Petreus is out of line

[G.T.]

I think of it as more like "Stop being morons and acting like the stupid jackassess that we are fighing."

And I agree with the notion, whole-heartedly. Problem is, coming from our General it makes our position look weak no matter what.

I don't see how it makes us look weak. I think it makes the pastor look more like the idiot that he is.

I would only be concerned with it coming from a General that it might appear like official policy or something. I expect him to be called to an emergency meeting with Obama pretty soon.

It's like: "Why shouldn't Obama address the Birth Certificate hysteria?"

He'll be lending it credence.

 

[manifold]

I mean, what is the guise our Red White and Blue fights under? Defending the Constitution?

I don't support the 9/11 burning of the Quran; however, opposing it on the grounds that it will create more Terrorists is an absolute contradiction to the Mission of our Armed forces.

Yes, it will put those who Volunteered to Defend the Constitution in presumably more danger. But these are the very hard-line ideals they're doing it for........The Freedom to think and express how you feel, no matter how distasteful or who doesn't like it. I think the General is out of line on this one.

So you're saying that Patreus (who actually risks his life to defend our nation) is not entitled to speak freely?

Fuck that, GT. He has earned the right - far more than most of us have.

Oh, you mean like Gen. McChrystal had earned the right to speak freely?

 

[LibocalypseNow]

By making such a big deal out of this completely insignificant issue,he's the one who has put our troops more at risk. Ironic and sad no?

 

[Ozmar]

I mean, what is the guise our Red White and Blue fights under? Defending the Constitution?

I don't support the 9/11 burning of the Quran; however, opposing it on the grounds that it will create more Terrorists is an absolute contradiction to the Mission of our Armed forces.

Yes, it will put those who Volunteered to Defend the Constitution in presumably more danger. But these are the very hard-line ideals they're doing it for........The Freedom to think and express how you feel, no matter how distasteful or who doesn't like it. I think the General is out of line on this one.

Well it's a good thing we're not paid to think.

 

[G.T.]

I mean, what is the guise our Red White and Blue fights under? Defending the Constitution?

I don't support the 9/11 burning of the Quran; however, opposing it on the grounds that it will create more Terrorists is an absolute contradiction to the Mission of our Armed forces.

Yes, it will put those who Volunteered to Defend the Constitution in presumably more danger. But these are the very hard-line ideals they're doing it for........The Freedom to think and express how you feel, no matter how distasteful or who doesn't like it. I think the General is out of line on this one.

Well it's a good thing we're not paid to think.

Any chance you're any good at comedy? No? Didn't think so.

 

[bodecea]

the problem folks is the MSM will see to it, this will be NEWS, you will see it on every channel, andfor a while. Its tailor made for them, it will validate their all religious people are nuts outlook.

Just like the danish cartoons etc. ,nothing today occurs in a vacuum, especially a media one, this will be inflated, worldwide and I have say, becasue of that fact, yes to an extent it could harm our general cause in Afghanistan. ..my 2 cents. ( I think the cause is lost and have for a while but hey)...

This is why the church is doing it.

 

[MaggieMae]

an officer's ultimate obligation is to protect the men and women for which he is responsible. i can't fault him for doing that, nor do i think he's out of line.

The Ultimate Obligation is to Defend the Constitution.

I don't want Americans to stop practicing their rights on account of Murderous Psychos. Do you?

There was a Supreme Court case in 1969 (Tinker v. Des Moines School Disrict) in which the Tinker teenagers (that's not a joke) wore black armbands to school as a protest of the Vietnam war. Both were suspended, and the high court ruled that their actions were "symbolic" and protected by the free speech clause of the First Amendment. HOWEVER, in the court's decision, it went on to exclude any student speech that would "materially and substantially disrupt the classroom."

Burning the Quran would probably create "material and substantial disruption" for the generals trying to fight the bad guys in Afghanistan (and elsewhere), in my opinion.

 

[G.T.]

the problem folks is the MSM will see to it, this will be NEWS, you will see it on every channel, andfor a while. Its tailor made for them, it will validate their all religious people are nuts outlook.

Just like the danish cartoons etc. ,nothing today occurs in a vacuum, especially a media one, this will be inflated, worldwide and I have say, becasue of that fact, yes to an extent it could harm our general cause in Afghanistan. ..my 2 cents. ( I think the cause is lost and have for a while but hey)...

This is why the church is doing it.

And they're scumbags for:

A: blaming an entire Religion on 9/11.
B: Putting more "rage" into the Terrorists' anti US Propoganda.

I still think that a General should be more-so defending the loony American Church's right to do so than he should be proclaiming publicly that practicing Free American Speech "helps" the enemy. (I know, in reality, they'll use anything. But this is how evil operates and you either take the bull by the horns or leave the fucking rodeo).

 

[Ozmar]

an officer's ultimate obligation is to protect the men and women for which he is responsible. i can't fault him for doing that, nor do i think he's out of line.

The Ultimate Obligation is to Defend the Constitution.

I don't want Americans to stop practicing their rights on account of Murderous Psychos. Do you?

There was a Supreme Court case in 1969 (Tinker v. Des Moines School Disrict) in which the Tinker teenagers (that's not a joke) wore black armbands to school as a protest of the Vietnam war. Both were suspended, and the high court ruled that their actions were "symbolic" and protected by the free speech clause of the First Amendment. HOWEVER, in the court's decision, it went on to exclude any student speech that would "materially and substantially disrupt the classroom."

Burning the Quran would probably create "material and substantial disruption" for the generals trying to fight the bad guys in Afghanistan (and elsewhere), in my opinion.

But would it create a "material and substantial disruption" to the running of the homeland? We can't curtail our free speech based on what may or may not offend people overseas.

 

[manifold]

Burning the Quran would probably create "material and substantial disruption" for the generals trying to fight the bad guys in Afghanistan (and elsewhere), in my opinion.

Abject Failure!

How your brain even knows to tell your lungs to breath is a mystery.

 

[MaggieMae]

He shouldn't have commented on it. He refused to comment on the Mosque on Ground Zero issue and he should have done the same on this. If a couple of kooks burning some Korans in some tiny Church no one's ever heard of influences the War in Afghanistan then that War is lost for sure. The guy in charge over there shouldn't have even commented on this stupid issue. He's helped make it a bigger deal than it actually is. If these few kooks can hurt soldiers over there,it's time to come home. That thing is definitely over.

Come home? Gee, whatever happened to the NUKE ALL MUSLIMS mantra of just a few years ago? It's amazing how a different war, different president, changes attitudes.

 

[G.T.]

an officer's ultimate obligation is to protect the men and women for which he is responsible. i can't fault him for doing that, nor do i think he's out of line.

The Ultimate Obligation is to Defend the Constitution.

I don't want Americans to stop practicing their rights on account of Murderous Psychos. Do you?

There was a Supreme Court case in 1969 (Tinker v. Des Moines School Disrict) in which the Tinker teenagers (that's not a joke) wore black armbands to school as a protest of the Vietnam war. Both were suspended, and the high court ruled that their actions were "symbolic" and protected by the free speech clause of the First Amendment. HOWEVER, in the court's decision, it went on to exclude any student speech that would "materially and substantially disrupt the classroom."

Burning the Quran would probably create "material and substantial disruption" for the generals trying to fight the bad guys in Afghanistan (and elsewhere), in my opinion.

I agree that it will.............and although we vehemently disagree with the Church's decision to do so, I think that our damn Generals stating as much conveys a weakness.....it comes off like we're collectively living in fear of Terrorists' abilities to recruit and destroy and should act accordingly. I beg to differ.

 

[konradv]

Yea because if those loons don't burn those Korans,the brutal Muslim Terrorists who gleefully saw peoples' heads off,will suddenly fall in love with us. Seriously,Petraeus is not only out of line but he's also incredibly f*cking silly.

It's not about the terrorists per se, but about not creating new ones. Film of the burning will be spread all over the world and "prove" the Islamists' claim that the West is out to destroy. Sure they have the right, but I thought we were supposed to be better than that.

 

[MaggieMae]

The Ultimate Obligation is to Defend the Constitution.

I don't want Americans to stop practicing their rights on account of Murderous Psychos. Do you?

I did not read what Petreus said exactly. I know that he said that burning the Koran puts the lives of the soldiers in the Middle East more at risk. Did he make any kind of statement about whether or not the church should be allowed to burn the Koran or did he just state that doing so was not good for the war effort?

Personally, I have no problem with him making a statement that burning the Koran makes life harder for the troops. I am opposed to the burning myself, but believe the church has a right to be stupid and unamerican if it so chooses. I must say if I had been a member of that church, I would not be one today.

The church has every right to burn Korans. However, if they are trying to win people to Christ (isn't that supposed to be the mission of every church?) I think that they are going about this the wrong way.

Immie

He advised it would hurt the war efforts..........and in my opinion, him saying that (in and of itself) hurt the war efforts. (get what I mean?).

If America fights for freedom, it shouldn't be fearful of oppression.

The problem is that the US military is over there trying to win the hearts and minds of those Afghan Muslims who want peace, and get rid of those who don't. Something like this will simply alienate them all. It's already sending the loud statement across the globe that the extremists who believe ALL Muslims are evil is the common belief of all Americans (and of the US government and its military).

 

[LibocalypseNow]

The War in Afghanistan is and should be over. If a couple of insignificant loons can influence the direction of an entire War,then you know it's all over. Petraeus f*cked up very badly on this one. By making such a big deal out of nothing he has become the one who has put our troops in more danger. It doesn't matter though. The fact he's panicking over this stuff tells the real story. Time to bring the kids home.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

"Hearts and Minds! Hearts and Minds!" Blah Blah Blah! We don't belong there and it's time to get the H*ll out. End of story.

 

[gautama]

I mean, what is the guise our Red White and Blue fights under? Defending the Constitution?

I don't support the 9/11 burning of the Quran; however, opposing it on the grounds that it will create more Terrorists is an absolute contradiction to the Mission of our Armed forces.

Yes, it will put those who Volunteered to Defend the Constitution in presumably more danger. But these are the very hard-line ideals they're doing it for........The Freedom to think and express how you feel, no matter how distasteful or who doesn't like it. I think the General is out of line on this one.

I find book burning distasteful. Sure they have the right, just as I have the right to call them unAmerican idiots.

I'm really torn on this one.

Didn't think I would sit on the fence on ANY issue.

But, this one gets me.

Wouldn't it be a nice GESTURE to burn Mein Kampf.... but, not to ERADICATE it from general readership ?

It is critically important to have DANGEROUS SHIT examined and analyzed, hence ERADICATION is out of the question.

The same goes for ANY book.

That's the same way I feel towards the FUCKING QUR'AN.

Howzabout a GESTURE of burning that PIECE OF CRAP ?

I am for that.

But .... that GESTURE endangering our troops ?????

That's a toughie.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

This is absurd for a general to be worried about a few book burners. Maybe he should be informing the Afghanis of our constitution and our rights to free speech. People exercise their rights to do crappy weird things everyday.

 

[G.T.]

I still disagree with International Burn a Quran day, and think the idea is disgusting, but I 110% agree with this comment by the Pastor today:

"We think it's time to turn the tables, and instead of possibly blaming us for what could happen, we put the blame where it belongs — on the people who would do it," he said. "And maybe instead of addressing us, we should address radical Islam and send a very clear warning that they are not to retaliate in any form."

 

[MaggieMae]

I know how to differentiate that. I know that he's not attempting to pose that they HAVE NO RIGHT. I'm just saying that I think that a man in a leadership position in fighting this war on terrorism is coming off like we do not have the courage of our convictions, as far as freedom of speech goes, and instead is coming off like "guys, please don't piss of these crazies who are already trying to kill us because they might want to kill us."

I think of it as more like "Stop being morons and acting like the stupid jackassess that we are fighing."

And I agree with the notion, whole-heartedly. Problem is, coming from our General it makes our position look weak no matter what.

I don't think so at all. It shows respect for their religion. The Quran isn't "just a book."