MW advocates - what are the downsides of minimum wage?

[Skull Pilot]

This thread is addressed to supporters of minimum wage laws. Detractors claim that minimum wage causes unemployment and/or inflation. But most supporters will vigorously deny this. Yet they seem to set their sights pretty low when it comes to setting the level of minimum wage. I assume this is because they believe there is some downside to minimum wage, some reason to not raise it to $200/hr, but it seems they never want to talk about what that reason might be. Hopefully, someone will step up here, and clear the air.

So, what are you saying? No MW AT ALL?

I am against a $15 MW. But no MW is crazy.

All the major/medium corporations/businesses could get together and set their own MW at like $3/hr.. And what could anyone do about it? If they are ALL in cahoots - you could not use economic boycott to force them to raise it.
Lots of seniors depend on that extra income. So now they would not have enough. So are they supposed to starve?

No...you have to have a remotely reasonable MW BUT having it as a 'living wage' is also ridiculous and is not in either the Constitution or the UN Charter.

$9.50/hr with yearly increases for inflation seems fair to me.

BTW, I say $9.50 because if the present $7.25 had been raised each year with inflation after it began...today it would be about $9.50.

only 3% of workers get paid the federal MW

And many states already have higher minimums than the federal

This issue isn't as important as you people are making it out to be

 

[dblack]

This thread is addressed to supporters of minimum wage laws. Detractors claim that minimum wage causes unemployment and/or inflation. But most supporters will vigorously deny this. Yet they seem to set their sights pretty low when it comes to setting the level of minimum wage. I assume this is because they believe there is some downside to minimum wage, some reason to not raise it to $200/hr, but it seems they never want to talk about what that reason might be. Hopefully, someone will step up here, and clear the air.

So, what are you saying? No MW AT ALL?

Well, in the OP I was focused on trying to understand what MW advocates mean when they claim that there are no negative repercussions to setting or raising the minimum wage. That makes no sense to me.

But that was then. The thread has mostly devolved into the usual debates over MW.

I am against a $15 MW. But no MW is crazy.

What's crazy about it? If people are allowed to work for free (volunteer), why shouldn't they be allowed to work for a very small amount?

All the major/medium corporations/businesses could get together and set their own MW at like $3/hr.. And what could anyone do about it?

Not work for them?

If they are ALL in cahoots - you could not use economic boycott to force them to raise it.

Well, if all major/medium corporations/businesses get together (on anything) I'm buying stock ice skates, because hell will have just frozen over.

No...you have to have a remotely reasonable MW BUT having it as a 'living wage' is also ridiculous and is not in either the Constitution or the UN Charter.

The problem is that "remotely reasonable" and "living wage" are entirely subjective terms. Some people can live on $15/day, and for some $15/hr won't be nearly enough.

$9.50/hr with yearly increases for inflation seems fair to me.

Awesome, then you should refuse to work for less than that. But other people might have a different number in mind. Any reason yours is better? Any reason government should force your values on others?

 

[Wyatt earp]

This thread is addressed to supporters of minimum wage laws. Detractors claim that minimum wage causes unemployment and/or inflation. But most supporters will vigorously deny this. Yet they seem to set their sights pretty low when it comes to setting the level of minimum wage. I assume this is because they believe there is some downside to minimum wage, some reason to not raise it to $200/hr, but it seems they never want to talk about what that reason might be. Hopefully, someone will step up here, and clear the air.

So, what are you saying? No MW AT ALL?

I am against a $15 MW. But no MW is crazy.

All the major/medium corporations/businesses could get together and set their own MW at like $3/hr.. And what could anyone do about it? If they are ALL in cahoots - you could not use economic boycott to force them to raise it.
Lots of seniors depend on that extra income. So now they would not have enough. So are they supposed to starve?

No...you have to have a remotely reasonable MW BUT having it as a 'living wage' is also ridiculous and is not in either the Constitution or the UN Charter.

$9.50/hr with yearly increases for inflation seems fair to me.

BTW, I say $9.50 because if the present $7.25 had been raised each year with inflation after it began...today it would be about $9.50.

You ignorant turd,, check the job boards in low minimum wage states they pay way over MW.


.

 

[McRocket]

This thread is addressed to supporters of minimum wage laws. Detractors claim that minimum wage causes unemployment and/or inflation. But most supporters will vigorously deny this. Yet they seem to set their sights pretty low when it comes to setting the level of minimum wage. I assume this is because they believe there is some downside to minimum wage, some reason to not raise it to $200/hr, but it seems they never want to talk about what that reason might be. Hopefully, someone will step up here, and clear the air.

So, what are you saying? No MW AT ALL?

Well, in the OP I was focused on trying to understand what MW advocates mean when they claim that there are no negative repercussions to setting or raising the minimum wage. That makes no sense to me.

But that was then. The thread has mostly devolved into the usual debates over MW.

I am against a $15 MW. But no MW is crazy.

What's crazy about it? If people are allowed to work for free (volunteer), why shouldn't they be allowed to work for a very small amount?

All the major/medium corporations/businesses could get together and set their own MW at like $3/hr.. And what could anyone do about it?

Not work for them?

If they are ALL in cahoots - you could not use economic boycott to force them to raise it.

Well, if all major/medium corporations/businesses get together (on anything) I'm buying stock ice skates, because hell will have just frozen over.

No...you have to have a remotely reasonable MW BUT having it as a 'living wage' is also ridiculous and is not in either the Constitution or the UN Charter.

The problem is that "remotely reasonable" and "living wage" are entirely subjective terms. Some people can live on $15/day, and for some $15/hr won't be nearly enough.

$9.50/hr with yearly increases for inflation seems fair to me.

Awesome, then you should refuse to work for less than that. But other people might have a different number in mind. Any reason yours is better? Any reason government should force your values on others?

6 quotes to my one post?

You want me to start a debate with six different points of my one post?

Sorry...I have a life.

Besides, my experience is people that do what you did are deliberately trying to muddy the conversation. No offense.

 

[Wyatt earp]

When 40% of jobs pay shit...there isn't any thing LIKE the choice available.

People take what work they can get

So you want 40% of workers to make minimum wage?

.

 

[danielpalos]

There is lower unemployment with a higher minimum wage.

Prove that, minus all other factors, raising the MW increases employment. And slogans are not evidence.

San Francisco and Seattle have lower unemployment rates.

I said minus all other factors. Do you really not think there might be other factors involved in those cities?

besides the higher minimum wage?

capitalism works.

Try them both being wealthy cities with a high cost of living and the higher MW being a result of that, not a driver. Your slogans are not getting the job done.

The wage is still higher and the rate is still lower, regardless. They should have higher rates of unemployment, according to right wing propaganda.

 

[danielpalos]

People for the most part are exactly where they want to be.

Have you ever MET anyone who made minimum wage?

They WANT to be in that position?

How's the air on your planet?

I worked for MW in high school and within 6 months was making a dollar more an hour.

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

But I'll say it again

If you are stuffing burgers in a bag for MW for years on end then yes you WANT to be there

A fallacy of false Cause? Social services cost around fourteen dollars an hour, regardless of any of your special pleading.

There is absolutely no reason to subsidize employers with Cheap labor in a First World economy.

 

[danielpalos]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

we need an Institutional upward pressure on wages. we know the right wing only cares about the profit, not the people.

 

[Skull Pilot]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

we need an Institutional upward pressure on wages. we know the right wing only cares about the profit, not the people.

You don't care about people if all you want to do is give them free shit.

 

[danielpalos]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

Wage dominoes. Those above the bottom will need to have increases, too.

#4 in my list of potential problems.
.

in the short run or long run?

Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

 

[danielpalos]

Median income adjusted for inflation is lower today than it was in 1974. A staggering 40 percent of all Americans now make less than the 1968 minimum wage, adjusted for inflation. Median middle-class wealth is plummeting. It is now 36 percent below what it was in 2000.

There's something wrong with that. It needs to be addressed

Ok, but do you have any ideas besides minimum wage laws? Because they won't work like you're thinking. You can't just wave a government wand and make low-wage labor worth more. The market doesn't work that way.

We don't have a free market, so, yes it does work that way.

 

[Wyatt earp]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

Wage dominoes. Those above the bottom will need to have increases, too.

#4 in my list of potential problems.
.

in the short run or long run?

Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

Trickle up poor.


.

 

[Wyatt earp]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

we need an Institutional upward pressure on wages. we know the right wing only cares about the profit, not the people.

Raising minimum wage only fucks with the red States jobs


.

 

[hadit]

Prove that, minus all other factors, raising the MW increases employment. And slogans are not evidence.

San Francisco and Seattle have lower unemployment rates.

I said minus all other factors. Do you really not think there might be other factors involved in those cities?

besides the higher minimum wage?

capitalism works.

Try them both being wealthy cities with a high cost of living and the higher MW being a result of that, not a driver. Your slogans are not getting the job done.

The wage is still higher and the rate is still lower, regardless. They should have higher rates of unemployment, according to right wing propaganda.

Higher rates compared to what? If they lowered the rate now, would UE go up or down? If they raised it, which way would UE go?

You can't just take isolated examples without considering everything.

 

[Skull Pilot]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

Wage dominoes. Those above the bottom will need to have increases, too.

#4 in my list of potential problems.
.

in the short run or long run?

Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

And the increase in prices across the board reduces the purchasing power the 97% of workers who already make more than the MW

 

[danielpalos]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

we need an Institutional upward pressure on wages. we know the right wing only cares about the profit, not the people.

You don't care about people if all you want to do is give them free shit.

or subsidize Cheap labor for Capitalists.

 

[danielpalos]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

Wage dominoes. Those above the bottom will need to have increases, too.

#4 in my list of potential problems.
.

in the short run or long run?

Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand.

Trickle up poor.


.

Higher paid labor pays more in taxes and creates more in demand. We don't need tax raise economics from the democrats; we should have minimum wage raise economics to raise tax money.

 

[danielpalos]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

we need an Institutional upward pressure on wages. we know the right wing only cares about the profit, not the people.

Raising minimum wage only fucks with the red States jobs


.

Don't worry, blue States can bail them out, like usual.

 

[danielpalos]

San Francisco and Seattle have lower unemployment rates.

I said minus all other factors. Do you really not think there might be other factors involved in those cities?

besides the higher minimum wage?

capitalism works.

Try them both being wealthy cities with a high cost of living and the higher MW being a result of that, not a driver. Your slogans are not getting the job done.

The wage is still higher and the rate is still lower, regardless. They should have higher rates of unemployment, according to right wing propaganda.

Higher rates compared to what? If they lowered the rate now, would UE go up or down? If they raised it, which way would UE go?

You can't just take isolated examples without considering everything.

projecting much, right wingers.

the national average.

 

[Skull Pilot]

3% of the workforce makes the federal MW so I really don't see why your panties are in a twist here.

If they raise the minimum wage to $15/hr, over 40% will be making the same minimum wage. I wonder how they think that will play out?

we need an Institutional upward pressure on wages. we know the right wing only cares about the profit, not the people.

You don't care about people if all you want to do is give them free shit.

or subsidize Cheap labor for Capitalists.

I'm not for subsidizing any businesses but you are