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And yet drug related deaths are something COMPLETELY WITHIN OUR ABILITY TO CONTROL! We can't prevent wars. We can't prevent accidents, but we can prevent those and you just blissfully ignore that simple fact!
Wow, just wow.
Are you guys so naive to think that criminals are going to stop being criminals simply because you take away their cash crops? As you noted, it didn't stop the Mafia. Eventually they will just move on to the next illegal activity to facilitate their cartels. Where does it stop? This magical fantasyland were we end all crime by legalizing drugs is just that.
We can't stop wars, but we can stop are eagerness to get into useless wars.
Heroin is much more addictive and much easier to overdose on.
It's also not deemed to be socially acceptable.
One reason prohibition was a disaster was that alcohol had previously been legal and was used by many Americans before they decided to make it illegal. Therefore, there was a huge demand for the product when it became illegal. While all illegal substances generate demand, the relative scope compared to alcohol is much smaller. That is why organized crime boomed. It was just the fact that something was made illegal. It was the fact that something a large portion of the society used was made illegal.
Furthermore, making alcohol illegal was a change from the status quo.
What good does it do our society to change the current status quo?
Ding, ding, ding!!!
The same argument you just made for alcohol and social acceptance can be made for drugs like pot and cocaine. You are aware that cocaine was an ingredient in a good number of products sold across the counter aren't you? There was no social stigma associated with cocaine until it was made illegal. People accepted it, used it and wanted it. Making it illegal was a change from the status quo.
snopes.com: Cocaine in Coca-Cola
And are you aware that ingesting cocaine completely changes it's pharmacological properties relative to snorting or inhaling it? If you apply cocaine locally, it's an anesthetic. If you give it direct access to your brain, it's a stimulant. Even if cocaine gave the exact same "high" by being ingested orally (it doesn't), you would have to ingest a much higher quantity of it to account for first pass metabolism by the liver before the drug got to the blood stream and then the brain compared to snorting it or smoking it.
So people who got cocaine in Coca Cola weren't exactly doing it for the same reasons that people use it for today.
You're correct. Alcohol kills far more people then all the other drugs combined save for the gang violence that accompanies them. Eliminate the gang violence and all the other drugs have much less impact on society than alcohol does.
How many people were killed in Chicago when Prohibition was in effect? How many were killed when it was lifted? The numbers are astounding. I will let you look them up so they have a stronger impact.
No, legalization won't end it, but it will significantly reduce the pain and suffering of complete innocents by a huge amount.
So riddle me this. Almost all drugs were legal up till the 1960's..did this country fall apart from that? What was the level of violent crime that was solely drug related? What was the incarceration rate of non-violent offendors? Criminologists know that 80% of all violent crime is committed by 7% of the criminal population, we have to let those animals out of jail to keep no-violent drug offendors in.
Does that make any kind of logical sense to you?
It won't end all crime, obviously, however it may take a sizable chunk out of it. If people can purchase whatever drug they wish without legal repercussions, what incentive do they have to purchase it from some seedy character in a back alley?Are you guys so naive to think that criminals are going to stop being criminals simply because you take away their cash crops? As you noted, it didn't stop the Mafia. Eventually they will just move on to the next illegal activity to facilitate their cartels. Where does it stop? This magical fantasyland were we end all crime by legalizing drugs is just that.
Almost every heroin overdose is directly due to the user not knowing the strength of the dose he or she is injecting. With purity and dose size regulated and labeled the biggest drug killer of all drug killers would be eliminated.
You're correct. Alcohol kills far more people then all the other drugs combined save for the gang violence that accompanies them. Eliminate the gang violence and all the other drugs have much less impact on society than alcohol does.
Right. This is simple statistics. The number of people using alcohol dwarfs the number of people using illegal drugs.
We haven't even touched the aspects of the law that would be affected aside from criminalization.
How many people who die from alcohol each year do so because of a car crash?
By the same logic, if we just legalized drunk driving, that number would drop to zero!
It won't end all crime, obviously, however it will take a sizable chunk out of it. If people can purchase whatever drug they wish without legal repercussions, what incentive do they have to purchase it from some seedy character in a back alley?
you are retarded
There are plenty of congressman, governors, Military commanders, professional athletes, doctors and lawyers who are alcoholics, how many heroin addicts are in prominent positions? heroin addicts may be do ok as Rock Stars or something but what else can they do?
there have been plenty of high functioning drug addicts in positions of responsibility
That's somewhat analogous to saying that "there have been plenty of high function autistic people".
However, I think we can all agree that it's a better hand to not be autistic.
Pointing out the facts is not throwing a tantrum, retardyou are retarded
Brilliant retort.
There is a reason I am not wasting my time with you on this thread. There are plenty of other posters (in fact, every other poster) on here who can discuss this matter without throwing a temper tantrum.
Now run along.
absolutely, but there is no choice involved in either scenario.
i think decriminalization would eliminate a lot, perhaps most, of the violence that surrounds illegal drug use. there is also the "forbidden fruit" aspect that attracts some kids to drugs. keeping addicts in the medical system and out of the penal system would also benefit society, imo.
absolutely, but there is no choice involved in either scenario.
Good point.
i think decriminalization would eliminate a lot, perhaps most, of the violence that surrounds illegal drug use. there is also the "forbidden fruit" aspect that attracts some kids to drugs. keeping addicts in the medical system and out of the penal system would also benefit society, imo.
I agree that treatment is much more desirable than incarceration. I wish we would try that approach first.
My issue with the ordeal is this: heroin is highly addictive. It's potential to create addicts is much higher than everything else but cigarettes. Now, if you legalize it and remove the societal stigma around the matter, we are going to have a lot of people who are addicted to heroin then would have otherwise been.
In other words, I agree with the forbidden fruit theory. I think it works both ways. I think plenty of people will never try heroin simply because it is illegal and the consequences outweigh the risk.
I see no benefit to our society in making it legal.
I understand the larger libertarian argument being made by that crowd, I just don't buy into that particular line of logic. As I am consistent, I also support public schools.
I also understand the people who are arguing that it will reduce crime. I agree it will reduce violent crime. But at what cost?
You're correct. Alcohol kills far more people then all the other drugs combined save for the gang violence that accompanies them. Eliminate the gang violence and all the other drugs have much less impact on society than alcohol does.
Right. This is simple statistics. The number of people using alcohol dwarfs the number of people using illegal drugs.
We haven't even touched the aspects of the law that would be affected aside from criminalization.
How many people who die from alcohol each year do so because of a car crash?
By the same logic, if we just legalized drunk driving, that number would drop to zero!
absolutely, but there is no choice involved in either scenario.
Good point.
i think decriminalization would eliminate a lot, perhaps most, of the violence that surrounds illegal drug use. there is also the "forbidden fruit" aspect that attracts some kids to drugs. keeping addicts in the medical system and out of the penal system would also benefit society, imo.
I agree that treatment is much more desirable than incarceration. I wish we would try that approach first.
My issue with the ordeal is this: heroin is highly addictive. It's potential to create addicts is much higher than everything else but cigarettes. Now, if you legalize it and remove the societal stigma around the matter, we are going to have a lot of people who are addicted to heroin then would have otherwise been.
In other words, I agree with the forbidden fruit theory. I think it works both ways. I think plenty of people will never try heroin simply because it is illegal and the consequences outweigh the risk.
I see no benefit to our society in making it legal.
I understand the larger libertarian argument being made by that crowd, I just don't buy into that particular line of logic. As I am consistent, I also support public schools.
I also understand the people who are arguing that it will reduce crime. I agree it will reduce violent crime. But at what cost?
i don't think that legalizing/decriminalizing it would remove the societal stigma. cigarette smoking is legal and has been stigmatized nonetheless.
Almost every heroin overdose is directly due to the user not knowing the strength of the dose he or she is injecting. With purity and dose size regulated and labeled the biggest drug killer of all drug killers would be eliminated.
