Medicaid Eligibility

[xotoxi]

Seriously Xot ... what drugs do NOT have risks? Really ... just one.

None. Even oxygen can be dangerous.

But tobacco/nicotine/smoking has all risks without true benefit from a medical perspective (with the exception of ulcerative colitis where cigarette smokers have a lower risk then non-smokers).

It's a killer from every perspective, and it's use is highly prevalent (as opposed to crack, heroin, meth - which kill, but are used less commonly)

Without a true benefit? Seriously ...

I know a lot of people who are getting great benefits from their prescription drugs ... as long as they take a dozen others to keep the side effects from killing them. While nicotine can actually replace several psych meds, particularly the one that I was suppose to take for social anxiety, which had so many side effects I felt worse from them and was at a MUCH higher risk of liver failure and hear disease than smoking has ever given me. Really, take off the blinders. A drug is a drug, and all drugs have risks, and those risks are never the same for two people, nor are the side effects.

Just because a lot of people taking one drug happen to have the same illness doesn't mean the drug is responsible as well. That's why it's all circumstantial evidence, there is no definitive connection yet, only statistics which are easily manipulated for one reason or another. That's how they are able to have several "number one causes" in our country at the same time.

Okay...

Let me know if your opinion changes after your first heart attack.

 

[manu1959]

Proposal:

People who are eligible for Medicaid should lose their eligibility if they smoke.

Discuss.


(I'd prefer not to discuss whether or not Medicaid should exist, but rather if poor people, who have enough money to waste on cigarettes, should be given government funds for their healthcare.)

i agree ...and people that drink booze....and eat junk food....and are overweight....and don't exercise......

 

[KittenKoder]

None. Even oxygen can be dangerous.

But tobacco/nicotine/smoking has all risks without true benefit from a medical perspective (with the exception of ulcerative colitis where cigarette smokers have a lower risk then non-smokers).

It's a killer from every perspective, and it's use is highly prevalent (as opposed to crack, heroin, meth - which kill, but are used less commonly)

Without a true benefit? Seriously ...

I know a lot of people who are getting great benefits from their prescription drugs ... as long as they take a dozen others to keep the side effects from killing them. While nicotine can actually replace several psych meds, particularly the one that I was suppose to take for social anxiety, which had so many side effects I felt worse from them and was at a MUCH higher risk of liver failure and hear disease than smoking has ever given me. Really, take off the blinders. A drug is a drug, and all drugs have risks, and those risks are never the same for two people, nor are the side effects.

Just because a lot of people taking one drug happen to have the same illness doesn't mean the drug is responsible as well. That's why it's all circumstantial evidence, there is no definitive connection yet, only statistics which are easily manipulated for one reason or another. That's how they are able to have several "number one causes" in our country at the same time.

Okay...

Let me know if your opinion changes after your first heart attack.

Actually .. my meds for physical problems will most likely be the cause ...if not for the fact that I have naturally low blood pressure ...

 

[xotoxi]

Without a true benefit? Seriously ...

I know a lot of people who are getting great benefits from their prescription drugs ... as long as they take a dozen others to keep the side effects from killing them. While nicotine can actually replace several psych meds, particularly the one that I was suppose to take for social anxiety, which had so many side effects I felt worse from them and was at a MUCH higher risk of liver failure and hear disease than smoking has ever given me. Really, take off the blinders. A drug is a drug, and all drugs have risks, and those risks are never the same for two people, nor are the side effects.

Just because a lot of people taking one drug happen to have the same illness doesn't mean the drug is responsible as well. That's why it's all circumstantial evidence, there is no definitive connection yet, only statistics which are easily manipulated for one reason or another. That's how they are able to have several "number one causes" in our country at the same time.

Okay...

Let me know if your opinion changes after your first heart attack.

Actually .. my meds for physical problems will most likely be the cause ...if not for the fact that I have naturally low blood pressure ...

If you don't mind me asking, what meds are you referring to that can cause liver failure. I'm just curious. (If you don't want to post it, PM me).

 

[Luissa]

Twelve states—Alaska, Arizona, Connecticut, Hawaii, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Washington—and the District of Columbia have a tax at or above $2.00 per pack. Eleven states—mostly in the southeastern United States—have a tax of less than 50 cents per pack.
State Overview


So in my state in 2008 not counting the new cigarette tax you paid an average of $2 a pack towards medicaid/taxes so if spent on average $5 a day on cigarettes that would mean you pay $60 a month towards medicaid and $720 for the year. Than you take away the people who pay for their own insurance but are still supporting medicaid through their taxes, I think smokers are giving their fair share of money to cover their medical insurance. With an average of 700,000 which is a low number of people smoking in my state times that by $720 a year. I think smokers are paying their fair share towards medicaid.

well, figure of the cost of a pnuemonectomy, chemotherapy, and radiation therapy,, then get back to us.

with smokers paying about 504 million dollars in tax dollars which is a low average a year in my state alone, how many actually are medicaid, I am sure not all of them and even if they are on medicaid not all of them have high medical costs. So I would say smokers are paying for each other to have medical care along with others.
By the way on average my state spends on average300 million dollars on smoking related medical care, so that 200 million left to spend on other medical and other state programs from the taxes generated from cigarettes. Like I said at least in my state smokers are covering their own tab!

 

[DiveCon]

Twelve states—Alaska, Arizona, Connecticut, Hawaii, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Washington—and the District of Columbia have a tax at or above $2.00 per pack. Eleven states—mostly in the southeastern United States—have a tax of less than 50 cents per pack.
State Overview


So in my state in 2008 not counting the new cigarette tax you paid an average of $2 a pack towards medicaid/taxes so if spent on average $5 a day on cigarettes that would mean you pay $60 a month towards medicaid and $720 for the year. Than you take away the people who pay for their own insurance but are still supporting medicaid through their taxes, I think smokers are giving their fair share of money to cover their medical insurance. With an average of 700,000 which is a low number of people smoking in my state times that by $720 a year. I think smokers are paying their fair share towards medicaid.

well, figure of the cost of a pnuemonectomy, chemotherapy, and radiation therapy,, then get back to us.

with smokers paying about 504 million dollars in tax dollars which is a low average a year in my state alone, how many actually are medicaid, I am sure not all of them and even if they are on medicaid not all of them have high medical costs. So I would say smokers are paying for each other to have medical care along with others.
By the way on average my state spends on average300 million dollars on smoking related medical care, so that 200 million left to spend on other medical and other state programs from the taxes generated from cigarettes. Like I said at least in my state smokers are covering their own tab!

what i find interesting is they want to deny coverage to those that they expect to fund it

 

[Luissa]

well, figure of the cost of a pnuemonectomy, chemotherapy, and radiation therapy,, then get back to us.

with smokers paying about 504 million dollars in tax dollars which is a low average a year in my state alone, how many actually are medicaid, I am sure not all of them and even if they are on medicaid not all of them have high medical costs. So I would say smokers are paying for each other to have medical care along with others.
By the way on average my state spends on average300 million dollars on smoking related medical care, so that 200 million left to spend on other medical and other state programs from the taxes generated from cigarettes. Like I said at least in my state smokers are covering their own tab!

what i find interesting is they want to deny coverage to those that they expect to fund it

That is what I am saying! but you won't see too many smokers quiting in protest.

 

[KittenKoder]

Twelve states—Alaska, Arizona, Connecticut, Hawaii, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Washington—and the District of Columbia have a tax at or above $2.00 per pack. Eleven states—mostly in the southeastern United States—have a tax of less than 50 cents per pack.
State Overview


So in my state in 2008 not counting the new cigarette tax you paid an average of $2 a pack towards medicaid/taxes so if spent on average $5 a day on cigarettes that would mean you pay $60 a month towards medicaid and $720 for the year. Than you take away the people who pay for their own insurance but are still supporting medicaid through their taxes, I think smokers are giving their fair share of money to cover their medical insurance. With an average of 700,000 which is a low number of people smoking in my state times that by $720 a year. I think smokers are paying their fair share towards medicaid.

well, figure of the cost of a pnuemonectomy, chemotherapy, and radiation therapy,, then get back to us.

with smokers paying about 504 million dollars in tax dollars which is a low average a year in my state alone, how many actually are medicaid, I am sure not all of them and even if they are on medicaid not all of them have high medical costs. So I would say smokers are paying for each other to have medical care along with others.
By the way on average my state spends on average300 million dollars on smoking related medical care, so that 200 million left to spend on other medical and other state programs from the taxes generated from cigarettes. Like I said at least in my state smokers are covering their own tab!

I've been smoking for just over 20 years, and my average medical costs (other than toxic poisoning from "safe" products and infections caused by medications) never exceeds about 50 bucks a month.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Okay...

Let me know if your opinion changes after your first heart attack.

Actually .. my meds for physical problems will most likely be the cause ...if not for the fact that I have naturally low blood pressure ...

If you don't mind me asking, what meds are you referring to that can cause liver failure. I'm just curious. (If you don't want to post it, PM me).

There are several drugs that require regular blood work to ensure they are not effecting your liver adversely. I believe Lipitor is one.

Wait, didn't you say your a doctor? You do not know there are medications that can adversely effect your liver? Hope you are not giving them to your patients and forgetting to do the blood work on a regular basis.

None of my mind drugs have that as a side effect, but I believe some do. I take Celexa, Geodon and Provigal. Geodon has some potential effect on the heart. And it can raise your blood sugar. But I will never willingly stop taking it. It changed my life completely. A VERY small research group recently showed that Provigal probably effects dopamine levels and so may be addictive. I have taken it for 5 years and it is not addictive to me at all. I have stopped taking it for a week or more more than once. No problem at all. Well except the benefits I gain by taking all go away quickly. Used to take ritilan before that, never got hooked to it either.

 

[KittenKoder]

Xotoxi is either just beginning med school or lying ... sadly I hope he is just naive still.

Any hormonal medication (including steroids used for common ailments like asthma and arthritis) can seriously damage the liver if taken orally. If taken through injection or patch they increase the risk of heart attack drastically, inhaled has a less effect for many thus why those for breathing problems are generally inhaled instead of taken in other forms, it delivers it directly to the airways without the high risk of hear attacks but can lead to other breathing problems with regular usage (which doctors rarely tell patients about).

Most real doctors however lie a LOT. They don't tell you about the side effects until after they make you miserable, and then they just give you more meds for those side effects, which in turn have more side effects .... and on and on it goes. In reality doctors don't want people to be healthy, they just want people to live as long as possible and keep going to them as much as possible. Another trend that has been happening far too much is the drug pushing, many doctors will take payments from pharmacutical companies now to push their drugs, thus why this sudden increase in non-disease (restless leg syndrome anybody?), worse is that they love people on Medicaid and Medicare since they are sure to get most of their bills now, which they will trump up as much as possible. My last doctor was cool, she was very informative and honest, something rare, my newest doctor isn't as honest I fear and I may have to put her in her place soon (thinking lawsuit).

 

[editec]

Also, what about those poor people who waste money on cars.

Then there's TVs and funky boxes for them.

What about cable and internet and phone?

How about those who waste money on liquor?

Then junk food?

Then those who waste money on clothes ... bastards don't need 50 pairs of shoes.

Coffee to.

Oh and don't forget those who waste money on makeup (400 a month easy for many).

Then the diet crap?

... it would never end.

If they are paying for it great but nothing irks me like seeing someone buying cigarettes,lottery tickets and beer yet pay for their groceries with food stamps(or the electronic card they have)

You're so full of shit, dude.

 

[xotoxi]

Xotoxi is either just beginning med school or lying ... sadly I hope he is just naive still.

What the fuck are you calling me out for???

I just asked what specific medication you were on that could cause liver failure. If you don't want to tell me, that's fine.

But you don't have to insult me or my intelligence.

 

[KittenKoder]

Xotoxi is either just beginning med school or lying ... sadly I hope he is just naive still.

What the fuck are you calling me out for???

I just asked what specific medication you were on that could cause liver failure. If you don't want to tell me, that's fine.

But you don't have to insult me or my intelligence.

Seriously ... why would you ask? A well studied doctor knows that many medications are dangerous to the liver, and any danger to the liver can cause liver failure, or even worse. Even Aspirin is dangerous to the liver in large doses.

That's also only one of a million deadly and potentially harmful side effects from every medication, no drug is safe, none at all. Even the herbal suppliments can be dangerous. My argument is that Nicotine has just as many dangers as those medications pushed on us by doctors, but no one calls any of them out on that ... really ... it's wrong. Doctors have been fucking us all in the ass for too long, greed rules them, nothing more, their god complexes and lies have made the rope, and now it's time to see them hang by that rope. All this bullshit about obesity using the BMI shit, saying smoking is sooooo bad for us but pushing these drugs that are even worse at times just because a drug company paid them money to "recommend" them ... then doing all they can to keep us alive but as sick as possible though many campaigns and scare tactics. Oooh, the germs will kill us all, oh don't forget the flu shot so your immune system won't be experienced enough to handle new virus' ... let's call all the body builders fat just because they weigh more than us ... let's make people afraid of a cough, sneeze, or even bloodshot eyes just so we can make more money. Sorry, but real doctors piss me off, and if you are one then you just gave me even more reason to want to see doctors outed.

 

[KittenKoder]

May as well add this now because I know I will eventually;

It's because of the failed medications and their harmful side effects from the time I was a child that I now have:

1. SEVERE Social Anxiety (Misdiagnosed as Scizo-whatever and forced to take meds by a controlling bitch of a mother causing my developing brain to retard in the personality regions)

2. Have to wear fucking diapers at 34.

3. Unable to work the career I loved (Fast Food manager, oddly).

4. Have no sleeping cycle at all.

5. Have no sex drive at all.

 

[editec]

My condolances, Kitten.

Having been in the medical industry and having been one of those people who sometimes forced pyschiatric patients to take their meds, and then having seen the negative effects those meds caused after years of taking them, too, I shift rather uncomfortably in my seat when I read of your problems.

I do NOT trust most medications anymore.

That is, actually, one of the reasons I smoke hemp.

I trust it not to screw me up in the long run, more than the drugs any shrink would give me, and (you might find this interesting) SO DOES MY SHRINK!

 

[xotoxi]

Xotoxi is either just beginning med school or lying ... sadly I hope he is just naive still.

What the fuck are you calling me out for???

I just asked what specific medication you were on that could cause liver failure. If you don't want to tell me, that's fine.

But you don't have to insult me or my intelligence.

Seriously ... why would you ask? A well studied doctor knows that many medications are dangerous to the liver, and any danger to the liver can cause liver failure, or even worse. Even Aspirin is dangerous to the liver in large doses.

That's also only one of a million deadly and potentially harmful side effects from every medication, no drug is safe, none at all. Even the herbal suppliments can be dangerous. My argument is that Nicotine has just as many dangers as those medications pushed on us by doctors, but no one calls any of them out on that ... really ... it's wrong. Doctors have been fucking us all in the ass for too long, greed rules them, nothing more, their god complexes and lies have made the rope, and now it's time to see them hang by that rope. All this bullshit about obesity using the BMI shit, saying smoking is sooooo bad for us but pushing these drugs that are even worse at times just because a drug company paid them money to "recommend" them ... then doing all they can to keep us alive but as sick as possible though many campaigns and scare tactics. Oooh, the germs will kill us all, oh don't forget the flu shot so your immune system won't be experienced enough to handle new virus' ... let's call all the body builders fat just because they weigh more than us ... let's make people afraid of a cough, sneeze, or even bloodshot eyes just so we can make more money. Sorry, but real doctors piss me off, and if you are one then you just gave me even more reason to want to see doctors outed.

Okay...

There is so much wrong with what you wrote, that I'm not even going to waste my time correcting you.

 

[Luissa]

May as well add this now because I know I will eventually;

It's because of the failed medications and their harmful side effects from the time I was a child that I now have:

1. SEVERE Social Anxiety (Misdiagnosed as Scizo-whatever and forced to take meds by a controlling bitch of a mother causing my developing brain to retard in the personality regions)

2. Have to wear fucking diapers at 34.

3. Unable to work the career I loved (Fast Food manager, oddly).

4. Have no sleeping cycle at all.

5. Have no sex drive at all.

are you my friend meghan! jk but because they put her on meds early on she is the same way except the fast food job.

 

[johnrocks]

I have what I call mild arthritis and have been taking Tylenol Arthritis meds each night for months and it helps, I read the bottle a few nights ago and it said *could* cause liver damage if used long term so I guess regardless of the path I choose, there will come a time when someone is and my ticket will be punched, I it's not respiratory related though.

 

[KittenKoder]

May as well add this now because I know I will eventually;

It's because of the failed medications and their harmful side effects from the time I was a child that I now have:

1. SEVERE Social Anxiety (Misdiagnosed as Scizo-whatever and forced to take meds by a controlling bitch of a mother causing my developing brain to retard in the personality regions)

2. Have to wear fucking diapers at 34.

3. Unable to work the career I loved (Fast Food manager, oddly).

4. Have no sleeping cycle at all.

5. Have no sex drive at all.

are you my friend meghan! jk but because they put her on meds early on she is the same way except the fast food job.

Doctors are greedy and many parents still expect preteens and teens to actually act "normal" all the time. Combine those two and you end up with a messed up kid. No one under at least 18 should EVER be put on psych drugs ... EVER. Of course they are going to seem crazy at that age, we all did, we thought we knew everything and yet understood nothing about what was happening in our own heads. Some manage to put on the appearance of normality, but it's actually more normal if they act up at those ages.

But meh, I didn't even mention my arthritis, but that's hereditary and no one could control that. But don't take the meds for arthritis unless you are so bad you can move, those are dangerous as hell.

 

[KittenKoder]

I have what I call mild arthritis and have been taking Tylenol Arthritis meds each night for months and it helps, I read the bottle a few nights ago and it said *could* cause liver damage if used long term so I guess regardless of the path I choose, there will come a time when someone is and my ticket will be punched, I it's not respiratory related though.

Tylenol has made the best pain killers, they have very few risks and side effects while still managing pain very well. I prefer Ibuproferin for most pains because Tylenol still has a slightly higher risk of dependency.