Let's take a look of what being gay can mean in Iran

[Gunny]

So is drinking alcohol; being left-handed; having a diet low in fruits and vegetables, and fiber; smoking; many other things.

http://nizkor.org/features/fallacies/relativist-fallacy.html

 

[Gunny]

I don't dislike your argument because it rejects mine. I dislike it because I feel it's invalid. Heterosexuality is a proven hereditary trait: yes. Because it's the norm, but I believe homosexuality is a reaction of nature and somewhat nurture in regards to the womb. It's something one doesn't choose.

However, that is your "belief," as stated in your own words, not fact based on evidence.

In that particular thread, it was not something being discussed and was brought up to make an invalid point. In fact, the commentary that was directed at me was quite unnecessary as has been pointed out by not just myself, but by others. And I didn't bring it up out of the blue like "OMG! LOL! I'M GAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" It was brought up in a discussion on homosexuality and I brought it up to show that it had a bit of an effect on how I felt towards the topic. And I have talked about other things, if you haven't completely noticed. I've talked a bit about the Middle East, I've talked about the baby Ada in that thread, I've responded to issues regarding illegal immigration, so on and so forth. You choose to view what threads I posted in and, admittedly, they're predominantly homosexual related. But that correlates with my feeling to defend myself and other homosexuals as best I can.

I whine when people act like assholes about the subject or if they bring it up in a thread that has NOTHING to do with it. And as for "whining", I actually debate and come back with rebuttal. That's not whining.

I'm an actor. I'm a writer. I'm a fan of mythology and religion. If people want to know more about me, they need only ask.

If you are going to post in predominantly homosexual-related threads, and define yourself as a homosexual, expect to take the criticism that goes with that stance.

This is a predominantly conservative board and homosexuality is disliked if not outright rejected in varying degrees. Know your audience, actor.

And I don't care what your personal interests are. That wasn't my point at all. Just wondering if you are capable of carrying on a debate without it regressing into your sexual behavior.

 

[Kagom]

If you are going to post in predominantly homosexual-related threads, and define yourself as a homosexual, expect to take the criticism that goes with that stance.

This is a predominantly conservative board and homosexuality is disliked if not outright rejected in varying degrees. Know your audience, actor.

And I don't care what your personal interests are. That wasn't my point at all. Just wondering if you are capable of carrying on a debate without it regressing into your sexual behavior.

And? People here give out their theories on this topic that have no evidence.

I'm quite aware what it entails with. I have no problem with it.

I'm also aware of that. Big deal. It never hurts to have the opposing side's thoughts and views.

But they define me as a person and it goes to answer if I solely label myself as gay. I am capable of carrying on a discussion without it regressing to my sexual behavior, but usually I'm not the one who brings it up. If you pay attention, others will bring it up in threads not pertaining to homosexuality.

 

[CTRLALTDEL]

He doesn't have any and his argument has been shot completely to shit more than once.

Here is an experience I had 16 year ago. A nephew of mine showed signs of FEMINE behavior when he was just four years old. He was very much into girl stuff. Now today (20 years old) he is a full blown homosexual. How does a kid learn to become the opposite sex at 4 to 5 years old unless it was programmed into them already. I've also seen homosexual behavior in dogs. I've seen a female dog which refuses to be humped by a male but instead tries to hump a female. Did the dog learn homosexuality as well?

 

[mattskramer]

http://nizkor.org/features/fallacies/relativist-fallacy.html

You better review the sequence and explain the relevancy of your link. Someone said that being homosexual was unhealthy as it that would be a reason to not have homosexuality. I was explaining that many people participate in activities or have conditions that are unhealthy.

 

[Gunny]

And? People here give out their theories on this topic that have no evidence.

Full-circle. They don't claim homosexuality is anything more than what can be proven by factual evidence. That currently would be a behavior which is documented.

You on the other hand claim it is something you cannot support.

Simple as that.

I'm quite aware what it entails with. I have no problem with it.

I'm also aware of that. Big deal. It never hurts to have the opposing side's thoughts and views.

But they define me as a person and it goes to answer if I solely label myself as gay. I am capable of carrying on a discussion without it regressing to my sexual behavior, but usually I'm not the one who brings it up. If you pay attention, others will bring it up in threads not pertaining to homosexuality.

They don't know you from Adam. YOU defined yourself. I know I didn't come on this board and first post announce that I am a heterosexual male. Haven't seen anyone else do it. However, we ALL know who the homosexuals are within hours if not minutes.

 

[Gunny]

You better review the sequence and explain the relevancy of your link. Someone said that being homosexual was unhealthy as it that would be a reason to not have homosexuality. I was explaining that many people participate in activities or have conditions that are unhealthy.

I just picked one of the 42 since ALL fallacious arguments apply to you.

Once again you are comparing irrelevant behavior, some that only YOU find abnormal, to homosexuality. Just your usual, relativist, bullshit argument.

DO try to let the homosexual guy speak for himself without dragging the conversation down into the pits of relativist Hell where all your debates end up.

 

[Kagom]

They don't know you from Adam. YOU defined yourself. I know I didn't come on this board and first post announce that I am a heterosexual male. Haven't seen anyone else do it. However, we ALL know who the homosexuals are within hours if not minutes.

They claim it's a choice all the way. That hasn't been proven true yet. They also claim people can change and that's only proven by extremely biased sources.

I did define myself and, again, it was in a discussion in which I said who I am to help support why I felt that way. And you probably STILL wouldn't know if I hadn't slipped up to help justify my feelings on the subject.

 

[Gunny]

They claim it's a choice all the way. That hasn't been proven true yet. They also claim people can change and that's only proven by extremely biased sources.

Behavior is choice. It requires a conscious decision to engage in conscious behavior. That IS supported by fact.

I did define myself and, again, it was in a discussion in which I said who I am to help support why I felt that way. And you probably STILL wouldn't know if I hadn't slipped up to help justify my feelings on the subject.

Well thank you God .... he's finally seen the damned light. By accident I am sure. You're damned right I wouldn't know. Neither would anyone else; which, is exactly my point, and exactly how it should be.

 

[Kagom]

Well thank you God .... he's finally seen the damned light. By accident I am sure. You're damned right I wouldn't know. Neither would anyone else; which, is exactly my point, and exactly how it should be.

Attraction isn't choice, Gunny. To act on it is. Whenever I say "born with it" or "genetic" or anyting like that, I'm talking about the attraction.

You can't turn back the clock, Gunny. We all know now and there's not a lot we can do about it.

 

[Gunny]

Attraction isn't choice, Gunny. To act on it is. Whenever I say "born with it" or "genetic" or anyting like that, I'm talking about the attraction.

I disagree. For whatever reason, you have chosen to go against nature. Acting out an impulse rather than doing what you know is the right thing to do has set you on a path you cannot turn back from.

You can't turn back the clock, Gunny. We all know now and there's not a lot we can do about it.

Well, yeah .... you could just shut up about it and not take every little bit of bait slung your way.

 

[Kagom]

Well, yeah .... you could just shut up about it and not take every little bit of bait slung your way.

I am doing what I know is right. My knowing what is right is different than yours.

I try not to for the most part, but sometimes we can't avoid things, as it's apart of human nature.

 

[Gunny]

I am doing what I know is right. My knowing what is right is different than yours.

The basic fallacy of your argument. You aren't defying me. You're defying nature.

I try not to for the most part, but sometimes we can't avoid things, as it's apart of human nature.

Really? I'd say it's got a WHOLE lot more to do with ego and pride than "human nature." Human nature is to survive and perpetuate the species.

 

[Kagom]

Really? I'd say it's got a WHOLE lot more to do with ego and pride than "human nature." Human nature is to survive and perpetuate the species.

That's apart of human nature too. We're naturally egotistical and full of pride. Some of us are good at overcoming it and some of us aren't.

 

[Gunny]

That's apart of human nature too. We're naturally egotistical and full of pride. Some of us are good at overcoming it and some of us aren't.

You would be incorrect. You seem to have a difficult time differentiating between inherited and learned traits.

It's human nature to seek shelter, warmth, and food, and to perpetuate the species.

Pride and egotism are learned traits.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

You better review the sequence and explain the relevancy of your link. Someone said that being homosexual was unhealthy as it that would be a reason to not have homosexuality. I was explaining that many people participate in activities or have conditions that are unhealthy.

Yea, and its a good reason not to do those other activities also. So whats your point?

 

[nt250]

You better review the sequence and explain the relevancy of your link. Someone said that being homosexual was unhealthy as it that would be a reason to not have homosexuality. I was explaining that many people participate in activities or have conditions that are unhealthy.

The difference is that other people who perform unhealthy acts don't expect the rest of us to celebrate it. Gays do expect and demand just that.

Smoking is a good analogy except it's the opposite of gay rights laws. Small minded people who think the world revolves around them have managed to get laws passed that stop a personal behavior. Gays have gotten laws passed that tell others they are breaking the law if they don't accept the personal behavior of homosexuals.

A teacher can be openly gay, but heaven forbid she smokes.

 

[mattskramer]

I just picked one of the 42 since ALL fallacious arguments apply to you.

Once again you are comparing irrelevant behavior, some that only YOU find abnormal, to homosexuality. Just your usual, relativist, bullshit argument.

DO try to let the homosexual guy speak for himself without dragging the conversation down into the pits of relativist Hell where all your debates end up.

I’m knowledgeable about the subject “Relativist (Subjectivist) Fallacy”. Relativism, as described in the link that you provided suggests that what might be bad for you might not be bad for me. It is similar to the Superman complex. I am not committing that error. I’m not saying that homosexuality is not risky for me, or you, or anyone else. I am not different than anyone else. I’ll go as far as to say that if I engage in promiscuous homosexual behavior, I’m more likely to get ill than if I were to engage in equally promiscuous heterosexual behavior. I am saying that people should be free to take such risks just as people take risks with other behaviors. The cost/benefit risk/reward of activity is relative to other activity. There must be a comparison. One can’t merely say, “Homosexual behavior is dangerous and, therefore, should be outlawed.” It is dangerous compared to what? If we were to have no measuring device or means for comparison then we would have to outlaw any and all risky behavior or permit any and all risky behavior.

 

[mattskramer]

The difference is that other people who perform unhealthy acts don't expect the rest of us to celebrate it. Gays do expect and demand just that.

Do gays demand that we celebrate homosexual behavior? How did you reach that conclusion? Do you have a link to such a statement? Many gay people want, at the very least, civil unions for gay couples so that gay couples have the same degree of access to the benefits that married couples receive. I don’t see that they demand that we celebrate homosexual activity. Even if laws were passed allowing gay marriage, it does not follow that I would be forced to celebrate homosexual behavior. Abortion is allowed. I’m not celebrating abortion.

Smoking is a good analogy except it's the opposite of gay rights laws. Small minded people who think the world revolves around them have managed to get laws passed that stop a personal behavior. Gays have gotten laws passed that tell others they are breaking the law if they don't accept the personal behavior of homosexuals.

Please be more specific about the use of the term accept. Are you referring to the laws that prohibit discrimination in hiring, promotion, discharge, pay, fringe benefits, job training, classification, referral, and other aspects of employment, on the basis of race, color (a genetic condition), religion (a choice), sex or national origin? I accept that people are trying to get sexual orientation included in the list of things for which people can’t be discriminated against. I doubt that they have succeeded. Even if they have succeeded, I don’t see that my non-discrimination against gays necessarily follows that I accept homosexual behavior. Again, where is it written that that I must accept the personal behavior of anyone?

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Do gays demand that we celebrate homosexual behavior? How did you reach that conclusion? ?

Yea, in LAUSD, the LARGEST school district in the world, they have gay pride month, all the way down to the lower elementary grades.

As for your quote, that just because homosexual behavior may be dangerous, doesnt mean we should make it illegal, PLEASE show me who here said it should be illegal.

You think you are mr debater, and know all the "fallacious",“Relativist (Subjectivist) Fallacy” terms and definitions. Well, trust me, I could easily go toe to toe with you in that arena, but this is a PUBLIC forum. MOST here dont go into in depth study of philosophy and debate. You need to learn to talk at a persons level. I have read books where the first sentence I needed to look up half the words. I simply put the book down. Using large words and knowledgable definitions doesnt make one smarter, or right in the arguement.

Trust me, just on canonical philosophy alone, one could go into the depths of theory, policiics, rhetoric, Nichomacean ethics and so on and so on. Many people spend their entire lives devoted to just studying one of those areas, and if you were to go up against them in a debate, you would be left slacked jaw. Nobody here is impressed with how much education one has, but more how much of a decent arguement one has, and we dont need lectures in every post on what relativism and straw man (as your 'it shouldn't be illegal' arguement is) arguements are.