Senate panel backs gay marriage ban

[Dr Grump]

That assumption would be incorrect.

Then why single out homos?

 

[dmp]

I actually think it was a pretty fair question. :halo:

of course 'you' would - you and he both have trouble with reality, common-sense, and good-judgement.

(shrug)

 

[jillian]

of course 'you' would - you and he both have trouble with reality, common-sense, and good-judgement.

(shrug)

Or maybe, in this particular instance, we have a clearer view of the situation because we have no horse in the race, so to speak.

 

[007]

Or maybe, in this particular instance, we have a clearer view of the situation because we have no horse in the race, so to speak.

Or maybe just, you and dr. grunt are trying to argue the virtues of butt banging against a board that's had their fill of it already. We're sick of trying to convince some liberal dough head that fags are NOT natural. WE know they're NOT, and we're tired as hell of you liberals coming in here every couple of months with the same bullshit.

I can tell you one thing for SURE, you are NOT going to change ANYONE'S opinion on here about fagness. We think it's wrong, and that's THAT!

If you want to condone butt fucking and the like between men, fine. Whatever. Go do it. But don't tell me it's NATURAL. It's NOT! And you will NEVER CHANGE MY MIND.

And one more thing, 'I AM THE VAST MAJORITY'!!!

 

[jillian]

Actually, was Powerman's question. But s'okay......

rave on.

Oh...and if you want to take the liberty of speaking to people like that, you might want to consider not negging them for their opinions. Then it's just bullying, IMO, because they can't respond in kind.

Cheers.

*Edit* And you're not the majority, vast or otherwise, cause most people couldn't care less about the issue.

 

[Mariner]

liberals frequently compare homopprobrium (as we decided, neutrally, to call it in an earlier discussion) with racism is that the arguments are so similar. Anti-gay-marriage arguments sound just like anti-miscegenation arguments of a century ago--society's fabric will be rent asunder if white and black people are permitted to have children. It was "obvious" back then that black people were inferior and it's "obvious" now that homosexual love is "not natural."

It's a lost cause, people. The culture is shifting under your feet, and you don't like it. But gay people aren't going away, and they're only going to become more accepted and more vocal over time. There will certainly be setbacks on the road to national gay marriage, but I have little doubt that it will eventually come to pass. In the meantime, though, Republican politicians will certainly use the issue to whip up their base. It worked in the last election, all too well.

If gay marriage is so bad for family values, how come Massachusetts has the lowest divorce rate in the country, which hasn't gone up since gays started marrying here... ? Perhaps gay marriage is good for family values--better that gay people be accepted by society, be able to put down roots, and contribute to their communities in peace. As for the next generation, well, I know several gay couples who have adopted children from abroad and are raising them beautifully. I can't imagine a better gift to the next generation.

If homosexuality is a choice, then presumably the heterosexuals here can easily imagine "choosing" homosexuality tomorrow? If that's not so easy to imagine, then who are you to question someone else's feeelings in this regard?

Mariner.

 

[007]

Actually, was Powerman's question. But s'okay......

rave on.

Oh...and if you want to take the liberty of speaking to people like that, you might want to consider not negging them for their opinions. Then it's just bullying, IMO, because they can't respond in kind.

Cheers.

Stop whinning because I've been here for two years and I've got a hell of a lot more rep power than you.

I neg liberals that talk psychobabble. That's what it's for. Don't like it, leave.

*Edit* And you're not the majority, vast or otherwise, cause most people couldn't care less about the issue.

Ummm no, you couldn't be more WRONG. States that have put the fag marriage issue up to a referendum vote, it was voted down in every instance, by a VAST MAJORITY. That only goes to show, when this fag issue is thrown in the face of the moral, NORMAL majority, they make their feelings known. So don't try and lie to me, or tell me anymore of your liberal stories. I know they're lies, the next guy knows they're lies, hell EVERYBODY knows they're lies.

Dismissed.

 

[jillian]

Yeah...I know that 11 states had anti-gay statues up for a vote so all the "good" folk will get out and vote. It's about "wedge issues"...get the folk riled on an issue and they'll mobilize. No one ever said the radical right doesn't mobilize. They're quite good at it, actually.

If that's the issue you care about, more power to ya. Let them listen to your phone calls, steal your freedoms....

but you'll be out there voting anti-gay.

I'm not the one whining, btw, cause I'm not the one who zaps people for disagreeing. Call it what you want. It's what you do. You want to yell? Cool... I can yell back, though it's not my favorite form of discussion. But I don't do it on unequal footing.

Don't like what someone says? Fair enough? Respond or don't as you feel like. But people think how they think...whether it's you and people who think like you, or people who think like me (looks to be closer to 2/3 the country right about now....).

Dunno about you, but for me, I don't look for hostility... this is for fun....and if everyone agreed with me, world would just be booooooring.

 

[Avatar4321]

avatar, AIDS can infect everybody, nobody is immune to it.
I will agree that many people are very immature when it comes to sex, however though, AIDS did not start with the homosexual community and they are also not to blame for it either.
Actually, according to the CDC, AIDS was first believed to have been transmitted to humans when hunters (that hunted monkeys and such) came into contact with infected blood. Considering that primates are 98% similar to humans, this is the most probable hypothesis.
Also, According to the CDC, they mention NOTHING about homosexuality contributing to AIDS.
avatar, you better rethink whether or not you could get AIDS because ignorant people like you are the most likely candidates.

Actually its easy to be immune from AIDS. Dont engage in premarital sex or do drugs.

Refrain from those activities are you are immune. There is nothing ignorant about that. The fact is AIDS is the easiest disease to prevent.

The fact is its you who is completely ignorant. Ignorant of the principles that can guarantee your safety.

 

[Avatar4321]

Do you REALLY give a shit?

If you're not going to be having sex with gay people then why are you so worried about the increased exposure to AIDS in the gay community?

Because unlike liberals us conservatives have compassion for our fellow man and have no desire to watch society be destroyed by people to ignorant to realize what keeps it together.

 

[sitarro]

If that's the issue you care about, more power to ya. Let them listen to your phone calls, steal your freedoms....

What is this suppose to mean? Do you honestly think that the goverment is listening to everyone's phone conversations? How exactly would they go about doing that? How many people would have to be employed by the goverment to even attempt this? And yet you pass this tidbit of bullshit on as if it was fact to other people without common sense. Gee, I wonder why the President"s approval ratings are so low. Obviously you are doing your part.

but you'll be out there voting anti-gay.

One issue voting is what Dimocrats are known for. This would also be a stretching of interpretation that is also what your kind specialize in.

But people think how they think...whether it's you and people who think like you, or people who think like me (looks to be closer to 2/3 the country right about now....).

With an uninformed population or worse a lied to population(by the mass media, the entertainment industry, no-little professors, etc.) along with manipulative poll questions, is there any surprise that they can create the polls they want to manipulate people like you even more?

 

[sitarro]

Here you are kids, I know that reading thing is difficult for you guys(YOU know who I'm speaking to)but try anyway, there will be a pop quiz later.

http://www.888webtoday.com/jamiel3.html

here are a few of the quotes I thought you would try to ignore....

Here is one more angle. My being of a different ethnic background from most of those around me hurts no one, nor does it hurt society as a whole, but homosexual sex does. These are medical statistics. If you are a homosexual and these statistics don't hold true for you, remember that these are averages. Some may not apply to your life.

50% of homosexuals had their first same-sex experience with an adult by the age of 14 (SIGMA Project 1992). Some may say about this statistic that the adult individuals were heterosexual men; I beg to differ, even if a man is married, if the man has sex with another man he has committed a homosexual act, and he is therefore homosexual until he ceases his behavior.

The average homosexual has 50 partners per year, and 79% of the time with strangers (USA Today 1984)

The average life span of an American male is 74 years, but the average life span of the homosexual male is 41 years., and 44 years for lesbians (CRM 1996).

91% of American AIDS cases have been traced to homosexual sex, intravenous drug use, or some combination of the two (Journal of the American Medical Assoc.).

If the homosexual life-style was natural, normal, and a civil right, it would not cause death, disease, and largely contribute to the one of the most serious epidemics the world has ever seen.

Homosexual marriage is not a civil right. A homosexual man has every right that I do. He can marry a woman; so can I; I can't marry a man; neither can he.

Not only is traditional marriage a benefit to society, but God also instituted it. It has been between a man and a woman since the beginning of time. There is no reason, nor can we change what marriage is. Even though the state of Vermont, where I am working with STARS to help overturn homosexual marriage, has redefined marriage, marriage only can, and always will be between a man and a woman!

It is not government's place to, in the name of civil rights, to condone sexual choices that harm society as a whole, or to pass laws contrary to the laws of God, upon which this country was founded.

Who will be the first idiot to try to dispute the documented facts stated in this editorial?

 

[Dr Grump]

Or maybe just, you and dr. grunt are trying to argue the virtues of butt banging against a board that's had their fill of it already. We're sick of trying to convince some liberal dough head that fags are NOT natural. WE know they're NOT, and we're tired as hell of you liberals coming in here every couple of months with the same bullshit.

I can tell you one thing for SURE, you are NOT going to change ANYONE'S opinion on here about fagness. We think it's wrong, and that's THAT!

If you want to condone butt fucking and the like between men, fine. Whatever. Go do it. But don't tell me it's NATURAL. It's NOT! And you will NEVER CHANGE MY MIND.

And one more thing, 'I AM THE VAST MAJORITY'!!!

Well Pasty Rider if you have had your fill, why post here? I mean, I ain't telling you what to do, but I'd never post on a board on a subject that has been done to death and holds no interest for me. That's just stupid....hhhmmmm..

Oh, as for changing anybody's mind, who in their right mind thinks they are gonna do that? Why don't you just change this whole board to "Neocons and conservatives only"? There are many ways to disagree, but yelling and screaming never got anybody anywhere in my experience.

Finally. Being the vast majority. So what? You ever heard of the expression the "Tyranny of the majority"?

 

[Dr Grump]

Here you are kids, I know that reading thing is difficult for you guys(YOU know who I'm speaking to)but try anyway, there will be a pop quiz later.

http://www.888webtoday.com/jamiel3.html

here are a few of the quotes I thought you would try to ignore....
Here is one more angle. My being of a different ethnic background from most of those around me hurts no one, nor does it hurt society as a whole, but homosexual sex does. These are medical statistics. If you are a homosexual and these statistics don't hold true for you, remember that these are averages. Some may not apply to your life.

50% of homosexuals had their first same-sex experience with an adult by the age of 14 (SIGMA Project 1992). Some may say about this statistic that the adult individuals were heterosexual men; I beg to differ, even if a man is married, if the man has sex with another man he has committed a homosexual act, and he is therefore homosexual until he ceases his behavior.

The average homosexual has 50 partners per year, and 79% of the time with strangers (USA Today 1984)
The average life span of an American male is 74 years, but the average life span of the homosexual male is 41 years., and 44 years for lesbians (CRM 1996).
91% of American AIDS cases have been traced to homosexual sex, intravenous drug use, or some combination of the two (Journal of the American Medical Assoc.).
If the homosexual life-style was natural, normal, and a civil right, it would not cause death, disease, and largely contribute to the one of the most serious epidemics the world has ever seen.
Homosexual marriage is not a civil right. A homosexual man has every right that I do. He can marry a woman; so can I; I can't marry a man; neither can he.
Not only is traditional marriage a benefit to society, but God also instituted it. It has been between a man and a woman since the beginning of time. There is no reason, nor can we change what marriage is. Even though the state of Vermont, where I am working with STARS to help overturn homosexual marriage, has redefined marriage, marriage only can, and always will be between a man and a woman!
It is not government's place to, in the name of civil rights, to condone sexual choices that harm society as a whole, or to pass laws contrary to the laws of God, upon which this country was founded.
Who will be the first idiot to try to dispute the documented facts stated in this editorial?

More about webtoday: Conservative News and Christian Daily News...Great, unbiased site Sitarro!

 

[sitarro]

More about webtoday: Conservative News and Christian Daily News...Great, unbiased site Sitarro!

Typical gimp,

The stats are linked to such biased people as The Journal of American Medical Association.......You are a close minded fool and I am done with you asshat.

 

[Dr Grump]

Typical gimp,

The stats are linked to such biased people as The Journal of American Medical Association.......You are a close minded fool and I am done with you asshat.

Ok..OK...I'll take you post seriously. Let's have a serious look at it Sitty.
What have we got: We've got this:

50% of homosexuals had their first same-sex experience with an adult by the age of 14 (SIGMA Project 1992).

OH MY GOD!! WHAT CAN THIS MEAN!! Er....nothing. Next we have:

(USA Today 1984)

Wow! Super compelling evidence! An alleged quote from a 22 year old article (?) in a paper with no evidence to back it up. Next is:

The average life span of an American male is 74 years, but the average life span of the homosexual male is 41 years., and 44 years for lesbians (CRM 1996).

Who or what are CRM? Where did they get their stats from? Department of health (at Federal or State level?)? Death certificates? Funeral homes?


91% of American AIDS cases have been traced to homosexual sex, intravenous drug use, or some combination of the two (Journal of the American Medical Assoc.).

Cool. Where is this research? What was the sample taken of this research? 100 gay men and 100 intravenous drug users? 1000? 10,000?

Someone's an asshat around here all right...and it ain't me...
Also, as for being close-minded, er, I'm the guy who has a live-and-let-live kinda belief, you on the other hand (IOW, go and look up the term "close-minded")

 

[sitarro]

Ok..OK...I'll take you post seriously. Let's have a serious look at it Sitty.
What have we got: We've got this:

50% of homosexuals had their first same-sex experience with an adult by the age of 14 (SIGMA Project 1992).

OH MY GOD!! WHAT CAN THIS MEAN!! Er....nothing. Next we have:

(USA Today 1984)

Wow! Super compelling evidence! An alleged quote from a 22 year old article (?) in a paper with no evidence to back it up. Next is:

The average life span of an American male is 74 years, but the average life span of the homosexual male is 41 years., and 44 years for lesbians (CRM 1996).

Who or what are CRM? Where did they get their stats from? Department of health (at Federal or State level?)? Death certificates? Funeral homes?


91% of American AIDS cases have been traced to homosexual sex, intravenous drug use, or some combination of the two (Journal of the American Medical Assoc.).

Cool. Where is this research? What was the sample taken of this research? 100 gay men and 100 intravenous drug users? 1000? 10,000?

Someone's an asshat around here all right...and it ain't me...
Also, as for being close-minded, er, I'm the guy who has a live-and-let-live kinda belief, you on the other hand (IOW, go and look up the term "close-minded")

Hey Grump,

Don't let anybody call you a dumbass or an arrogant, know nothing, dimwit because you aren't......really......now a horse's ass, yea maybe, but none of that other shit...... :fu2:

 

[cslaughlin13]

actually sitarro, he is right, the artice is six years old now, if you are going to try to use facts, at least make sure they have occurred in the last five years, or maybe you are too old, grandpa, to remember your basic techniques of research

 

[dmp]

More about webtoday: Conservative News and Christian Daily News...Great, unbiased site Sitarro!

pssssssssst....hey? read very closely - the article sited sources for it's data. See how that works? Somebody does research, and somebody else reports it.

neat huh?

 

[Mariner]

I'll ask my question again, since I think it got missed earlier--if you're sure that homosexuality is a choice, then presumably you could choose to live a homosexual lifestyle beginning tomorrow?

If you can't imagine making such a choice, then how can you judge gay people for feeling just as you do?

The difference between homosexuality and, say, bestiality or pedophilia, is a difference of power. Consenting adults choosing their own partners are equal in power--animals and children are not. So it's ridiculous to portray acceptance of homosexuality as a step down a slippery slope.

As for all the "destroying society" stuff, it's equally ridiculous. Gay people have contributed immensely to society in every arena. I know dozens of gay people, nearly all of whom are healthy, in committed relationships, paying their taxes, and enjoying family and community. I'm having trouble seeing how these people are destroying society; quite the contrary, they seem to be building it.

Massachusetts society doesn't seem to be suffering from the existence of happily married gay couples. We still have the lowest divorce rate in the country.

Mariner.