Jewish History

[Deadstick]

If you want the real history of Israel, I invite you to visit my website The Case for Israel:

The Case for Israel

The Case for Israel Why Israel Deserves Our Support Michael T. Griffith If any nation on Earth deserves our support, it is the nation of Israel. After the Holocaust, the United States led the way to help establish the state of Israel in 1948. Israel was founded mostly by Jews who left Europe

sites.google.com

You are right about one thing, Israel is a European Colonial state.

 

[Sixties Fan]

They arrived with their slaves in New Amsterdam around 1630 from Recife, Brazil. There were 15 families.

[In other words, in 1654 the Portuguese would expel the Jews from Recife "with" their slaves? I do not see that happening. ]

In September 1654, 23 Jews arrived in New Amsterdam aboard the St Cathrien. The Jews had come from Recife in Northeast Brazil, where they lived under Dutch rule. The Portuguese captured Recife from the Dutch and expelled the Jews.
When the Jews arrived the captain of the ship sued them for the money to pay for their passage. The local court sold their belonging and imprisoned two of the party.

Peter Stuyvesant the governor of the colony was not happy to receive the Jews. He described the Jews as "deceitful" and very "repugnant". Stuyvesant asked permission from the Dutch East India Company, who the colony belonged to remove the Jews from the settlement. The board, which included several Jewish investors, refused and instructed the governor to allow the new Jewish settlers to remain in New Amsterdam.

The 23 Jews who arrived are not the first Jews, to arrive in North America, but it is the first record we have of a group of men women and children arriving to make it their permanent home.

Jews arrive in New Amsterdam

Jews arrive in New Amsterdam

www.historycentral.com

 

[surada]

[In other words, in 1654 the Portuguese would expel the Jews from Recife "with" their slaves? I do not see that happening. ]

In September 1654, 23 Jews arrived in New Amsterdam aboard the St Cathrien. The Jews had come from Recife in Northeast Brazil, where they lived under Dutch rule. The Portuguese captured Recife from the Dutch and expelled the Jews.
When the Jews arrived the captain of the ship sued them for the money to pay for their passage. The local court sold their belonging and imprisoned two of the party.

Peter Stuyvesant the governor of the colony was not happy to receive the Jews. He described the Jews as "deceitful" and very "repugnant". Stuyvesant asked permission from the Dutch East India Company, who the colony belonged to remove the Jews from the settlement. The board, which included several Jewish investors, refused and instructed the governor to allow the new Jewish settlers to remain in New Amsterdam.

The 23 Jews who arrived are not the first Jews, to arrive in North America, but it is the first record we have of a group of men women and children arriving to make it their permanent home.

Jews arrive in New Amsterdam

Jews arrive in New Amsterdam

www.historycentral.com

Thanks. It was 1654. I wanted to come back and correct my error, but it timed out for an edit.

 

[surada]

Sixties Fan

The Portuguese and Dutch fell out . The opposition was English later on.

Dutch–Portuguese War - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[surada]

[In other words, in 1654 the Portuguese would expel the Jews from Recife "with" their slaves? I do not see that happening. ]

In September 1654, 23 Jews arrived in New Amsterdam aboard the St Cathrien. The Jews had come from Recife in Northeast Brazil, where they lived under Dutch rule. The Portuguese captured Recife from the Dutch and expelled the Jews.
When the Jews arrived the captain of the ship sued them for the money to pay for their passage. The local court sold their belonging and imprisoned two of the party.

Peter Stuyvesant the governor of the colony was not happy to receive the Jews. He described the Jews as "deceitful" and very "repugnant". Stuyvesant asked permission from the Dutch East India Company, who the colony belonged to remove the Jews from the settlement. The board, which included several Jewish investors, refused and instructed the governor to allow the new Jewish settlers to remain in New Amsterdam.

The 23 Jews who arrived are not the first Jews, to arrive in North America, but it is the first record we have of a group of men women and children arriving to make it their permanent home.

Jews arrive in New Amsterdam

Jews arrive in New Amsterdam

www.historycentral.com

Dutch–Portuguese War - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Sixties Fan]

Dutch–Portuguese War - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I am still not seeing your claim about the Jews arriving with their slaves. Will you call it a mistake on your part?

 

[surada]

I am still not seeing your claim about the Jews arriving with their slaves. Will you call it a mistake on your part?

You were right. It was 1654. It was 15 families and their slaves. See Sugar Jews. My family goes back to the same time and places because they worked for the Dutch East Indies company.

 

[Sixties Fan]

You were right. It was 1654. It was 15 families and their slaves. See Sugar Jews. My family goes back to the same time and places because they worked for the Dutch East Indies company.

Find a source which says these expelled Jewish families from Recife had slaves and were allowed to take the slaves with them.

 

[surada]

Find a source which says these expelled Jewish families from Recife had slaves and were allowed to take the slaves with them.

The sugar Jews had to have slave labor for their sugar plantations. They also invested in slave ships. They didn't take field hands with them to New Amsterdam... Just house slaves. It's all well documented in Brazil and in the Netherlands.

This guy was an able administrator.

1911 Encyclopædia Britannica/John Maurice of Nassau - Wikisource, the free online library

en.m.wikisource.org

 

[Sixties Fan]

The sugar Jews had to have slave labor for their sugar plantations. They also invested in slave ships. They didn't take field hands with them to New Amsterdam... Just house slaves. It's all well documented in Brazil and in the Netherlands.

This guy was an able administrator.

1911 Encyclopædia Britannica/John Maurice of Nassau - Wikisource, the free online library

en.m.wikisource.org

I continue to miss any and all sources saying that Brazil allowed Jews who were expelled from Recife in 1654, or at any other time, to take any slaves at all, plantation or domestic ones, and did not leave Brazil by themselves. Every source I find mentions only the Jewish families leaving.

You, on the other hand are adding 1+1 and turning into 5 and insist that these Jews had domestic slaves and would have been allowed to take them with them while being forcibly expelled by the Portuguese.

IF, and a BIG IF, that had actually happened, it would have been included in history books.

How many Jews expelled from Spain or Portugal were allowed to take their domestic laborers?

And in the end it is NOT WELL DOCUMENTED, because NO SOURCE says that any expelled Jews were allowed to take their domestics with them.

It does not even say that those Jews expelled from Recife had any slaves at all, domestic or not.


What else do you have?

 

[zaangalewa]

ndc

... How many Jews ... from Spain ...

I did not read now what you wrote here about the Jewish history - a very interesting and very complex theme - but as far as I can see you are currently in a kind of defense level because of senseless racist Nazi nonsense. So let me make Nazis and racists more angry just for fun: As far as I know existed theoretically no Spanish Jews any longer at this time of history. The Jews who still existed had been officially Catholics who still lived tarned in the Jewish traditions. They had been called "Krypto Jews" - what's by the way a reason why "der Übermensch" = "superman" = "Kal El" ="Clark Kent" came from the planet Krypton.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Today in Jewish History​

• Judah Touro (1854)

The 19th of Tevet is the yahrtzeit (anniversary of the passing) of American Jewish philanthropist Judah Touro (1775-1854).

 

[Mushroom]

Just house slaves. It's all well documented in Brazil and in the Netherlands.

Then share those documents. Because you have as of yet failed to produce anything.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Today in Jewish History​

• Passing of Maimonides (1204)
Rabbi Moses ben Maimon, Talmudist, Halachist, physician, philosopher and communal leader, known in the Jewish world by the acronym "Rambam" and to the world at large as "Maimonides", passed away in Egypt on the 20th of Tevet in 1204 (4965).

 

[surada]

I continue to miss any and all sources saying that Brazil allowed Jews who were expelled from Recife in 1654, or at any other time, to take any slaves at all, plantation or domestic ones, and did not leave Brazil by themselves. Every source I find mentions only the Jewish families leaving.

You, on the other hand are adding 1+1 and turning into 5 and insist that these Jews had domestic slaves and would have been allowed to take them with them while being forcibly expelled by the Portuguese.

IF, and a BIG IF, that had actually happened, it would have been included in history books.

How many Jews expelled from Spain or Portugal were allowed to take their domestic laborers?

And in the end it is NOT WELL DOCUMENTED, because NO SOURCE says that any expelled Jews were allowed to take their domestics with them.

It does not even say that those Jews expelled from Recife had any slaves at all, domestic or not.


What else do you have?

The native laborers had died or run away in Recife.. They had to import Africans to work on the sugar plantations. Why did you think they had slaves in Portugal?

 

[Sixties Fan]

The native laborers had died or run away in Recife.. They had to import Africans to work on the sugar plantations. Why did you think they had slaves in Portugal?

I will put a stop to your garbage right here.

You alleged that Jews were expelled with their slaves and left with them to New Amsterdam.

There is NO source, much less any evidence that the expelled Jews from Recife arrived in New Amsterdam with slaves, laborers or domestics.

You can post all the nonsense you like, which has nothing to do with your original post, your original allegation. You have FAILED once again......to prove the lies you want to be true for your enjoyment of watching us proving you wrong AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN.

I asked what else you had. You had more garbage to dish. More nothing to do with what you alleged in your first post, and no sources to prove that what you said was true.


Surada's trip to the land of Jews this, and Jews that continues into 2024.

 

[Mushroom]

The native laborers had died or run away in Recife

Then produce some kind of documentation to prove your claims.

Come on now, it should not be all that hard if anything you are claiming is even remotely true.

 

[irosie91]

Then produce some kind of documentation to prove your claims.

Come on now, it should not be all that hard if anything you are claiming is even remotely true.

can she cite family gossip?

 

[surada]

I continue to miss any and all sources saying that Brazil allowed Jews who were expelled from Recife in 1654, or at any other time, to take any slaves at all, plantation or domestic ones, and did not leave Brazil by themselves. Every source I find mentions only the Jewish families leaving.

You, on the other hand are adding 1+1 and turning into 5 and insist that these Jews had domestic slaves and would have been allowed to take them with them while being forcibly expelled by the Portuguese.

IF, and a BIG IF, that had actually happened, it would have been included in history books.

How many Jews expelled from Spain or Portugal were allowed to take their domestic laborers?

And in the end it is NOT WELL DOCUMENTED, because NO SOURCE says that any expelled Jews were allowed to take their domestics with them.

It does not even say that those Jews expelled from Recife had any slaves at all, domestic or not.


What else do you have?

They were expelled from Spain and Portugal and many went to Amsterdam. From there they went to Recife Brazil and got involved in sugar plantations. They were expelled from Recife in 1654 and some went to New Amsterdam. Inventories of their belongings are on line from the archives including black negro boys etc. it seems that there were 120 or so slaves from Brazil as well but they were owned by the Dutch West Indies company.

It's been more than 25 years since I studied their history because my ancestors were right there with them in Recife and in New Amsterdam.

 

[irosie91]

They were expelled from Spain and Portugal and many went to Amsterdam. From there they went to Recife Brazil and got involved in sugar plantations. They were expelled from Recife in 1654 and some went to New Amsterdam. Inventories of their belongings are on line from the archives including black negro boys etc. it seems that there were 120 or so slaves from Brazil as well but they were owned by the Dutch West Indies company.

It's been more than 25 years since I studied their history because my ancestors were right there with them in Recife and in New Amsterdam.

similar crap littered the town of my
childhood which was founded during
the pre-revolutionary war era ---like
"new amsterdam" Fortunately, that
core population, largely, has died out.