Obama's Tortured Weakness...

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Sinatra, Apr 23, 2009.

  1. Sinatra
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    Sinatra Senior Member

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    The growing "torture" debate has left Obama appearing, once again, as a weak and uncertain figure swimming in waters far too deep for his limited experience and skill.

    "Reactions to this CIA program, which was used against senior al Quaeda suspects in 2002-2003 are demonstrating how little Barack Obama and some Democrat members of Congress understand the dire threats to our nation."

    "An honest and thoughtfull review of the enhanced interrogation program must also assess the likely damage done to US national security by Mr. Obama's decision to release the memos over the objections of Mr. Panetta and four of his successors."

    But in releasing the memos last week, Obama unwittingly reinforced Osama Bin Laden's view of America as a country of pantywaists.

    But when Obama opened the door for his attorney general to prosecute Bush lawyers, that flip-flop told US intelligence and law enforcement operatives that Obama's assurances cannot be trusted. That cannot be good for America's safety.

    Now all sides are mad at him (Obama) and he looks weak. Weakness is the death knell for a president...Obama's got to be tougher or he will be viewed as a personality who reads well from a teleprompter."

    What I am trying to say is the CIA does not need to be handcuffed or demoralized. It needs to know its mission.

    Congress Knew About the Interrogations - WSJ.com

    RealClearPolitics - U.S. Foes Have Only Bad Lawyering to Fear

    Commentary: Obama waffled on torture -- and looks weak - CNN.com
     
  2. Newby
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    Newby Does it get any better? Supporting Member

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    You also have to seriously question the ramifications on the CIA itself and how this 'debate' will effectively cut their feet right out from under them. Do something for the current administration, but then worry about when the next administration comes in and changes policy, that you're going to be thrown in jail. Real incentive to really do your job and try to keep this country safe.
     
  3. amrchaos
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    amrchaos Pentheus torn apart

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    You do know that there is something wrong with the media trying to push this issue forward, right? This is not an election year, so what do you think is really going on?
     
  4. amrchaos
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    amrchaos Pentheus torn apart

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    Ahh yes--the CIA. The CIA that said Cheney said nothing about releasing all the memos.

    That CIA? You guys better check to see if the CIA is really the GOP's buddy!!
     
  5. Newby
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    Newby Does it get any better? Supporting Member

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    They're most definitely not the GOP's 'buddy', nor were they whenever Bush was in office.
     
  6. amrchaos
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    amrchaos Pentheus torn apart

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    I think that Cheney/Bush plus their WH lawyers that wrote the memos may be the only ones that will go down if Obama opens an investigation into the matter.

    I personally think there are alot more people that had a hand in this from both sides of the aisle. I really wonder how the Dems are going to control the possible spin out from this.
     
  7. Newby
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    Newby Does it get any better? Supporting Member

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    I think it's all a media display to appease Obama's leftist crowd, and will never really go anywhere. As you said, there are many Dems who knew what was happening and said nothing, it's not like they weren't informed of what was happening. It will be interesting to see where it goes, but I think it's just a lot of smoke.
     
  8. Indiana Oracle
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    Indiana Oracle The Truth is Hard to Find

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    Due to PC mentalities, meddling by Washington wise men that did not know beans from butterballs when it came to warfare, and threat of court marshall if rules of engagement were violated, more than once I watched enemy movements and, though I wanted to, did not act.

    Create uncertainty in CIA officers and the country will suffer. All it takes is the right set of circumstances. It could be argued that one of the reasons we did not act to circumvent the 9/11 attack is that the services were covering their own turf and following the (absurd) rules handed down to them.
     
  9. Newby
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    Newby Does it get any better? Supporting Member

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    Well, here you go.

    Republicans Claim Top Lawmakers Were in the Loop on Interrogations - First 100 Days of Presidency - Politics FOXNews.com

     
  10. Coloradomtnman
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    Coloradomtnman Rational and proud of it.

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    This isn't something the media is using to appease us leftists. We want more done to ensure that the US is not a country involved in the practice of torturing prisoners. Obama isn't doing enough, and that's what the media is protraying. It pisses me off. Weak ass democrats. The GOP isn't weak, but their draconian tactics aren't right either. Where's Nader when we need him? Where's Kucinich? Goddamn Democrats won't vote for someone as apparently abrasive as either of these two, but that's what they need: tough, no bull-shit, tell-it-like-it-is, leaders who will kick asses, not kiss them.

    Now, you can split hairs on "what is torture", but I consider what was done to these prisoners as torture. It wasn't the rack, it wasn't the iron maiden (excellent), and it wasn't pulling fingernails out with pliers, but it was still torture.

    This doesn't mean that I am defending the extremists behind the 9/11 attacks, or any sort of terrorism. If any of those people at Guantanamo committed acts of violence or terror or planned to against innocent people: then they can stay in prison forever. But we shouldn't torture them for any reason. My point has nothing to do with defending the people at Guantanamo or Abu Graib, or any where else. It has everthing to do with what I think is right and wrong and what I think our nation's principles are, and I think torturing people is wrong and un-American. I consider what was done torture. I don't think the US should torture people even if it provides real information that could save innocent lives. Its the principle of the matter.

    If Denver was blown up with a WMD, and my entire family was killed, or I was killed, because torture wasn't used to obtain information that would have saved our lives and the lives of a hundred thousand innocent people, then we died, not because terrorists murdered us, but to maintain that the US will not be intimidated by terrorist organizations, will not fear them, and will not compromise the humane (or if you like Christian-value) principles upon which our nation was founded by torturing human beings whether they be innocent or despicable, evil, or murderous. The US shouldn't use the tactics of the ancient civilizations, the Inquisition, the Nazis, of Stalin, Pol Pot, Chairman Mao, Kim Jong-Il, or Saddam Hussein, because if we do, we are no different from them.
     

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