Obama Signs Ten Years Plus Sofa Deal With Afghans - Shows Bush How Iraq Shoulda Been Done.

[ogibillm]

So if Obama was so skilled he could negotiate a stay behind agreement in Afghanistan, how come he couldn't do the same in Iraq?
Oops.

iraq had no reason to negotiate. they already had the agreement they wanted.

We give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars! I repeat...we give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars. If that doesn't provide a "reason" for them to negotiate with us then I don't know what would...

gave. past tense. meaning they already had what they wanted.

still, you might think that would make the difference, that they would be willing to negotiate. history proves you wrong.

 

[Oldstyle]

No he didn't obuthurt is an embarrassment.

Obama's no angel. But Bush was the epitome of incompetence. How quickly people forget.

You know what, Black? Before the Obama Administration began you might have been able to make that claim but the reason that people have "forgotten" how bad Bush was, is that Barry is SO much worse in so many areas of expertise that he's given Jimmy Carter a run for his money for the title of worst Presidential performance post WWII! He's awful with economics! Looks like the slow kid at school getting picked on by the smart kids when it comes to foreign policy! His Administration is so secretive and manipulates the media in such an in your face style that they make the Nixon White House look warm and fuzzy by comparison! Barack Obama has divided the US like no other President before him...by race...by economic level...by political affiliation. I've NEVER seen the level of discord that we have now.

 

[Oldstyle]

So if Obama was so skilled he could negotiate a stay behind agreement in Afghanistan, how come he couldn't do the same in Iraq?
Oops.

iraq had no reason to negotiate. they already had the agreement they wanted.

We give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars! I repeat...we give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars. If that doesn't provide a "reason" for them to negotiate with us then I don't know what would...

gave. past tense. meaning they already had what they wanted.

still, you might think that would make the difference, that they would be willing to negotiate. history proves you wrong.

History proves me wrong when I say that giving someone billions in aid gives you some terms to negotiate? Really! What history would that be, Ogi?

 

[ogibillm]

So if Obama was so skilled he could negotiate a stay behind agreement in Afghanistan, how come he couldn't do the same in Iraq?
Oops.

iraq had no reason to negotiate. they already had the agreement they wanted.

We give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars! I repeat...we give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars. If that doesn't provide a "reason" for them to negotiate with us then I don't know what would...

gave. past tense. meaning they already had what they wanted.

still, you might think that would make the difference, that they would be willing to negotiate. history proves you wrong.

History proves me wrong when I say that giving someone billions in aid gives you some terms to negotiate? Really! What history would that be, Ogi?

because we gave iraq lots of support. they still didn't want us there and stuck to the original agreement.

 

[Oldstyle]

So if Obama was so skilled he could negotiate a stay behind agreement in Afghanistan, how come he couldn't do the same in Iraq?
Oops.

iraq had no reason to negotiate. they already had the agreement they wanted.

We give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars! I repeat...we give Iraq BILLIONS of dollars. If that doesn't provide a "reason" for them to negotiate with us then I don't know what would...

gave. past tense. meaning they already had what they wanted.

still, you might think that would make the difference, that they would be willing to negotiate. history proves you wrong.

History proves me wrong when I say that giving someone billions in aid gives you some terms to negotiate? Really! What history would that be, Ogi?

because we gave iraq lots of support. they still didn't want us there and stuck to the original agreement.

When did Obama threaten to take away that support if Iraq DIDN'T agree to a Stay of Forces agreement? Did I miss when that took place? Maliki was put in place by the US. He was propped up by the billions that we gave to Iraq. But you honestly don't think he would have agreed to keep a residual force of US troops in Iraq if he'd REALLY been pressed on that issue? Come on...get real!

You know as well as I do that Barack Obama didn't WANT to keep US troops in Iraq because doing so didn't mesh with his whole "I ended the war" message that he was putting out as he ran for reelection.

 

[blackhawk]

Nice to see Obama learned from his Iraq mistake.

 

[tinydancer]

This thread title is a joke. Obama wanted to remove the troops from Iraq by 2008.

The assertion that Obama had absolutely no choice in the matter except to adhere to the rules set out in the 2008 SOFA agreement is a lie.

Obama in his own words in the debate with Romney boasts that he was never going to leave troops in Iraq.

Good grief! When will the bullshit ever end from the left?

Obama Bill Sets Date For Troop Withdrawal
By Shailagh Murray
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, January 31, 2007

Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois, one of the most prominent Democrats in the 2008 presidential field, proposed for the first time setting a deadline for withdrawing troops from Iraq, as part of a broader plan aimed at bolstering the freshman senator's foreign policy credentials.

Obama's legislation, offered on the Senate floor last night, would remove all combat brigades from Iraq by March 31, 2008. The date falls within the parameters offered by the bipartisan Iraq Study Group, which recommended the removal of combat troops by the first quarter of next year.

Obama Bill Sets Date For Troop Withdrawal

AND

Obama's 2012 Debate Boast: I Didn't Want to Leave Any Troops in Iraq

MR. ROMNEY: [W]ith regards to Iraq, you and I agreed, I believe, that there should have been a status of forces agreement. Did you —

PRESIDENT OBAMA: That's not true.

MR. ROMNEY: Oh, you didn't — you didn't want a status of forces agreement?

PRESIDENT OBAMA: No, but what I — what I would not have done is left 10,000 troops in Iraq that would tie us down. That certainly would not help us in the Middle East.
"Here's one thing I've learned as commander in chief," Obama said at the end of the exchange. "You've got to be clear, both to our allies and our enemies, about where you stand and what you mean. Now, you just gave a speech a few weeks ago in which you said we should still have troops in Iraq. That is not a recipe for making sure that we are taking advantage of the opportunities and meeting the challenges of the Middle East."



Obama s 2012 Debate Boast I Didn t Want to Leave Any Troops in Iraq The Weekly Standard

 

[tinydancer]

And while I'm at it I found this piece most interesting by a left winger praising Bush for caving to Obama's timeline that the Iraqi government adopted.

Check it out.

"But Bush entered the SOFA negotiations looking for something entirely different than what emerged at the end.

The U.S. went into the SOFA talks intent on obtaining legitimacy for a long-term military presence in Iraq once the Security Council mandate ended.

When negotiations began, it was widely assumed that Bush would extract from the Iraqis an agreement which made the removal of U.S. troops entirely contingent upon American assessments of conditions on the ground.

There were widespread discussions of permanent U.S. bases and a Korea-style presence for generations, an assumption that the U.S. would retain a free hand in its operations, and an absolute rejection of an Obama-style timeline for withdrawal.

*************************************************************************

OK here's where the author of the piece describes what happened with those negotiations over the SOFA.

*************************************************************************

As negotiations dragged on, the December 31 deadline loomed large, threatening to leave the U.S. troops without any legal mandate to remain in the country and forcing the hand of American negotiators.

Finally, the Iraqi leaders clearly kept a careful eye on the American Presidential elections and used Obama's stance to strengthen their own hand in negotiations.

**************************************************************************

They used Obama's stance. Early troop withdrawal.

Bush s finest moment on Iraq SOFA not the surge

 

[tinydancer]

And over and over the praise is heaped on Bush for caving to Obama's early timeline. So when the OP and other left wing morons have the audacity to insinuate that Bush wanted the early withdrawal shove this down their throats.

Obama style timeline. Over and over.

"And here's where I will offer some sincere praise for Bush and his team.

When the Iraqis insisted on an Obama-style timeline for U.S. withdrawal instead of a Bush/McCain- style conditions-based aspirational time frame for U.S. withdrawal, he could have insisted on the latter.

This would have fit with his administration's often-repeated preferences. He could have continued to push for this conception closer to the December 31 deadline, playing high-stakes chicken at the expense of American military planning for the coming year and at the risk of the Iraqi political system not having adequate time to ratify the deal.

But he didn't.

To his credit, Bush agreed to the Obama-style timeline for U.S. withdrawal.

Granted, he hedged -- he didn't authorize Ambassador Ryan Crocker to sign off on the deal until after the Presidential election (on November 18).

But at that point he bowed to the political realities in the U.S. and Iraq and agreed to a SOFA which far more closely matched Obama's avowed vision for Iraq -- withdrawal of U.S. forces in three years, no permanent bases -- than his own."

Bush s finest moment on Iraq SOFA not the surge

 

[NotfooledbyW]

If George W. Bush was doing the things that Barack Obama has done over the past six years...you would literally be foaming at the mouth you'd be so outraged yet here you are demanding praise for Barry.

I supported Bush when he killed terrorists, and when he invaded Afghanistan to 'eliminate' the Taliban and Al Qaeda. But when Bush pulled military and intelligence personnel and assets out of Afghanistan in order to invade Iraq. Have you forgotten the Bush withdrawal from Afghanistan at a very bad time because it allowed the Taliban to regroup and become a very strong insurgency

Bush did good to invade Afghanistan in response to 9/11. He should have stuck with killin' terrorists in Afghanistan and let the UN inspectors finish the job peacefully I Iraq.

And Bush should have never tied Obama to a fixed deadline for all troops to be gone from Iraq by 2012.

So if Obama was so skilled he could negotiate a stay behind agreement in Afghanistan, how come he couldn't do the same in Iraq?
Oops.

iraq had no reason to negotiate. they already had the agreement they wanted.

And plus that Bush set the precedent with the Iraqis in 2008 that all troops could be withdrawn and the Iraqis were capable to take care of security themselves. Surely no one could believe by 2011 the Iraqis could not take care of security themselves. Bush tied Obama's hands. Why couldn't Bush get a ten year deal like Obama did?

 

[Geaux4it]

The ten year SOFA with Afghanistan was signed yesterday - keeping 10 thousand US troops there through 2024.

No placeholder bullcrap going on there.

It follows the historic first democratic transfer of governmental power in Afghanistan's long war torn history.

Our troops along with those of the ISAF and the vast majority of Afghans made this historic achievement possible.

Politically here in the US how will the SOFA and the transfer of power be mocked and torn apart?

So where is the praise for Obama getting a long term SOFA deal with the new Afghan government?

Where's the SOFA deal he negotiated with Iraq?

I can wait

-Geaux

 

[Oldstyle]

If George W. Bush was doing the things that Barack Obama has done over the past six years...you would literally be foaming at the mouth you'd be so outraged yet here you are demanding praise for Barry.

I supported Bush when he killed terrorists, and when he invaded Afghanistan to 'eliminate' the Taliban and Al Qaeda. But when Bush pulled military and intelligence personnel and assets out of Afghanistan in order to invade Iraq. Have you forgotten the Bush withdrawal from Afghanistan at a very bad time because it allowed the Taliban to regroup and become a very strong insurgency

Bush did good to invade Afghanistan in response to 9/11. He should have stuck with killin' terrorists in Afghanistan and let the UN inspectors finish the job peacefully I Iraq.

And Bush should have never tied Obama to a fixed deadline for all troops to be gone from Iraq by 2012.

So if Obama was so skilled he could negotiate a stay behind agreement in Afghanistan, how come he couldn't do the same in Iraq?
Oops.

iraq had no reason to negotiate. they already had the agreement they wanted.

And plus that Bush set the precedent with the Iraqis in 2008 that all troops could be withdrawn and the Iraqis were capable to take care of security themselves. Surely no one could believe by 2011 the Iraqis could not take care of security themselves. Bush tied Obama's hands. Why couldn't Bush get a ten year deal like Obama did?

Only Obama apologists believe that Barack Obama was "tied" to any agreement over a Status of Forces agreement with Iraq! That was something he COULD have simply insisted be changed as a condition of continuing aid from the US and Maliki would have had no choice but to comply. It's what Obama JUST did in Afghanistan because it's finally dawned on him what happens when you pull troops out of an area that isn't prepared to defend itself. Iraq is a total cluster fuck right now because we have a President who is a naive ideologue instead of a realist.

When Bush signed the original agreement, ISIS was not massing across an almost non-existent border in Syria and Maliki hadn't dismissed Sunni military leaders and replaced them with his own guys. The truth is...the situation had TOTALLY changed from 2008 until 2011 but Barry was so intent on being the President who "ends wars" that he ignored both ISIS and the problems with the Iraq military!

 

[Claudette]

The only reason they want us there is because Karsai would be dead once we leave.

The Taliban would move right on in again and his life wouldn't be worth a plug nickel so you can bet your ass he wants US troops in Afghanistan.

Karzai is out. It was the new govt. that signed.

You think they don't want the same deal??

Boy are you naive. The longer we have troops in Afghanistan the longer that govt lasts.

The minute we are gone the Taliban will be in power and anyone in Govt will either be dead or running for their lives.

Karzai refused to sign. The new government signed. Oh yea and 1 + 1 = 2.

Are you stupid?

Of course they signed. Doesn't matter if it was Karsai or his successor.

They signed for the same reason. As long as US troops are in Astan the Taliban won't be running the show.

If we leave. The Taliban will be back in power and you can bet they will kill anyone who was in the former Government.

It ain't rocket science sparky. Its commons sense. Something you seem to have none of.

Good God. Catch a fucking clue.

 

[Avorysuds]

Sooo, Obama lied about ending that war too?

 

[DriftingSand]

Well ... we do need to remain in control of the opium trade. Have I mentioned lately that Obama is an idiot? If not ... just let me say that Obama is an idiot.

 

[paulitician]

Mission accomplished. Time to get the hell out of Afghanistan. And it's also time to withdraw from the Middle East as well. We don't belong in those lands. It's time to scale back and adopt a humble Non-Intervention Foreign Policy. Time to end this state of Permanent War the Globalist Elites have us stuck in.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

HG 9892338

10,000 Troops is just not enough for a country the size of Afghanistan smh.

How do you even think you know that?

 

[NotfooledbyW]

AV 9897164

Sooo, Obama lied about ending that war too?

How about a date time and location for the alleged lie?

 

[1776]

Shut the fuck up liberal scum...

Panetta unloads on White House for pulling US forces out of Iraq Fox News

 

[NotfooledbyW]

OS 9897097 regarding NF 9896226, OS 9892073, OG 9892401, BB 9892391.

.

Only Obama apologists believe that Barack Obama was "tied" to any agreement over a Status of Forces agreement with Iraq! That was something he COULD have simply insisted be changed as a condition of continuing aid from the US and Maliki would have had no choice but to comply.

Now Oldstyle is speaking for the entire Shiite majority in Iraq's parliament. In Oldstyle's fantasy world Obama simply insists the Iraqis sign the Bush way or its the highway as a condition of continuing aid from the US. Now there is a knuckle-headed thought for records

Iraq has oil money. They are buying billions worth of Military equipment from the US. Abrams Tanks, fighter planes,

Half of the $2 billion of US aid to Iraq goes to the PTP. The police training program is one helluva bargaining chip Oldstyle thinks Obama had. Here's why Oldstyle demonstrates cluelessness once again. The Iraqis don't want the PTP.

By TIM ARANGO. MAY 13, 2012. BAGHDAD — In the face of spiraling costs and Iraqi officials who say they never wanted it in the first place, the State Department has slashed — and may jettison entirely by the end of the year — a multibillion-dollar police training program that was to have been the centerpiece of a hugely expanded civilian mission here.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2012/05/1...310&pmnc=410&fr=onesearch&pagewanted=all&_r=0

[TBODY] [/TBODY]