Politicians, Lying and the American People...

[Lumpy 1]

Without going into details, name calling, even links because we all know it's true.

Do we just expect our politicians to lie to us, mainly when their running for office but also in general?

I suppose it's always been this way but is seems it's the severity of the lie that gets them in trouble enough, that the American people finally reject them.

A recent example , of course, you have Bill Clinton who, no doubt lied to the American people and to the courts and yet a greater percentage of the American people rallied around him.

Another example, John Ensign the Senator from Nevada had an affair, admitted to it and is rejected. In this case no severity at all..

Ah......fickle putts...

 

[Lumpy 1]

Without going into details, name calling, even links because we all know it's true.

Do we just expect our politicians to lie to us, mainly when their running for office but also in general?

I suppose it's always been this way but is seems it's the severity of the lie that gets them in trouble enough, that the American people finally reject them.

A recent example , of course, you have Bill Clinton who, no doubt lied to the American people and to the courts and yet a greater percentage of the American people rallied around him.

Another example, John Ensign the Senator from Nevada had an affair, admitted to it and is rejected. In this case no severity at all..

Ah......fickle putts...

Well, I guess I'll just sweep this one under the carpet...

 

[RodISHI]

I have considered this every time I see a post here that is eluding "well they did it". Like it's okay everyone does it, no problem. I have a problem with our government leaders lying. Everyone should have a problem with that no matter what side of the fence they lean towards.

 

[uptownlivin90]

As long as they're not lying, I truly don't care. I'm not the kind of person that get's offended by personal scandals, just by people who lie about them to cover them up. For instance I don't care if Clinton get's a blow job in the office, not my business. Any man that does care is gay. I don't care if Ensign cheats on his wife, that's their business. Do you do your job, that's what I care about. If you lie about something related to what I elected you to do, Hell yeah your gone.

To answer your question though, uh yeah we SHOULD expect our politicians to lie to us, all of them. Because 93% of them ARE liars. There's a few straight talkers, Ron Paul, Tim Ryan, Dennis Kucinich, Congress woman Kapture. I don't neccesarily agree with all of em but there's a few out there that may have some stuff wrong but they're HONEST at least.

 

[Lumpy 1]

As long as they're not lying, I truly don't care. I'm not the kind of person that get's offended by personal scandals, just by people who lie about them to cover them up. For instance I don't care if Clinton get's a blow job in the office, not my business. Any man that does care is gay. I don't care if Ensign cheats on his wife, that's their business. Do you do your job, that's what I care about. If you lie about something related to what I elected you to do, Hell yeah your gone.

To answer your question though, uh yeah we SHOULD expect our politicians to lie to us, all of them. Because 93% of them ARE liars. There's a few straight talkers, Ron Paul, Tim Ryan, Dennis Kucinich, Congress woman Kapture. I don't neccesarily agree with all of em but there's a few out there that may have some stuff wrong but they're HONEST at least.

I wonder if it's because most of the politicians are lawyers and trained to deceive and see shades of truth.

 

[uptownlivin90]

My favorite Honest Politicians:

Marcy Kaptur (D-OH)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMCZ8JeEpUw]YouTube - WALLSTREET BAILOUT America is going down the toilet[/ame]
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmp2XHgXkvU&feature=related]YouTube - Congresswoman Marcy Kaptur on NAFTA and elites 4/6/08[/ame]

Tim Ryan (D-OH)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePHJ5fWUgFQ]YouTube - Democrat Tim Ryan kicks Bush's ass[/ame]

Ron Paul (R-TX)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4kxTkhwR_Q]YouTube - Ron Paul 0wnz the Federal Reserve[/ame]

Dennis Kucinich (D-OH)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAGzLfmV4Ks]YouTube - Kucinich: Bailout 'Driven by Fear Not Fact'[/ame]

Russ Feingold (D-WI)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duS9YQCIRIg]YouTube - Sen. Feingold on the misuse of the Patriot Act[/ame]

I tend to think that midwestern politicians are more honest especially from Ohio alot of politicians for Ohio are actually concerned about the people they represent.

 

[uptownlivin90]

As long as they're not lying, I truly don't care. I'm not the kind of person that get's offended by personal scandals, just by people who lie about them to cover them up. For instance I don't care if Clinton get's a blow job in the office, not my business. Any man that does care is gay. I don't care if Ensign cheats on his wife, that's their business. Do you do your job, that's what I care about. If you lie about something related to what I elected you to do, Hell yeah your gone.

To answer your question though, uh yeah we SHOULD expect our politicians to lie to us, all of them. Because 93% of them ARE liars. There's a few straight talkers, Ron Paul, Tim Ryan, Dennis Kucinich, Congress woman Kapture. I don't neccesarily agree with all of em but there's a few out there that may have some stuff wrong but they're HONEST at least.

I wonder if it's because most of the politicians are lawyers and trained to deceive and see shades of truth.

Could be, but there's also a serious lack of accountability when it comes to lying in the political arena. These guys are not afraid of lying to the American people because they have gauranteed corporate lobbying jobs waiting for them if they get kicked out, as long as they work for the interests of the folks that fund their campaign and not for the interest fo the American people. This is why they really just don't seem to care who or what sees them. They have no fear. Of course this could be changed... it's just going to have to take people voting in politicians with integrity and taking off their partisan blindfolds.

 

[Lumpy 1]

As long as they're not lying, I truly don't care. I'm not the kind of person that get's offended by personal scandals, just by people who lie about them to cover them up. For instance I don't care if Clinton get's a blow job in the office, not my business. Any man that does care is gay. I don't care if Ensign cheats on his wife, that's their business. Do you do your job, that's what I care about. If you lie about something related to what I elected you to do, Hell yeah your gone.

To answer your question though, uh yeah we SHOULD expect our politicians to lie to us, all of them. Because 93% of them ARE liars. There's a few straight talkers, Ron Paul, Tim Ryan, Dennis Kucinich, Congress woman Kapture. I don't neccesarily agree with all of em but there's a few out there that may have some stuff wrong but they're HONEST at least.

I wonder if it's because most of the politicians are lawyers and trained to deceive and see shades of truth.

Could be, but there's also a serious lack of accountability when it comes to lying in the political arena. These guys are not afraid of lying to the American people because they have gauranteed corporate lobbying jobs waiting for them if they get kicked out, as long as they work for the interests of the folks that fund their campaign and not for the interest fo the American people. This is why they really just don't seem to care who or what sees them. They have no fear. Of course this could be changed... it's just going to have to take people voting in politicians with integrity and taking off their partisan blindfolds.

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

 

[California Girl]

Lying to prove a point or to get the political advantage has always existed. I think a lot of the problem now is that there are so many lies that the lies become the truth.

Our politicians - both sides - no longer recognize the difference between lies and truth, they lie to get their own point across and we have no standards of honesty - we allow our politicians to lie to us and we reward them for it.

If we want to really change things, we should all - left, right and indies - stop electing idiots.

 

[Si modo]

Lying to prove a point or to get the political advantage has always existed. I think a lot of the problem now is that there are so many lies that the lies become the truth.

Our politicians - both sides - no longer recognize the difference between lies and truth, they lie to get their own point across and we have no standards of honesty - we allow our politicians to lie to us and we reward them for it.

If we want to really change things, we should all - left, right and indies - stop electing idiots.

Unfortunately, at this point I believe we need even 'babier' steps than that. We the People need to stop having a team sport mentality when it comes to politics.

Somehow, no matter how egregious the actions of a team member are, too many defend it because it's by their team.

 

[uptownlivin90]

I wonder if it's because most of the politicians are lawyers and trained to deceive and see shades of truth.

Could be, but there's also a serious lack of accountability when it comes to lying in the political arena. These guys are not afraid of lying to the American people because they have gauranteed corporate lobbying jobs waiting for them if they get kicked out, as long as they work for the interests of the folks that fund their campaign and not for the interest fo the American people. This is why they really just don't seem to care who or what sees them. They have no fear. Of course this could be changed... it's just going to have to take people voting in politicians with integrity and taking off their partisan blindfolds.

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

 

[California Girl]

Could be, but there's also a serious lack of accountability when it comes to lying in the political arena. These guys are not afraid of lying to the American people because they have gauranteed corporate lobbying jobs waiting for them if they get kicked out, as long as they work for the interests of the folks that fund their campaign and not for the interest fo the American people. This is why they really just don't seem to care who or what sees them. They have no fear. Of course this could be changed... it's just going to have to take people voting in politicians with integrity and taking off their partisan blindfolds.

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

Just wondering who made you the voice of the American people?

 

[Lumpy 1]

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

Just wondering who made you the voice of the American people?

Why Cali maiden, I think you'd pull on Superman' s cape, just to tick him off..?

 

[Si modo]

Could be, but there's also a serious lack of accountability when it comes to lying in the political arena. These guys are not afraid of lying to the American people because they have gauranteed corporate lobbying jobs waiting for them if they get kicked out, as long as they work for the interests of the folks that fund their campaign and not for the interest fo the American people. This is why they really just don't seem to care who or what sees them. They have no fear. Of course this could be changed... it's just going to have to take people voting in politicians with integrity and taking off their partisan blindfolds.

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

So, as long as the nanny is making sure we have some fundamental entitlements and as long as we are comfy with those we should have no interest in who has power over us?

 

[California Girl]

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

Just wondering who made you the voice of the American people?

Why Cali maiden, I think you'd pull on Superman' s cape, just to tick him off..?

Why, yes, I certainly do. My bad. I shall slap my own hand and take my cookie away.



*Rubs hand where she slapped it and sobs cuz she wants a cookie.*

 

[uptownlivin90]

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

Just wondering who made you the voice of the American people?

See my point exactly. This wasn't even a damn issue that anyone had any expressed disagreement on. I state my opinion, as an American I have the right to do so. All of a sudden I'm speaking for all Americans. I speak for my damn self, thank you. And for nobody else.

 

[uptownlivin90]

All truth and yet how do you fight pessimism, partisanship and the peanuts they throw out to keep people in line? Possibly the doom of a complete breakdown of government is the only answer.

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

So, as long as the nanny is making sure we have some fundamental entitlements and as long as we are comfy with those we should have no interest in who has power over us?

No. Not what I said at all. My point is we as Americans don't have a clue what we want anymore. We are a spend spend spend, credit card loving society and then wonder why we have a deficit that's not even a number, and blame everyone else for it but ourselves. Politicians lie because they can get away with it. They can get away with it because people are divided. People are divided because they believe stupid lies about other people that don't look like them and conspiracy theories about different ethnic groups trying to take over the government to get some sort of happy revenge for a past wrong commited hundreds of years ago. The only way we can fix this nation through democratic processes is unity. In my opinion poverty, people swimming up to their eyeballs in debt, people struggling to pay mortgages isn't an environment conducive to unity it creates more fear and division. So the solution to this is to the best we can educate people on how to take responsability for themselves and suceed. Really if the politicians won't "change" America then the rest of us have to as individuals... that's all I'm saying. (And we've gotta find a way to do it without the whole bloody revolution thing).

 

[Lumpy 1]

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

Just wondering who made you the voice of the American people?

See my point exactly. This wasn't even a damn issue that anyone had any expressed disagreement on. I state my opinion, as an American I have the right to do so. All of a sudden I'm speaking for all Americans. I speak for my damn self, thank you. And for nobody else.

Well, I think your wrong there buddy. I think that many would agree with you but not be able to put it so eloquently. I don't know the answer, you basically say take baby steps to the goal, I kinda say hit rock bottom and start over again. The final aspirations are the same.

 

[Si modo]

Get everything written down on paper, and look at the fine print. I don't pay much attention to the media either. Personally I think eventually people will just start to say enough is enough and stop falling for the titles that's been placed on them. No, I don't think there's a need for a breakdown of government or a violent bloody revolution. People aren't interested in that at all. All people in this nation really want is to have the opportunity to work hard and provide for their families living a comfortable life. Our best way of "going up against the establishment" is not breaking it down by force, but it's fighting to achieve just that, a good life for ourselves. I mean what if we raise a generation of folks that are personal debt free, not caught up in credit and mortgage schemes, well-educated but not drowning in college loans, and each had three kids and a dog. The state of the republic would be that much better (well... I mean you get the point). So if we can just be smart about how we conduct ourselves as Americans eventually the barriers will be broken and we'll all be just that... Americans. Then all the dirty politicians are in serious f-ing trouble.

So, as long as the nanny is making sure we have some fundamental entitlements and as long as we are comfy with those we should have no interest in who has power over us?

No. Not what I said at all. My point is we as Americans don't have a clue what we want anymore. We are a spend spend spend, credit card loving society and then wonder why we have a deficit that's not even a number, and blame everyone else for it but ourselves. Politicians lie because they can get away with it. They can get away with it because people are divided. People are divided because they believe stupid lies about other people that don't look like them and conspiracy theories about different ethnic groups trying to take over the government to get some sort of happy revenge for a past wrong commited hundreds of years ago. The only way we can fix this nation through democratic processes is unity. In my opinion poverty, people swimming up to their eyeballs in debt, people struggling to pay mortgages isn't an environment conducive to unity it creates more fear and division. So the solution to this is to the best we can educate people on how to take responsability for themselves and suceed. Really if the politicians won't "change" America then the rest of us have to as individuals... that's all I'm saying. (And we've gotta find a way to do it without the whole bloody revolution thing).

Forgive me for not getting your gist, but you're saying the reasons politicians lie is because they know that they can get away with it. On that I agree, for the most part. Then you go on to say that they can get away with it because we are divided so the solution to demanding their accountability is to unite. I can agree that we are divided, but I cannot understand how you conclude that this coming together of two groups - one that demands accountability of government and the other defending their team players in power regardless of their actions - is going to make politicians become accountable.

 

[Lumpy 1]

Just wondering who made you the voice of the American people?

Why Cali maiden, I think you'd pull on Superman' s cape, just to tick him off..?

Why, yes, I certainly do. My bad. I shall slap my own hand and take my cookie away.



*Rubs hand where she slapped it and sobs cuz she wants a cookie.*

Eat the damn cookie, precocious maiden and let the arrows fly..