Shoot or not shoot?

[Midnight Marauder]

But even the ''always shoot to kill''...i still think that may be wrong instructions as well...if the other person can not kill you because they have just a knife and are 15 feet away and you have a gun pointed at them, you have the upper hand and if the other guy makes a move of any sort, you still have the upper hand and it is not necessary to kill another human being...you could shoot him in the leg or shoulder if necessary...especially if you have had training and shooting practice with your gun...the thigh has a major artery so you still could kill him, but it would not be intentionally as putting 4 bullets in him would be.

Let's make sure we understand -- my comments here on what I would do are limited to the scenario from the OP. However, I do not take time to identify the weapon. I shoot. I do not care if it is a knife, a gun, a screwdriver, or a hostess twinkie. That detail can be sorted out after I call the police.

If you had no threat from a robber in your house, in most states that are not, pro gun wild west states like florida and texas...you could be subject to being prosecuted if you killed someone breaking in that did not try to kill you or have a weapon that could kill you, or that threatened you and said they were going to kill you...I believe?

I know not or care what the laws are in other states. Here, even if completely unarmed, if you invade someone's house the homeowner has every right to shoot you. And he has every right to shoot to kill.

By the way, here in "gun happy West Texas" formal training is required if you're going to legally own a handgun. Bet you didn't know that.

 

[007]

Of course people with training are taught to shoot to kill MM, and this IS BECAUSE they are also TAUGHT NOT to use their gun or aim it ant anyone that is not trying to kill them or another person...

They should be trained on WHEN to shoot to kill and WHEN not to.....NOT JUST to shoot to kill under any circumstance?

If they are teaching all of you gun owners JUST TO SHOOT TO KILL, NO MATTER in reading the circumstances then I would be AGAINST anyone owning a gun, because they would be owning one for the sole purpose of killing another without thought or reasoning coming in to play and THAT would be DANGEROUS imo.

Very FEW people are actually trained compared to the amount of folks who own handguns.

Those who are, are trained that if you are going to shoot a person, put four slugs in the torso. Because it's the biggest target, and cannot move as fast as a leg, arm or head. That's all it is. Otherwise, you don't pull the trigger.

Deciding when to shoot or not is case by case. Shoot/don't shoot drills are handy little rehearsals but they're not real life.

You may, if you want to take the time, go back and re-read all my posts and find where I said ALWAYS shoot.

I said, ALWAYS shoot to KILL. Not always shoot.

See the difference?

YEP! Now I do see the difference MM, but I did not catch that initially! It is clearer now...

But even the ''always shoot to kill''...i still think that may be wrong instructions as well...if the other person can not kill you because they have just a knife and are 15 feet away and you have a gun pointed at them, you have the upper hand and if the other guy makes a move of any sort, you still have the upper hand and it is not necessary to kill another human being...you could shoot him in the leg or shoulder if necessary...especially if you have had training and shooting practice with your gun...the thigh has a major artery so you still could kill him, but it would not be intentionally as putting 4 bullets in him would be.

If you had no threat from a robber in your house, in most states that are not, pro gun wild west states like florida and texas...you could be subject to being prosecuted if you killed someone breaking in that did not try to kill you or have a weapon that could kill you, or that threatened you and said they were going to kill you...I believe?

Care... all I can say to you is, you better hope and pray this never happens to you, because from what you keep saying here, you're going to be the victim.

I have no idea how you can say "no threat" when someone has ALREADY BROKEN INTO YOUR HOME and is HEADED TOWARDS YOU WITH WEAPON IN HAND.... you don't see a THREAT THERE? Damn care.... sometimes you have to let go of the liberal touchy feely crap and get real. Just sayin'...

 

[WillowTree]

If you cannot reach the gun or it is not close enough to reach when an intruder comes into your bedroom it will do you absolutely no good whatsoever.

My pistol is either ON me, or locked up. The lone exception is, bedtime. Then, it goes in my left boot, on the floor right by me -- for easy reach and so I won't forget it in the morning.

You leave yours in the bed, where anyone can find it, from what I'm reading. A burglar can find that gun someday and kill a little girl with it. A kid can find it, play with it, and shoot you or his friend.

Because you're untrained and irresponsible.

oh crap! MM lighten up, a friend of mine left town for 3 days to go to a wedding, while gone someone broke into her house stole the computers, some petty cash, some jewelry, the gun case was smashed open an a .38 caliber handgun stolen. Yep someday that registered .38 could posssibly kill someone. you are off base and over the line here. Unless Rodhishi typically has small children around the gun is safe. I live in an all adult household so I'll keep mine in a place of my choosing.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

One additional item folks. You DON'T KNOW from the scenario presented that the perp is alone. He may have one or more buds following him in. They may have guns.

SHOOT and KILL the first fuck, then secure your premises, then call the police.

 

[Mr Natural]

One additional item folks. You DON'T KNOW from the scenario presented that the perp is alone. He may have one or more buds following him in. They may have guns.

SHOOT and KILL the first fuck, then secure your premises, then call the police.

Hence the 12 guage as my weapon of choice.

That, and no PITA license or registration required.

 

[AllieBaba]

I don't do handguns either. I can't hit shit with them, except possibly my own foot.

But I'm dead on with a rifle.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

oh crap! MM lighten up, a friend of mine left town for 3 days to go to a wedding, while gone someone broke into her house stole the computers, some petty cash, some jewelry, the gun case was smashed open an a .38 caliber handgun stolen. Yep someday that registered .38 could posssibly kill someone. you are off base and over the line here. Unless Rodhishi typically has smally children around the gun is safe. I live in an all adult household so I'll keep mine in a place of my choosing.

That .38 was at least locked up. NOT in the bed. Big difference.

MY guns, if not on me or in my left boot, are all in a gun SAFE, not a glass case. Glass cases are for display, guns are not toys to display. They're not fine China for crying out loud. No gun professional ever recommends storing guns in a display case. Because it's not responsible enough.

The SAFE I keep my guns and ammo in is out of sight, and is bolted down to the floor. A burglar is probably going to find it, but he's not gonna waste any time with it.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

One additional item folks. You DON'T KNOW from the scenario presented that the perp is alone. He may have one or more buds following him in. They may have guns.

SHOOT and KILL the first fuck, then secure your premises, then call the police.

Hence the 12 guage as my weapon of choice.

That, and no PITA license or registration required.

Except in New York City, that I know of so far.

I don't do handguns either. I can't hit shit with them, except possibly my own foot.

But I'm dead on with a rifle.

I love the rifles and shotguns. With one of my rifles, I can regularly hit a dime at 100 yards and regularly do so.

 

[WillowTree]

Well, first I'd call police. Then I'd go after the person and want them to identify themselves and of course - drop the knife. If he/she did what I said, I'd have them sit on their hands until the police get there. If they made a threatening move towards me, I'd shoot in the shoulder or leg... depends on how fast it all happens.

No reason to immediately shoot. Most robbers will run for their lives and won't try any shit when they find out they've been found out.

All of this, so he can come back later? Or so he can find another victim? One of your neighbors? Perhaps your parents?

You're really going to call the police while a guy who broke into your house is coming up your stairs with a knife(?) in his hand? Who might even have a gun on him? Who might actually be carrying a gun, instead of a knife?

Even if you're able to hold him until police arrive, he's going to bail out the next business day. Going to be right back at it.

There's many reasons to immediately shoot.

I hope you're just a dog that barks but doesn't bite because if you actually really thought and acted like this, you'd be considered a danger to society. Seriously. You have no right to dispense justice, my friend - especially when it includes possible death or a life-threatening injury.

And to your questions: Yeah, exactly. I'd give him/her to police. Because I live in a society and I will play by its rules. That is what civilization is based on. IMHO.

so evidently you don't reside in a state with the "castle doctrine"?

 

[WillowTree]

oh crap! MM lighten up, a friend of mine left town for 3 days to go to a wedding, while gone someone broke into her house stole the computers, some petty cash, some jewelry, the gun case was smashed open an a .38 caliber handgun stolen. Yep someday that registered .38 could posssibly kill someone. you are off base and over the line here. Unless Rodhishi typically has smally children around the gun is safe. I live in an all adult household so I'll keep mine in a place of my choosing.

That .38 was at least locked up. NOT in the bed. Big difference.

MY guns, if not on me or in my left boot, are all in a gun SAFE, not a glass case. Glass cases are for display, guns are not toys to display. They're not fine China for crying out loud. No gun professional ever recommends storing guns in a display case. Because it's not responsible enough.

The SAFE I keep my guns and ammo in is out of sight, and is bolted down to the floor. A burglar is probably going to find it, but he's not gonna waste any time with it.

it wasn't a glass case. it was solid wood and locked.

 

[Care4all]

Very FEW people are actually trained compared to the amount of folks who own handguns.

Those who are, are trained that if you are going to shoot a person, put four slugs in the torso. Because it's the biggest target, and cannot move as fast as a leg, arm or head. That's all it is. Otherwise, you don't pull the trigger.

Deciding when to shoot or not is case by case. Shoot/don't shoot drills are handy little rehearsals but they're not real life.

You may, if you want to take the time, go back and re-read all my posts and find where I said ALWAYS shoot.

I said, ALWAYS shoot to KILL. Not always shoot.

See the difference?

YEP! Now I do see the difference MM, but I did not catch that initially! It is clearer now...

But even the ''always shoot to kill''...i still think that may be wrong instructions as well...if the other person can not kill you because they have just a knife and are 15 feet away and you have a gun pointed at them, you have the upper hand and if the other guy makes a move of any sort, you still have the upper hand and it is not necessary to kill another human being...you could shoot him in the leg or shoulder if necessary...especially if you have had training and shooting practice with your gun...the thigh has a major artery so you still could kill him, but it would not be intentionally as putting 4 bullets in him would be.

If you had no threat from a robber in your house, in most states that are not, pro gun wild west states like florida and texas...you could be subject to being prosecuted if you killed someone breaking in that did not try to kill you or have a weapon that could kill you, or that threatened you and said they were going to kill you...I believe?

Care... all I can say to you is, you better hope and pray this never happens to you, because from what you keep saying here, you're going to be the victim.

I have no idea how you can say "no threat" when someone has ALREADY BROKEN INTO YOUR HOME and is HEADED TOWARDS YOU WITH WEAPON IN HAND.... you don't see a THREAT THERE? Damn care.... sometimes you have to let go of the liberal touchy feely crap and get real. Just sayin'...

I still don't own a gun, though I have been meaning to get one, so I am dead meat regardless Pale!

I am just trying to imagine if I did own a gun, what I would do....and believe me, when I do get a gun, I will be getting training before ever using it....matt was in the service and has had some substantial training in how to use a gun but I am clueless.

At the River Festival in town this year matt had a gig singing there and we met the people that own the land next to the meadow across the way from us and they have a rod and gun club, shooting range and invited to teach me with free time at their club....how to use the gun I buy but they want matt to sing and play his guitar for their club guests occasionally, which is fine with us....so an even barter.

And I suppose, I still would end up dead because I am uncertain if I could use the gun at all, but pretending that i could, if I was NOT in any immediate danger of being killed by the perp, I would not kill the perp....I just couldn't do it without CERTAINTY that I or matt would be dead if I didn't....or even my cat would be dead if i didn't....but outside of that, i just can't see me being able to kill someone.

I can't even kill a spider or a Palmetto bug that I hate, without feeling pretty badly for doing it.... I kid you not...!

Though, i have no conscience with mosquitoes, it's automatic...slap and kill in one motion!

Care

 

[Midnight Marauder]

oh crap! MM lighten up, a friend of mine left town for 3 days to go to a wedding, while gone someone broke into her house stole the computers, some petty cash, some jewelry, the gun case was smashed open an a .38 caliber handgun stolen. Yep someday that registered .38 could posssibly kill someone. you are off base and over the line here. Unless Rodhishi typically has smally children around the gun is safe. I live in an all adult household so I'll keep mine in a place of my choosing.

That .38 was at least locked up. NOT in the bed. Big difference.

MY guns, if not on me or in my left boot, are all in a gun SAFE, not a glass case. Glass cases are for display, guns are not toys to display. They're not fine China for crying out loud. No gun professional ever recommends storing guns in a display case. Because it's not responsible enough.

The SAFE I keep my guns and ammo in is out of sight, and is bolted down to the floor. A burglar is probably going to find it, but he's not gonna waste any time with it.

it wasn't a glass case. it was solid wood and locked.

Well, a safe is more responsible. But I know for sure, now, that you're not intelligently trying to compare the locked, wooden gun case, with an idiot hiding their gun in their bed.

Right? Because there's no comparison. One displays at least some responsibility, one does not.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Though, i have no conscience with mosquitoes, it's automatic...slap and kill in one motion!

That's what good handgun training will give you, when it's an intruder. The remorse, if it comes, comes after the shooting though.

Is the home intruder not unlike a mosquito? It's there to assault you, take your property, and maybe even kill you with West Nile virus it might be carrying.

I know that I would feel bad later for killing someone if I ever had to do so. But I would also remember I had to do it. That person's actions got him shot. He broke into the wrong house, and that is a risk he accepted when deciding to invade people's homes. Just like the mosquito accepts the risk of getting whacked.

 

[Mr. H.]

I would at least yell "stop or I'll" before pulling the trigger.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

I would at least yell "stop or I'll" before pulling the trigger.

"Stop or I'll - BLAMMM!"

I have nothing to say to someone who has broken into my home, and is coming up the stairs with a weapon in his hand. My automag does all the talking in this scenario.

Then, I check to see if he has buddies, possibly armed.

 

[johnrocks]

The son of a bitch would have more holes in him than a slice of Swiss Cheese.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Why in the world would you turn the bedroom light on making yourself an easy target?

I'd tell them I had a gun, tell them to stop and if they didn't I'd shoot them, aiming for the leg. If I missed and hit the torso or head, so be it.

 

[Againsheila]

Tell them to drop the knife and then shoot them in the leg, if they come toward me after that, I would have no choice but to shoot to kill

I would never aim at a leg, I might miss, if I'm going to shoot at someone, I will shoot to kill.

 

[Againsheila]

I don't do handguns either. I can't hit shit with them, except possibly my own foot.

But I'm dead on with a rifle.

I went shooting a couple of weeks ago....the target was a paper Bin Ladin....I got him right in the heart with a sig 229...and here's the cool part....that's where I was aiming.

I'm thinking about getting a hand gun, I shot real well with that sig 229.

 

[Againsheila]

I really don't know if I would shoot him or not. I only know that if I did shoot, it would be shoot to kill and if I didn't shoot, I'd be climbing out the window and running for the neighbors.