Shutdown Fallout Effects....

[Desperado]

What happens when you pay ransom to kidnappers?

No I don't know, Please tell me

 

[Desperado]

Hate the Shutdown and its effects? Easy fix, build the wall!

Better fix Impeach the moron swine

I agree but you cannot impeach the Speaker of the House.

 

[Papageorgio]

while Trump cries to cameras about protecting America , his actions actually do the opposite.

If getting rid of illegals is such an important focus , then you should want to end the shutdown .

Maybe use wall money to find more courts and judges so we can get through the huge immigration court backlogs .


Immigration courts at a standstill during government shutdown, undermining President Trump's agenda


Far from the president’s rallying cry of “securing our border,” delaying court hearings puts additional strain on the immigration system, while allowing those who would have been deported to stay in the country for possibly years longer as they await new court dates.

Lol he is such a moron. Of course, his brain dead supporters will desperately try to defend him on this.

Trump is getting his jollies enjoying the shit show he's created. He's deranged, he's a maniac who doesn't give a rats ass if this wall is built or not.

And anyone who thinks Trump has principles is a fool. It's not about the wall, it's about him. He moved The Apprentice from NBC to the White House. We're all contestants in his game.

Well there is one National Park Service site that is going to remain open. Just one, the old Post Office Tower in DC, which is part of, you can't make this up, the TRUMP HOTEL.

I can tell you this, our forefathers would have already ran Trump's ass out of town on a rail, after tarring and feathering him. His supporters are utter fools.

Do you have a link for your claiming only the old Post Office Tower is open?

 

[eagle1462010]

The ransom amount is 5 billion.

5 billion isn't going to get a wall.

It's an arbitrary amount. Trump has been offered 1.6 billion...

That's a LARGER amount than the 1.2 billion for Border security that was appropriated (and left largely unspent) last year.

End this bullshit now

Wonder how come the pos never mentions the 1.2 billion not used?? Maybe he put it in his charity foundation before it was closed down because he's nothing more than a thief?

Many contracts were awarded late last year.........The lengths these clowns go to spin the information with MSM garbage.

Border Wall Contract Awards in California | U.S. Customs and Border Protection

Border Wall Contract Award in Arizona | U.S. Customs and Border Protection

Border Wall Contract Award in Rio Grande Valley, Texas | U.S. Customs and Border Protection

El Paso Border Wall Project to Begin | U.S. Customs and Border Protection

 

[Flopper]

Millions of workers are one paycheck away from the streets. Millions more live from paycheck to paycheck I know several people that have no savings, no pay check, then no groceries, no rent payment, etc.

What we're hearing now is mostly fear. After missing another paycheck or so, a lot of people are going to be desperate. People that are furrowed are eligible for unemployment. Those that are working without pay aren't.

If this goes on another month or so, we are going have massive walkouts in critical jobs and Trump will have deal with it.

Well then he'll have to deal with it, but I don't think the Democrats can play chicken that long. They will cave before then. This shutdown is going to hurt them more than Trump.

History tells a different story of government shutdowns. Looking at the longest shutdowns since 1977 shows that presidents lose an average of three percentage points of public support or approval during a government shutdown of four or more days. And only two of the nine shutdowns did the president boost his numbers. Considering how low Trump's numbers are he probably can't drop more than a couple of percentage points.

Presidents usually lose support in government shutdowns because people see the president as the most powerful actor in government. The president has control of the money, the military, and the news cycle. Since the president is recognized as the most powerful person on earth and according to him the greatest deal maker who ever lived then certainly he can cut deal and get the government up an running.

One thing voters will remember is that Trump started the process by demanding money to build a wall that most people don't want and he refused to compromise. What happen to the great deal maker we elected? He's sounding more and more like the little boy who can get what he wants so he's going to take his marbles and go home.

It's like this:

Party A: wants a wall.
Party B: doesn't want a wall.

Party A: what would it take to get this wall?
Party B: There is nothing you can offer us that will give you that wall no matter what.

So tell me what other negotiator could solve this problem? It's very similar to the Palestinian/ Israel conflict. What do Palestinians want? They want every Jew dead. How would the Jewish negotiate that?

Trump wants a wall for the interest of this country. Democrats don't want the wall for the interest of their party.

Not being a master negotiator and deal maker like Trump, I have no idea.

Why is he asking congress for money anyway? Remember Mexico is paying for the wall. Pelosi should make him an offer, every cent the US government receives from Mexico in payment for the wall will be turned over to Trump for wall construction. That seems fair to me.

Trump said he'd get Mexico to pay for the wall. He didn't say he'd get Mexico to write us a check up front or lay down a deposit.

The point is I don't care how great of a negotiator you are. If one of the two parties refuses to negotiate, it can't be done by anybody. That's like saying you're going to negotiate with your neighbor to buy his car. If he's not selling his car, there is nothing to negotiate.

However, he plans to secure the funds from Mexico, maybe he should do so before running to congress. He's had two years and the Mexican government hasn't transferred a cent to the US treasury to pay for the wall.

If Trump had actually secured the funds from Mexico that he promised, there would have been no need to ask congress for the money and there would no shutdown. The shutdown is of Trump's making. He said he would take responsibility for the shutdown. He owns it and it's too late to try to shift the blame to democrats.

 

[Flopper]

The ransom amount is 5 billion.

5 billion isn't going to get a wall.

It's an arbitrary amount. Trump has been offered 1.6 billion...

That's a LARGER amount than the 1.2 billion for Border security that was appropriated (and left largely unspent) last year.

End this bullshit now

Trump wanted 30 billion for the wall. He scaled that down to 5 billion. Trump believes according to his experts, that it's enough to erect a wall in critical areas. It has nothing to do with the money. It has to do with erecting a structure that will work. Democrats don't want it to work. They want to keep letting in these murderers, rapists and drug dealers entering our country.

You do realize his plans now have changed to building a barrier on only 10% of the border. I wonder what his supporters think of leaving 90% of the border without the barrier.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The ransom amount is 5 billion.

5 billion isn't going to get a wall.

It's an arbitrary amount. Trump has been offered 1.6 billion...

That's a LARGER amount than the 1.2 billion for Border security that was appropriated (and left largely unspent) last year.

End this bullshit now

Trump wanted 30 billion for the wall. He scaled that down to 5 billion. Trump believes according to his experts, that it's enough to erect a wall in critical areas. It has nothing to do with the money. It has to do with erecting a structure that will work. Democrats don't want it to work. They want to keep letting in these murderers, rapists and drug dealers entering our country.

You do realize his plans now have changed to building a barrier on only 10% of the border. I wonder what his supporters think of leaving 90% of the border without the barrier.

We're not happy about it, but we can't even get the 10% from the Democrats, so we are more pissed off at them.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Well then he'll have to deal with it, but I don't think the Democrats can play chicken that long. They will cave before then. This shutdown is going to hurt them more than Trump.

History tells a different story of government shutdowns. Looking at the longest shutdowns since 1977 shows that presidents lose an average of three percentage points of public support or approval during a government shutdown of four or more days. And only two of the nine shutdowns did the president boost his numbers. Considering how low Trump's numbers are he probably can't drop more than a couple of percentage points.

Presidents usually lose support in government shutdowns because people see the president as the most powerful actor in government. The president has control of the money, the military, and the news cycle. Since the president is recognized as the most powerful person on earth and according to him the greatest deal maker who ever lived then certainly he can cut deal and get the government up an running.

One thing voters will remember is that Trump started the process by demanding money to build a wall that most people don't want and he refused to compromise. What happen to the great deal maker we elected? He's sounding more and more like the little boy who can get what he wants so he's going to take his marbles and go home.

It's like this:

Party A: wants a wall.
Party B: doesn't want a wall.

Party A: what would it take to get this wall?
Party B: There is nothing you can offer us that will give you that wall no matter what.

So tell me what other negotiator could solve this problem? It's very similar to the Palestinian/ Israel conflict. What do Palestinians want? They want every Jew dead. How would the Jewish negotiate that?

Trump wants a wall for the interest of this country. Democrats don't want the wall for the interest of their party.

Not being a master negotiator and deal maker like Trump, I have no idea.

Why is he asking congress for money anyway? Remember Mexico is paying for the wall. Pelosi should make him an offer, every cent the US government receives from Mexico in payment for the wall will be turned over to Trump for wall construction. That seems fair to me.

Trump said he'd get Mexico to pay for the wall. He didn't say he'd get Mexico to write us a check up front or lay down a deposit.

The point is I don't care how great of a negotiator you are. If one of the two parties refuses to negotiate, it can't be done by anybody. That's like saying you're going to negotiate with your neighbor to buy his car. If he's not selling his car, there is nothing to negotiate.

However, he plans to secure the funds from Mexico, maybe he should do so before running to congress. He's had two years and the Mexican government hasn't transferred a cent to the US treasury to pay for the wall.

If Trump had actually secured the funds from Mexico that he promised, there would have been no need to ask congress for the money and there would no shutdown. The shutdown is of Trump's making. He said he would take responsibility for the shutdown. He owns it and it's too late to try to shift the blame to democrats.

To be honest nobody on our side cares who pays for it, just as long as it's built. The puppet masters have you on the left keep bringing up that point to deflect from the conversation. It doesn't work because we keep telling you we don't care. The shutdown already cost the country more than Trump was asking for. So money wise, it would have been cheaper if the Democrats allowed him to have the 5 billion. That's about what we spend on food stamps for just one month.

 

[Flopper]

The ransom amount is 5 billion.

5 billion isn't going to get a wall.

It's an arbitrary amount. Trump has been offered 1.6 billion...

That's a LARGER amount than the 1.2 billion for Border security that was appropriated (and left largely unspent) last year.

End this bullshit now

Trump wanted 30 billion for the wall. He scaled that down to 5 billion. Trump believes according to his experts, that it's enough to erect a wall in critical areas. It has nothing to do with the money. It has to do with erecting a structure that will work. Democrats don't want it to work. They want to keep letting in these murderers, rapists and drug dealers entering our country.

You do realize his plans now have changed to building a barrier on only 10% of the border. I wonder what his supporters think of leaving 90% of the border without the barrier.

We're not happy about it, but we can't even get the 10% from the Democrats, so we are more pissed off at them.

The reason you can't get the 10% is it makes even less sense than 100%. If you had a thousand foot property border around your house, would you build a hundred foot long wall then claim it will keep out intruders? It's this kind of craziness that surrounds Trump, that keeps congress from trusting him. You can't depend on anything he says.

 

[Flopper]

History tells a different story of government shutdowns. Looking at the longest shutdowns since 1977 shows that presidents lose an average of three percentage points of public support or approval during a government shutdown of four or more days. And only two of the nine shutdowns did the president boost his numbers. Considering how low Trump's numbers are he probably can't drop more than a couple of percentage points.

Presidents usually lose support in government shutdowns because people see the president as the most powerful actor in government. The president has control of the money, the military, and the news cycle. Since the president is recognized as the most powerful person on earth and according to him the greatest deal maker who ever lived then certainly he can cut deal and get the government up an running.

One thing voters will remember is that Trump started the process by demanding money to build a wall that most people don't want and he refused to compromise. What happen to the great deal maker we elected? He's sounding more and more like the little boy who can get what he wants so he's going to take his marbles and go home.

It's like this:

Party A: wants a wall.
Party B: doesn't want a wall.

Party A: what would it take to get this wall?
Party B: There is nothing you can offer us that will give you that wall no matter what.

So tell me what other negotiator could solve this problem? It's very similar to the Palestinian/ Israel conflict. What do Palestinians want? They want every Jew dead. How would the Jewish negotiate that?

Trump wants a wall for the interest of this country. Democrats don't want the wall for the interest of their party.

Not being a master negotiator and deal maker like Trump, I have no idea.

Why is he asking congress for money anyway? Remember Mexico is paying for the wall. Pelosi should make him an offer, every cent the US government receives from Mexico in payment for the wall will be turned over to Trump for wall construction. That seems fair to me.

Trump said he'd get Mexico to pay for the wall. He didn't say he'd get Mexico to write us a check up front or lay down a deposit.

The point is I don't care how great of a negotiator you are. If one of the two parties refuses to negotiate, it can't be done by anybody. That's like saying you're going to negotiate with your neighbor to buy his car. If he's not selling his car, there is nothing to negotiate.

However, he plans to secure the funds from Mexico, maybe he should do so before running to congress. He's had two years and the Mexican government hasn't transferred a cent to the US treasury to pay for the wall.

If Trump had actually secured the funds from Mexico that he promised, there would have been no need to ask congress for the money and there would no shutdown. The shutdown is of Trump's making. He said he would take responsibility for the shutdown. He owns it and it's too late to try to shift the blame to democrats.

To be honest nobody on our side cares who pays for it, just as long as it's built. The puppet masters have you on the left keep bringing up that point to deflect from the conversation. It doesn't work because we keep telling you we don't care. The shutdown already cost the country more than Trump was asking for. So money wise, it would have been cheaper if the Democrats allowed him to have the 5 billion. That's about what we spend on food stamps for just one month.

Just as Trump supporters would not stand for him to accept nothing, democrat supporters would not accept giving him 5 billion for a wall. The only solution seems to be a proclamation of a national emergency. I'm not sure why he hasn't already done it.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Just as Trump supporters would not stand for him to accept nothing, democrat supporters would not accept giving him 5 billion for a wall. The only solution seems to be a proclamation of a national emergency. I'm not sure why he hasn't already done it.

Because it would be a fail for the GOP.

Under Section 202 of the National Emergencies Act of 1976 such a national emergency can be ended either through the President rescinding the order, or by a Joint Resolution of Congress. With DEMs in control of the House, such a JR would be passed in a hot minute and sent to the Senate where McConnell would have no choice but to bring it to a vote (the law mandates votes). McConnell DOESN'T WANT Senators on the record with a vote going into an election year. (For example Garland prior to 2016 and his refusal to bring House bills to reopen the government).

Then there are the court charges of overreach of power, which would likely succeed.


.>>>>>

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It's like this:

Party A: wants a wall.
Party B: doesn't want a wall.

Party A: what would it take to get this wall?
Party B: There is nothing you can offer us that will give you that wall no matter what.

So tell me what other negotiator could solve this problem? It's very similar to the Palestinian/ Israel conflict. What do Palestinians want? They want every Jew dead. How would the Jewish negotiate that?

Trump wants a wall for the interest of this country. Democrats don't want the wall for the interest of their party.

Not being a master negotiator and deal maker like Trump, I have no idea.

Why is he asking congress for money anyway? Remember Mexico is paying for the wall. Pelosi should make him an offer, every cent the US government receives from Mexico in payment for the wall will be turned over to Trump for wall construction. That seems fair to me.

Trump said he'd get Mexico to pay for the wall. He didn't say he'd get Mexico to write us a check up front or lay down a deposit.

The point is I don't care how great of a negotiator you are. If one of the two parties refuses to negotiate, it can't be done by anybody. That's like saying you're going to negotiate with your neighbor to buy his car. If he's not selling his car, there is nothing to negotiate.

However, he plans to secure the funds from Mexico, maybe he should do so before running to congress. He's had two years and the Mexican government hasn't transferred a cent to the US treasury to pay for the wall.

If Trump had actually secured the funds from Mexico that he promised, there would have been no need to ask congress for the money and there would no shutdown. The shutdown is of Trump's making. He said he would take responsibility for the shutdown. He owns it and it's too late to try to shift the blame to democrats.

To be honest nobody on our side cares who pays for it, just as long as it's built. The puppet masters have you on the left keep bringing up that point to deflect from the conversation. It doesn't work because we keep telling you we don't care. The shutdown already cost the country more than Trump was asking for. So money wise, it would have been cheaper if the Democrats allowed him to have the 5 billion. That's about what we spend on food stamps for just one month.

Just as Trump supporters would not stand for him to accept nothing, democrat supporters would not accept giving him 5 billion for a wall. The only solution seems to be a proclamation of a national emergency. I'm not sure why he hasn't already done it.

It’s a last option. If he did so, it’s going to be challenged by the Democrats because they will get some Commie judge to stop him like so many times before. It will be fought up to the Supreme Court which will take a lot of time. During this battle the government will remain shutdown.




Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

 

[TroglocratsRdumb]

President Trump has exposed how the Corrupt and Greedy Democrats don't care about the American people.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The ransom amount is 5 billion.

5 billion isn't going to get a wall.

It's an arbitrary amount. Trump has been offered 1.6 billion...

That's a LARGER amount than the 1.2 billion for Border security that was appropriated (and left largely unspent) last year.

End this bullshit now

Trump wanted 30 billion for the wall. He scaled that down to 5 billion. Trump believes according to his experts, that it's enough to erect a wall in critical areas. It has nothing to do with the money. It has to do with erecting a structure that will work. Democrats don't want it to work. They want to keep letting in these murderers, rapists and drug dealers entering our country.

You do realize his plans now have changed to building a barrier on only 10% of the border. I wonder what his supporters think of leaving 90% of the border without the barrier.

We're not happy about it, but we can't even get the 10% from the Democrats, so we are more pissed off at them.

The reason you can't get the 10% is it makes even less sense than 100%. If you had a thousand foot property border around your house, would you build a hundred foot long wall then claim it will keep out intruders? It's this kind of craziness that surrounds Trump, that keeps congress from trusting him. You can't depend on anything he says.

Terrible comparison. It only takes seconds to walk a hundred feet. It’s different if you have to go 50 miles to get around a wall. Plus the fact there will be more agents in the open spaces and there are natural barriers where there is no wall.

It has nothing to do with making sense or not, it has to do with Democrats wanting the continuation of illegals entering the country.


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Flopper]

Just as Trump supporters would not stand for him to accept nothing, democrat supporters would not accept giving him 5 billion for a wall. The only solution seems to be a proclamation of a national emergency. I'm not sure why he hasn't already done it.

Because it would be a fail for the GOP.

Under Section 202 of the National Emergencies Act of 1976 such a national emergency can be ended either through the President rescinding the order, or by a Joint Resolution of Congress. With DEMs in control of the House, such a JR would be passed in a hot minute and sent to the Senate where McConnell would have no choice but to bring it to a vote (the law mandates votes). McConnell DOESN'T WANT Senators on the record with a vote going into an election year. (For example Garland prior to 2016 and his refusal to bring House bills to reopen the government).

Then there are the court charges of overreach of power, which would likely succeed.
.>>>>>

Wouldn't it still require a 2/3 vote in congress to override a veto by Trump.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Just as Trump supporters would not stand for him to accept nothing, democrat supporters would not accept giving him 5 billion for a wall. The only solution seems to be a proclamation of a national emergency. I'm not sure why he hasn't already done it.

Because it would be a fail for the GOP.

Under Section 202 of the National Emergencies Act of 1976 such a national emergency can be ended either through the President rescinding the order, or by a Joint Resolution of Congress. With DEMs in control of the House, such a JR would be passed in a hot minute and sent to the Senate where McConnell would have no choice but to bring it to a vote (the law mandates votes). McConnell DOESN'T WANT Senators on the record with a vote going into an election year. (For example Garland prior to 2016 and his refusal to bring House bills to reopen the government).

Then there are the court charges of overreach of power, which would likely succeed.
.>>>>>

Wouldn't it still require a 2/3 vote in congress to override a veto by Trump.

Yep, but it's the vote itself the McConnell doesn't want. Before Trump can veto it the Senate would have to vote on the record. (True the law says the vote can be by the yeas/nays, but it just takes someone to object to a voice vote to then require a roll call vote on the record.)

McConnell doesn't want GOP Senators to have to vote on the wall, specially since the 2020 class for the Senate is not as favorable as the 2018 class was.

.
.
.>>>>

 

[JWBooth]

 

[JWBooth]

 

[Ambivalent1]

Very simple. Give him the 5 Billion shutdown over.

 

[Flopper]

The ransom amount is 5 billion.

5 billion isn't going to get a wall.

It's an arbitrary amount. Trump has been offered 1.6 billion...

That's a LARGER amount than the 1.2 billion for Border security that was appropriated (and left largely unspent) last year.

End this bullshit now

Trump wanted 30 billion for the wall. He scaled that down to 5 billion. Trump believes according to his experts, that it's enough to erect a wall in critical areas. It has nothing to do with the money. It has to do with erecting a structure that will work. Democrats don't want it to work. They want to keep letting in these murderers, rapists and drug dealers entering our country.

You do realize his plans now have changed to building a barrier on only 10% of the border. I wonder what his supporters think of leaving 90% of the border without the barrier.

We're not happy about it, but we can't even get the 10% from the Democrats, so we are more pissed off at them.

The reason you can't get the 10% is it makes even less sense than 100%. If you had a thousand foot property border around your house, would you build a hundred foot long wall then claim it will keep out intruders? It's this kind of craziness that surrounds Trump, that keeps congress from trusting him. You can't depend on anything he says.

Terrible comparison. It only takes seconds to walk a hundred feet. It’s different if you have to go 50 miles to get around a wall. Plus the fact there will be more agents in the open spaces and there are natural barriers where there is no wall.

It has nothing to do with making sense or not, it has to do with Democrats wanting the continuation of illegals entering the country.


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

That makes no sense. Crossing the border illegally is rarely an unplanned event. As we know quite well, migrants travel hundreds and thousands of miles to cross the border. They can just as easily go to Sonora as Juarez, or the Rio Grande Valley. Within days of completion of the Wall, migrants will be selecting another crossing somewhere in 1800 miles of un-walled border. All Trump is doing is making a 10% section of the border more difficult to cross, assuming the wall every get's built.