has changed fundamentally, they are just spreading the risk wider and deeper.

the market here took a breather today, volume lowest in 10 years....I think they are thinking wtf with the horrible Manufacturing data, they excepted a drop but they were off massively.