Marijuana: It’s Time for a Conversation

[Paulie]

Baba learns nothing that isn't derived from the spoken word of jebus.

And apparently she doesn't even learn some of THAT.

 

[auditor0007]

People are hypocrites. Look at Rush Limbaugh.

Here's another example. My one friend got a felony drug charge 3 years ago. 2 other friends who are brothers, disowned him. Didn't want anything to do with him.

Well just recently one of them had the cops called on him because his radio was too loud. The radio turned on by itself. So the cops went in to make sure everything was alright and they saw his pot sitting on the counter. So they waited for him to come home and they arrested him.

I FUCKING LOVE IT!!! How's Karma for you?

So I just saw the other brother and said, "care to rethink disowning that other buddy considering what just happened to your brother?"

And OOPS!!! He didn't know his brother got arrested.

Serves them right. Judgemental mother fuckers.

Keep Cocaine and Acid and Heroine as ILLEGAL, but for god sakes, Pot is NOTHING!!!! It's about time us pot heads stood up and told the rest of you to lighten up!!

All drugs are bad and should be kept illegal. Alcohol should be illegal also. It's time to start prohibition again. I know the government can make us a drug and alcohol free country again.

 

[alan1]

And the law of the land in Germany was to turn in all Jews... Would you of done it because we're "to obey the law of the land". BTW the law of the land when he said 'he who's with out sin cast the first stone' was that she was to be stoned.

Did you even watch the video? It's not talking about smoking up. It's talking about how the laws came about. It talks about the history of the plant... BTW it's just a plant. It talks about how it's not a danger that we've all been told.

Watch and maybe you can learn something...

So are poppies and hemlock.

 

[Angel Heart]

So are poppies and hemlock.

But both of those can be grown legally... Hypocrisy at it's best.

I can get seeds on line for poppies....

Richters Product Listing

 

[Tech_Esq]

Agreed, but it STILL criminalizes people who are NOT criminals.

If you're intoxicated on hemp while driving you ought to go to jail just like somebody who is drinking alcohol or doing drugs and driving.

Of course, having some decent way to establish what (or if!) the sobriety level is for hemp is damned near impossible, because hemp does NOT effect people's ability to drive like alcohol or most drugs do.

This whole area needs to be explored scientically and dispassionately so that we can figure out how much THC it take to make one an unsafe driver.

Right now I don't think they have a clue about that.

I call BULLSHIT. In my teenage years, I recall being so blasted on weed that I kept thinking the car was trying to flip over backwards while I was driving down a hill. I will give you that you tend to drive slower on pot than on alcohol. By the time I decided to give up trying to drive, I think I was going about 20 in a 45.....thankfully no one was injured during this story.

On another note, listening to Whole Lotta Love (Zepplin) tends to intensify the intoxicating effects especially while driving.

 

[Tech_Esq]

The gateway drug argument is a red herring. If you want to get marijuana you can't just slip down to the 7-11, you have to actually find someone willing to sell it to you because it's criminal activity, so you have to enter the criminal milieu. That's the gateway. If marijuana were legalised you'd probably only have to go out to your back yard to get your own, no need to hang out with crims. If you choose to ferret out harder stuff then that's your problem. But I'd like to see the number of past/present marijuana users who have not gone on to use harder drugs. I'd be willing to suggest not too many actually do go on that path.

You're absolutely right on target with that.

I think there are also statistics from Amsterdam after its legalization program that show no change in total percentage of users from before and after legalization (after an initial 2-3 year surge). Further, I think everything is legal there not just pot. So, this further supports the "not a gateway drug" argument.

 

[DiamondDave]

I still go with the effect argument as well.. as in effect directly on others...

Alcohol you can have a drink and the person besides you is not going to get any effect off of it whatsoever... you smoke marijuana next to someone, and they can and will get some effect from the smoke they inhale thanks to your lighting up

The medical argument is a bullshit one, as the benefits for creating appetite in cancer patients etc have been translated into a prescription drug called Marinol... and inhalation is not an effective delivery system for most any drug that is not directly to impact lung function issues such as asthma...

 

[sealybobo]

I still go with the effect argument as well.. as in effect directly on others...

Alcohol you can have a drink and the person besides you is not going to get any effect off of it whatsoever... you smoke marijuana next to someone, and they can and will get some effect from the smoke they inhale thanks to your lighting up

The medical argument is a bullshit one, as the benefits for creating appetite in cancer patients etc have been translated into a prescription drug called Marinol... and inhalation is not an effective delivery system for most any drug that is not directly to impact lung function issues such as asthma...

I've heard arguments to the contrary about the pill vs puffing a joint. The fact is, a sick person prefers a joint and there is no real argument as to why they shouldn't have it.

Same with the pill that will kill you they perscribe in 2 states to terminally ill patients. Most of them never take the pill. They just die from the sickness. But it gives them piece of mind knowing that if it gets too unbearable, they have a pill they can take to end the suffering.

OMG, keep pot illegal despite the costs and troubles all because you might get some blown in your face? Get a life.

And we would be energy independent if we grew hemp for bio deasel. Further proof your side is in bed with the Saudi's and doesn't want energy independence. Because your party leaders own oil companies too. Suckers.

 

[QUENTIN]

I still go with the effect argument as well.. as in effect directly on others...

Alcohol you can have a drink and the person besides you is not going to get any effect off of it whatsoever... you smoke marijuana next to someone, and they can and will get some effect from the smoke they inhale thanks to your lighting up

Which is why you would be able to smoke only in your home/private property, and certain designated areas, just like it is everywhere else in the world where it's legalized. I lived in Prague and visited Amsterdam, despite its legality there and their generally lax laws regarding infringements on personal liberty, you can't just light up anywhere.

You can't drink on the street in America. You can't smoke cigarettes in most businesses. Marijuana legalization would decriminalize buying and possessing it and allow the government to sin tax the hell out of it, bringing in a lot of revenue and also putting all marijuana dealers out of business (the government's resources allow it to manufacture better, safer pot for less money), it wouldn't suddenly mean you could smoke on the street or in a day care center.

It is a mind-altering substance, like alcohol, and it has a potential second-hand effect, like cigarettes (though I've been around a lot of pot smoking and never felt any change from it nor failed a drug test) so it would still be reasonably controlled. It just wouldn't be illegal, because the reasons it is currently illegal are not logically sound nor Constitutionally valid and far more harm comes from it than positives.

See the report from the Nixon commissioned National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse which found no legal basis for the criminalization of private, personal drug use and recommended an end to the prohibition:

National Commission on Marihuana and Drug Abuse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[DiamondDave]

I've heard arguments to the contrary about the pill vs puffing a joint. The fact is, a sick person prefers a joint and there is no real argument as to why they shouldn't have it.

Same with the pill that will kill you they perscribe in 2 states to terminally ill patients. Most of them never take the pill. They just die from the sickness. But it gives them piece of mind knowing that if it gets too unbearable, they have a pill they can take to end the suffering.

OMG, keep pot illegal despite the costs and troubles all because you might get some blown in your face? Get a life.

And we would be energy independent if we grew hemp for bio deasel. Further proof your side is in bed with the Saudi's and doesn't want energy independence. Because your party leaders own oil companies too. Suckers.

They PREFER it because of the HIGH... DUH

Which is the ONLY reason people want it legalized... the fucking HIGH... there is no medical benefit to smoked marijuana over the marinol prescription.. ZERO.. none.. nada... zilch

There are more efficient production methods for bio diesel than Hemp (WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY more)... start looking into algae production, which I have been a HEAVY supporter of for YEARS

And when a mind altering substance can have effects reach others directly, including children in a home, people in a bar, people at a bus stop, etc, yes it is something that should not be legal

The precedent of making it legal in some ways and not others is also a very slippery slope than can lead to some very bad things with marijuana as a drug, and other currently illegal drugs as well....

If you want to sit in your house and smoke it... knock your socks off... I don't care if you do that or shoot heroin into your tiny dick or snort your dead grandfather's ashes with cocaine... but it is your choice to do it, knowing it is an illegal substance along with many other things in society.. and if caught purchasing those substances, or caught with them in your system while committing a crime, or caught with them in your system at all while driving a vehicle, etc, then live with the consequences that it is an illegal act

 

[Tech_Esq]

They PREFER it because of the HIGH... DUH

Which is the ONLY reason people want it legalized... the fucking HIGH... there is no medical benefit to smoked marijuana over the marinol prescription.. ZERO.. none.. nada... zilch

There are more efficient production methods for bio diesel than Hemp (WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY more)... start looking into algae production, which I have been a HEAVY supporter of for YEARS

And when a mind altering substance can have effects reach others directly, including children in a home, people in a bar, people at a bus stop, etc, yes it is something that should not be legal

The precedent of making it legal in some ways and not others is also a very slippery slope than can lead to some very bad things with marijuana as a drug, and other currently illegal drugs as well....

If you want to sit in your house and smoke it... knock your socks off... I don't care if you do that or shoot heroin into your tiny dick or snort your dead grandfather's ashes with cocaine... but it is your choice to do it, knowing it is an illegal substance along with many other things in society.. and if caught purchasing those substances, or caught with them in your system while committing a crime, or caught with them in your system at all while driving a vehicle, etc, then live with the consequences that it is an illegal act

I disagree. You treat it like a gun or other potentially dangerous instrumentality, you can legally purchase it, possess it and use it. But, if you do something bad with it, then you have to pay. Criminalize the potentially bad resultant behavior, not the act of possession or use.

 

[DiamondDave]

Except that a gun or weapon has a purpose.. self defense, hunting, sport, etc...

Marijuana has only 1 use and that is a high... and that is not a purpose or benefit, it is a use... again, that high being the only reason that supporters want it decriminalized... there is no benefit to marijuana use that is not obtained thru the drug marinol

 

[QUENTIN]

The only use for alcohol, cigarettes, and caffeine is also the high. The mind-altering effect it has.

There is nothing inherently illegal about having a good time and a drug doesn't have to have positive health benefits to be legal. Cigarettes have no health benefits and the effects of smoking them are even worse on your body. They're still legal because there's no good reason for them not to be. They're still regulated because there is good reason for them to be. Marijuana's no different.

The government simply has no right to send people to jail for doing something to their own bodies in their own homes that harms no one else.

Marijuana has been stigmatized due to a successful campaign by William Randolph Hearst and Henry Anslinger, who we now know prohibited it to get rid of competition for his newspaper business and painted it as a moral issue to get support from the puritanicals who would also ban lots of personal, private choices one should be free to make with their own body.

Marijuana is in no way substantially different than alcohol and cigarettes, the government's own commission intended to probe deeply into the legal status of marijuana concluded the same thing.

By the way, one of the major difference between Marinol and smoked Marijuana is that one negatively effects your liver and the other negatively effects your lungs. For people like my aunt (an evangelical who has never even been drunk) who battled cancer for years and took every prescribed drug in the book to treat and deal with the pain, their livers have been completely destroyed by pills. Once your liver goes, you face some massive problems and getting a transplant is a risky crapshoot (also, sadly but understandably, not one a terminal patient is likely to receive). Marijuana does damage your lungs, but if you've got pink lungs and a couple years at best, it's a safer alternative to any oral medication. Marinol may be better for some, smoked marijuana better for others. But both have positive effects and negative side effects.

 

[sealybobo]

Except that a gun or weapon has a purpose.. self defense, hunting, sport, etc...

Marijuana has only 1 use and that is a high... and that is not a purpose or benefit, it is a use... again, that high being the only reason that supporters want it decriminalized... there is no benefit to marijuana use that is not obtained thru the drug marinol

Yes, I want to get high. The sick person wants to get high too. That is a benefit. They don't just want to get hungry. They want the high. So what? Is that reason to ban it?

I want to get drunk when I drink. So what?

I want to win when I gamble.

If marinol was so good, why don't we want it? If it doesn't get you high, then fuck it. And I heard you do get high on it, if its the same thing I'm thinking of. I heard of a pill where you get high, it's just people prefer to smoke it.

You need to lighten up. Maybe smoke a joint.

 

[sealybobo]

The only use for alcohol, cigarettes, and caffeine is also the high. The mind-altering effect it has.

There is nothing inherently illegal about having a good time and a drug doesn't have to have positive health benefits to be legal. Cigarettes have no health benefits and the effects of smoking them are even worse on your body. They're still legal because there's no good reason for them not to be. They're still regulated because there is good reason for them to be. Marijuana's no different.

The government simply has no right to send people to jail for doing something to their own bodies in their own homes that harms no one else.

Marijuana has been stigmatized due to a successful campaign by William Randolph Hearst and Henry Anslinger, who we now know prohibited it to get rid of competition for his newspaper business and painted it as a moral issue to get support from the puritanicals who would also ban lots of personal, private choices one should be free to make with their own body.

Marijuana is in no way substantially different than alcohol and cigarettes, the government's own commission intended to probe deeply into the legal status of marijuana concluded the same thing.

I have a feeling he would ban cigarettes too if he could.

A week ago I saw a show on Prohibition. People who were for prohibition later came out to admit that it was wrong and what they were hoping for when they banned it was the exact opposite thing they got. Instead of less violence and less crime, they got more.

No doubt if you made pot legal today, NOTHING would happen. You would hardly know anything changed. Only then I would save $200 a month because I would grow my own shit. You'd find pot plants and green rooms popping up all over america. Drug dealers would lose their business. Real corporations that pay taxes would start growing really good pot. Smoke shops would open up. A new industry would be born and a new revenue source for uncle sam.

 

[Tech_Esq]

Except that a gun or weapon has a purpose.. self defense, hunting, sport, etc...

Marijuana has only 1 use and that is a high... and that is not a purpose or benefit, it is a use... again, that high being the only reason that supporters want it decriminalized... there is no benefit to marijuana use that is not obtained thru the drug marinol

That's still a legitimate purpose, so what's your point?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Except that a gun or weapon has a purpose.. self defense, hunting, sport, etc...

Marijuana has only 1 use and that is a high... and that is not a purpose or benefit, it is a use... again, that high being the only reason that supporters want it decriminalized... there is no benefit to marijuana use that is not obtained thru the drug marinol

Your argument is based on the belief that the government should have the right to control somebody's body. There are no benefits to eating a Snickers bar either, should that be made illegal as well? The fact is that if somebody wants to get high they should be free to do so the same way that somebody that wants to get drunk is free to do so.

 

[AllieBaba]

I just popped in to tell you pot heads that I walked by this room a while back and when I got to my desk there was a roach stuck to the bottom of my foot.

Just saying...you might want to be careful what you leave laying around....

 

[QUENTIN]

I just popped in to tell you pot heads that I walked by this room a while back and when I got to my desk there was a roach stuck to the bottom of my foot.

Just saying...you might want to be careful what you leave laying around....

It's easy to dismiss everyone who supports individual liberty as it pertains to all things as "potheads" when drug use happens to be one of those things.

It's also stupid and has no basis in reality though.

I don't want drugs to be legalized because I want to use them. I want drugs to be legalized because the government has no right to intrude on personal decisions people make with what to do to their bodies. All citizens have the right to do whatever the hell they want so long as it does not harm or impinge the liberties of any other citizen. That applies across the board. Any curtailment of those rights is a tyrannical over extension of government and a suppression of liberty, period.

Not to mention the fact that the drug war has been a total disaster, wastes billions and needlessly destroys tons of lives so it's not just an encroachment of our freedom, it's also a clusterfuck.

 

[Father Time]

They PREFER it because of the HIGH... DUH

Which is the ONLY reason people want it legalized... the fucking HIGH... there is no medical benefit to smoked marijuana over the marinol prescription.. ZERO.. none.. nada... zilch

Prove it, source it, get me a quote, I need evidence

There are more efficient production methods for bio diesel than Hemp (WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY more)... start looking into algae production, which I have been a HEAVY supporter of for YEARS

And when a mind altering substance can have effects reach others directly, including children in a home, people in a bar, people at a bus stop, etc, yes it is something that should not be legal

Shall we make cigarettes illegal than? It's entirely possible to smoke weed or tobacco and not effect any one else. Not everyone lives in heavily populated cities where you can't go outside without bumping into people. Your own property also works great for that purpose.

The precedent of making it legal in some ways and not others is also a very slippery slope than can lead to some very bad things with marijuana as a drug, and other currently illegal drugs as well....

Crack, heroin, meth, etc. all have the same arguments for and against legalization, which coincidentally are almost identical to the arguments for criminalizing alcohol (give or take 2nd hand smoke).

If you want to sit in your house and smoke it... knock your socks off... I don't care if you do that or shoot heroin into your tiny dick or snort your dead grandfather's ashes with cocaine... but it is your choice to do it,

Aye and it should be, as is drinking alcohol, going on an all sugar diet, or any other dangerous activity.

knowing it is an illegal substance along with many other things in society.. and if caught purchasing those substances, or caught with them in your system while committing a crime, or caught with them in your system at all while driving a vehicle, etc, then live with the consequences that it is an illegal act

Why should there be any consequences for purchasing said substances?