Navy Seal as a father for some

[pAntiChrist]

I thought you were not to post again. That's what your buddy said.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/religion-and-ethics/168584-would-you-take-a-life-25.html#post3685537
Post #242

What are you the gestapo? Quit being a message board Nazi. I don't even know what she said and she's MY friend. Are you really keeping tabs on us? Lame. I don't know why I/we are such a concern to you.

Besides that, everything has been handled. Not that it's any of your business. But thanks. Please don't derail the thread.

Are you the gestapo? I'll post where I want, when I want, derail or not. This place is known for derailments. Don't like it? Tough.
No, I'm not keeping tabs on you. But for two new people who started off the way you did (you mostly), and me being a member here that posts often, of course I remember what was said in other threads.
I don't give a shit if she is your friend or not. That was not the point. I asked a question. You answered it has been taken care of. Good nuff for me.
Now go "lame" yourself without vaseline.

And how exactly did I start off?

 

[Wicked Jester]

What we're talking about here is NOT "brainwashing"; but a selection and training process designed to produce troops whose physical, intellectual and emotional abilities , as well as their motivation and dedication, allow them to perform missions in environments and situations which are far more extreme than the conventional combat soldier can be expected to cope with effectively. As an old Special Forces recruiting poster put it, "People join us not because we are different...but because they are". The fact is, though, that just as no selection and training process can produce a man that is bulletproof, it can't produce a man who is emotionally unbreakable, either. These are still men, not automatons, and every man has a breaking point. Just as the armed forces know and accept that a certain proportion of these men will be killed or wounded in doing the missions they are tasked with, they also know and accept that some will be damaged or destroyed emotionally. We're talking extraordinarily skilled and resilient, not indestructible. The man being discussed here is a case in point; something he had to do or see broke him, as it has many others. It's not about brainwashing, but about the extreme missions such operators are tasked with performing. This is just one more part of the cruel calculus of war, and especially that of unconventional warfare. It's not the military's fault, and it's not the individual's fault. The breaking point for these personnel may be both well beyond and different from that of most ordinary people, but it is there, nonetheless, and for reasons we cannot know this man reached his. What I've seen described here is severe PTSD, and those of us who have experienced that would recognize it as such. It's an occupational hazard for any combatant, and "brainwashing" has nothing to do with it, nothing at all.

That's exactly it....Those using the term "brainwashed" are full of it.

There is a selection process for special op's. It has to do with skill, intelligence, physical and mental toughness. Part of the mental toughness comes in play, partly, due to selecting people who will not be "broken" in certain situations that may arise. Those who will not break down when the shit hits the proverbial fan.........Most of those who have experienced horrors beyong imagination, don't immediately show signs of PTSD, Paranoia, nightmares etc., until weeks, months, years down the road. That comes after having the time to reflect. Having the to time to fully process many things.......It also comes from keeping it bottled up inside. From never talking about it......The VA does have some excellent one on one and group counseling programs. Where you can get things off your chest, either one on one, or in a group setting where you share with others who have experienced similar things.....It's good to know that you are not the only one with dealing with it.......The key is to seek them out. To inquire about them. There is no shame in doing so. It doesn't make one any less a man, or woman for that matter, to admit that one is dealing with things inside their minds. Things that are affecting the everyday quality of their life.

I just wish people would save threads like this for other times, as opposed to a weekend where those who never came home are reflected on and honored.

 

[Truthmatters]

It reflects a part of the sacrafice these people make to our country.

 

[geauxtohell]

Christ, the liberal idiots on this board are going to make a mockery of this weekend......It's already started.

And conservative idiots are going to act like they own the intellectual property rights to "memorial day".

 

[Grace]

What are you the gestapo? Quit being a message board Nazi. I don't even know what she said and she's MY friend. Are you really keeping tabs on us? Lame. I don't know why I/we are such a concern to you.

Besides that, everything has been handled. Not that it's any of your business. But thanks. Please don't derail the thread.

Are you the gestapo? I'll post where I want, when I want, derail or not. This place is known for derailments. Don't like it? Tough.
No, I'm not keeping tabs on you. But for two new people who started off the way you did (you mostly), and me being a member here that posts often, of course I remember what was said in other threads.
I don't give a shit if she is your friend or not. That was not the point. I asked a question. You answered it has been taken care of. Good nuff for me.
Now go "lame" yourself without vaseline.

And how exactly did I start off?

You are derailing your friend's thread, dear.

 

[Truthmatters]

The harvest war reaps on people should always be talked about especially on a weekend like this one.

 

[geauxtohell]

I apologize for saying, "brainwashed". He became scary to me at times... Especially when he started drinking and having flashbacks.

One 4th of July he had to go to the basement and wear earplugs because the fireworks that were blasting made him nervous. I was ten at the time and I remember following him down there and asked if he was ok. I could clearly see he wasn't. He replied in a scared voice and said, "please let me be. I'll be upstairs soon.". I never understood that moment until years later as to why he seemed so frightened.

I would like to also say I am not saying all military are like this. I am only speaking from MY experience with MY father. There are amazing people who are in the military and have never acted the way dad did/does.

That's because you have never been on the other end of incoming.

 

[Truthmatters]

And MOST people never will be , its why we honor those who do.

Ignoring the ravages it places in their lives is a dishonor to their sacrafices.

 

[geauxtohell]

I personally think the OP is full of bullshit and this thread is yet another one of her lies.

However, on the off chance that it's true.... I personally find it incredibly disloyal to:

a. badmouth your parent on a message board.

b. announce to people that your Dad was a Navy SEAL.

Smokin' kat? Smokin' fucking idiot.

Haven't you talked about your dad being a Marine?

California Girl? Alcoholic Bitch!

Idiot. Marines are not SEALs. Marines don't have to hide their affiliation... SEALS do.

If everyone who claimed to be a SEAL actually was a SEAL, we'd have more fucking SEALs than Marines. Likewise with those who claim that a family member was a SEAL... many wish they were... very few actually were..

Stupid stoner.

SEALs don't have to hide the fact that they are SEALs.

They might not be able to divulge specifics about their missions and what team they are on, but simply being a SEAL isn't classified information.

 

[The Gadfly]

"Family and friends are the forgotten casualties of war" -smokin-kat

Grace, that quote, sums up why I'm more sympathetic to the OP than a lot of people here; because it's true, and as you know from conversations with me, if anyone here knows that, I do.

It would be bad enough, if PTSD only affected those of us who have it, but it also affects friends and family members who have to deal with us, especially when we are going through a rough time with it. I've seen it tear the families of my buddies apart; and I'm neither so blind or so selfish as not to know what it has done to my own friends and loved ones.My heart aches for her father, and so many others like him, but it also aches for the parents, spouses, children and friends who have had to bear the burden as well. It may be, that some of her words were less than well-chosen, and it may be that I don't agree with some of her feelings about the military; but all I see, is someone hurting from an all-too-familiar cause asking for advice about something that I know is a terrible thing for a child to have to understand. So, when I see that, I think of my own struggles with my own demons, and the people I hurt on my long way back, and I think of buddies I couldn't help, and I think of those still going through the pain, and if I can offer up one word that might make a difference to one person, then I figure I owe it to all of them to try.

Do forgive my emotional state; but this holiday is always a hard one for me.

 

[pAntiChrist]

The harvest war reaps on people should always be talked about especially on a weekend like this one.

When is a better time? I am certainly thinking of the friends and loved ones in the military I have lost. I find it only natural to think of things like this on a weekend like this one.

EDIT: NVM! I read that wrong. I interpreted it as you being against talking about it. Sorry about that.

 

[Truthmatters]

Gadfly, Thank you for your sacrafice of service

 

[Truthmatters]

The harvest war reaps on people should always be talked about especially on a weekend like this one.

When is a better time? I am certainly thinking of the friends and loved ones in the military I have lost. I find it only natural to think of things like this on a weekend like this one.

Its a day to remember what their sacrafice was and just how deep it flows.

 

[The Gadfly]

I apologize for saying, "brainwashed". He became scary to me at times... Especially when he started drinking and having flashbacks.

One 4th of July he had to go to the basement and wear earplugs because the fireworks that were blasting made him nervous. I was ten at the time and I remember following him down there and asked if he was ok. I could clearly see he wasn't. He replied in a scared voice and said, "please let me be. I'll be upstairs soon.". I never understood that moment until years later as to why he seemed so frightened.

I would like to also say I am not saying all military are like this. I am only speaking from MY experience with MY father. There are amazing people who are in the military and have never acted the way dad did/does.

That's because you have never been on the other end of incoming.

Geaux,
Maybe it's also because a ten-year-old little girl whose daddy is going through that can't understand why; or why the way he acts scares her sometimes, or why he drinks too much...sometimes, it's not just about us, no matter how much we hurt....

 

[Truthmatters]

the toll is heavy and all its fallout should never be swept under the rug

 

[geauxtohell]

I apologize for saying, "brainwashed". He became scary to me at times... Especially when he started drinking and having flashbacks.

One 4th of July he had to go to the basement and wear earplugs because the fireworks that were blasting made him nervous. I was ten at the time and I remember following him down there and asked if he was ok. I could clearly see he wasn't. He replied in a scared voice and said, "please let me be. I'll be upstairs soon.". I never understood that moment until years later as to why he seemed so frightened.

I would like to also say I am not saying all military are like this. I am only speaking from MY experience with MY father. There are amazing people who are in the military and have never acted the way dad did/does.

That's because you have never been on the other end of incoming.

Geaux,
Maybe it's also because a ten-year-old little girl whose daddy is going through that can't understand why; or why the way he acts scares her sometimes, or why he drinks too much...sometimes, it's not just about us, no matter how much we hurt....

No, and I get that. As I said earlier, people should lay off of her. A message board probably isn't the best place to get family counseling, but c'est la vie.

That being said, she is old enough now (I am assuming if her father was in Viet Nam she's at least 30) to figure this stuff out. You don't have to be a military historian to know how horrific artillery is. Her example didn't sound weird or disturbing to me at all. Weird or disturbing would have been forcing her to hide in the basement with him. Her father had insight into the fact that they were just fireworks, but it still bothered him because it conjured up bad memories. That should be sufficient.

 

[California Girl]

What we're talking about here is NOT "brainwashing"; but a selection and training process designed to produce troops whose physical, intellectual and emotional abilities , as well as their motivation and dedication, allow them to perform missions in environments and situations which are far more extreme than the conventional combat soldier can be expected to cope with effectively. As an old Special Forces recruiting poster put it, "People join us not because we are different...but because they are". The fact is, though, that just as no selection and training process can produce a man that is bulletproof, it can't produce a man who is emotionally unbreakable, either. These are still men, not automatons, and every man has a breaking point. Just as the armed forces know and accept that a certain proportion of these men will be killed or wounded in doing the missions they are tasked with, they also know and accept that some will be damaged or destroyed emotionally. We're talking extraordinarily skilled and resilient, not indestructible. The man being discussed here is a case in point; something he had to do or see broke him, as it has many others. It's not about brainwashing, but about the extreme missions such operators are tasked with performing. This is just one more part of the cruel calculus of war, and especially that of unconventional warfare. It's not the military's fault, and it's not the individual's fault. The breaking point for these personnel may be both well beyond and different from that of most ordinary people, but it is there, nonetheless, and for reasons we cannot know this man reached his. What I've seen described here is severe PTSD, and those of us who have experienced that would recognize it as such. It's an occupational hazard for any combatant, and "brainwashing" has nothing to do with it, nothing at all.

You are correct.

Some can handle it, others can't.

I know a British Royal Marine who is one of the highest trained soldiers in their military. He is made of steel and yet sometimes.........

But he knows his calling is to his country and the men he serves with, and everything else comes second. That's why he's the best at what he does.

Like you said, some can handle the intense training, others can't



Those that have 'inner demons' need to get help through the VA or elsewhere.

Marines, SEALs.... any of our military.... they are human beings, not robots. But I suspect not many would want their service, or their issues, being discussed by a bunch of strangers on a messageboard.

Personally, I doubt the OP has said one truthful word since she joined the board... and I find it offensive that she would use those who serve in our military to satisfy some sick fantasy of hers.

 

[Truthmatters]

You must not be a parent gueax

 

[geauxtohell]

the toll is heavy and all its fallout should never be swept under the rug

That's sounds good on paper, but pragmatically, we can't even cure schizophrenia. How can we presume to think we can undo the things other men and women have seen and done?

We can't. All the support needs to be given to those who go to the combat zone, and I am personally glad that Rumsfled got fired so as to open the door to Robert Gates who gets the toll that soldier's are asked to carry and has made PTSD a priority.

All the same, no matter how much society devotes to people who have been in combat, the notion that we can pay enough attention or care enough about the issue to make it go away is a little Polly Annish.

 

[Grace]

"Family and friends are the forgotten casualties of war" -smokin-kat

Grace, that quote, sums up why I'm more sympathetic to the OP than a lot of people here; because it's true, and as you know from conversations with me, if anyone here knows that, I do.

It would be bad enough, if PTSD only affected those of us who have it, but it also affects friends and family members who have to deal with us, especially when we are going through a rough time with it. I've seen it tear the families of my buddies apart; and I'm neither so blind or so selfish as not to know what it has done to my own friends and loved ones.My heart aches for her father, and so many others like him, but it also aches for the parents, spouses, children and friends who have had to bear the burden as well. It may be, that some of her words were less than well-chosen, and it may be that I don't agree with some of her feelings about the military; but all I see, is someone hurting from an all-too-familiar cause asking for advice about something that I know is a terrible thing for a child to have to understand. So, when I see that, I think of my own struggles with my own demons, and the people I hurt on my long way back, and I think of buddies I couldn't help, and I think of those still going through the pain, and if I can offer up one word that might make a difference to one person, then I figure I owe it to all of them to try.

Do forgive my emotional state; but this holiday is always a hard one for me.

{{{{{Gadfly}}}}}}