Looting the USA

[jwoodie]

I used to think that the Clintons were the scumbags of the universe when it came to enriching themselves and their friends at the expense of the taxpayers, but their corrupt practices are starting to pale in comparison with those of the current occupants of the White House.

The hostile takeover of America began with seizing one of our largest companies (GM) and giving it as a political payoff to the labor union (UAW) who was most responsible for its demise. This was followed by billions of dollars of political patronage doled out to friends of the new administration under the guise of economic stimulation. After that, things got even nastier when more billions of dollars were extorted from BP under the ludicrous threat of criminal prosecution of its executives for the Gulf oil spill. Next was the vilification of local law enforcement for trying to keep order in high crime areas and rewarding thousands of felons with early release from prison.

Now that the last elections are over, the end game has begun: Companies throughout the U.S. are being pressured to hire and promote African Americans out of all proportion to their numbers or qualifications, under threat of criminal and/or administrative sanctions by the federal government. Combined with the ever-increasing ease of bringing lawsuits for alleged discrimination, this is a final (and lasting) payoff to Obama's most loyal constituency.

The last act of this conspiracy of corruption will be mass pardons after the 2016 elections, the likes of which we have never seen in the history of our Republic.

 

[g5000]

GM was not brought down by labor unions.

GM was brought down by its banking arm, GMAC (a.k.a. Ally Financial), and its toxic mortgage lending practices.

Dipshit.

 

[blastoff]

That's not the only looting that's been going on. The outright waste and fraud throughout the sprawling, bungling federal government in its various budgets and contracts is likely inestimable, yet none of our professional politicians ever seem to care about it. Every once in a while some jackass gets on his high horse about it but that's it, just more Washington hot air spewed and then it's back to business as usual.

 

[jwoodie]

GM was not brought down by labor unions.

Missing the forest again? The point is that GM was given to the UAW as a political payoff. Something that you happened to overlook?

P.S. GM asked for government assistance in 2005, recognizing that it could never meet the pension benefits demanded by the UAW.

 

[warf]

Saving GM from disappearing from the face of the earth is "seizing one of our largest companies" and trying to make an irresponsible corporation make compensation for the damage they do is " billions of dollars were extorted from BP under the ludicrous threat of criminal prosecution".

No wonder it's almost impossible to have a sane conversation on this site. Half of these folks are nuts.

 

[warf]

P.S. GM asked for government assistance in 2005, recognizing that it could never meet the pension benefits demanded by the UAW.

Pension benefits "demanded" by the UAW??????

Those pensions were promised to the workers by the company. It was one of the carrots dangled to get people to take the job.

Or do you think lying and breaking contracts is an honorable thing to do?

 

[g5000]

GM was not brought down by labor unions.

Missing the forest again? The point is that GM was given to the UAW as a political payoff. Something that you happened to overlook?

P.S. GM asked for government assistance in 2005, recognizing that it could never meet the pension benefits demanded by the UAW.

I repeat, the General Motors labor unions were not "most responsible for its demise". GMAC's toxic mortgage lending was.

As for car making, I am in agreement with David Brooks that America probably won't be making cars for much longer. He predicted five years, but I think it will be longer than that. Nonetheless, auto manufacturing will become less and less of a domestic product. We need to move on to higher tech manufacturing. That's where the money will be.

 

[boedicca]

P.S. GM asked for government assistance in 2005, recognizing that it could never meet the pension benefits demanded by the UAW.

Pension benefits "demanded" by the UAW??????

Those pensions were promised to the workers by the company. It was one of the carrots dangled to get people to take the job.

Or do you think lying and breaking contracts is an honorable thing to do?

Yes, when negotiators are on the Same Side of the Table, then the deal is fraudulent.

Taxpayers will be on the hook when the pension funds go insolvent, as will inevitably happen. The same situation applies to Public Employee Unions, who are siphoning off funds needed for city services for excessive pensions & early retirement.

 

[g5000]

Strong economic growth will mitigate looming pension obligations.

Now if we could just find some guys who know what they are doing...

 

[warf]

Taxpayers will be on the hook when the pension funds go insolvent, as will inevitably happen. The same situation applies to Public Employee Unions, who are siphoning off funds needed for city services for excessive pensions & early retirement.

Public Employee Unions are siphoning off funds needed for city services by drawing the pensions they were promised when they took those jobs?

What kind of services would be offered if there were no public employees?

Are you advocating slavery? Or saying that public employees are some how less than human?

 

[jwoodie]

Taxpayers will be on the hook when the pension funds go insolvent, as will inevitably happen. The same situation applies to Public Employee Unions, who are siphoning off funds needed for city services for excessive pensions & early retirement.

Public Employee Unions are siphoning off funds needed for city services by drawing the pensions they were promised when they took those jobs?

What kind of services would be offered if there were no public employees?

Are you advocating slavery? Or saying that public employees are some how less than human?

There has been no shortage of applicants for UAW or public employee jobs, so your argument is completely bogus. The lavish benefits "negotiated" by these groups was done through political pressure from politicians to whom they had made massive campaign contributions.

 

[warf]

There has been no shortage of applicant for UAW or public employee jobs, so your argument is completely bogus.

My argument is; when you promise employees pension benefits you have to give them those benefits when they retire. Even if irresponsible governments or companies didn't fund those pensions.

That's a pretty simple concept.

Blaming unions for companies and governments not funding pensions is brain dead. If they don't think they can fund them - don't offer them. The union negotiators didn't use a gun.

 

[jwoodie]

There has been no shortage of applicant for UAW or public employee jobs, so your argument is completely bogus.

My argument is; when you promise employees pension benefits you have to give them those benefits when they retire. Even if irresponsible governments or companies didn't fund those pensions.

That's a pretty simple concept.

Blaming unions for companies and governments not funding pensions is brain dead. If they don't think they can fund them - don't offer them. The union negotiators didn't use a gun.

Tell me about CA Gov. Gray Davis & Democrats retroactively raising public pensions by 50% immediately after their election in 1998...

The Real Cause of the Pension Crisis Mother Jones

 

[gipper]

GM was not brought down by labor unions.

Missing the forest again? The point is that GM was given to the UAW as a political payoff. Something that you happened to overlook?

P.S. GM asked for government assistance in 2005, recognizing that it could never meet the pension benefits demanded by the UAW.

To say nothing of how the government screwed GM's bondholders...a terrible injustice few Americans know about.

 

[jwoodie]

Saving GM from disappearing from the face of the earth is "seizing one of our largest companies" and trying to make an irresponsible corporation make compensation for the damage they do is " billions of dollars were extorted from BP under the ludicrous threat of criminal prosecution".

No wonder it's almost impossible to have a sane conversation on this site. Half of these folks are nuts.

There was no danger of GM "disappearing from the face of the earth." A legitimate (non-coerced) bankruptcy reorganization would have allowed it to restructure its obligations to creditors and contracts with the UAW. Instead, the creditors were illegally stiffed and the company was given to the UAW along with billions in "bailout" funds.

No wonder it's almost impossible to have a sane conversation with people who constantly try to divert attention away from the main issue in the OP.

 

[BluesLegend]

GM was not brought down by labor unions.

GM was brought down by its banking arm, GMAC (a.k.a. Ally Financial), and its toxic mortgage lending practices.

Dipshit.

What are you smoking? Unsustainable union compensation and benefits leading to a GM pension plan that was bankrupt had everything to do with the GM taxpayer bail out.

 

[boedicca]

Taxpayers will be on the hook when the pension funds go insolvent, as will inevitably happen. The same situation applies to Public Employee Unions, who are siphoning off funds needed for city services for excessive pensions & early retirement.

Public Employee Unions are siphoning off funds needed for city services by drawing the pensions they were promised when they took those jobs?

What kind of services would be offered if there were no public employees?

Are you advocating slavery? Or saying that public employees are some how less than human?

You are very gullible. I'm agreeing with FDR and George Meany who both recognized that politicians negotiating with unions are sitting on the same side of the table.

All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress. Accordingly, administrative officials and employees alike are governed and guided, and in many instances restricted, by laws which establish policies, procedures, or rules in personnel matters.

Text of FDR Letter Opposing Public Employee Government Unions - Amy Ridenour s National Center Blog - A Conservative Blog


“It is impossible to bargain collectively with the government.”

That wasn’t Newt Gingrich, or Ron Paul, or Ronald Reagan talking. That was George Meany -- the former president of the A.F.L.-C.I.O -- in 1955. Government unions are unremarkable today, but the labor movement once thought the idea absurd.

F.D.R. Warned Us About Public Sector Unions - NYTimes.com

 

[warf]

There has been no shortage of applicant for UAW or public employee jobs, so your argument is completely bogus.

My argument is; when you promise employees pension benefits you have to give them those benefits when they retire. Even if irresponsible governments or companies didn't fund those pensions.

That's a pretty simple concept.

Blaming unions for companies and governments not funding pensions is brain dead. If they don't think they can fund them - don't offer them. The union negotiators didn't use a gun.

Tell me about CA Gov. Gray Davis & Democrats retroactively raising public pensions by 50% immediately after their election in 1998...

The Real Cause of the Pension Crisis Mother Jones

The bill to increase the pension was passed in the assembly and state senate without a single dissenting vote. That means both Democrats and Republicans voted in favor.

Why are you saying it was Davis and the Democrats? Do you think there are no Republicans in California? What is your real bitch about pensions?

 

[Roadrunner]

GM was not brought down by labor unions.

GM was brought down by its banking arm, GMAC (a.k.a. Ally Financial), and its toxic mortgage lending practices.

Dipshit.

GM was brought down by vehicles that died just about the time a comparable Toyota or Honda was getting broken in.

 

[Roadrunner]

Saving GM from disappearing from the face of the earth is "seizing one of our largest companies" and trying to make an irresponsible corporation make compensation for the damage they do is " billions of dollars were extorted from BP under the ludicrous threat of criminal prosecution".

No wonder it's almost impossible to have a sane conversation on this site. Half of these folks are nuts.

There was no danger of GM "disappearing from the face of the earth." A legitimate (non-coerced) bankruptcy reorganization would have allowed it to restructure its obligations to creditors and contracts with the UAW. Instead, the creditors were illegally stiffed and the company was given to the UAW along with billions in "bailout" funds.

No wonder it's almost impossible to have a sane conversation with people who constantly try to divert attention away from the main issue in the OP.

Any sensible President would have saved GM by hiring folks to replace the broke down shit the Army drives by here every day.

It is a fuckin' disgrace; the roads they have to use suck, and the vehicles they drive suck.