Oh My God--DNC is attacking the American Populace in new add regarding health bill

[oreo]

There is one thing I know about all Americans. They will not tolerate a government attack on private citizens--regardless of party affiliation. It's like you can say anything you want to about one of your relatives--but by golly no one else better.

In my 56 years I have NEVER seen one political party attack the citizens of this country. THIS IS A FIRST. It shows the character of this current administration, congress & the entire DNC with their Chicago style Thug tactics. They are purposely trying to pit one American against another. It won't work.

The DNC is so ignorant--to believe they can put this add out with average everyday--hardworking--taxpaying citizens & win with this add. No one is buying "lets" blame the past President--we are TALKING about Obama's health care plan--of which President Bush had nothing to do with.

 

[DiveCon]

There is one thing I know about all Americans. They will not tolerate a government attack on private citizens--regardless of party affiliation. It's like you can say anything you want to about one of your relatives--but by golly no one else better.

In my 56 years I have NEVER seen one political party attack the citizens of this country. THIS IS A FIRST. It shows the character of this current administration, congress & the entire DNC with their Chicago style Thug tactics. They are purposely trying to pit one American against another. It won't work.

The DNC is so ignorant--to believe they can put this add out with average everyday--hardworking--taxpaying citizens & win with this add. No one is buying "lets" blame the past President--we are TALKING about Obama's health care plan--of which President Bush had nothing to do with.

well, clearly SOME will

 

[Darkwind]

There is one thing I know about all Americans. They will not tolerate a government attack on private citizens--regardless of party affiliation. It's like you can say anything you want to about one of your relatives--but by golly no one else better.

In my 56 years I have NEVER seen one political party attack the citizens of this country. THIS IS A FIRST. It shows the character of this current administration, congress & the entire DNC with their Chicago style Thug tactics. They are purposely trying to pit one American against another. It won't work.

The DNC is so ignorant--to believe they can put this add out with average everyday--hardworking--taxpaying citizens & win with this add. No one is buying "lets" blame the past President--we are TALKING about Obama's health care plan--of which President Bush had nothing to do with.

Really?

Seems that America and most Americans were pretty quiet when Congress was thinking about crafting a bill that targeted specific citizens of this country. I think that they'll pretty much keep quiet about this as well.

Besides, it does fall under free speech. Poor taste as well, but..well, there it is.

 

[DiveCon]

ya know, i wonder how those conservative democrats at those meetings will respond to being dismissed as GOP opperatives

 

[Annie]

I'm glad to see a Senator respond to the gestapo tactics of the fascists in the White House:

.: United States Senator John Cornyn, Texas :: For The Press :.

Dear President Obama,

I write to express my concern about a new White House program to monitor American citizens' speech opposing your health care policies, and to seek your assurances that this program is being carried out in a manner consistent with the First Amendment and America's tradition of free speech and public discourse.

Yesterday, in an official White House release entitled "Facts are Stubborn Things," the White House Director of New Media, Macon Phillips, asserted that there was "a lot of disinformation out there," and encouraged citizens to report "fishy" speech opposing your health care policies to the White House. Phillips specifically targeted private, unpublished, even casual speech, writing that "rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation." Phillips wrote "If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to [email protected]."

I am not aware of any precedent for a President asking American citizens to report their fellow citizens to the White House for pure political speech that is deemed "fishy" or otherwise inimical to the White House's political interests.

By requesting that citizens send "fishy" emails to the White House, it is inevitable that the names, email addresses, IP addresses, and private speech of U.S. citizens will be reported to the White House. You should not be surprised that these actions taken by your White House staff raise the specter of a data collection program. As Congress debates health care reform and other critical policy matters, citizen engagement must not be chilled by fear of government monitoring the exercise of free speech rights.

I can only imagine the level of justifiable outrage had your predecessor asked Americans to forward emails critical of his policies to the White House. I suspect that you would have been leading the charge in condemning such a program-and I would have been at your side denouncing such heavy-handed government action.

So I urge you to cease this program immediately. At the very least, I request that you detail to Congress and the public the protocols that your White House is following to purge the names, email addresses, IP addresses, and identities of citizens who are reported to have engaged in "fishy" speech. And I respectfully request an answer to the following:

How do you intend to use the names, email addresses, IP addresses, and identities of citizens who are reported to have engaged in "fishy" speech?
How do you intend to notify citizens who have been reported for "fishy" speech?
What action do you intend to take against citizens who have been reported for engaging in "fishy" speech?
Do your own past statements qualify as "disinformation"? For example, is it "disinformation" to note that in 2003 you said:"I happen to be a proponent of a single-payer universal health care plan"?
I look forward to your prompt response.

Sincerely,

JOHN CORNYN

United States Senator

Sen. Cornyn serves on the Finance, Judiciary, Agriculture and Budget Committees. He serves as the top Republican on the Judiciary Committee's Immigration, Refugees and Border Security subcommittee. He served previously as Texas Attorney General, Texas Supreme Court Justice, and Bexar County District Judge.

 

[oreo]

Calling tax paying Americans the "mob" somehow ain't gonna sit to well. methinks.. folks you are seeing chicargo thuggery at it's finest.

DITTO--I have never seen any political party attack a very large segment of this population--that are law abiding--taxpaying American citizens in such a manner.

In fact, I am still in a state of shock over it.

 

[Chris]

I am still in a state of shock at how the Republicans destroyed America.

I am glad Obama is going to rebuild it.

 

[elvis]

I am still in a state of shock at how the Republicans destroyed America.

I am glad Obama is going to rebuild it.

i am still in shock how much you are willing to gag on Obama.

 

[Annie]

Calling tax paying Americans the "mob" somehow ain't gonna sit to well. methinks.. folks you are seeing chicargo thuggery at it's finest.

DITTO--I have never seen any political party attack a very large segment of this population--that are law abiding--taxpaying American citizens in such a manner.

In fact, I am still in a state of shock over it.

The more I think about this and the more I read about it, the more concerned I get by the gestapo running Pennsylvania Ave. If some Democrats don't quickly suggest to Obama that that gets pulled down and the threats of data collection stop, for the first time I think there credence in those I previously considered fringe elements.

I've never heard of such behavior, in public, by an administration. When I first read some of this last night, this morning, I though it had to be spin. It isn't.

 

[KittenKoder]

Calling tax paying Americans the "mob" somehow ain't gonna sit to well. methinks.. folks you are seeing chicargo thuggery at it's finest.

DITTO--I have never seen any political party attack a very large segment of this population--that are law abiding--taxpaying American citizens in such a manner.

In fact, I am still in a state of shock over it.

The more I think about this and the more I read about it, the more concerned I get by the gestapo running Pennsylvania Ave. If some Democrats don't quickly suggest to Obama that that gets pulled down and the threats of data collection stop, for the first time I think there credence in those I previously considered fringe elements.

I've never heard of such behavior, in public, by an administration. When I first read some of this last night, this morning, I though it had to be spin. It isn't.

Actually, one thing that has me sleeping a bit better lately is that the outrage is finally about real things like this, instead of a dinner trip or something else lame. I mentioned in such lame outrage threads about this shit, told everyone there is some reason why those stories were focused on so much ... I hate being right because I am just to jaded.

Now maybe we will see a possible reclaiming of power for the people?

 

[Annie]

DITTO--I have never seen any political party attack a very large segment of this population--that are law abiding--taxpaying American citizens in such a manner.

In fact, I am still in a state of shock over it.

The more I think about this and the more I read about it, the more concerned I get by the gestapo running Pennsylvania Ave. If some Democrats don't quickly suggest to Obama that that gets pulled down and the threats of data collection stop, for the first time I think there credence in those I previously considered fringe elements.

I've never heard of such behavior, in public, by an administration. When I first read some of this last night, this morning, I though it had to be spin. It isn't.

Actually, one thing that has me sleeping a bit better lately is that the outrage is finally about real things like this, instead of a dinner trip or something else lame. I mentioned in such lame outrage threads about this shit, told everyone there is some reason why those stories were focused on so much ... I hate being right because I am just to jaded.

Now maybe we will see a possible reclaiming of power for the people?

Well you and me both. It's seldom I read about birther stuff, dinner stuff, pizza stuff, shoe stuff, mom pants, etc. Not saying I don't, I really couldn't understand the pizza fly in, when he could have done it with a Chicago vendor.

For the rest, seems a press created diversion to give 'talking points' to the extremes on both ends.

This now, this is outrageous beyond imho the health care, tarp, cap and trade. It's an implied threat to anyone disagreeing publicly with the administration and so many Democrats seem so willing to fly with it. Next we'll find they haven't a problem with packing SCOTUS, after all, he WAS elected.

 

[Navy1960]

Annie, actually what Obama is doing when it applies to this so called "fishy" policy and this white house tattle tale site is nothing new. It's the same thing that democrats have for years and years called presidents to task for except this one. When Nixon was accused of spying on Democrats and creating ememies lists, what was the result of that? a presidents resignation. Or Johnson's creation of a program for domestic spying of anti-war protestors, resulted in such an uproar within the democratic party and even more protest a president made the choice not to run for a second term. Then of course there was George W. Bush who for years was accused by every group from the DNC, moveon.org, and every other democratic group you could think of violations of the 1st Amendment with the patriot act. With this president though all we hear is "silence" because the same party that has defended the 1st amendment is now selective because as Franklin reminded everyone..

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. "

Are willing to give up that liberty for that safety and that of their fellow Americans as well and are more than willing to condemn those that exercise that liberty in the pursuit of that safety.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Alinsky's Rules For Radicals Rule #5: Ridicule the Opposition.


Pelosi and Obama are using the rules for radicals playbook effectively.

 

[Coyote]

Alinsky's Rules For Radicals Rule #5: Ridicule the Opposition.


Pelosi and Obama are using the rules for radicals playbook effectively.

You mean like the way the right ridiculed the likes of Cindy Sheehan?

It's a playbook used well by both sides I'd say.

 

[Tech_Esq]

So while I'm waiting for that citation...

It appears the legislation first has to accept and provide for what exists (even after modification of the insurance system with the Exchange). This is because if they did not provide for what exists, they would have to provide a working substitute on day one. Even they don't think they can do that.

So, we must have current plans in the Exchange with the new Public plan.

OK. Now we start talking about the future. All private plans must adhere to the requirements of the new law. What this has meant in the states is that plans must provide all of things that the new laws say. So, in some states, all plans must provide for prescription drugs or coverage for obstetrics etc. The new federal law with have a long list that all plans must cover. So, this imposes costs for the private plans that they didn't have before. For instance, in TX a plan didn't have to cover podiatry visits, but under the federal plan, they must.

Simple though, all the plans must cover what is in the law in and in the manner provided by law. So does the public plan.

Potential outcome:

- United Health - family plan - $807
- Blue Cross - family plan - $956
- Public Plan - family plan - $496

By the end of 6 years, no private plans exist. How do we know? Canada did the same thing when they started.

(b) GRACE PERIOD FOR CURRENT EMPLOYMENT9
BASED HEALTH PLANS.—
10 (1) GRACE PERIOD.—
11 (A) IN GENERAL.—The Commissioner
12 shall establish a grace period whereby, for plan
13 years beginning after the end of the 5-year pe14
riod beginning with Y1, an employment-based
15 health plan in operation as of the day before
16 the first day of Y1 must meet the same require17
ments as apply to a qualified health benefits
18 plan under section 101, including the essential
19 benefit package requirement under section 121.

http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/aahca.pdf


Taken in conjuntion with previous section you are exactly right.

Yep. I noticed the 5 year grace period when I was scanning the bill. That's how Obama gets to say, "If you like your coverage, you won't have to change it." He just doesn't add, "Well not immediately anyway."

 

[Tech_Esq]

That wouldn't necessarily make you any more objective since even if opposed, your ideological leanings might make you more sympathetic to one over the other.

Nonsense, did you not read what i wrote?

Go back and look again.

He's projecting.

 

[Tech_Esq]

Republican lies are like roadkill: run over so many times they're dried up, impossible to identify what they started out as and you need a trowel to scrape them off the pavement...but...if you're hungry enough....you can probably find a little protein there.

it's your legacy.. obamalama lied and the economy died.. you can't scrape that off. it's a sticker.

The economy was dead on arrival. That was your legacy. How many times you gonna keep running over it with the same old failed policies?

For someone who claims independence, you sure sound like a party hack.

 

[bodecea]

The DNC is actually attacking the people (who represent 52%)--of the American populace who are showing up at these town hall meetings regarding the government proposed health care bill--basically stating:

"They lost the election--& now they are trying to DESTROY Obama!!!! Inferring that there are no democrats or independants at these town hall meetings? Accusing Rush Limbaugh & other right wing organizations of orchestrating this.

Then they have Rush Limbaugh: "I hope he fails"--in this add--& then in the last sentence refers to normal honest-hardworking- taxpaying Americans as a MOB."

THEY ARE IN ESSENSE ATTACKING responsible AMERICANS who expect our elected representatives to actually read massive new government spending bills FIRST before they sign off on them. They are attacking Americans who want DETAILS on this plan not rhetoric.

I'll tell you this country is going to blow-up if this add--is run throughout this country. It's going to blow up right in Obama's & these democrats faces.

The DNC in essense--just increased the size of these town-hall meetings 1000 fold. Americans will not tolerate other Americans being targeted or attacked by our government, regardless of party affiliation.

Gallop & Pew polls show the majority of Americans do not support this health care bill. Talk about committing political suicide-LOL

HERE IT IS:

YouTube - "Enough of the Mob"

What do you suggest be done?

If the ad is that horrible, you might be happy because it will cause a backlash.

If that ad is effective, you might want to wonder why.

 

[bodecea]

Alinsky's Rules For Radicals Rule #5: Ridicule the Opposition.


Pelosi and Obama are using the rules for radicals playbook effectively.

You mean like the way the right ridiculed the likes of Cindy Sheehan?

It's a playbook used well by both sides I'd say.

I wasn't a member of this forum back then, but was there as much outrage over the "Yes on H8" ads coming out of CA? You know, the ones that were nothing but lies?

 

[Navy1960]

So while I'm waiting for that citation...

It appears the legislation first has to accept and provide for what exists (even after modification of the insurance system with the Exchange). This is because if they did not provide for what exists, they would have to provide a working substitute on day one. Even they don't think they can do that.

So, we must have current plans in the Exchange with the new Public plan.

OK. Now we start talking about the future. All private plans must adhere to the requirements of the new law. What this has meant in the states is that plans must provide all of things that the new laws say. So, in some states, all plans must provide for prescription drugs or coverage for obstetrics etc. The new federal law with have a long list that all plans must cover. So, this imposes costs for the private plans that they didn't have before. For instance, in TX a plan didn't have to cover podiatry visits, but under the federal plan, they must.

Simple though, all the plans must cover what is in the law in and in the manner provided by law. So does the public plan.

Potential outcome:

- United Health - family plan - $807
- Blue Cross - family plan - $956
- Public Plan - family plan - $496

By the end of 6 years, no private plans exist. How do we know? Canada did the same thing when they started.

(b) GRACE PERIOD FOR CURRENT EMPLOYMENT9
BASED HEALTH PLANS.—
10 (1) GRACE PERIOD.—
11 (A) IN GENERAL.—The Commissioner
12 shall establish a grace period whereby, for plan
13 years beginning after the end of the 5-year pe14
riod beginning with Y1, an employment-based
15 health plan in operation as of the day before
16 the first day of Y1 must meet the same require17
ments as apply to a qualified health benefits
18 plan under section 101, including the essential
19 benefit package requirement under section 121.

http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/aahca.pdf


Taken in conjuntion with previous section you are exactly right.

Yep. I noticed the 5 year grace period when I was scanning the bill. That's how Obama gets to say, "If you like your coverage, you won't have to change it." He just doesn't add, "Well not immediately anyway."

Tech, do you know I have scanned this bill and the Senate version and can only find one part that has anything to do with Immigration and that is the section that deals with "credits" for low income indivuduals to use for purchasing healthcare. Other than that there is no place in the bill I can find that will require an individual who purchases the public option through the exchange to provide proof of citizenship. For example here in Arizona in order to get a DL you have to at least prove your here in this nation legally before they will issue you one. However, I can find no such regulations in this bill that would require the same other than the section that deals with credits. So according to my read on it, if your illegal, you can purchase public healthcare insurance you just can't qualify for the credits to purchsse it.