Suffering Succotash

[initforme]

Private sector unions are necessary as most all american employers try to undercut and underpay their employees. Basic economics is framed around the concept that employees and employers are in constant conflict. Workers will not ever get ahead if they cannot stand against their emploiyer while still producinproducing.

 

[Eloy]

I was a teacher and neither I nor any of my colleagues were rich.

To Eloy: As an admitted teacher can I assume you and your colleagues consider this terrible man a hero:

https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.BdmbMlSCRFgsuLN5LPTRkQEsEs&pid=Api&w=180&h=181

John Dewey: Bosom Serpent of American Education
Kelly OConnell Sunday, February 24, 2013

John Dewey: Bosom Serpent of American Education​

With two master's degrees and several teaching certificates and after sixteen years of teaching, I was earning $40,000 per annum.

To Eloy: Many professions require teaching degrees. The question is: Why do teaching degrees entitle teachers to tax dollars? Answer: Major and minor political parties cater to, as well as fear, the teachers’ unions because the Ministry of Propaganda is squarely on the side of teachers.

Author to Newsmax: Obama Is First ‘Union-Label’ President
Monday, August 20, 2012 09:04 PM
By: Todd Beamon and John Bachman

Author to Newsmax: Obama Is First ‘Union-Label’ President​

I do not know what Donald Trump earned for his years as a real estate entrepreneur or what he paid in income tax but I would not trade one semester for the earnings of ten years property trading.

To Eloy: Nobody forces children to believe Trump’s philosophy. Indeed, teaching is the only profession that was handed the power of government.

I well-realize that most rank & file teachers are probably not Socialists, but the political clout exercised by the teaching profession is clearly oriented towards totalitarian government as designed by social engineer John Dewey. His philosophy dominates the NEA, the Dept of Education, and the AFT.

Teachers are no different than any employee working for a company that produces goods or services they personally hate. It is awfully difficult to walk away from a nice income with the best medical and pension plans.​

NOTE: There is no shortage of mean spirited Socialists in teaching who just love breaking children to collectivism.

Parenthetically, the poor are never going to live as well Socialists/Communists in government live even if they work harder because the poor do not have the institutional skills necessary to acquire sufficient income in a Socialist institution anymore than they have the skills required to gather enough of the wherewithal in any other institutional climate. When you take individual liberty, mainly expressed through freedom of choice, away from everyone as Socialism does, the poor have absolutely nothing left except Communistic Democratic party good intentions standing over them with a club in hand.

Education is unquestionably the best way to rise above poverty, but teaching the three R’s is not the purpose of a Socialist/Communist education in the United States; paying off the teachers’ unions to institutionalize the young is the real deal.

The American education establishment is only interested in identifying and rewarding those children whose personalities are compatible with Socialism. Such children are pushed forward and given material rewards after they complete their education and are deemed to be loyal Socialists —— they are welcomed to feast at the public trough. If education continues down the same road it has been traveling on since the FDR years, it is inevitable that one day soon this country will be governed by a handful of teacher’s pets. Won’t it be a wonderful country then?

As for the undeserving: They are simply given obedience training that passes for education. There is no help available for those youngsters who simply do not do well, or even belong, in an institutional setting. Such kids and American education contradict each other. The only thing that will help those youngsters in life is to teach them how to avoid being exploited by institutional types —— and that will never be taught by the government.

It is because of those kids that failing grades are taboo. Socialism/Communism itself cannot be associated with failure of any kind in the public’s mind. If a few million kids are given failing grades every year in spite of the billions of dollars spent on teaching the three R’s, opponents of the current education system would then point to solid numbers and ask “Why?” Whenever Department of Education defenders admit in doublespeak that a few kids do “fall between the cracks,” they mean that those kids just won’t be broken to the Socialist/Communist institutional bit. When funding time rolls around like clockwork, the media never reports that it has to be one big-ass crack if so many kids keep falling through it every year.

In the modern world, as well as in mediaeval times, every religion that ever controlled a government behaved in the exactly same way insofar as the children are concerned. Religion always boils down to indoctrinating the young. The leaders of Islam’s radical organizations were children once, and I’ll wager they were Islam’s most adept pupils for all the wrong reasons.

In the same vain, the Roman Catholic Church always said, “Give me the child at six and I will have it for life.” The Communist/Socialist religion is not as good as Catholicism, or any traditional religion’s priesthood held in check for that matter; so Communists must get their hands on kids at an even younger age in order to get a head start on their competitors. And that’s not the worst of it. With all of this talk about even more funding for higher education, we can see that the Socialists want to keep their neophytes in indoctrination centers until they are old enough to collect Social Security. It all goes to show what a lousy religion Socialism/Communism really is; it has to get ‘em younger and keep ‘em longer just to get the job done properly.

Leading Democrats and Republicans not only conspired in supporting Communist/Socialist indoctrination centers with lots of money, they ordered the media to spin their skullduggery into a positive score for bipartisan deceit. However, one thing does become clearer with each bipartisan vote on education and that is this: There are three kinds of sneaks —— sneaks, filthy sneaks, and legislators. It really drives me crazy trying to figure out why everyone elected to federal office thinks their office grants them a license to be a sneak? Or does high office attract those characters who are sneaks to begin with?

For those people who say “Communism in the United States is not that big of a threat,” I can only reply “No religion should exercise governmental powers, no matter how slight those powers might be.” If Socialism’s religious evolution to full-blown Communism in the United States is not frustrated before much more time goes by, it will soon have the power it requires to drop any pretense of government by and for “all of the people.” Once Communists/Socialists are in position, they will govern in the same way religious fanatics always govern. They will control and punish the heretics [It has already started with home schoolers] while they reward and pardon the faithful. If enough non-Communist Americans finally come to understand they are being taxed into supporting and promoting a religion that is not their religion, there might still be a chance to turn the US around. Unfortunately, support for Bernie Sanders shows that each year more young people are accepting Socialist/Communist doctrine as shining truth without realizing what’s happening to them.​

/www.usmessageboard.com/threads/the-wealth-of-an-empire.456579/

I'm sorry but your post is too long for me to properly understand what your meaning.

 

[Eloy]

Dangit, I typed "should" when I meant "shouldn't"

Unions are really no longer necessary in America, period.

There's enough labor laws and bureaus to insure workers get a fair shake.

This is 2017, not 1937.

Flanders, I am glad that's not the part you quoted.

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Not sure what teachers make nowadays, but historically it has not been a killing.

Californian between $80K and $200K a year. Retire after 20 years to have a taxpayer funded retirement for life. It's pretty cushy.

 

[Marion Morrison]

Dangit, I typed "should" when I meant "shouldn't"

Unions are really no longer necessary in America, period.

There's enough labor laws and bureaus to insure workers get a fair shake.

This is 2017, not 1937.

Flanders, I am glad that's not the part you quoted.

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

"Organized labor" is code for Communism, so no.

 

[Eloy]

Dangit, I typed "should" when I meant "shouldn't"

Unions are really no longer necessary in America, period.

There's enough labor laws and bureaus to insure workers get a fair shake.

This is 2017, not 1937.

Flanders, I am glad that's not the part you quoted.

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

"Organized labor" is code for Communism, so no.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

 

[Marion Morrison]

Dangit, I typed "should" when I meant "shouldn't"

Unions are really no longer necessary in America, period.

There's enough labor laws and bureaus to insure workers get a fair shake.

This is 2017, not 1937.

Flanders, I am glad that's not the part you quoted.

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

"Organized labor" is code for Communism, so no.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

He didn't allow capitalism or free press, either, what's your point?

You Godwinizer, you.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

​

The Left Coast wants to give teacher more money:

Daffy Duck with lots of gold​

http://cdn01.dailycaller.com/wp-con...e-screenshot-screenshot-What-Tunes-You-On.jpg

MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS: California Mulls Exempting Teachers From Income Tax
Eric Owens
Education Editor
1:11 AM 03/14/2017

MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS: California Mulls Exempting Teachers From Income Tax​

The other coast wants to make teachers dumber:

New York to eliminate literacy test for teachers in order to be more diverse
Brandon Morse

New York to eliminate literacy test for teachers in order to be more diverse​

Presumably, they will meet in the middle. Richer and Dumber.

To hell with that. Let them go to Europe for an education and then they can just stay there. We've got Betsy DeVos to make sure our people will be well trained to mop floors, pick produce and flip burgers. And thanks to the cheeto in chief, those jobs will be wide open, and he did promise shit jobs.


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Eloy]

Dangit, I typed "should" when I meant "shouldn't"

Unions are really no longer necessary in America, period.

There's enough labor laws and bureaus to insure workers get a fair shake.

This is 2017, not 1937.

Flanders, I am glad that's not the part you quoted.

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

"Organized labor" is code for Communism, so no.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

He didn't allow capitalism or free press, either, what's your point?

You Godwinizer, you.

My point is that you share the same view about unions as Hitler did. Strange company to be in.

 

[Marion Morrison]

Dangit, I typed "should" when I meant "shouldn't"

Unions are really no longer necessary in America, period.

There's enough labor laws and bureaus to insure workers get a fair shake.

This is 2017, not 1937.

Flanders, I am glad that's not the part you quoted.

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

"Organized labor" is code for Communism, so no.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

He didn't allow capitalism or free press, either, what's your point?

You Godwinizer, you.

My point is that you share the same view about unions as Hitler did. Strange company to be in.

There's enough US gov't authority to render unions obsolete.

Nobody will be working overtime without getting paid properly these days.

 

[Eloy]

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.
Most issues can be resolved without recourse to laws.

"Organized labor" is code for Communism, so no.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

He didn't allow capitalism or free press, either, what's your point?

You Godwinizer, you.

My point is that you share the same view about unions as Hitler did. Strange company to be in.

There's enough US gov't authority to render unions obsolete.

Nobody will be working overtime without getting paid properly these days.

You might be surprised to learn the many issues handled by union representatives and stewards in the normal course of an academic year.

 

[Flanders]

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.

To Eloy: Public sector unions are an abomination.

Throughout history democracy has been the parasite's preferred form of government.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

To Eloy: The Soviet Union did.

My point is that you share the same view about unions as Hitler did. Strange company to be in.

To Eloy: You obviously prefer Stalin’s company.

You might be surprised to learn the many issues handled by union representatives and stewards in the normal course of an academic year.

To Eloy: Provide a few examples.

Just to be clear on private sector unions. They should be allowed but restricted to negotiating wages. Benefits must end in a totalitarian government. Labor unions should never be allowed to negotiate pensions, holidays, sick days, working conditions, healthcare, or anything other than wages.

 

[Eloy]

Organized labor, proud and free, is important in every democracy.

To Eloy: Public sector unions are an abomination.

Throughout history democracy has been the parasite's preferred form of government.

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

To Eloy: The Soviet Union did.

My point is that you share the same view about unions as Hitler did. Strange company to be in.

To Eloy: You obviously prefer Stalin’s company.

You might be surprised to learn the many issues handled by union representatives and stewards in the normal course of an academic year.

To Eloy: Provide a few examples.

Just to be clear on private sector unions. They should be allowed but restricted to negotiating wages. Benefits must end in a totalitarian government. Labor unions should never be allowed to negotiate pensions, holidays, sick days, working conditions, healthcare, or anything other than wages.

Employees in the public sector need just as much protection as their counterparts in the private sector.
Democracy is the preferred system in the United States and Europe.
Trade unions in the Soviet Union were different in purpose than those in a liberal democracy and cannot be compared.
You ask for a few examples of the many issues which occupy the efforts of representatives and stewards over the period of an academic year. I am happy to do so.

1. A school board may want to radically change the academic year and union representatives would need to be ready to canvass the membership on the views of teachers and be ready to represent the teachers when the board was making its deliberations.
2. A school board may want to change some aspect of the contract with teachers, for example on the manner in which teachers are evaluated and union representatives will want to protect the interests of teachers in this matter.
3. Teachers may wish to initiate a change in the contract for example getting professional development credits recognized toward certification renewal and representatives will need to get agreement before asking for the contract to be reopened and the views of the teachers are put cogently to the board.
4. Elections to school boards will be of interest to teachers and the philosophy of candidates will want to be understood by representatives through a series of meetings with candidates followed by an endorsement or failure to endorse particular candidates.
5. Parents and the general public should be kept informed through the efforts of a press officer from the union.
6. Representatives should be available regularly to update teachers' stewards on matters related to their working conditions and remuneration and to receive communications from the faculties of various schools.
7. Teacher morale should be promoted by union representatives through various solidarity programs from family days to sending regards to teachers in hospital.

At the school level there will be different and just as important matters needing attention from union stewards. I can name some of these if you like.

 

[Flanders]

Democracy is the preferred system in the United States and Europe.

To Eloy: It is not. The large parasite class in this country notwithstanding, repeatedly saying the United States is a democracy does not make it so.

Trade unions in the Soviet Union were different in purpose than those in a liberal democracy and cannot be compared.

To Eloy: Naturally, you deny the comparison because democracy is always going towards something worse; never towards liberty. Even a teacher like you should understand this:

The key difference between a democracy and a republic lies in the limits placed on government by the law, which has implications for minority rights. Both forms of government tend to use a representational system — i.e., citizens vote to elect politicians to represent their interests and form the government. In a republic, a constitution or charter of rights protects certain inalienable rights that cannot be taken away by the government, even if it has been elected by a majority of voters. In a "pure democracy," the majority is not restrained in this way and can impose its will on the minority.

Most modern nations are democratic republics with a constitution, which can be amended by a popularly elected government. This comparison therefore contrasts the form of government in most countries today with a theoretical construct of a "pure democracy", mainly to highlight the features of a republic.

Comparison chart

Democracy
Definition Rule by the omnipotent majority. In a democracy, an individual, and any group of individuals composing any minority, have no protection against the unlimited power of the majority. It is a case of Majority-over-Man.
Republic
A republic is similar to a representative democracy except it has a written constitution of basic rights that protect the minority from being completely unrepresented or overridden by the majority.​

Democracy vs. Republic

Democracy vs Republic - Difference and Comparison | Diffen​

You ask for a few examples of the many issues which occupy the efforts of representatives and stewards over the period of an academic year. I am happy to do so.

To Eloy: I cannot see taxpayers —— MANAGEMENT —— represented in your examples?

At the school level there will be different and just as important matters needing attention from union stewards. I can name some of these if you like.

To Eloy: Do not clutter up this thread with more public sector unions talking points unless you can show taxpayer input.

 

[Flanders]

Democracy is the preferred system in the United States

In addition to discrediting the democracy fertilizer that liberals spread about so freely, I have to thank Mr, Pauker for confirming my opinion of Woodrow Wilson’s as the worst president until Obama challenged him for the title:

In contrast, the Progressive-liberal view of democracy -- in addition to its hostility to individual rights -- was illustrated perfectly by Woodrow Wilson over a century ago. He noted (approvingly) that "socialism and democracy are almost if not quite one and the same. They both rest at bottom upon the absolute right of the community to determine its own destiny and that of its members. Men as communities are supreme over men as individuals." Wilson complained, "Some citizens of this country have never got beyond the Declaration of Independence."

As president, Wilson openly embraced the idea of a "living constitution." Basically, Progressives and liberals (and some Republican "moderates") insist that the Constitution can be changed without a constitutional amendment simply by reinterpretation (i.e., by redefining its words and reading into its text new principles, such as new government powers).

Progressives and liberals have engaged in a relentless attack on America, pushing countless policies that incorporate leftist ideology and violate individual rights. On issue after issue, the federal government (with laws passed by Congress, executive orders issued by presidents, and opinions delivered by the Supreme Court) has disregarded the Constitution's limits on federal power and has imposed such policies on the entire nation. And this has been done in the name of democracy.

The founding fathers would have vehemently opposed both this abuse of power and the promotion of democracy (sometimes called representative democracy) to rationalize the abuse.​

March 15, 2017
A Republic, If You Can Keep It
By Paul Pauker

Articles: A Republic, If You Can Keep It​

 

[Uncensored2008]

[

Hitler did not allow unions in the Third Reich.

Nor did Stalin in the USSR, so you may be in for a shock should your side win.

Trade unions are the natural offset to corporations. Hence, a PUBLIC union is an abomination and inherently corrupt, as there are no owners or independent management team. Corrupt unions bargain against their customer, the tax payer. It is abhorrent and flat out graft.

 

[Unkotare]

Not sure what teachers make nowadays, but historically it has not been a killing.

To Marion Morrison: It is quite a bit when you program in the benefits: lucrative pensions at a younger age; hence, collected for more years, days worked, etc.

The average salary for public school teachers in California is $69,324, according to TeacherPortal.com.

This amount is notably higher than California’s $61,818 median household income.

The average starting salary for California teachers is $41,259.​

MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS: California Mulls Exempting Teachers From Income Tax

A few years ago I read that the University of California (10 campuses) had 50 billion dollars in its pension fund alone. Most of that money came from tax dollars, and that’s just one university. Yet teachers’ unions expect taxpayers to bailout their pension plans in trouble. Years ago I suggested that higher education use the enormous amount of money in their pension funds to bailout the troubled pension funds of their union brothers and sisters instead of asking taxpayers for more.​

The Wealth Of An Empire

No-one goes into teaching for the money.

To Eloy: That is exactly why they go into teaching.

Exchange their salaries and pay teachers what lawyers get, and lawyers what teachers get.

To Emilynghiem: Both professions feed at the public trough. Lawyers have been at it for thousands of years: so they are naturally richer:

all lawyers work for the government because all lawyers do their work for the courts even if they never see the inside of a courtroom.

Lawyers double-dip by complicating the law in order to generate income for their profession. Cynics claim that lawyers built the public feed tub to sate themselves. Others claim that lawyering is the oldest profession and that is why they are so adept at acquiring a nation’s wealth. Lawyers have definitely been feeding at the public trough longer than any other profession.​

Lou Dobbs Guilty Of Blasphemy

As bad as lawyers are, teachers are not far behind:

1. Teachers’ unions are education. Whatever union officials believe passes for education.

2. The education industry has no taxation authority in the Constitution, yet it absorbs more tax dollars than any other government expenditure including the military.

3. The education industry spends tax dollars to finance an ideology most Americans abhor.

4. The education industry created a welfare state that benefits millions in the industry in addition to teachers.

5. The education industry is the political, intellectual, and economic force driving Socialism/Communism.

6. The education industry is the major philosophical force behind open-borders

7. The education industry gets billions every year to indoctrinate illegal aliens.

8. The education industry’s propaganda apparatus is committed to indoctrinating children into the joys of Socialism, multiculturalism, and collectivism.​

The worst part is that teachers destroyed many more generations of children than they ever helped:

Last but not least, the real job of primary education is to first break children to the will of the government. Teaching the three R’s is relatively simple; implanting organizational skills in a youngster is much more difficult. Those who best learn the required institutional skills do very well for themselves; especially at the public feed tub under the our system of government control.​

The Wealth Of An Empire

Teachers could be paid more if we got rid of tenure and based their pay on the free market.

To AsianTrumpSupporter: First get rid of the teachers’ unions.

Incidentally, teachers brainwashing children into the joys of collectivism destroyed a helluva lot more children than they ever educated.

There are two popular held views of teachers. One is Mr. Chipping —— the other is Ichabod Crane. I always leaned towards a little-known third view. Teachers no longer beat children, but they do just as much damage with a Socialist stick:

​

Did you really say "that's exactly why they go into teaching "? Are you shitting me?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Having a UNION in the Department of defense is NO DIFFERENT than selling the DOD to WalMart or some other Corporation. It is blatant corruption.

 

[Eloy]

Democracy is the preferred system in the United States and Europe.

To Eloy: It is not. The large parasite class in this country notwithstanding, repeatedly saying the United States is a democracy does not make it so.

Trade unions in the Soviet Union were different in purpose than those in a liberal democracy and cannot be compared.

To Eloy: Naturally, you deny the comparison because democracy is always going towards something worse; never towards liberty. Even a teacher like you should understand this:

The key difference between a democracy and a republic lies in the limits placed on government by the law, which has implications for minority rights. Both forms of government tend to use a representational system — i.e., citizens vote to elect politicians to represent their interests and form the government. In a republic, a constitution or charter of rights protects certain inalienable rights that cannot be taken away by the government, even if it has been elected by a majority of voters. In a "pure democracy," the majority is not restrained in this way and can impose its will on the minority.

Most modern nations are democratic republics with a constitution, which can be amended by a popularly elected government. This comparison therefore contrasts the form of government in most countries today with a theoretical construct of a "pure democracy", mainly to highlight the features of a republic.

Comparison chart

Democracy
Definition Rule by the omnipotent majority. In a democracy, an individual, and any group of individuals composing any minority, have no protection against the unlimited power of the majority. It is a case of Majority-over-Man.
Republic
A republic is similar to a representative democracy except it has a written constitution of basic rights that protect the minority from being completely unrepresented or overridden by the majority.​

Democracy vs. Republic

Democracy vs Republic - Difference and Comparison | Diffen​

You ask for a few examples of the many issues which occupy the efforts of representatives and stewards over the period of an academic year. I am happy to do so.

To Eloy: I cannot see taxpayers —— MANAGEMENT —— represented in your examples?

At the school level there will be different and just as important matters needing attention from union stewards. I can name some of these if you like.

To Eloy: Do not clutter up this thread with more public sector unions talking points unless you can show taxpayer input.

I do not share your distinction between a democracy and a republic.
You did not ask me originally to comment on "taxpayer input" when you asked for some examples of issues handled by union representatives and stewards in the normal course of an academic year. But I can assure you that teachers are taxpayers.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Teachers could be paid more if we got rid of tenure and based their pay on the free market.

So how has that worked out in states that did away with tenure or never had it to begin with?