Smart Democrats Should Be Worried

[rightwinger]

Middle income people dont itemize generally. So the mortgage deduction actually benefits high income people more.
Or did you not consider that?

Those who have a mortgage almost always itemize.

Um,no.
http://www.urban.org/uploadedpdf/412099-mortgage-deduction-reform.pdf
Check P2. The MID disproportionately benefits upper income taxpayers. No wonder you like it so much. Lefties are the biggest fucking hypocrites on the planet.

Your link does nothing to disprove what I posted that those who have a mortgage almost always itemize

It merely states that those who do not itemize do not benefit from the deduction (Rocket Science?)

 

[The Rabbi]

Those who have a mortgage almost always itemize.

Um,no.
http://www.urban.org/uploadedpdf/412099-mortgage-deduction-reform.pdf
Check P2. The MID disproportionately benefits upper income taxpayers. No wonder you like it so much. Lefties are the biggest fucking hypocrites on the planet.

Your link does nothing to disprove what I posted that those who have a mortgage almost always itemize

It merely states that those who do not itemize do not benefit from the deduction (Rocket Science?)

It benefits upper income earners. Thus you would like it because the Dems are the party of the wealthy. They just play to the lower income people but really they feel they own them.

 

[Katzndogz]

Ryan's plan is actually quite good. It cuts taxes across the board and closes the loopholes used by the wealthiest corporations. Under obama GE has a high tax rate. We do have the highest corporate rate in the world. But, GE actually pays no taxes at all. Under the Ryan plan, the corporate tax rate would be lowered but GE wouldn't be able to take advantage of the loopholes resulting in a net revenue gain. This means lower corporate taxes on small companies who don't get to take advantage of those loopholes.

It's a good plan.

 

[regent]

Why do we have tax loopholes? Those creatures are the pay-back method by which politicians repay their campaign and other contributors. The loopholes are sacred to the American political process. Probably the only way they could be erased would be to erase the whole corporate tax structure. If there were no taxes on corporations their would be no need for the loopholes. I think Republicans would go for that?

 

[Moonglow]

Sounds like a liberal repub to me.

Ryan voted to support;

:
Paul Ryan on Bailouts and Government Stimuli
-Voted YES on TARP (2008)
-Voted YES on Economic Stimulus HR 5140 (2008)
-Voted YES on $15B bailout for GM and Chrysler. (Dec 2008)
-Voted YES on $192B additional anti-recession stimulus spending. (Jul 2009)


Paul Ryan on Entitlement Programs
-Voted YES on limited prescription drug benefit for Medicare recipients. (Nov 2003)
-Voted YES on providing $70 million for Section 8 Housing vouchers. (Jun 2006)
-Voted YES on extending unemployment benefits from 39 weeks to 59 weeks. (Oct 2008)
-Voted YES on Head Start Act (2007)

Paul Ryan on Education
Rep. Ryan went along with the Bush Administration in supporting more federal involvement in education. This is contrary to the traditional Republican position, which included support for abolition of the Department of Education and decreasing federal involvement in education.
-Voted YES on No Child Left Behind Act (2001)

Paul Ryan on Civil Liberties
-Voted YES on federalizing rules for driver licenses to hinder terrorists. (Feb 2005)
-Voted YES on making the PATRIOT Act permanent. (Dec 2005)
-Voted YES on allowing electronic surveillance without a warrant. (Sep 2006)

Paul Ryan on War and Intervention Abroad
-Voted YES on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002)
-Voted YES on emergency $78B for war in Iraq & Afghanistan. (Apr 2003)
-Voted YES on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006)
-Voted NO on redeploying US troops out of Iraq starting in 90 days. (May 2007)


Congressman Ryan supports the United Nations, the World Trade Organization, federal bailouts, increased federal involvement in education, unconstitutional and undeclared wars, Medicare Part D (a multi trillion dollar unfunded liability), stimulus spending, and foreign aid.


According to Michelle Malkin in 2009, “[Paul Ryan] gave one of the most hysterical speeches in the rush to pass TARP last fall; voted for the auto bailout; and voted with the Barney Frank-Nancy Pelosi AIG bonus-bashing stampede. Milwaukee blogger Nick Schweitzer wrote: ‘He ought to be apologizing for his previous votes, not pretending he was being responsible the entire time, but I don’t see one bit of regret for what he did previously. And I’ll be damned if I’m going to let him get away with it’.”




Source: Republican Liberty Caucus of Wisconsin

 

[Moonglow]

Why would they take away the mortgage interest deduction? Do they not want people to be able to afford homes? Do you know how many more foreclosures there will be as a result?

Middle income people dont itemize generally. So the mortgage deduction actually benefits high income people more.
Or did you not consider that?

Despite persistent claims to the contrary, the President’s proposal to cap the value of itemized deductions at 28 percent would have only small effects on small business, charitable giving, and homeownership.

That’s because the proposal, which would save $318 billion over the next ten years to help finance health care reform, would affect only those tax households with incomes over $250,000 that face tax rates of either 35 or 33 percent and that itemize their deductions. Such taxpayers represent fewer than 1.2 percent of all taxpayers.

Some critics charge that the proposal would hurt small business by raising taxes on many small business owners, and that it would hurt charities and housing by reducing the incentives to make charitable donations and to buy homes. These charges are overblown, however. Because the proposal would affect such a small percentage of taxpayers, it would likely have no substantial effect on small business, it would reduce charitable giving in the United States by only an estimated 1.3 percent, and it would have little impact on home-buying across America (and an even more negligible impact on home construction). Furthermore, the proposal would return the top value of itemized deductions to what it was during the latter Reagan years, after Congress cut the top tax rate to 28 percent.

Limiting Itemized Deductions for Upper-Income Taxpayers Would Have Little Effect on Small Business, Charities, Housing — Center on Budget and Policy Priorities

 

[Conservadude]

Ryan's plan is actually quite good. It cuts taxes across the board and closes the loopholes used by the wealthiest corporations. Under obama GE has a high tax rate. We do have the highest corporate rate in the world. But, GE actually pays no taxes at all. Under the Ryan plan, the corporate tax rate would be lowered but GE wouldn't be able to take advantage of the loopholes resulting in a net revenue gain. This means lower corporate taxes on small companies who don't get to take advantage of those loopholes.

It's a good plan.

Don't waste your time using common sense! Cmon man!

 

[rightwinger]

Um,no.
http://www.urban.org/uploadedpdf/412099-mortgage-deduction-reform.pdf
Check P2. The MID disproportionately benefits upper income taxpayers. No wonder you like it so much. Lefties are the biggest fucking hypocrites on the planet.

Your link does nothing to disprove what I posted that those who have a mortgage almost always itemize

It merely states that those who do not itemize do not benefit from the deduction (Rocket Science?)

It benefits upper income earners. Thus you would like it because the Dems are the party of the wealthy. They just play to the lower income people but really they feel they own them.

Dollar wise? Of course

Percent of total income? Not even close. The mortgage deduction is the largest deduction most working Americans have

 

[The Rabbi]

Your link does nothing to disprove what I posted that those who have a mortgage almost always itemize

It merely states that those who do not itemize do not benefit from the deduction (Rocket Science?)

It benefits upper income earners. Thus you would like it because the Dems are the party of the wealthy. They just play to the lower income people but really they feel they own them.

Dollar wise? Of course

Percent of total income? Not even close. The mortgage deduction is the largest deduction most working Americans have

Except they don't take it. Too easy to take the standard and given the time it takes to calculate the difference people are probably right not to.
Only realtors and mortgage bankers love the deduction. I'd be happy with lower rates across the board and no MD.

 

[rightwinger]

It benefits upper income earners. Thus you would like it because the Dems are the party of the wealthy. They just play to the lower income people but really they feel they own them.

Dollar wise? Of course

Percent of total income? Not even close. The mortgage deduction is the largest deduction most working Americans have

Except they don't take it. Too easy to take the standard and given the time it takes to calculate the difference people are probably right not to.
Only realtors and mortgage bankers love the deduction. I'd be happy with lower rates across the board and no MD.

Can you prove that most homeowners don't take the Mortgage deduction or itemize?

200,000 mtg at 4% is $8000. Throw in Real Estate taxes of $3000 , State and local taxes of $2000, Charitable contributions of $1000 and you are easily over the standard deduction

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Romney had been running on a platform of.......We gave Obama a chance and he failed
That tactic had no legs and Romney fell further back in the race

With the selection of Ryan, Romney is embracing extreme rightwing economic ideology. He is firmly abandoning the middle class in favor of supply side solution to our economy

Double down on Trickle Down

Ryan is almost as extreme as Obama, ie. not at all. You really need to stop spouting sound bites in an attempt to look intelligent and informed, it makes you look as dumb as rdean.

Reform is reform; Ryan's ideas maybe reform but seem at first look to be radical. Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years and learning on your 54th birthday the supplemental retirement income you counted on evaporated as did you IRA in October 2008?

Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years

If I was putting my contributions into the market for 30 or more years, at the low point in 2009, my investments would still fund a benefit several times what I'd receive from the Social Security system.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Sounds like a liberal repub to me.

Ryan voted to support;

:
Paul Ryan on Bailouts and Government Stimuli
-Voted YES on TARP (2008)
-Voted YES on Economic Stimulus HR 5140 (2008)
-Voted YES on $15B bailout for GM and Chrysler. (Dec 2008)
-Voted YES on $192B additional anti-recession stimulus spending. (Jul 2009)


Paul Ryan on Entitlement Programs
-Voted YES on limited prescription drug benefit for Medicare recipients. (Nov 2003)
-Voted YES on providing $70 million for Section 8 Housing vouchers. (Jun 2006)
-Voted YES on extending unemployment benefits from 39 weeks to 59 weeks. (Oct 2008)
-Voted YES on Head Start Act (2007)

Paul Ryan on Education
Rep. Ryan went along with the Bush Administration in supporting more federal involvement in education. This is contrary to the traditional Republican position, which included support for abolition of the Department of Education and decreasing federal involvement in education.
-Voted YES on No Child Left Behind Act (2001)

Paul Ryan on Civil Liberties
-Voted YES on federalizing rules for driver licenses to hinder terrorists. (Feb 2005)
-Voted YES on making the PATRIOT Act permanent. (Dec 2005)
-Voted YES on allowing electronic surveillance without a warrant. (Sep 2006)

Paul Ryan on War and Intervention Abroad
-Voted YES on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002)
-Voted YES on emergency $78B for war in Iraq & Afghanistan. (Apr 2003)
-Voted YES on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006)
-Voted NO on redeploying US troops out of Iraq starting in 90 days. (May 2007)


Congressman Ryan supports the United Nations, the World Trade Organization, federal bailouts, increased federal involvement in education, unconstitutional and undeclared wars, Medicare Part D (a multi trillion dollar unfunded liability), stimulus spending, and foreign aid.


According to Michelle Malkin in 2009, “[Paul Ryan] gave one of the most hysterical speeches in the rush to pass TARP last fall; voted for the auto bailout; and voted with the Barney Frank-Nancy Pelosi AIG bonus-bashing stampede. Milwaukee blogger Nick Schweitzer wrote: ‘He ought to be apologizing for his previous votes, not pretending he was being responsible the entire time, but I don’t see one bit of regret for what he did previously. And I’ll be damned if I’m going to let him get away with it’.”




Source: Republican Liberty Caucus of Wisconsin

Are you trying to convince liberals to vote for him?

 

[Moonglow]

Ryan is almost as extreme as Obama, ie. not at all. You really need to stop spouting sound bites in an attempt to look intelligent and informed, it makes you look as dumb as rdean.

Reform is reform; Ryan's ideas maybe reform but seem at first look to be radical. Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years and learning on your 54th birthday the supplemental retirement income you counted on evaporated as did you IRA in October 2008?

Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years

If I was putting my contributions into the market for 30 or more years, at the low point in 2009, my investments would still fund a benefit several times what I'd receive from the Social Security system.

oh that is why so many people lost their retirement investments during that period?

 

[Moonglow]

Sounds like a liberal repub to me.

Ryan voted to support;

:
Paul Ryan on Bailouts and Government Stimuli
-Voted YES on TARP (2008)
-Voted YES on Economic Stimulus HR 5140 (2008)
-Voted YES on $15B bailout for GM and Chrysler. (Dec 2008)
-Voted YES on $192B additional anti-recession stimulus spending. (Jul 2009)


Paul Ryan on Entitlement Programs
-Voted YES on limited prescription drug benefit for Medicare recipients. (Nov 2003)
-Voted YES on providing $70 million for Section 8 Housing vouchers. (Jun 2006)
-Voted YES on extending unemployment benefits from 39 weeks to 59 weeks. (Oct 2008)
-Voted YES on Head Start Act (2007)

Paul Ryan on Education
Rep. Ryan went along with the Bush Administration in supporting more federal involvement in education. This is contrary to the traditional Republican position, which included support for abolition of the Department of Education and decreasing federal involvement in education.
-Voted YES on No Child Left Behind Act (2001)

Paul Ryan on Civil Liberties
-Voted YES on federalizing rules for driver licenses to hinder terrorists. (Feb 2005)
-Voted YES on making the PATRIOT Act permanent. (Dec 2005)
-Voted YES on allowing electronic surveillance without a warrant. (Sep 2006)

Paul Ryan on War and Intervention Abroad
-Voted YES on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002)
-Voted YES on emergency $78B for war in Iraq & Afghanistan. (Apr 2003)
-Voted YES on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006)
-Voted NO on redeploying US troops out of Iraq starting in 90 days. (May 2007)


Congressman Ryan supports the United Nations, the World Trade Organization, federal bailouts, increased federal involvement in education, unconstitutional and undeclared wars, Medicare Part D (a multi trillion dollar unfunded liability), stimulus spending, and foreign aid.


According to Michelle Malkin in 2009, “[Paul Ryan] gave one of the most hysterical speeches in the rush to pass TARP last fall; voted for the auto bailout; and voted with the Barney Frank-Nancy Pelosi AIG bonus-bashing stampede. Milwaukee blogger Nick Schweitzer wrote: ‘He ought to be apologizing for his previous votes, not pretending he was being responsible the entire time, but I don’t see one bit of regret for what he did previously. And I’ll be damned if I’m going to let him get away with it’.”




Source: Republican Liberty Caucus of Wisconsin

Are you trying to convince liberals to vote for him?

He is no conservative.

 

[The Rabbi]

Sounds like a liberal repub to me.

Ryan voted to support;

:
Paul Ryan on Bailouts and Government Stimuli
-Voted YES on TARP (2008)
-Voted YES on Economic Stimulus HR 5140 (2008)
-Voted YES on $15B bailout for GM and Chrysler. (Dec 2008)
-Voted YES on $192B additional anti-recession stimulus spending. (Jul 2009)


Paul Ryan on Entitlement Programs
-Voted YES on limited prescription drug benefit for Medicare recipients. (Nov 2003)
-Voted YES on providing $70 million for Section 8 Housing vouchers. (Jun 2006)
-Voted YES on extending unemployment benefits from 39 weeks to 59 weeks. (Oct 2008)
-Voted YES on Head Start Act (2007)

Paul Ryan on Education
Rep. Ryan went along with the Bush Administration in supporting more federal involvement in education. This is contrary to the traditional Republican position, which included support for abolition of the Department of Education and decreasing federal involvement in education.
-Voted YES on No Child Left Behind Act (2001)

Paul Ryan on Civil Liberties
-Voted YES on federalizing rules for driver licenses to hinder terrorists. (Feb 2005)
-Voted YES on making the PATRIOT Act permanent. (Dec 2005)
-Voted YES on allowing electronic surveillance without a warrant. (Sep 2006)

Paul Ryan on War and Intervention Abroad
-Voted YES on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002)
-Voted YES on emergency $78B for war in Iraq & Afghanistan. (Apr 2003)
-Voted YES on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006)
-Voted NO on redeploying US troops out of Iraq starting in 90 days. (May 2007)


Congressman Ryan supports the United Nations, the World Trade Organization, federal bailouts, increased federal involvement in education, unconstitutional and undeclared wars, Medicare Part D (a multi trillion dollar unfunded liability), stimulus spending, and foreign aid.


According to Michelle Malkin in 2009, “[Paul Ryan] gave one of the most hysterical speeches in the rush to pass TARP last fall; voted for the auto bailout; and voted with the Barney Frank-Nancy Pelosi AIG bonus-bashing stampede. Milwaukee blogger Nick Schweitzer wrote: ‘He ought to be apologizing for his previous votes, not pretending he was being responsible the entire time, but I don’t see one bit of regret for what he did previously. And I’ll be damned if I’m going to let him get away with it’.”




Source: Republican Liberty Caucus of Wisconsin

Are you trying to convince liberals to vote for him?

He is no conservative.

So you're voting for him, because you're no conservative either, right?

 

[candycorn]

Are you trying to convince liberals to vote for him?

He is no conservative.

So you're voting for him, because you're no conservative either, right?

Well, neither is Romney and hardly anyone is voting FOR him.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Reform is reform; Ryan's ideas maybe reform but seem at first look to be radical. Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years and learning on your 54th birthday the supplemental retirement income you counted on evaporated as did you IRA in October 2008?

Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years

If I was putting my contributions into the market for 30 or more years, at the low point in 2009, my investments would still fund a benefit several times what I'd receive from the Social Security system.

oh that is why so many people lost their retirement investments during that period?

If they were in a diversified stock portfolio, they only lost if they sold at the bottom.
And 30 years of market contributions, even if you sold at the bottom, would still give you multiples of what your Social Security benefit would give you.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Sounds like a liberal repub to me.

Ryan voted to support;

:
Paul Ryan on Bailouts and Government Stimuli
-Voted YES on TARP (2008)
-Voted YES on Economic Stimulus HR 5140 (2008)
-Voted YES on $15B bailout for GM and Chrysler. (Dec 2008)
-Voted YES on $192B additional anti-recession stimulus spending. (Jul 2009)


Paul Ryan on Entitlement Programs
-Voted YES on limited prescription drug benefit for Medicare recipients. (Nov 2003)
-Voted YES on providing $70 million for Section 8 Housing vouchers. (Jun 2006)
-Voted YES on extending unemployment benefits from 39 weeks to 59 weeks. (Oct 2008)
-Voted YES on Head Start Act (2007)

Paul Ryan on Education
Rep. Ryan went along with the Bush Administration in supporting more federal involvement in education. This is contrary to the traditional Republican position, which included support for abolition of the Department of Education and decreasing federal involvement in education.
-Voted YES on No Child Left Behind Act (2001)

Paul Ryan on Civil Liberties
-Voted YES on federalizing rules for driver licenses to hinder terrorists. (Feb 2005)
-Voted YES on making the PATRIOT Act permanent. (Dec 2005)
-Voted YES on allowing electronic surveillance without a warrant. (Sep 2006)

Paul Ryan on War and Intervention Abroad
-Voted YES on authorizing military force in Iraq. (Oct 2002)
-Voted YES on emergency $78B for war in Iraq & Afghanistan. (Apr 2003)
-Voted YES on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date. (Jun 2006)
-Voted NO on redeploying US troops out of Iraq starting in 90 days. (May 2007)


Congressman Ryan supports the United Nations, the World Trade Organization, federal bailouts, increased federal involvement in education, unconstitutional and undeclared wars, Medicare Part D (a multi trillion dollar unfunded liability), stimulus spending, and foreign aid.


According to Michelle Malkin in 2009, “[Paul Ryan] gave one of the most hysterical speeches in the rush to pass TARP last fall; voted for the auto bailout; and voted with the Barney Frank-Nancy Pelosi AIG bonus-bashing stampede. Milwaukee blogger Nick Schweitzer wrote: ‘He ought to be apologizing for his previous votes, not pretending he was being responsible the entire time, but I don’t see one bit of regret for what he did previously. And I’ll be damned if I’m going to let him get away with it’.”




Source: Republican Liberty Caucus of Wisconsin

Are you trying to convince liberals to vote for him?

He is no conservative.

I never said he was. He is, however, the best choice to frame this election as a choice between conservative principles and progressive ones.

 

[Peach]

He is no conservative.

So you're voting for him, because you're no conservative either, right?

Well, neither is Romney and hardly anyone is voting FOR him.

Ryan has ALWAYS hunted for media attention; he will or do anything to further his goal, PAUL RYAN. He'll vote one way if it'll get him on the news, the next day, he does a 180. Bad choice by Romney, Ryan's MEDICARE reputation is already resounding, it might not be deserved, but could not stop running his mouth when he saw the cameras.

 

[Full-Auto]

Imagine paying into social security for 30 or more years

If I was putting my contributions into the market for 30 or more years, at the low point in 2009, my investments would still fund a benefit several times what I'd receive from the Social Security system.

oh that is why so many people lost their retirement investments during that period?

If they were in a diversified stock portfolio, they only lost if they sold at the bottom.
And 30 years of market contributions, even if you sold at the bottom, would still give you multiples of what your Social Security benefit would give you.

fiscal reality can not be spoken by democrats. They are still under orders.......