Soooo...how will the new tax on gas effect you?

[Mr. H.]

Won't a new tax just be negating some of the subsidies?
You Merkins don't know what you want.

But an examination of the American tax code indicates that oil production is among the most heavily subsidized businesses, with tax breaks available at virtually every stage of the exploration and extraction process.

Oil Companies Reap Billions From Subsidies - NYTimes.com

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".
Do you even make a dime that you can call your own? Go dig a hole in the ground for a living, and try to tell the government that you can't decuct the shovel as a necessary business expense.

All taxes are passed on to comsumers.
Gas and Oil are compaines.
All compaines collect taxes they do not pay taxes.

No they're not ALL passed on to consumers.

Disallowing a legitimate expense as an offset to taxes is not in itself a tax.
This is of what Lord Obama speaketh.

And I'll reiterate- being involved in energy markets is not the same as selling pizzas.
A surtax on pizzas is easily passed along to pizza gobblers.
But there is no way in hell for an energy company- at any point of the marketing "loop" - to pass along increased tax liability that is borne of a negation in legitimate business deductions.

linky?

There is no link to your ignorance. You're a classic fail.

do you really believe the costs will not be passed on to the consumer? do you recall the spike in food prices when gas went over the four dollar mark? did you read the comments about delivery costs increasing?

Oh- so now you're talking about transportation? You are not even on your own page.
Why don't you close this thread and we'll pretend it didn't happen. Bury your stupid while you have the chance.

 

[anuthervoice]

Won't a new tax just be negating some of the subsidies?
You Merkins don't know what you want.

But an examination of the American tax code indicates that oil production is among the most heavily subsidized businesses, with tax breaks available at virtually every stage of the exploration and extraction process.

Oil Companies Reap Billions From Subsidies - NYTimes.com

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".
Do you even make a dime that you can call your own? Go dig a hole in the ground for a living, and try to tell the government that you can't decuct the shovel as a necessary business expense.

No they're not ALL passed on to consumers.

Disallowing a legitimate expense as an offset to taxes is not in itself a tax.
This is of what Lord Obama speaketh.

And I'll reiterate- being involved in energy markets is not the same as selling pizzas.
A surtax on pizzas is easily passed along to pizza gobblers.
But there is no way in hell for an energy company- at any point of the marketing "loop" - to pass along increased tax liability that is borne of a negation in legitimate business deductions.


There is no link to your ignorance. You're a classic fail.

do you really believe the costs will not be passed on to the consumer? do you recall the spike in food prices when gas went over the four dollar mark? did you read the comments about delivery costs increasing?

Oh- so now you're talking about transportation? You are not even on your own page.
Why don't you close this thread and we'll pretend it didn't happen. Bury your stupid while you have the chance.

ouch, you hurt me.
yes, I do have a couple of dimes. I use them to pay other people to shovel for me.
and, I am only talking about any type of transportation that uses fossil fuels for the discussion here.

 

[Mr. H.]

Fair enuff.

Understand if you will - Obama speaks of negating ordinary and necessary oil and gas deductions that are taken as expenditures made during the normal course of operations.

One example is the reducing of taxable income by the use of "intangible drilling cost" deductions.
For example- if I hire a geologist or an engineer in advance of actually drilling a well, then I reduce my taxable income by the amount that I paid that geologist or engineer. These two services are vital to the conduct of business.

In contrast- let's say you are going to construct an office building for your business. You hire an engineer, a surveyor, and maybe a landscaper and/or architect. These expenses are recognized under existing tax code as necessary expenses and are fully deductible as a current-year expense.

BUT- Obama proposes to treat the oil and gas industry differently by DISALLOWING such deductions.

I hope that makes sense because that's just about as simple as I can present it.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Cuz you know those big bad oil companies are passing this cost right down the line.

Yeah because they never raise the price unless they are forced to raise prices.

 

[Mr. H.]

And seriously- with respect to whomever requested a link regarding the fact the independents account for 90% of oil and gas activity in the U.S....

The links are out there- but they are primarily industry links. I try not to quote them because invariably they are dismissed. The mainstream media pays no attention to such facts. But it is in fact... a fact.

Carry on my wayward sons...

 

[idb]

Won't a new tax just be negating some of the subsidies?
You Merkins don't know what you want.

But an examination of the American tax code indicates that oil production is among the most heavily subsidized businesses, with tax breaks available at virtually every stage of the exploration and extraction process.

Oil Companies Reap Billions From Subsidies - NYTimes.com

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".
Do you even make a dime that you can call your own? Go dig a hole in the ground for a living, and try to tell the government that you can't decuct the shovel as a necessary business expense.

No they're not ALL passed on to consumers.

Disallowing a legitimate expense as an offset to taxes is not in itself a tax.
This is of what Lord Obama speaketh.

And I'll reiterate- being involved in energy markets is not the same as selling pizzas.
A surtax on pizzas is easily passed along to pizza gobblers.
But there is no way in hell for an energy company- at any point of the marketing "loop" - to pass along increased tax liability that is borne of a negation in legitimate business deductions.


There is no link to your ignorance. You're a classic fail.

do you really believe the costs will not be passed on to the consumer? do you recall the spike in food prices when gas went over the four dollar mark? did you read the comments about delivery costs increasing?

Oh- so now you're talking about transportation? You are not even on your own page.
Why don't you close this thread and we'll pretend it didn't happen. Bury your stupid while you have the chance.

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".

That's a different discussion.
The point is that they're getting considerable advantages over others.

 

[Ringel05]

Won't a new tax just be negating some of the subsidies?
You Merkins don't know what you want.

Oil Companies Reap Billions From Subsidies - NYTimes.com

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".
Do you even make a dime that you can call your own? Go dig a hole in the ground for a living, and try to tell the government that you can't decuct the shovel as a necessary business expense.


Oh- so now you're talking about transportation? You are not even on your own page.
Why don't you close this thread and we'll pretend it didn't happen. Bury your stupid while you have the chance.

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".

That's a different discussion.
The point is that they're getting considerable advantages over others.

Proof? Link?

 

[idb]

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".
Do you even make a dime that you can call your own? Go dig a hole in the ground for a living, and try to tell the government that you can't decuct the shovel as a necessary business expense.


Oh- so now you're talking about transportation? You are not even on your own page.
Why don't you close this thread and we'll pretend it didn't happen. Bury your stupid while you have the chance.

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".

That's a different discussion.
The point is that they're getting considerable advantages over others.

Proof? Link?

Yawn?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Maybe if you buy a quart of motor oil. But with respect to gasoline prices- with market forces being what they are it's not practical that such taxes are able to be passed along to consumers.

Re: Obama's comment on oil company taxes- this is nothing new. It's been in his budget proposal since it's inception.

Oil companies make very little money on gas, they would have no choice but to pass the cost on if their expenses rose.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Ahh to be more accurate Obama wants to do away with some tax breaks that oil companies get.
Not exactly the same as a tax increase.

And any fuel increase will impact me very little as I only use about 1 tank of gas a month.
Only used 3/4 tank this month.

Quite true, it is the same as an increase in production costs, which will be passed on to consumers.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Won't a new tax just be negating some of the subsidies?
You Merkins don't know what you want.

But an examination of the American tax code indicates that oil production is among the most heavily subsidized businesses, with tax breaks available at virtually every stage of the exploration and extraction process.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/04/business/04bptax.html

For the umpfuckingteenth time, there are no subsides for oil companies.

PBS, NPR, Planned Parenthood, solar power companies, and farmers get subsides. Oil companies get the same deductions as every other business in this country. In fact, they actually get fewer deductions.

 

[Ringel05]

That's a different discussion.
The point is that they're getting considerable advantages over others.

Proof? Link?

Yawn?

You find a legitimate request for proof to be tiresome??!!
I'm mean, get real. You make an outlandish claim yet refuse to back it up. How many different ways of stupid is that?

 

[idb]

Proof? Link?

Yawn?

You find a legitimate request for proof to be tiresome??!!
I'm mean, get real. You make an outlandish claim yet refuse to back it up. How many different ways of stupid is that?

Did you not read my link?

 

[editec]

Obviously depending on the elasticity of the end-demand, increases in the price of gas or oil decreases demand.

Let me ask you this....why should the oil companies get SUBSIDES (read pork) for doing what they would do anyway?

What is so special about the oil companies?

 

[Mr. H.]

Won't a new tax just be negating some of the subsidies?
You Merkins don't know what you want.

Oil Companies Reap Billions From Subsidies - NYTimes.com

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".
Do you even make a dime that you can call your own? Go dig a hole in the ground for a living, and try to tell the government that you can't decuct the shovel as a necessary business expense.


Oh- so now you're talking about transportation? You are not even on your own page.
Why don't you close this thread and we'll pretend it didn't happen. Bury your stupid while you have the chance.

Not taking money that isn't yours to begin with isn't a "tax break".

That's a different discussion.
The point is that they're getting considerable advantages over others.

Considerable advantage? There are certain tax preference items that are tailored to various industries due to activities unique to that industry. Percentage depletion is an example. It's a form of depreciation as it relates to a depletable asset. But this particular treatment applies only to independent oil producers- you know, the small guys whose wells make an average of 3 barrels per day.

Other than that, it's a relatively even playing field that does not put oil and gas at a "considerable advantage". Yet- Obama insists on singling out and punishing its successes.

Similarly, there was no special consideration given to the petroleum industry in the late 90's when oil was $10 a barrel and gasoline was $1 per gallon (40 cents of which was federal, state, local, and environmental taxes). The market will make or break anyone in this industry- and that's how it should be in my opinion.

Again- over 90% of the players in oil and gas exploration, drilling, and production are Independents. They are price takers, not price makers.

 

[peach174]

A tax break is not a subside. We all get tax breaks.
The Government is not paying money to oil companies,that is what a subside is.
Manufacturers get a 9% tax break.
Oil Companies get 6%
I f they got rid of the tax breaks for oil, to the big 5 companies that would amount to 9 billion dollars.
You think congress is going to use that to pay the debt down?
What ever tax money goes to the government , it is always spent on something but it never goes toward the debt, just to the minimum amount due on the debt.
They have to cut spending, not tax.
Good Question: Why Does Big Oil Get Taxpayer Subsidies? « CBS Minnesota
Even this guy calls it a subside. It's a TAX BREAK.

 

[Ringel05]

Yawn?

You find a legitimate request for proof to be tiresome??!!
I'm mean, get real. You make an outlandish claim yet refuse to back it up. How many different ways of stupid is that?

Did you not read my link?

Now that you say something I had to look for it. I don't care what the author of the article is attempting to portray, tax breaks and subsidies are two different animals. If the oil companies are taking advantage of more tax breaks then other industries then the problem is in the tax code and that's what needs to be changed.

 

[Mr. H.]

Worldwide, the oil and gas industry annually contributes a half-trillion dollars toward economic activities. That's $500 followed by a bunch of zeros. And in return, we all get something really useful - energy.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Ahh to be more accurate Obama wants to do away with some tax breaks that oil companies get.
Not exactly the same as a tax increase.

And any fuel increase will impact me very little as I only use about 1 tank of gas a month.
Only used 3/4 tank this month.

It's hysterical, taking away an unneeded tax break given an industry making historic profits by a president attempting to reduce our deficite spending will be cause for said industry to raise their prices to maintain historic profits.

Yet many of these same 'amerikans' hope to reduce benefits to the aged, infirm and children; allow drug companies to continue to charge outrageous fees for life saving medicines; and support starve the beast plutocrats who hope to remake America into a plutocratic oligarchy so big oil, big pharma and big farma benefit while ending the right of all Americans to bargin collectively.

 

[editec]

Why does the oil industry need to be paid WELFARE to drill for oil?