New CNN poll shows overwhelming support for Cut, Cap, and Balance

[peach174]

The Senate has just recently voted down the cut,cap and balance bill.
Sen, Harry Reid would not even bring it up for straight up and down vote.
He has done this all year. Some bills, he hasn't even allowed on the floor.
Does Reid know that he is not a dictator?
Of course he did not like this bill. It took the power away from him as the leader of the Senate.
He could not have remained the dictator of the Senate.
Dem's have not added any of their own bills up for a debate so that compromise between two bills could be reached.
None of the Dem's have passed a budget since 2009.
Why is that? Because the New Health Care bill costs 960 billion, that's why.

 

[Jarhead]

Sure, I take you for your word. But you're not a hypocrite like some of your fellow Repubs.

and you are not as some of your fellow liberals.
I am not a republican...I am a conservative who likely will vote republican....but the GOP does not get a dime from me.

What beliefs do you hold which make you say you are a "conservative"? I'm curious because many different opinions are posted by others who make that claim.

I will answer your question as it seems to be a legit question...

But I ask the following....

Feel free to criticize my thinking, but try not to spin it.

Do not tell me I am a rightwing nutjob.

Short story first...

Short stint in military....went to college....worked hard for degree...took years to poay it off.

Got a decent job out of college....but my work ethic sucked. Got fired...blamed everyone but myself. Sat on the boardwalk of long island hating the world (lived underneath the boardwalk for a stint)...met a guy...had a physical challange of some kind....maybe CP or MS...but was happy. He had just recieved his loan to open a restaurant.

I sat there and realized I was given all of the tools to create my own future....andhere was a man who was not given all the tools and did anyway

Struggled for a few years, but built a business...andnow own 2 businesses, family of four, own a home valued at 900K...have some debt...kids through college....wife of 27 years my best friend. Life is great.

As a conservative I bleieve that no one is responsible for me, but me. No one cares enough about me, but me, so I am to follow my own instincts.

No one is at fault for my failures, but me.

My decisions are mine and I am to educate myself of all consequences before making a decision...as I have no one to blame but me.

Nothing can get in my way, but me. If I cant acheive what I want, I am to find a new way to acheive it as no one wants it as much as me, but me.

My fellow mans success or failure is not my business, but I will lend a hand when I am able, if such a hand is asked for.

In a nutshell....my business is none of your business, and your business is none of my business, but if we can work together to ahceive happiness for those we love, then lets do it. I am my own man and I am to count on no one to help me ahceive what I want. If one offers a hand and I feel it can be useful, I will accept it. But I will never expect it nor will I ever count on it.

It workd for me Wry Catcher...and it is working for my sons.

 

[rightwinger]

And a CNN/ORC International Poll also indicates that while Democrats and independent voters are open to a number of different approaches, Republicans draw the line at tax increases, and many of them oppose raising the nation's debt ceiling under any circumstances.

"That may create a problem for the Republican party, because most Americans think that GOP has been acting irresponsibly in the debt ceiling talks and they will blame congressional Republicans, not President Barack Obama, if no action is taken on the debt ceiling by August 2," says CNN Polling Director Keating Holland

 

[Jarhead]

Sure, I take you for your word. But you're not a hypocrite like some of your fellow Repubs.

and you are not as some of your fellow liberals.
I am not a republican...I am a conservative who likely will vote republican....but the GOP does not get a dime from me.

So there is hope for you yet.

Since the day you and I started discussing our alternative ideas...I have been thinking the same about you.

 

[Jarhead]

and you are not as some of your fellow liberals.
I am not a republican...I am a conservative who likely will vote republican....but the GOP does not get a dime from me.

What beliefs do you hold which make you say you are a "conservative"? I'm curious because many different opinions are posted by others who make that claim.

I will answer your question as it seems to be a legit question...

But I ask the following....

Feel free to criticize my thinking, but try not to spin it.

Do not tell me I am a rightwing nutjob.

Short story first...

Short stint in military....went to college....worked hard for degree...took years to poay it off.

Got a decent job out of college....but my work ethic sucked. Got fired...blamed everyone but myself. Sat on the boardwalk of long island hating the world (lived underneath the boardwalk for a stint)...met a guy...had a physical challange of some kind....maybe CP or MS...but was happy. He had just recieved his loan to open a restaurant.

I sat there and realized I was given all of the tools to create my own future....andhere was a man who was not given all the tools and did anyway

Struggled for a few years, but built a business...andnow own 2 businesses, family of four, own a home valued at 900K...have some debt...kids through college....wife of 27 years my best friend. Life is great.

As a conservative I bleieve that no one is responsible for me, but me. No one cares enough about me, but me, so I am to follow my own instincts.

No one is at fault for my failures, but me.

My decisions are mine and I am to educate myself of all consequences before making a decision...as I have no one to blame but me.

Nothing can get in my way, but me. If I cant acheive what I want, I am to find a new way to acheive it as no one wants it as much as me, but me.

My fellow mans success or failure is not my business, but I will lend a hand when I am able, if such a hand is asked for.

In a nutshell....my business is none of your business, and your business is none of my business, but if we can work together to ahceive happiness for those we love, then lets do it. I am my own man and I am to count on no one to help me ahceive what I want. If one offers a hand and I feel it can be useful, I will accept it. But I will never expect it nor will I ever count on it.

It workd for me Wry Catcher...and it is working for my sons.

I want to add one thing WC....

Despite my success...I have never sued anyone; although I have allowed myself to be wronged by many....and lost much becuase of it

I have been sued by some...for their own failures.....and never lost a suit...but also never counter sued (despite my attorney insisting I do) as I blamed myself for letting myeself get involved with those that try to capitalize on me...

I know it may sound strnage...but when you have a belief system like mine, hypocrisy will compromise its integrity..

For me...it is all or nothing...I believe every move I make is my move and no-one else is at fault if it goes sour.

 

[peach174]

Why are the Dem's insisting on Tax raises now?
Why can't they bring this up after the tax thing expires in a couple of years.
Because they don't want to really cut the size of Government.
They have been this way since January.

 

[Avatar4321]

Conservatives spin as much as liberals spin...and our politicians on both sides spoin all the time.

But the bottom line is this....the GOP are not looking to protect the rich...albeit the rich are being protected.....but the truth is, they are looking to protect the integrity of "equality" as it pertains to tax legislation.....and yes, such protects the rich...but that is not what the GOP is looking at...but it is spun that way.

And Cali Girl is by no means a hypocrite. She is one of the few that isnt on here. She is passionate about what she believes in. Truith is, she AND I were both against only onbe things....the Obama proposal to contiunue the Bush cuts for the bottom 95% and discontiue them for the top 5%.

We do not agree with any type of legislation that is based on income.

That is the way conservatives believe....agree or not...it has nothing to do with rich and poor.

If there were legislation proposed to tax those UNDER 250K but not those above 250K, conservatives would be against it.....I know...such legislation would be absurd...but conservatives would be 100% against it.

You raise some good points but we'll have to disagree about Cali_Girl. She's a hypocrite to the core. She doesn't respond many times when shes called out on her hypocrisy.

Let's put it this way. If she was in favor or letting the bush tax cuts expire for everyone, all she has to do is post a link to her comments and I'll apologize. But if I were a betting man, I know where I'd be placing my money on this one.

Let me clarify...

I was against letting them expire....when that was the discussion...as I believed business owners needed them as did all Americans.

But when the discussion went to letting them expire for just one class of people...I was dead set against such a proposal...

And that was when I was out there saying "let them expoire for all or for none....but do not turn us into a caste system"..

And yes...I use the term caste system for sensationalism...

I don't see how it's sensationalism when it's an accurate depiction of the problem.

 

[Jarhead]

You raise some good points but we'll have to disagree about Cali_Girl. She's a hypocrite to the core. She doesn't respond many times when shes called out on her hypocrisy.

Let's put it this way. If she was in favor or letting the bush tax cuts expire for everyone, all she has to do is post a link to her comments and I'll apologize. But if I were a betting man, I know where I'd be placing my money on this one.

Let me clarify...

I was against letting them expire....when that was the discussion...as I believed business owners needed them as did all Americans.

But when the discussion went to letting them expire for just one class of people...I was dead set against such a proposal...

And that was when I was out there saying "let them expoire for all or for none....but do not turn us into a caste system"..

And yes...I use the term caste system for sensationalism...

I don't see how it's sensationalism when it's an accurate depiction of the problem.

Because in a true caste system, one is born into a class with no chance of moving out of it.

Certainly , as much as a tax on one income group creates a "class" system, it will not create a caste system.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So you were in favor of letting the bush tax cuts expire?

Across the board?
Yes....if it will help.
But I am not convicned it is in the best interest of America to enact legislation that includes "income" as a criteria.

Now...I may be wrong.

That is what debate is about.

But as long as the dems continue to say the GOP only cares about the rich, we will never have an honest debate.

The debate should be...."are we ready to make America a country based on classes and enact legislation based on classes"

But look at it from a dem perspective. The only thing that never seems to be on the table is tax increases for the rich and closing corporate tax loopholes. Any talk of raising taxes and conservatives point to the "51%" who don't pay anything and ask to have taxes raises on the poor/middle class as well. This is on top of cons insisting that we cut assistance programs that the middle class/poor really heavily on. Step back and look at that and it's hard to not reach the conclusion that the GOP's top priority is protecting the rich.

And when a hypocrite like Cali-Girl starts suggesting that we should raise taxes on everyone and not just the rich, I think to myself....gee, didn't Obama try and do that by letting the Bush tax cuts expire? Maybe she was in favor of letting them expire at the time, but I have serious doubts.

Which corporate loopholes would you like to close?
Could you be specific?

 

[Avatar4321]

Really? no one is proposing it? hell I hear it right here on this message board at least daily(and that's a conservative estimate). As far as tyranny goes... Let's see, who wants to cut Medicare and Social Security to the Bone? What about the money we earned that we put into Social Security and Medicare? Oh yeah.. fuck us. Who appointed you God insofar as FORCING us to work till we're 70(or at least making it virtually impossible not to)?

I love how when it's the vast majority of people with the least power and the least political representation.. it's OK to walk all over them. But when it's the very few who have most of the money and power...it's Tyranny.

Talk about fucked up priorities.

So cutting unconstitutional prograrms is tyranny now?

Haven't you figured out that the second government takes your money you and your political allies have already established that the money no longer belongs to you, but belongs to the government? Once government takes your money it's gone. It's going to be wasted.

Unlike you, I don't have any false beliefs that I will ever see that money again. It's gone. The politicians have lied to you. They've lied to all the American people. They have Robbed us of our hard earned money for decades promising to "pay us back" with it down the road, only to use that money to buy votes and pay their campaign contributors.

Perhaps it's time we try the experment in self government again. The one where we save our own money instead of giving it to government to save. The one where we pay for own our health care and actively seek preventative care instead of delegating that responsibility to the government. We give so much power over our lives to the government and yet you think taking this power back is tyranny. Why?

As for forcing us to work until we are 70, it's supreme arrogance to presume that somehow as we get older, our responsibility to work and take care of ourselves goes away. Work has been one of the fundamental laws of humanity since the Fall of Adam. Working is a good thing. Providing for ourselves gives us self confidence. It makes us independente. Work is something we should rejoice in. We shouldn't be doing everything in our power to be idle and slothful. We should be working hard to support ourselves.

Why you think you are entitled to live off someone elses labor is a question I will never understand. I don't understand why you think you are entitled to be idle and slothful once you reach a certain age or if you have a small amount of income. Perhaps you can tell us what makes you exempt from the rest of the human race.

 

[Avatar4321]

Let me clarify...

I was against letting them expire....when that was the discussion...as I believed business owners needed them as did all Americans.

But when the discussion went to letting them expire for just one class of people...I was dead set against such a proposal...

And that was when I was out there saying "let them expoire for all or for none....but do not turn us into a caste system"..

And yes...I use the term caste system for sensationalism...

I don't see how it's sensationalism when it's an accurate depiction of the problem.

Because in a true caste system, one is born into a class with no chance of moving out of it.

Certainly , as much as a tax on one income group creates a "class" system, it will not create a caste system.

I think that is there very intention. If the poor can work themselves out of poverty, why would they need the politicians? You think they really want those who are born poor associating with them and their children?

 

[NYcarbineer]

The poll did not support the GOP's cut/cap/balance bill. Period. The poll supported a combination of tax hikes and spending cuts to balance the budget. the GOP CCB does no such thing.

 

[Steelplate]

Really? no one is proposing it? hell I hear it right here on this message board at least daily(and that's a conservative estimate). As far as tyranny goes... Let's see, who wants to cut Medicare and Social Security to the Bone? What about the money we earned that we put into Social Security and Medicare? Oh yeah.. fuck us. Who appointed you God insofar as FORCING us to work till we're 70(or at least making it virtually impossible not to)?

I love how when it's the vast majority of people with the least power and the least political representation.. it's OK to walk all over them. But when it's the very few who have most of the money and power...it's Tyranny.

Talk about fucked up priorities.

So cutting unconstitutional prograrms is tyranny now?

Haven't you figured out that the second government takes your money you and your political allies have already established that the money no longer belongs to you, but belongs to the government? Once government takes your money it's gone. It's going to be wasted.

Unlike you, I don't have any false beliefs that I will ever see that money again. It's gone. The politicians have lied to you. They've lied to all the American people. They have Robbed us of our hard earned money for decades promising to "pay us back" with it down the road, only to use that money to buy votes and pay their campaign contributors.

Perhaps it's time we try the experment in self government again. The one where we save our own money instead of giving it to government to save. The one where we pay for own our health care and actively seek preventative care instead of delegating that responsibility to the government. We give so much power over our lives to the government and yet you think taking this power back is tyranny. Why?

As for forcing us to work until we are 70, it's supreme arrogance to presume that somehow as we get older, our responsibility to work and take care of ourselves goes away. Work has been one of the fundamental laws of humanity since the Fall of Adam. Working is a good thing. Providing for ourselves gives us self confidence. It makes us independente. Work is something we should rejoice in. We shouldn't be doing everything in our power to be idle and slothful. We should be working hard to support ourselves.

Why you think you are entitled to live off someone elses labor is a question I will never understand. I don't understand why you think you are entitled to be idle and slothful once you reach a certain age or if you have a small amount of income. Perhaps you can tell us what makes you exempt from the rest of the human race.

What a crock of shit... Lest you forget... WE PAY INTO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF IT BEING THERE WHEN WE GET OLD!!! ok... did you get that... it's not "OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY..... IT'S OUR OWN!!!"

moron.... If you want to turn this country into a slave labor nation where we work till we die for the profits of our "betters", I will fight you with my last breath.

 

[asaratis]

It makes sense...a majority favors it...it should pass. Households across America have their own Cut,Cap and Balance programs because they can't print money...and their credit is limited.

The progressive spending program requires that the treasury's credit limit be increased every time the debt gets close to the limit. That is senseless. Harry Reid is senseless. Nancy Pelosi is senseless. Barack Obama is senseless.

The main reason that they are not worried about being senseless is that they are all rich, all fixed for life, have not to worry about medical care or loss of their excessive retirement plan, or in Obama's case, Secret Service protection for him and his family....all of this on the backs of those that they are seeking to tax into oblivion.

Harry Reid and his ilk are enemies of a vibrant free economy. It makes it harder for them to buy votes.

 

[Jarhead]

Really? no one is proposing it? hell I hear it right here on this message board at least daily(and that's a conservative estimate). As far as tyranny goes... Let's see, who wants to cut Medicare and Social Security to the Bone? What about the money we earned that we put into Social Security and Medicare? Oh yeah.. fuck us. Who appointed you God insofar as FORCING us to work till we're 70(or at least making it virtually impossible not to)?

I love how when it's the vast majority of people with the least power and the least political representation.. it's OK to walk all over them. But when it's the very few who have most of the money and power...it's Tyranny.

Talk about fucked up priorities.

So cutting unconstitutional prograrms is tyranny now?

Haven't you figured out that the second government takes your money you and your political allies have already established that the money no longer belongs to you, but belongs to the government? Once government takes your money it's gone. It's going to be wasted.

Unlike you, I don't have any false beliefs that I will ever see that money again. It's gone. The politicians have lied to you. They've lied to all the American people. They have Robbed us of our hard earned money for decades promising to "pay us back" with it down the road, only to use that money to buy votes and pay their campaign contributors.

Perhaps it's time we try the experment in self government again. The one where we save our own money instead of giving it to government to save. The one where we pay for own our health care and actively seek preventative care instead of delegating that responsibility to the government. We give so much power over our lives to the government and yet you think taking this power back is tyranny. Why?

As for forcing us to work until we are 70, it's supreme arrogance to presume that somehow as we get older, our responsibility to work and take care of ourselves goes away. Work has been one of the fundamental laws of humanity since the Fall of Adam. Working is a good thing. Providing for ourselves gives us self confidence. It makes us independente. Work is something we should rejoice in. We shouldn't be doing everything in our power to be idle and slothful. We should be working hard to support ourselves.

Why you think you are entitled to live off someone elses labor is a question I will never understand. I don't understand why you think you are entitled to be idle and slothful once you reach a certain age or if you have a small amount of income. Perhaps you can tell us what makes you exempt from the rest of the human race.

What a crock of shit... Lest you forget... WE PAY INTO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF IT BEING THERE WHEN WE GET OLD!!! ok... did you get that... it's not "OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY..... IT'S OUR OWN!!!"

moron.... If you want to turn this country into a slave labor nation where we work till we die for the profits of our "betters", I will fight you with my last breath.

thats not a conservatives fault.

Thats the fault of our government that we all voted in to oversee it for us.

So now we need to pay the price for continuing to elect incompetent, not to be trusted politicians.

 

[Annie]

This bill would make it impossible to go to war.

But Republicans (and Democrats) never let a budget stop them from doing that.

Didn't read that pesky amendment, eh?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Really? no one is proposing it? hell I hear it right here on this message board at least daily(and that's a conservative estimate). As far as tyranny goes... Let's see, who wants to cut Medicare and Social Security to the Bone? What about the money we earned that we put into Social Security and Medicare? Oh yeah.. fuck us. Who appointed you God insofar as FORCING us to work till we're 70(or at least making it virtually impossible not to)?

I love how when it's the vast majority of people with the least power and the least political representation.. it's OK to walk all over them. But when it's the very few who have most of the money and power...it's Tyranny.

Talk about fucked up priorities.

So cutting unconstitutional prograrms is tyranny now?

Haven't you figured out that the second government takes your money you and your political allies have already established that the money no longer belongs to you, but belongs to the government? Once government takes your money it's gone. It's going to be wasted.

Unlike you, I don't have any false beliefs that I will ever see that money again. It's gone. The politicians have lied to you. They've lied to all the American people. They have Robbed us of our hard earned money for decades promising to "pay us back" with it down the road, only to use that money to buy votes and pay their campaign contributors.

Perhaps it's time we try the experment in self government again. The one where we save our own money instead of giving it to government to save. The one where we pay for own our health care and actively seek preventative care instead of delegating that responsibility to the government. We give so much power over our lives to the government and yet you think taking this power back is tyranny. Why?

As for forcing us to work until we are 70, it's supreme arrogance to presume that somehow as we get older, our responsibility to work and take care of ourselves goes away. Work has been one of the fundamental laws of humanity since the Fall of Adam. Working is a good thing. Providing for ourselves gives us self confidence. It makes us independente. Work is something we should rejoice in. We shouldn't be doing everything in our power to be idle and slothful. We should be working hard to support ourselves.

Why you think you are entitled to live off someone elses labor is a question I will never understand. I don't understand why you think you are entitled to be idle and slothful once you reach a certain age or if you have a small amount of income. Perhaps you can tell us what makes you exempt from the rest of the human race.

What a crock of shit... Lest you forget... WE PAY INTO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF IT BEING THERE WHEN WE GET OLD!!! ok... did you get that... it's not "OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY..... IT'S OUR OWN!!!"

moron.... If you want to turn this country into a slave labor nation where we work till we die for the profits of our "betters", I will fight you with my last breath.

"OUR OWN" money isn't there anymore. It's been paid out to current retirees or spent by Congress. And when we retire, if the program still exists, we won't get "OUR OWN" money back, we'll get the money paid in by those still working during our retirement.

 

[asaratis]

Really? no one is proposing it? hell I hear it right here on this message board at least daily(and that's a conservative estimate). As far as tyranny goes... Let's see, who wants to cut Medicare and Social Security to the Bone? What about the money we earned that we put into Social Security and Medicare? Oh yeah.. fuck us. Who appointed you God insofar as FORCING us to work till we're 70(or at least making it virtually impossible not to)?

I love how when it's the vast majority of people with the least power and the least political representation.. it's OK to walk all over them. But when it's the very few who have most of the money and power...it's Tyranny.

Talk about fucked up priorities.

So cutting unconstitutional prograrms is tyranny now?

Haven't you figured out that the second government takes your money you and your political allies have already established that the money no longer belongs to you, but belongs to the government? Once government takes your money it's gone. It's going to be wasted.

Unlike you, I don't have any false beliefs that I will ever see that money again. It's gone. The politicians have lied to you. They've lied to all the American people. They have Robbed us of our hard earned money for decades promising to "pay us back" with it down the road, only to use that money to buy votes and pay their campaign contributors.

Perhaps it's time we try the experment in self government again. The one where we save our own money instead of giving it to government to save. The one where we pay for own our health care and actively seek preventative care instead of delegating that responsibility to the government. We give so much power over our lives to the government and yet you think taking this power back is tyranny. Why?

As for forcing us to work until we are 70, it's supreme arrogance to presume that somehow as we get older, our responsibility to work and take care of ourselves goes away. Work has been one of the fundamental laws of humanity since the Fall of Adam. Working is a good thing. Providing for ourselves gives us self confidence. It makes us independente. Work is something we should rejoice in. We shouldn't be doing everything in our power to be idle and slothful. We should be working hard to support ourselves.

Why you think you are entitled to live off someone elses labor is a question I will never understand. I don't understand why you think you are entitled to be idle and slothful once you reach a certain age or if you have a small amount of income. Perhaps you can tell us what makes you exempt from the rest of the human race.

What a crock of shit... Lest you forget... WE PAY INTO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF IT BEING THERE WHEN WE GET OLD!!! ok... did you get that... it's not "OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY..... IT'S OUR OWN!!!"

moron.... If you want to turn this country into a slave labor nation where we work till we die for the profits of our "betters", I will fight you with my last breath.

It (social security funds) used to be ours. It was ours in a separate trust fund until the progressive liberals moved it to the general fund so they could use it as they please. The next thing you know, the liberals will be going after all of the 401Kays and other retirement programs because they think the government can do a better job of issuing it wisely.

Liberalism is equivalent to insanity. History tells us repeatedly that collectivism FAILS. The biggest problem I see with liberalism is that the rich ones are in control and do not care one bit for the welfare of the poor voters. They just want to give them a living in exchange for a vote.

 

[Avatar4321]

What a crock of shit... Lest you forget... WE PAY INTO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF IT BEING THERE WHEN WE GET OLD!!! ok... did you get that... it's not "OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY..... IT'S OUR OWN!!!"

moron.... If you want to turn this country into a slave labor nation where we work till we die for the profits of our "betters", I will fight you with my last breath.

The truth hurts sometimes. I understand that. And I can't forget what's true. We dont pay into social security for the express purpose of being there when we get old. We are forced to pay into social security for the express purpose of supporting those who are currently old with the promise that when we get older, those of the upcoming generation will pay it for us. It's a big ponzie scheme. It wasn't designed to work. It was designed to buy the current politicians votes on the backs of the people suffering in the future when the program can't be sustained.

The program was designed so that one group of people will be supported by the labor of another. In other words, you support government sanctioned slavery. Ironic that you consider supporting yourself slavery, yet you think that forcing others to support you is something you are entitled to.

Stop buying the lie the politicians feed you. The truth will set you free.

 

[Conservative]

doesnt matter... the Dems im the house just killed it.

Senate Votes to Set Aside 'Cut, Cap and Balance' Plan Proposed by House GOP - FoxNews.com

The House Republican "Cut, Cap and Balance" (measure) is now over. It's done, dead," Reid said after the 51-46 vote.