Lefties favor Islam

[Timmy]

We are defending freedom of speech . Not "Islam" per se. Islam is just another kooky religion to be kept in check by us secularists . So long as you ain't forcing your religion on others , or causing harm, you are ok.

 

[Mac1958]

We are defending freedom of speech

Ah.

So you're all for Coulter at Berkeley then. Good.
.

 

[Timmy]

We are defending freedom of speech

Ah.

So you're all for Coulter at Berkeley then. Good.
.

Freedom of religion . And speech.

 

[Timmy]

We are defending freedom of speech

Ah.

So you're all for Coulter at Berkeley then. Good.
.

I am .

Although I don't know why anyone pays attention to her . She's just a "look at me " bomb thrower for hire .

 

[EvMetro]

We are defending freedom of speech . Not "Islam" per se. Islam is just another kooky religion to be kept in check by us secularists . So long as you ain't forcing your religion on others , or causing harm, you are ok.

The euphemism that you used where Islam is just another religion is a classic example of lefties protecting Islam. It's as classic as "yea, but Christians..." Why are you defending Islam? Do you like the sound of "surrender or submit"?

 

[Kondor3]

Not surprisingly, the snowflakes and twinks on The Left see Islam as just another religion.

They really are clue-less.

 

[Tilly]

I hate islam and all fascist religions. Wtf do you mean I favor islam? lol

Which religions do you consider fascist?

 

[danielpalos]

In thread after thread, I see that lefties hold a position that favors Islam. It's not just lefties favoring and defending Islam, but lefties also take a position against Christianity at the same time. What is it about Islam that has lefties defending it like this? Is it they way Islam treats women and children? Is it the promise of global dhimmitude? Is it genital mutilation? Is it the intolerance of other religions? Is there something appealing about sharia law?

No dear; the position of some on the left is, if our Religious Right could not "do it"; why should any Person of morals believe, any other religious right can do it.

 

[Coyote]

I realize this is really just a troll bait thread...but...here goes.

Islam, like Christianity is a diverse world religion that spans many CULTURES.

Like Christianity it encompass' good and bad actors.

The funny thing is...most leftists who criticize Christianity don't seem enamored by Islam either. In fact, they state that. I don't think I've heard them say much positive about Islam specifically.

The answer to the OP question is: Freedom of Religion. You know, that pesky silly clause in our Constitution that guarantees freedom of people to worship whatever faith they wish, within the framework of our legal and constitutional system.

Why do you have such a problem with that? Why do you want to strip away the rights and freedoms of Muslims in this country? Is it religious freedom for me but not thee?

I anticipate someone will now chip in with a "whataboutism" on how Muslim majority countries treat non-Muslims.

 

[Coyote]

In thread after thread, I see that lefties hold a position that favors Islam. It's not just lefties favoring and defending Islam, but lefties also take a position against Christianity at the same time. What is it about Islam that has lefties defending it like this? Is it they way Islam treats women and children? Is it the promise of global dhimmitude? Is it genital mutilation? Is it the intolerance of other religions? Is there something appealing about sharia law?

Dear EvMetro
I am thinking that since the left reject Constitutional laws as they are taught and enforced by the Christian right,
they may accept them as taught by the Muslim scholars who take a broader approach to natural laws than just making it a Western Christian thing.

Seriously, the eighth grade history teacher who taught me the spirit of the Constitutional laws
emphasized the history of laws coming from Moses Hammurabi and Mohammad.

So if the left won't get the concept through the Conservative and Christian Right they reject politically,
maybe the spirit of the laws can be established by equal witnesses coming from the secular left!

I have noticed that many of the Muslim, Catholics, Jehovah's Witnesses, and others who are seen
as following some other authority outside the Christian path are actually part of the "secular gentiles"
under NATURAL LAWS which is how Jefferson approached Jesus and the Bible, as a secular gentile.

Both paths, the church by scriptural authority and Biblical laws and the state by secular/civil laws,
are SUPPOSED to be in harmony. The spirit of the laws of EQUAL JUSTICE is what Jesus is supposed to fulfill
for both laws of God and laws of man. So the point is for BOTH branches, the faith based right and the secular left,
to agree in TRUTH.

Our Constitutional laws based on natural laws are supposed to be universal to all humanity.
It will take the right and the left serving as two witnesses to the same truth to bring about agreement.

so if Christians are seen as representing the right, perhaps it will take the Muslim Constitutionalists to bring the left around.

Your post is the kind of stuff that inspired me to start this thread.

I doubt it. Emily's failing is that she attempts to encourage serious discussion in a thread that is meant as trollbait. She assumes you are interested in real discussion.

You offer no real evidence that lefties "prefer" Islam, just your subjective view that because they attack the bad practices of Christians (guess they can't be critized) they therefore support the bad practices of Islam.

If you can find some one who supports FGM (which is a cultural, not religious practice); subservience of women, child marriages - then by all means, bring us the links.

In the meantime, I would love to know if those sorts of things bother you when they are practiced by non-muslims cause...I just can't find many rightwing threads on it

 

[Norman]

Of course they favor Islam, they want to hang gay people and oppress women.

That's just how they naturally are. Can't help it...

 

[Borillar]

We are defending freedom of speech . Not "Islam" per se. Islam is just another kooky religion to be kept in check by us secularists . So long as you ain't forcing your religion on others , or causing harm, you are ok.

The euphemism that you used where Islam is just another religion is a classic example of lefties protecting Islam. It's as classic as "yea, but Christians..." Why are you defending Islam? Do you like the sound of "surrender or submit"?

You still haven't defined what you think "defending" Islam is. You seem to think that unless you are advocating a new crusade against Islam, you are somehow defending them. Just WTF is our approach to Islam supposed to be then?

 

[emilynghiem]

Not surprisingly, the snowflakes and twinks on The Left see Islam as just another religion.

They really are clue-less.

Dear Kondor3
There IS a difference between
A. the Muslim practice that is just a private religion separated from politics and govt and law
B. the Islamic practice that mixes elements and laws of the faith with govt politics and law
C. the EXTREME militant political religion that takes govt power and justice into the hands of individuals acting as judge jury and executioner with NO separation of powers and due process of laws

It's not just the left saying there is a difference.

I heard a conservative host filling in for Hannity who made these SAME THREE DISTINCTIONS
between
1. law abiding Muslims
2. Islamic govt
3. Jihadist terrorists

Do you want me to research the fill in host and get his name?

I was SO GLAD to hear that someone else was saying this besides me.

AND IT TURNED OUT TO BE A CONSERVATIVE HOST ON HANNITY'S RADIO TALK SHOW.

Imagine that!

[NOTE: I'm a Constitutionalist, believe in limited govt, but am a prochoice progressive Democrat who believe in equal inclusion of diversity and conflict resolution to reach a consensus on issues involving beliefs. So I stay somewhat central and try to stick where all sides agree on public policy, or keep things private where people disagree religiously.]

 

[frigidweirdo]

In thread after thread, I see that lefties hold a position that favors Islam. It's not just lefties favoring and defending Islam, but lefties also take a position against Christianity at the same time. What is it about Islam that has lefties defending it like this? Is it they way Islam treats women and children? Is it the promise of global dhimmitude? Is it genital mutilation? Is it the intolerance of other religions? Is there something appealing about sharia law?

The problem is you just don't know what people are saying.

Usually people on the left will fight for FREEDOM OF RELIGION, regardless of whether they actually like the religion or not.

Personally I think religion is ridiculous. But I also stand for people to have religious freedom. Therefore when you attack Islam, and I defend the right to religion, you see this as promoting Islam and attacking Christianity.

 

[emilynghiem]

In thread after thread, I see that lefties hold a position that favors Islam. It's not just lefties favoring and defending Islam, but lefties also take a position against Christianity at the same time. What is it about Islam that has lefties defending it like this? Is it they way Islam treats women and children? Is it the promise of global dhimmitude? Is it genital mutilation? Is it the intolerance of other religions? Is there something appealing about sharia law?

The problem is you just don't know what people are saying.

Usually people on the left will fight for FREEDOM OF RELIGION, regardless of whether they actually like the religion or not.

Personally I think religion is ridiculous. But I also stand for people to have religious freedom. Therefore when you attack Islam, and I defend the right to religion, you see this as promoting Islam and attacking Christianity.

Dear frigidweirdo:
A. the right tends to defend religious freedom when it comes to
* Christianity
* right to life
* definition of "traditional" marriage
as 1 man and 1 woman
* beliefs in gun rights
* and defending conservative beliefs against liberal agenda including gay marriage, LGBT and transgender beliefs that many reject as a CHOICE of behavior and NOT a protected class like race or gender decided at birth

B. the left tends to defend freedom of choice FROM "religious and political oppression" when it comes to
* pro choice beliefs
* atheism, secular humanism, liberalism, feminism, socialism
* beliefs in health care as a right, marriage as a right, voting rights, gay rights, transgender rights
-- These are political BELIEFS which are the equivalent of the political religion of the left, but this isn't recognized as an organized religion so it isn't barred from govt!

BOTH sides are faster at defending their own beliefs and quicker to denounce the imposition of the opposing sides' beliefs.

I haven't found very many people willing to include and treat BOTH sides' beliefs as equal. Maybe some Libertarians saying to keep BOTH beliefs about marriage out of govt.

But on the whole frigidweirdo I find as much bias on the left as on the right. The main difference is the biases on the right can be checked by citing the Constitution because most of the conservatives and Christians recognize those principles. On the left, because there is not the same level of adherence or sense of authority of law, there isn't that loyalty to Constitutional values. And the same arguments have to be made a different way.

(This might also explain why conservatives are more comfortable with other conservatives who respect the same standard principles they can all cite collectively (ie Constitutional principles they adopt in common), but tend to give up on "arguing with liberals" who require a different/relative explanation for each person and don't have a set standard way of making the same argument for the whole group since they're not all Christian or not all Constitutionalists speaking the same language for the laws.)

NOTE: how this relates back to OP ? This is why people like EvMetro discredit the left as being driven by agenda and not rallying against Islamic abuses as Christians are denounced, but see the left as siding with the Muslims against Christians. This is sadly similar to how liberal Democrats will ABUSE the Green vote to rail against corporate interests for political points while betraying true environmentalists; will ABUSE the antiwar vote to rail against Republicans and Bush oil interests while doing nothing to change the war situation and spending; will ABUSE the black vote to rail against white establishment again for political points while doing nothing to change the situation of black poverty and prison issues, etc.

 

[frigidweirdo]

In thread after thread, I see that lefties hold a position that favors Islam. It's not just lefties favoring and defending Islam, but lefties also take a position against Christianity at the same time. What is it about Islam that has lefties defending it like this? Is it they way Islam treats women and children? Is it the promise of global dhimmitude? Is it genital mutilation? Is it the intolerance of other religions? Is there something appealing about sharia law?

The problem is you just don't know what people are saying.

Usually people on the left will fight for FREEDOM OF RELIGION, regardless of whether they actually like the religion or not.

Personally I think religion is ridiculous. But I also stand for people to have religious freedom. Therefore when you attack Islam, and I defend the right to religion, you see this as promoting Islam and attacking Christianity.

Dear frigidweirdo:
A. the right tends to defend religious freedom when it comes to
* Christianity
* right to life
* definition of "traditional" marriage
as 1 man and 1 woman
* beliefs in gun rights
* and defending conservative beliefs against liberal agenda including gay marriage, LGBT and transgender beliefs that many reject as a CHOICE of behavior and NOT a protected class like race or gender decided at birth

B. the left tends to defend freedom of choice FROM "religious and political oppression" when it comes to
* pro choice beliefs
* atheism, secular humanism, liberalism, feminism, socialism
* beliefs in health care as a right, marriage as a right, voting rights, gay rights, transgender rights
-- These are political BELIEFS which are the equivalent of the political religion of the left, but this isn't recognized as an organized religion so it isn't barred from govt!

BOTH sides are faster at defending their own beliefs and quicker to denounce the imposition of the opposing sides' beliefs.

I haven't found very many people willing to include and treat BOTH sides' beliefs as equal. Maybe some Libertarians saying to keep BOTH beliefs about marriage out of govt.

But on the whole frigidweirdo I find as much bias on the left as on the right. The main difference is the biases on the right can be checked by citing the Constitution because most of the conservatives and Christians recognize those principles. On the left, because there is not the same level of adherence or sense of authority of law, there isn't that loyalty to Constitutional values. And the same arguments have to be made a different way.

(This might also explain why conservatives are more comfortable with other conservatives who respect the same standard principles they can all cite collectively (ie Constitutional principles they adopt in common), but tend to give up on "arguing with liberals" who require a different/relative explanation for each person and don't have a set standard way of making the same argument for the whole group since they're not all Christian or not all Constitutionalists speaking the same language for the laws.)

NOTE: how this relates back to OP ? This is why people like EvMetro discredit the left as being driven by agenda and not rallying against Islamic abuses as Christians are denounced, but see the left as siding with the Muslims against Christians. This is sadly similar to how liberal Democrats will ABUSE the Green vote to rail against corporate interests for political points while betraying true environmentalists; will ABUSE the antiwar vote to rail against Republicans and Bush oil interests while doing nothing to change the war situation and spending; will ABUSE the black vote to rail against white establishment again for political points while doing nothing to change the situation of black poverty and prison issues, etc.

Sure, there are people on both sides who are partisan hacks, and this forum is full of nonsense threads like this one which are just another part of the partisan game.

 

[Kondor3]

Not surprisingly, the snowflakes and twinks on The Left see Islam as just another religion.

They really are clue-less.

Dear Kondor3
There IS a difference between
A. the Muslim practice that is just a private religion separated from politics and govt and law
B. the Islamic practice that mixes elements and laws of the faith with govt politics and law
C. the EXTREME militant political religion that takes govt power and justice into the hands of individuals acting as judge jury and executioner with NO separation of powers and due process of laws

It's not just the left saying there is a difference.

I heard a conservative host filling in for Hannity who made these SAME THREE DISTINCTIONS
between
1. law abiding Muslims
2. Islamic govt
3. Jihadist terrorists

Do you want me to research the fill in host and get his name?

I was SO GLAD to hear that someone else was saying this besides me.

AND IT TURNED OUT TO BE A CONSERVATIVE HOST ON HANNITY'S RADIO TALK SHOW.

Imagine that!

[NOTE: I'm a Constitutionalist, believe in limited govt, but am a prochoice progressive Democrat who believe in equal inclusion of diversity and conflict resolution to reach a consensus on issues involving beliefs. So I stay somewhat central and try to stick where all sides agree on public policy, or keep things private where people disagree religiously.]

The trouble is, that Islam is a Warrior Cult, born in a bloodbath, expanded in a bloodbath, and sustained in periodic bloodbaths.

It's Founder was a bloodthirsty conqueror who invented a knock-off of Judaism-meets-Christianity in order to sucker large numbers of warriors into fighting for him.