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Elway never had Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Roger Craig, Dwight Clark.55-10
Montana vs Elway in SB 1990
Montana won 2 major bowls at ND
Elways never won in a bowl game at Stanford
Put Elway on that team, and you've got more wins and super bowls.
Stanford was known as an academic school back then, not a football powerhouse. Unlike Notre Dame, they actually went to class, and had a tougher schedule than Notre Dame. Back then, Notre Dame had a patsy schedule.
Montana was great, Elway was greater.
Elway had HOF Shannon Sharpe; it wasn't as if he was throwing the ball to nobody...jeezus. I seem to remember them having an impressive running back a few years there too...Terrel Davis??
I will say this; the overall talent of the 49ers (especially the 89 team) was much higher than the average talent of the Broncos and any other team. I would argue that if you took Jerry Rice and put him on a lesser team, he'd been less spectacular--you can't double him when there is Taylor and Jones on the routes too and a game breaking running back in the backfield.
As for Notre Dame not playing a tough schedule...here is what one source says:
1978 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Schedule and Results | College Football at Sports-Reference.com
1978 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Statistics
School Index: Previous Year ▪ Next Year
Navigation:
Record: 9-3, .750 W-L% (15th of 138) (Schedule and Results)
Coach: Dan Devine (9-3)
PTS/G: 24.4 (35th of 138) ▪ Opp PTS/G: 16.4 (32nd of 138)
SRS: 19.72 (8th of 138) ▪ SOS: 11.81 (8th of 138)
Bowl Game: Won Cotton Bowl 35-34 versus Houston
8th hardest schedule isn't cheddar. They played Michigan, Tennessee, Purdue, Miami (FL), USC, among others that year on the way to winning the Cotton Bowl.
According to the same source, Montana had 72 carries that year...
Elway was a stud; Montana is a legend.
Peyton Manning before Joe Montana or Tom Brady is a joke.Manning was almost as bad as Marino was in the big games.Always stunk up the joint in the playoffs the majority of the time when it counted.The only reason he won the superbowl before was he was playing against a team that did not belong there in the chicago bears.The Bears defense and speacil teams is what carried them that far to the superbowl that year.Rex Grossman showed his true colors that he did have the mentality of a starting quarterback and is now a bench warmer.Once Manning had to face a REAL team in the superbowl who had a good quarterback and offense to play against,he was a joke.Manning cant carry Montana jockstrap.
So when Peyton Manning retires in a few years with ALL the passing records, I guess you will have to come up with another reason to leave him off the list.
Montana is a legend thanks to a great coach who designed an offense to make up for his lacks.. He's also a legend because he had the greatest receiver of all time. One of the greatest backs to catch the ball out of the backfield of all time. And a defense who kept the ball in the hands of the offense.Elway never had Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Roger Craig, Dwight Clark.
Put Elway on that team, and you've got more wins and super bowls.
Stanford was known as an academic school back then, not a football powerhouse. Unlike Notre Dame, they actually went to class, and had a tougher schedule than Notre Dame. Back then, Notre Dame had a patsy schedule.
Montana was great, Elway was greater.
Elway had HOF Shannon Sharpe; it wasn't as if he was throwing the ball to nobody...jeezus. I seem to remember them having an impressive running back a few years there too...Terrel Davis??
I will say this; the overall talent of the 49ers (especially the 89 team) was much higher than the average talent of the Broncos and any other team. I would argue that if you took Jerry Rice and put him on a lesser team, he'd been less spectacular--you can't double him when there is Taylor and Jones on the routes too and a game breaking running back in the backfield.
As for Notre Dame not playing a tough schedule...here is what one source says:
1978 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Schedule and Results | College Football at Sports-Reference.com
1978 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Statistics
School Index: Previous Year ▪ Next Year
Navigation:
Record: 9-3, .750 W-L% (15th of 138) (Schedule and Results)
Coach: Dan Devine (9-3)
PTS/G: 24.4 (35th of 138) ▪ Opp PTS/G: 16.4 (32nd of 138)
SRS: 19.72 (8th of 138) ▪ SOS: 11.81 (8th of 138)
Bowl Game: Won Cotton Bowl 35-34 versus Houston
8th hardest schedule isn't cheddar. They played Michigan, Tennessee, Purdue, Miami (FL), USC, among others that year on the way to winning the Cotton Bowl.
According to the same source, Montana had 72 carries that year...
Elway was a stud; Montana is a legend.
Elways is the greatest of all time based on pure talent. toughness, knowledge of the game. And the fact that many of those Denver teams weren't that great, but his talent alone made them perrenial contenders.
The premise of this thread is best quarterback......The best quarterback was John Elway.
Based on pure talent, and giving your team a chance to win, even when your team ain't all that, It's John Elway.Montana is a legend thanks to a great coach who designed an offense to make up for his lacks.. He's also a legend because he had the greatest receiver of all time. One of the greatest backs to catch the ball out of the backfield of all time. And a defense who kept the ball in the hands of the offense.Elway had HOF Shannon Sharpe; it wasn't as if he was throwing the ball to nobody...jeezus. I seem to remember them having an impressive running back a few years there too...Terrel Davis??
I will say this; the overall talent of the 49ers (especially the 89 team) was much higher than the average talent of the Broncos and any other team. I would argue that if you took Jerry Rice and put him on a lesser team, he'd been less spectacular--you can't double him when there is Taylor and Jones on the routes too and a game breaking running back in the backfield.
As for Notre Dame not playing a tough schedule...here is what one source says:
1978 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Schedule and Results | College Football at Sports-Reference.com
8th hardest schedule isn't cheddar. They played Michigan, Tennessee, Purdue, Miami (FL), USC, among others that year on the way to winning the Cotton Bowl.
According to the same source, Montana had 72 carries that year...
Elway was a stud; Montana is a legend.
Elways is the greatest of all time based on pure talent. toughness, knowledge of the game. And the fact that many of those Denver teams weren't that great, but his talent alone made them perrenial contenders.
The premise of this thread is best quarterback......The best quarterback was John Elway.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Based on pure talent, and giving your team a chance to win, even when your team ain't all that, It's John Elway.Montana is a legend thanks to a great coach who designed an offense to make up for his lacks.. He's also a legend because he had the greatest receiver of all time. One of the greatest backs to catch the ball out of the backfield of all time. And a defense who kept the ball in the hands of the offense.
Elways is the greatest of all time based on pure talent. toughness, knowledge of the game. And the fact that many of those Denver teams weren't that great, but his talent alone made them perrenial contenders.
The premise of this thread is best quarterback......The best quarterback was John Elway.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Look at Manning, a great quarterback, but basically one dimensional. Can't run to save his life....Face it, look at the Giants last Super Bowl win, Eli's famous play. Peyton's ass would have been sacked. Why, cause he's stiff, and can't run.
I'm basing my choice on pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
It's one of those questions that will always be argued, and very few will agree upon.....Most people vote based on heart, and whether their team is involved.
I'm a die hard USC fan, and former L.A. Ram fanatic.....I never rooted for John Elway, or had a connection with him. I simply base my vote on what I saw from him all those years.
If I'm starting a team, Elway is my Quarterback.
Based on pure talent, and giving your team a chance to win, even when your team ain't all that, It's John Elway.That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Look at Manning, a great quarterback, but basically one dimensional. Can't run to save his life....Face it, look at the Giants last Super Bowl win, Eli's famous play. Peyton's ass would have been sacked. Why, cause he's stiff, and can't run.
I'm basing my choice on pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
It's one of those questions that will always be argued, and very few will agree upon.....Most people vote based on heart, and whether their team is involved.
I'm a die hard USC fan, and former L.A. Ram fanatic.....I never rooted for John Elway, or had a connection with him. I simply base my vote on what I saw from him all those years.
If I'm starting a team, Elway is my Quarterback.
Well, If that is how you are judging this, then I would go with Favre. When it comes to stats though, Manning will finish as the king. I do respect John Elway's play alot though. I guess Marino never get's any love because he never won a Superbowl. ~BH
pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
Montana is a legend thanks to a great coach who designed an offense to make up for his lacks.. He's also a legend because he had the greatest receiver of all time. One of the greatest backs to catch the ball out of the backfield of all time. And a defense who kept the ball in the hands of the offense.Elway had HOF Shannon Sharpe; it wasn't as if he was throwing the ball to nobody...jeezus. I seem to remember them having an impressive running back a few years there too...Terrel Davis??
I will say this; the overall talent of the 49ers (especially the 89 team) was much higher than the average talent of the Broncos and any other team. I would argue that if you took Jerry Rice and put him on a lesser team, he'd been less spectacular--you can't double him when there is Taylor and Jones on the routes too and a game breaking running back in the backfield.
As for Notre Dame not playing a tough schedule...here is what one source says:
1978 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Schedule and Results | College Football at Sports-Reference.com
8th hardest schedule isn't cheddar. They played Michigan, Tennessee, Purdue, Miami (FL), USC, among others that year on the way to winning the Cotton Bowl.
According to the same source, Montana had 72 carries that year...
Elway was a stud; Montana is a legend.
Elways is the greatest of all time based on pure talent. toughness, knowledge of the game. And the fact that many of those Denver teams weren't that great, but his talent alone made them perrenial contenders.
The premise of this thread is best quarterback......The best quarterback was John Elway.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
once he played against a REAL quarterback in the superbowl against Drew Brees and couldnt stay on the field all day because they had a good offense,he couldnt deliver against a good football team with a GOOD quaterback.manning couldnt carry Montana's jockstrap or many of those other quarterbacks that have been mentioned.
Montana is a legend thanks to a great coach who designed an offense to make up for his lacks.. He's also a legend because he had the greatest receiver of all time. One of the greatest backs to catch the ball out of the backfield of all time. And a defense who kept the ball in the hands of the offense.
Elways is the greatest of all time based on pure talent. toughness, knowledge of the game. And the fact that many of those Denver teams weren't that great, but his talent alone made them perrenial contenders.
The premise of this thread is best quarterback......The best quarterback was John Elway.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Big freaking deal,just like Marino,in any big game,he panics and gets scared.He finally kept his composure that one year and made it to the superbowl and only one because they were playing a team that was carried there by defense and special teams
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Big freaking deal,just like Marino,in any big game,he panics and gets scared.He finally kept his composure that one year and made it to the superbowl and only one because they were playing a team that was carried there by defense and special teams
Now I'm a big Brees fan-but in no way is Brees better than Manning.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Big freaking deal,just like Marino,in any big game,he panics and gets scared.He finally kept his composure that one year and made it to the superbowl and only one because they were playing a team that was carried there by defense and special teams
Now I'm a big Brees fan-but in no way is Brees better than Manning.
Big freaking deal,just like Marino,in any big game,he panics and gets scared.He finally kept his composure that one year and made it to the superbowl and only one because they were playing a team that was carried there by defense and special teams
Now I'm a big Brees fan-but in no way is Brees better than Manning.
I wasnt implying that.I was just saying that once Manning faced a GOOD quarterback in the superbowl,he couldnt win.He could only win when he faced a has been quarterback who is now a benchwarmer named rex grossman.
Based on pure talent, and giving your team a chance to win, even when your team ain't all that, It's John Elway.
Look at Manning, a great quarterback, but basically one dimensional. Can't run to save his life....Face it, look at the Giants last Super Bowl win, Eli's famous play. Peyton's ass would have been sacked. Why, cause he's stiff, and can't run.
I'm basing my choice on pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
It's one of those questions that will always be argued, and very few will agree upon.....Most people vote based on heart, and whether their team is involved.
I'm a die hard USC fan, and former L.A. Ram fanatic.....I never rooted for John Elway, or had a connection with him. I simply base my vote on what I saw from him all those years.
If I'm starting a team, Elway is my Quarterback.
Well, If that is how you are judging this, then I would go with Favre. When it comes to stats though, Manning will finish as the king. I do respect John Elway's play alot though. I guess Marino never get's any love because he never won a Superbowl. ~BH
I guess thats what I don't understand; if you're just going by...
pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
Marino would be your guy. He threw for 10,000 more yards than Elway playing only 1 more year. He lead the league in passing 5 years (3 years in a row so he didn't sneak up on anybody) He didn't have a HOF receiver to throw to at all like Elway did.
Miami defenses were a joke for his entire tenure;
Def Rank
Year Pts Yds
1999 19 5
1998 1 3
1997 16 26
1996 17 17
1995 10 16
1994 17 19
1993 24 20
1992 11 10
1991 24 25
1990 4 7
1989 22 24
1988 24 26
1987 16 26
1986 26 26
1985 12 23
1984 7 19
1983 1 7
the only joke funnier was their running game which featured illuminaries such as the following:
Top Players
Year Passing Rushing
1999 Marino Johnson
1998 Marino Abdul-Jabbar
1997 Marino Abdul-Jabbar
1996 Marino Abdul-Jabbar
1995 Marino Parmalee
1994 Marino Parmalee
1993 Mitchell Higgs
1992 Marino Higgs
1991 Marino Higgs
1990 Marino Smith
1989 Marino Smith
1988 Marino Hampton
1987 Marino Stradford
1986 Marino Hampton
1985 Marino Nathan
1984 Marino Bennett
1983 Marino Franklin
Marino played hurt most of his last 7 years so toughness is at least a wash. Knowledge of the game...Elway was a coach's son so it's probably hard to top him and, while this is no great measure, Dan is a studio analyst for CBS so I'm guessing he's no slouch. And in terms of being a threat, Denver does have more SB appearances than MIA; thats true but being in the AFC East with the great Bills teams of the era was harder than Denver having a comparative cake walk in the AFC West with user-friendly KC, OAK, SD, and the Seahawks if memory serves.
Marino is on my Mt. Rushmore of 4 best ever (I only judge QB's I saw play so I could appreciate the team mates, the rules, and the competition as well as their performances) as is Mr. John Elway. I'd feel comfortable with either one guiding my team.
Still I'd take Joe Montana over any of them.
Montana is a legend thanks to a great coach who designed an offense to make up for his lacks.. He's also a legend because he had the greatest receiver of all time. One of the greatest backs to catch the ball out of the backfield of all time. And a defense who kept the ball in the hands of the offense.
Elways is the greatest of all time based on pure talent. toughness, knowledge of the game. And the fact that many of those Denver teams weren't that great, but his talent alone made them perrenial contenders.
The premise of this thread is best quarterback......The best quarterback was John Elway.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Big freaking deal,just like Marino,in any big game,he panics and gets scared.He finally kept his composure that one year and made it to the superbowl and only one because they were playing a team that was carried there by defense and special teams
Now I'm a big Brees fan-but in no way is Brees better than Manning.
I wasnt implying that.I was just saying that once Manning faced a GOOD quarterback in the superbowl,he couldnt win.He could only win when he faced a has been quarterback who is now a benchwarmer named rex grossman.
He will still hold most, if not all, of the passing records when he retires. He didn't have the weapons that Montana had.
That would depend on how you are coming to that conclusion. Are you looking at QB's who did the most with the little that they had? Or are we judging by Yards, TD records ect? Or maybe number of Superbowl wins? Someone might want to make a decision on what we are debating here?
Elway better than Manning? = Insanity. Hell, I wouldn't put Elway over Favre. Elway ONE of the greatest ever? = Yeah I would say so. Like I said before, Fact is, When Manning retires he will own the most passing yards in NFL History record. ~BH
Big freaking deal,just like Marino,in any big game,he panics and gets scared.He finally kept his composure that one year and made it to the superbowl and only one because they were playing a team that was carried there by defense and special teams
"manning couldnt carry Montana's jockstrap"? Give me a break bro, That's ridiculious. He had Jerry Rice, the best ever. Well, I respect alot of your opinions, but when it comes to this subject, I don't (in regards to the quote above). I could understand you picking Montana over Manning, but not that comment. ~BH
Marino had two of the best receivers in the game, Clayton and Duper.......Somewhere along the lines of 18000 receiving yards between the two of 'em.Based on pure talent, and giving your team a chance to win, even when your team ain't all that, It's John Elway.
Look at Manning, a great quarterback, but basically one dimensional. Can't run to save his life....Face it, look at the Giants last Super Bowl win, Eli's famous play. Peyton's ass would have been sacked. Why, cause he's stiff, and can't run.
I'm basing my choice on pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
It's one of those questions that will always be argued, and very few will agree upon.....Most people vote based on heart, and whether their team is involved.
I'm a die hard USC fan, and former L.A. Ram fanatic.....I never rooted for John Elway, or had a connection with him. I simply base my vote on what I saw from him all those years.
If I'm starting a team, Elway is my Quarterback.
Well, If that is how you are judging this, then I would go with Favre. When it comes to stats though, Manning will finish as the king. I do respect John Elway's play alot though. I guess Marino never get's any love because he never won a Superbowl. ~BH
I guess thats what I don't understand; if you're just going by...
pure talent, toughness, knowledge of the game, and the ability to take a mediocre team and make them a perrenial threat.
Marino would be your guy. He threw for 10,000 more yards than Elway playing only 1 more year. He lead the league in passing 5 years (3 years in a row so he didn't sneak up on anybody) He didn't have a HOF receiver to throw to at all like Elway did.
Miami defenses were a joke for his entire tenure;
Def Rank
Year Pts Yds
1999 19 5
1998 1 3
1997 16 26
1996 17 17
1995 10 16
1994 17 19
1993 24 20
1992 11 10
1991 24 25
1990 4 7
1989 22 24
1988 24 26
1987 16 26
1986 26 26
1985 12 23
1984 7 19
1983 1 7
the only joke funnier was their running game which featured illuminaries such as the following:
Top Players
Year Passing Rushing
1999 Marino Johnson
1998 Marino Abdul-Jabbar
1997 Marino Abdul-Jabbar
1996 Marino Abdul-Jabbar
1995 Marino Parmalee
1994 Marino Parmalee
1993 Mitchell Higgs
1992 Marino Higgs
1991 Marino Higgs
1990 Marino Smith
1989 Marino Smith
1988 Marino Hampton
1987 Marino Stradford
1986 Marino Hampton
1985 Marino Nathan
1984 Marino Bennett
1983 Marino Franklin
Marino played hurt most of his last 7 years so toughness is at least a wash. Knowledge of the game...Elway was a coach's son so it's probably hard to top him and, while this is no great measure, Dan is a studio analyst for CBS so I'm guessing he's no slouch. And in terms of being a threat, Denver does have more SB appearances than MIA; thats true but being in the AFC East with the great Bills teams of the era was harder than Denver having a comparative cake walk in the AFC West with user-friendly KC, OAK, SD, and the Seahawks if memory serves.
Marino is on my Mt. Rushmore of 4 best ever (I only judge QB's I saw play so I could appreciate the team mates, the rules, and the competition as well as their performances) as is Mr. John Elway. I'd feel comfortable with either one guiding my team.
Still I'd take Joe Montana over any of them.
He could throw.So, when Manning breaks all the passing records, what will the excuse be then?
So, when Manning breaks all the passing records, what will the excuse be then?
