"Make America Great Again"...what do you think it means?

[rightwinger]

Let me see
1. It means we're going back to limiting women from being able to work, get educated and throwing them back into the kitchen.
2. It means that human rights mean less and people are treated like shit as a pass time.
3. It means we have less freedom in our lives
4. most people were paid next to shit and were used as serfs to make the rich richer. This was before TR and FDR reformed things and added rights.
5. Disabled people were considered unable to work and thought of as a joke. Not something I want to see in my life time.

Lets just say that live was far harder and there was no mercy in the 19th century you want to take us back to. Is that really worth doing?

VERY well stated.

It also means that trump is ashamed of the US. So are RWNJ trumpanzees.

The trumpanzees have had no objection to Donny Two Scoops going from country to country and trashing the US. The love it.

They love that trump has ended our Number One status around the globe.

Hell yes we're ashamed of what the U.S. has become. More importantly we're ashamed of what U.S. citizens have become. You whack-jobs have infiltrated and polluted the foundation of America and it's values.

What are you ashamed of?

 

[BrokeLoser]

....there were times when this country was better than it is today...

The bolded statement is not true.

That's why you don't understand the criticsm.

You don't get out much, do ya Doc.

Been to Detroit lately? How about Danville Illinois, or Youngstown Ohio, or Uniontown Pensylvania or Fairmont West Virginia or Cairo Illinois or Gary Indiana. Look at St Louis for Pete's sake...

Things ain't better brother. They are far, far worse. You're just not paying attention.

I've spent my whole life in the cities you're so terrified of.

And I stand by my statement.

Perhaps you'll answer the question that no one has been able to - when exactly was this "great" time?

I've spent my whole life in the cities you're so terrified of.

And I stand by my statement.

Perhaps you'll answer the question that no one has been able to - when exactly was this "great" time?

If you've spent your whole life there, then why would you think I was terrified?

The obvious tie in of those places is there economic decline. Sure, Detroit ain't no picnic, but my wife's from Ypsilanti. My mom's from Uniontown, my cousin was a mine foreman in Fairmont, my uncle worked the steelmills in Youngstown, my best friend is from Little America Illinois. I'm usually in Gary once a week.

Danville is terrible...it was included because it is in especially sad economic shape.

St Louis has gone from a population of close to a million to a scant 400,000.

If you've lived in and around these places all your life, why didn't you immediately draw the connection?

Do you believe that those cities you've mentioned are a bellwether for the country as a whole?

I'll ask you again - when exactly was America "greater" than it is now?

I've spent my whole life in the cities you're so terrified of.

And I stand by my statement.

Perhaps you'll answer the question that no one has been able to - when exactly was this "great" time?

If you've spent your whole life there, then why would you think I was terrified?

The obvious tie in of those places is there economic decline. Sure, Detroit ain't no picnic, but my wife's from Ypsilanti. My mom's from Uniontown, my cousin was a mine foreman in Fairmont, my uncle worked the steelmills in Youngstown, my best friend is from Little America Illinois. I'm usually in Gary once a week.

Danville is terrible...it was included because it is in especially sad economic shape.

St Louis has gone from a population of close to a million to a scant 400,000.

If you've lived in and around these places all your life, why didn't you immediately draw the connection?

Do you believe that those cities you've mentioned are a bellwether for the country as a whole?

I'll ask you again - when exactly was America "greater" than it is now?

At the point in time that Americans were able to keep the most of their earnings.

The point in time when what people earned got them more for their money.

The only thing that I see cheaper these days is TVs and electronics.

For some it may have been when every other dude at the gym didn't stare at their ball sack and want to ram their ass or when men were men because they had a penis and not because they had a feeling.
Maybe it was when criminals were criminalized and not glamorized.
Maybe it was when core family values were taught in homes and people had faith in God.
Maybe it was when neighbors were likeminded, were friends, had no communication barriers and respected one another.
Maybe it was when you could start a conversation with the guy standing in front of you at the bank because you knew he was friendly and spoke your language.
Maybe it was when REAL Americans didn't have to send their children to private schools for $2,000 a month to get an education and keep them from immoral, misbehaving foreign filth.

 

[LeftofLeft]

-Apologizing for American Exceptionalism is not great
- Accepting dependence on foreign energy is not great.
- Pursuing Energy policies that 'necessarily' increase energy prices is not great.
- Record families on food stamps and welfare is not great.
- High UnEmployment is not great
- High Corporate Taxes, Regulation, and - ---
- Liability that stifle small businesses is not great.

Moving away from these policies and outcomes Make America Great Again.

 

[MPS777]

In regards to Trump's..

...
Cut scholarships and grants
...

If federal scholarships and grants cuts hurt your state, it’s largely because “liberals” let Washington DC have control over that policy. I don’t think they should have done that. I have to think about my state, it’s got a relatively good K-12 public education system; ranked near the very top. It’s almost entirely financed and managed at the state level, because that’s how it historically evolved. Before the New Deal broke down the wall between state and federal responsibility, education was considered a state matter. So I don’t have to worry much about an education hostile government taking power in Washington DC ruining our K-12 schools. That’s actually how the constitution was meant to be followed; “domestic tranquility” could be maintained by insulating different minded people using greater regional autonomy. If we returned to a system where the federal government was only taxing/spending on the VERY SPECIFIC enumerated items in the constitution, then higher education grants and loans would have been wholly under your state’s control, and you’d only have to worry about discussing and agreeing upon education policy amongst the people of your state. That seems to me a much more manageable solution than having to resort to screaming at each other in far flung regions of the nation on message boards and blog comment sections.

I advocate for inserting into the constitution some language that insures a basic federal health care safety net. Any American that is at or below the poverty line can get covered. Beyond that, send all other social spending/taxing responsibilities back to the states. I think that could deflate a whole heck of a lot of the angry ugly political resentments that seem to only be getting worse in this country.

 

[Correll]

I've noticed Liberals can become quite offended by the phrase and I can't for the life of me figure out why such a thing could be considered offensive to a real American.
The meaning and implication to me is clear....there were times when this country was better than it is today...let's work toward becoming the type of citizens we were during those times.
Why does that notion suck again?

All you deplorables heard the dog whistle. You know it means,” Make America WHITE again.”

You are a race baiting asshole. FUCK YOU .

 

[Correll]

I've noticed Liberals can become quite offended by the phrase and I can't for the life of me figure out why such a thing could be considered offensive to a real American.
The meaning and implication to me is clear....there were times when this country was better than it is today...let's work toward becoming the type of citizens we were during those times.
Why does that notion suck again?

All you deplorables heard the dog whistle. You know it means,” Make America WHITE again.”

Nothing set them off as much as a negro in the Whitehouse

Their immediate response was Obama was not a true President

Then the rallying cry was that America could not be great if Obama was President

Says the partisan lefty pretending to not remember how much republicans hated Bill Clinton, or even more recently Hillary Clinton.


Not to mention how much the Lefties hate Trump now, or hated the Bushes, and Reagan.


Obama got the normal, bitter partisan treatment, that is the norm for America.


You are a race baiting piece of shit.

 

[Correll]

I've spent my whole life in the cities you're so terrified of.

And I stand by my statement.

Perhaps you'll answer the question that no one has been able to - when exactly was this "great" time?

If you've spent your whole life there, then why would you think I was terrified?

The obvious tie in of those places is there economic decline. Sure, Detroit ain't no picnic, but my wife's from Ypsilanti. My mom's from Uniontown, my cousin was a mine foreman in Fairmont, my uncle worked the steelmills in Youngstown, my best friend is from Little America Illinois. I'm usually in Gary once a week.

Danville is terrible...it was included because it is in especially sad economic shape.

St Louis has gone from a population of close to a million to a scant 400,000.

If you've lived in and around these places all your life, why didn't you immediately draw the connection?

I live in the Rust Belt too. Some places are finally started to bottom out and come back.

But even there decades were lost, whole generations having a shit environment.


AND plenty of places are still just dead.

 

[Correll]

"Make America Great Again"
Considering, America began to become "Great", was during the timeline of the middle class becoming a strong force between the early 50's to the early 80's.
"Making America Great Again", would require the middle class to be strong again. Since the 1980's, middle class wages have remain basically flat and their share of the National Income has shrunk.
View attachment 156078 View attachment 156079 Based on the current tax reform plans, those who have gained the most since the 1980's, will gain the most by larger percentages of the individual benefits received.
This is not "Making America Great Again", this is an acceleration of what has made America less great.

It's turning the trade policies around to bring back those manufacturing jobs, that will reduce income inequality.


Taxing more is not the path to a rich society.

 

[Correll]

Do you believe that those cities you've mentioned are a bellwether for the country as a whole?

I'll ask you again - when exactly was America "greater" than it is now?

Yes. Those are just off the top of my head...The list is endless... Cleveland Cincinnati Wooster Lima Napoleon Fremont Circleville Dayton Columbus Canton Akron...thank God the Minerva area is seeing a resurgence due to fracking...Findlay, Toledo, Chillicothe...and that's just Ohio...all in decline...

A great nation doesn't look away as it's heartland dies.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

No.
The wage woes for drywallers are purely a result of the hiring of undocumented laborers. It's by the industry's own design. No one forced contractors to hire them. Maybe they used ancient Mayan magic to fool the white devils in to hiring them.

IF the government had enforced the democratically enacted laws of the land, the contractors would have been forced to hire the Americans at 19$ an hour.


Do you think it is better for the American to be out of work, while the illegal does the job for half the wage and the employer pockets the difference?


Because your side of the debate is fighting to keep that status quo, while I want to empower the American worker.

There is no debate. Undocumented workers come here to work because they can. Period.

It's the employers that are bigger criminals than the undocumented.

An uninteresting debate. I'm for fixing the problem, and getting the wages of Americans back up.


Do you support that or not? THis is now the THIRD time I've asked a very simple yes/no question that you are afraid to answer.

I'm for that as well. Just not for vilifying good people who just want to work.

I'm not vilifying anyone.

I'm discussing the effect of their presence in our labor pool.


So, we agree we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


So, what is your path to get there?

I'm not vilifying anyone.

You are.
Their presence in the labor pool is only possible because employers employ them.

Placing the blame on them rather than those who create the demand for their labor is disingenuous.

 

[Correll]

IF the government had enforced the democratically enacted laws of the land, the contractors would have been forced to hire the Americans at 19$ an hour.


Do you think it is better for the American to be out of work, while the illegal does the job for half the wage and the employer pockets the difference?


Because your side of the debate is fighting to keep that status quo, while I want to empower the American worker.

There is no debate. Undocumented workers come here to work because they can. Period.

It's the employers that are bigger criminals than the undocumented.

An uninteresting debate. I'm for fixing the problem, and getting the wages of Americans back up.


Do you support that or not? THis is now the THIRD time I've asked a very simple yes/no question that you are afraid to answer.

I'm for that as well. Just not for vilifying good people who just want to work.

I'm not vilifying anyone.

I'm discussing the effect of their presence in our labor pool.


So, we agree we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


So, what is your path to get there?

I'm not vilifying anyone.

You are.
Their presence in the labor pool is only possible because employers employ them.

Placing the blame on them rather than those who create the demand for their labor is disingenuous.

Even if the actions of the employers somehow magically removed from them, the responsibility for their actions, which it does NOT,


it would still not be vilifying them to discuss the effects of their presence in the labor pool.


We've agreed that we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


I've asked you what is YOUR path to get there.


You've not answered.


What is your path to get there? (for the second time)

 

[dudmuck]

I've noticed Liberals can become quite offended by the phrase and I can't for the life of me figure out why such a thing could be considered offensive to a real American.
The meaning and implication to me is clear....there were times when this country was better than it is today...let's work toward becoming the type of citizens we were during those times.
Why does that notion suck again?

All you deplorables heard the dog whistle. You know it means,” Make America WHITE again.”

Nothing set them off as much as a negro in the Whitehouse

Their immediate response was Obama was not a true President

Then the rallying cry was that America could not be great if Obama was President

Says the partisan lefty pretending to not remember how much republicans hated Bill Clinton, or even more recently Hillary Clinton.


Not to mention how much the Lefties hate Trump now, or hated the Bushes, and Reagan.


Obama got the normal, bitter partisan treatment, that is the norm for America.


You are a race baiting piece of shit.

Criticism of Trump comes from within his own party. Its not partisan, its just reality. The 'G' is MAGA is for Golf.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Of course the real problem is the "wetbacks" rather than those who are eager to employ them.

Both are the problem.

Do you want that drywaller to make 19$ an hour or would you prefer be out of work while illegals do it for half?

No.
The wage woes for drywallers are purely a result of the hiring of undocumented laborers. It's by the industry's own design. No one forced contractors to hire them. Maybe they used ancient Mayan magic to fool the white devils in to hiring them.

IF the government had enforced the democratically enacted laws of the land, the contractors would have been forced to hire the Americans at 19$ an hour.


Do you think it is better for the American to be out of work, while the illegal does the job for half the wage and the employer pockets the difference?


Because your side of the debate is fighting to keep that status quo, while I want to empower the American worker.

There is no debate. Undocumented workers come here to work because they can. Period.

It's the employers that are bigger criminals than the undocumented.

NEGATIVE
Anyone who is for the eradication of illegals is also for aggressively hammering down on employers of illegals. Cracking down on employers may remove the incentive for Carlos to go to work....BUT what about the illegals presenting employers with fraudulent documents to gain employment? What about the incentive for Guadalupe to drop her five anchors here and collect welfare, EBT, housing assistance, health care, schooling etc etc? Will Carlos simply stay at home, not try to work...and leech on Guadalupe's taxpayer funded goodies?
In a feeble attempt to spin the issue and decriminalize illegals many have tried to sell that employers are the root cause....who's more the criminal the drug dealer or the drug manufacture? It's a retarded argument as both sides are pieces of shits. The bottom line is illegals still have plenty of motivation to come here and steal from American's even if employers aren't hiring.
The problem has to be dealt with at its source and point of origin....the border and Mexico...TA-DA!
With that said....Where do you go with your spin from here?

Anyone who is for the eradication of illegals is also for aggressively hammering down on employers of illegals.

That is simply not true. We have seen a push for a wall and deportations. I have not heard either in rhetoric or in the news a push to crack down on employers.

In a feeble attempt to spin the issue and decriminalize illegals many have tried to sell that employers are the root cause....who's more the criminal the drug dealer or the drug manufacture? It's a retarded argument as both sides are pieces of shits.

These are good people who come here to work. There is no comparison to drug dealers.
You're the one attempting to decriminalize the employers. The employers are exponentially bigger criminals.

Each person here illegally is guilty of one midemeanor count.
Employers are guilty of hundreds or thousands of counts.

The bottom line is illegals still have plenty of motivation to come here and steal from American's even if employers aren't hiring.

Except we're talking about illegal labor.

The problem has to be dealt with at its source and point of origin....the border and Mexico...TA-DA!
With that said....Where do you go with your spin from here?

I thought cracking down on employers was part of the solution?

Who's spinning?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

There is no debate. Undocumented workers come here to work because they can. Period.

It's the employers that are bigger criminals than the undocumented.

An uninteresting debate. I'm for fixing the problem, and getting the wages of Americans back up.


Do you support that or not? THis is now the THIRD time I've asked a very simple yes/no question that you are afraid to answer.

I'm for that as well. Just not for vilifying good people who just want to work.

I'm not vilifying anyone.

I'm discussing the effect of their presence in our labor pool.


So, we agree we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


So, what is your path to get there?

I'm not vilifying anyone.

You are.
Their presence in the labor pool is only possible because employers employ them.

Placing the blame on them rather than those who create the demand for their labor is disingenuous.

Even if the actions of the employers somehow magically removed from them, the responsibility for their actions, which it does NOT,


it would still not be vilifying them to discuss the effects of their presence in the labor pool.


We've agreed that we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


I've asked you what is YOUR path to get there.


You've not answered.


What is your path to get there? (for the second time)

Placing the blame for stagnant wages on illegal labor is indeed vilifying them and in no way addresses the problem.
This isn't the path. Illegal labor is not stealing opportunity from you or depressing wages.

Better wages come from employers.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

"Make America Great Again"
Considering, America began to become "Great", was during the timeline of the middle class becoming a strong force between the early 50's to the early 80's.
"Making America Great Again", would require the middle class to be strong again. Since the 1980's, middle class wages have remain basically flat and their share of the National Income has shrunk.
View attachment 156078 View attachment 156079 Based on the current tax reform plans, those who have gained the most since the 1980's, will gain the most by larger percentages of the individual benefits received.
This is not "Making America Great Again", this is an acceleration of what has made America less great.

It's turning the trade policies around to bring back those manufacturing jobs, that will reduce income inequality.


Taxing more is not the path to a rich society.

Fantasy. Just like coal jobs.

America needs retraining to meet the needs of the changing labor markets. We don't need more menial jobs.

 

[jknowgood]

Let me see
1. It means we're going back to limiting women from being able to work, get educated and throwing them back into the kitchen.
2. It means that human rights mean less and people are treated like shit as a pass time.
3. It means we have less freedom in our lives
4. most people were paid next to shit and were used as serfs to make the rich richer. This was before TR and FDR reformed things and added rights.
5. Disabled people were considered unable to work and thought of as a joke. Not something I want to see in my life time.

Lets just say that live was far harder and there was no mercy in the 19th century you want to take us back to. Is that really worth doing?

Also means that grown men use the men's room. Not the girls room.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Do you believe that those cities you've mentioned are a bellwether for the country as a whole?

I'll ask you again - when exactly was America "greater" than it is now?

Yes. Those are just off the top of my head...The list is endless... Cleveland Cincinnati Wooster Lima Napoleon Fremont Circleville Dayton Columbus Canton Akron...thank God the Minerva area is seeing a resurgence due to fracking...Findlay, Toledo, Chillicothe...and that's just Ohio...all in decline...

Simply not true. The urban areas are doing well. The rural areas suffer everywhere. There's simply no opportunity. The days of relying on Whirlpool to support half a county are gone. Perhaps people should seek out the opportunity rather than wait for it to come to them.

 

[Correll]

I've noticed Liberals can become quite offended by the phrase and I can't for the life of me figure out why such a thing could be considered offensive to a real American.
The meaning and implication to me is clear....there were times when this country was better than it is today...let's work toward becoming the type of citizens we were during those times.
Why does that notion suck again?

All you deplorables heard the dog whistle. You know it means,” Make America WHITE again.”

Nothing set them off as much as a negro in the Whitehouse

Their immediate response was Obama was not a true President

Then the rallying cry was that America could not be great if Obama was President

Says the partisan lefty pretending to not remember how much republicans hated Bill Clinton, or even more recently Hillary Clinton.


Not to mention how much the Lefties hate Trump now, or hated the Bushes, and Reagan.


Obama got the normal, bitter partisan treatment, that is the norm for America.


You are a race baiting piece of shit.

Criticism of Trump comes from within his own party. Its not partisan, its just reality. The 'G' is MAGA is for Golf.

Internal republican criticism does not mean that RW is not a partian race baiting piece of shit.


I explained what I thought he was just being partisan (the race baiting pieces of shit part required no explanation)


Would like to counter the points I raised? Because otherwise, it looks like I've revealed RW to be a partisan lefty who is just spewing bullshit.

 

[Correll]

An uninteresting debate. I'm for fixing the problem, and getting the wages of Americans back up.


Do you support that or not? THis is now the THIRD time I've asked a very simple yes/no question that you are afraid to answer.

I'm for that as well. Just not for vilifying good people who just want to work.

I'm not vilifying anyone.

I'm discussing the effect of their presence in our labor pool.


So, we agree we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


So, what is your path to get there?

I'm not vilifying anyone.

You are.
Their presence in the labor pool is only possible because employers employ them.

Placing the blame on them rather than those who create the demand for their labor is disingenuous.

Even if the actions of the employers somehow magically removed from them, the responsibility for their actions, which it does NOT,


it would still not be vilifying them to discuss the effects of their presence in the labor pool.


We've agreed that we want better jobs and wages for Americans.


I've asked you what is YOUR path to get there.


You've not answered.


What is your path to get there? (for the second time)

Placing the blame for stagnant wages on illegal labor is indeed vilifying them and in no way addresses the problem.
This isn't the path. Illegal labor is not stealing opportunity from you or depressing wages.

Better wages come from employers.

SUpply of labor is, AT LEAST one of the reasons for stagnant wages.


We can't address that problem if we are not allowed to discuss the problem for some odd reason.


Illegal labor, is certainly taking jobs and depressing wages. It's absurd to pretend that the law of supply and demand does not apply to labor.


Better wages do not come from employers. THey come from employers being forced to increase wages to attract needed labor.


That will not happen while US employers have unfettered access to the entire Third World.


AND for the THIRD TIME NOW, what is YOUR path to better jobs and higher wages?

 

[Correll]

"Make America Great Again"
Considering, America began to become "Great", was during the timeline of the middle class becoming a strong force between the early 50's to the early 80's.
"Making America Great Again", would require the middle class to be strong again. Since the 1980's, middle class wages have remain basically flat and their share of the National Income has shrunk.
View attachment 156078 View attachment 156079 Based on the current tax reform plans, those who have gained the most since the 1980's, will gain the most by larger percentages of the individual benefits received.
This is not "Making America Great Again", this is an acceleration of what has made America less great.

It's turning the trade policies around to bring back those manufacturing jobs, that will reduce income inequality.


Taxing more is not the path to a rich society.

Fantasy. Just like coal jobs.

America needs retraining to meet the needs of the changing labor markets. We don't need more menial jobs.

Retraining? That's the line that the Free Traders have been pushing for 40 years.

They had their chance with that one. That policy has failed.


We need more manufacturing jobs, and do dismiss them as "menial" is ignores economic reality.