Is the US going the way of the Roman Empire?

[Ray9]

An interesting parallel exists in modern times. Although the US was established less than 250 years ago, it may be going down in an accelerated fashion for many of the same reasons that brought about the collapse of the Roman Empire. Rome itself lasted for over a thousand years but its glory days as an empire began falling apart after about five hundred. Its resources were chronically stretched with a military presence in foreign districts designed to expand power and influence, not for the people of the empire but to ensure the continuation of Rome’s control authority.

Like Rome, America today is under the thumb of tolerated de facto foreign invasions mostly in the form of uncontrolled mass migrations turning its civilized territories into chaotic, lawless idiocracies. The US Deep State, like Rome’s leadership, is densely corrupted with the self-preservation of centrally planned bureaucracies designed to maintain a status quo unable to quickly and adequately respond to threats that can topple law and order, fail to preserve cultural traditions and ensure the peaceful interactions of its citizens.

The sycophantic alliance of America’s liberal press with the Deep State dovetails quite nicely with the laments of Juvenal, a first century Roman satirical poet who complains of “Bread and Circuses”. Roman plebian society was constantly distracted with promises of free food and entertainment for votes to keep established Roman leadership in place. As in the US the people of Rome began to feel they were owed a basic existence that became more extravagant over time.

The fourth Estate in America, Hollywood and much of the entertainment industry have become the right-hand man of the US Deep State. They are the circus aspect of smoke and mirrors in tandem with the Pretorian Guard (FBI, DOJ, NSA, FISA Courts and half of US Congress). When a leader emerged in Rome that resonated with the people this threatened a power shift from the Roman state to rank and file citizens, so assassination was a common regulating agent. Impeachment in the US today is a modern manifestation of assassination to save the state.

People an ocean away in the UK are aware that history repeats itself and they know that Rome died by suicide, not murder; they reject the state to save their country. Americans can save themselves as well because as Yogi Berra said: “It’s déjà vu all over again”. It doesn’t have to be that way.

 

[Mac1958]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

If so, then yeah.

 

[The Original Tree]

Are we in a Surveillance State with Secret Courts, Lying Anonymous Witnesses, Secret Warrants, Secret Testimony, The FBI Lying to Courts and Filing False Affidavits, and Spying on Rival Political Campaigns, with ZERO Accountability?

 

[iceberg]

i've often wondered this. we're arguing over where people pee and whether or not a statue should be taken down and if a transgender sex offender should be able to read to our kids at school.

these really the important issues we need to be focusing on? of course not. but we're so hellbent on destroying the foundation out from under us in order to "demonize the other side" we're losing it all piece by piece.

 

[Mr Natural]

All empires rise and fall.

I'd say we had a pretty good run.

 

[iceberg]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

If so, then yeah.

https://www.history.com/news/8-reasons-why-rome-fell

bullet #5 is us to the core right now. the rest - meh. depends.

 

[The Original Tree]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

If so, then yeah.

You have got to be the biggest DumbAss on the planet.

The Roman Empire was destroyed by two things.

1.) Excessive spending on "Bread and Circuses" programs to keep their people pacified, and excessive taxes.

2.) Refusal of Barbarians to adopt Roman Culture and Language, and pressure from these Barbarian Groups on The Roman Empire, and their inability to continue to Recruit, and afford to Pay Roman Soldiers to continue to secure their borders.

They were basically overrun by Illegal Aliens, and then taxed their people to death which then plummeted The Western World in to The Dark Ages for several centuries.

Per the above link I just saw, AFTER I POSTED THE ABOVE REPLY:

1. Invasions by Barbarian tribes
The most straightforward theory for Western Rome’s collapse pins the fall on a string of military losses sustained against outside forces. Rome had tangled with Germanic tribes for centuries, but by the 300s “barbarian” groups like the Goths had encroached beyond the Empire’s borders. The Romans weathered a Germanic uprising in the late fourth century, but in 410 the Visigoth King Alaric successfully sacked the city of Rome. The Empire spent the next several decades under constant threat before “the Eternal City” was raided again in 455, this time by the Vandals. Finally, in 476, the Germanic leader Odoacer staged a revolt and deposed the Emperor Romulus Augustulus. From then on, no Roman emperor would ever again rule from a post in Italy, leading many to cite 476 as the year the Western Empire suffered its deathblow.

2. Economic troubles and overreliance on slave labor
Even as Rome was under attack from outside forces, it was also crumbling from within thanks to a severe financial crisis. Constant wars and overspending had significantly lightened imperial coffers, and oppressive taxation and inflation had widened the gap between rich and poor. In the hope of avoiding the taxman, many members of the wealthy classes had even fled to the countryside and set up independent fiefdoms. At the same time, the empire was rocked by a labor deficit. Rome’s economy depended on slaves to till its fields and work as craftsmen, and its military might had traditionally provided a fresh influx of conquered peoples to put to work. But when expansion ground to a halt in the second century, Rome’s supply of slaves and other war treasures began to dry up. A further blow came in the fifth century, when the Vandals claimed North Africa and began disrupting the empire’s trade by prowling the Mediterranean as pirates. With its economy faltering and its commercial and agricultural production in decline, the Empire began to lose its grip on Europe.

 

[NightFox]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

No, there were more than two.

Besides we shouldn't be so concerned with the parallels with the Roman Empire (which I'll admit are plentiful), we should focus on the parallels with the late Roman Republic which we're mimicking with near perfection; all we need now is our own Caesar v. Pompeii replay to finally lay our own Republic in its grave.

 

[Mac-7]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

If so, then yeah.

If you have groups with radically different beliefs then compromise is impossible

 

[iceberg]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

No, there were more than two.

Besides we shouldn't be so concerned with the parallels with the Roman Empire (which I'll admit are plentiful), we should focus on the parallels with the late Roman Republic which we're mimicking with near perfection; all we need now is our own Caesar v. Pompeii replay to finally lay our own Republic in its grave.

we're killing ourselves from our own success and forgetting what values made us successful to begin with.

 

[iceberg]

All empires rise and fall.

I'd say we had a pretty good run.

it ain't over yet but we sure got some rooms on fire that we set ourselves only to blame others for our own inability to grow the fuck up.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

We've just about run our course. We're pretty much teetering on dependency back to bondage.

 

[Oddball]

Was the Roman Empire pulled apart by two opposing narcissistic tribes who were convinced that they new what was best for everyone else?

If so, then yeah.

They also fell apart because they had become decadent and worthless consumers of all and producers of nothing, sucking dry the production of all their conquered territories......Not at all unlike what exists today, with the five of the six wealthiest counties in the nation being those surrounding the District of Criminals.

 

[The Original Tree]

Thanks ICEBERG:

Since we are talking about The Roman Empire:

For America's first 175 Years we had just 1 impeachment.... ONE

In our last 50 years we have had 3! The Democrats have tried to impeach every Republican President since Nixon. Think about that for a minute.

https://www.history.com/news/8-reasons-why-rome-fell

5. Government corruption and political instability

If Rome’s sheer size made it difficult to govern, ineffective and inconsistent leadership only served to magnify the problem. Being the Roman emperor had always been a particularly dangerous job, but during the tumultuous second and third centuries it nearly became a death sentence. Civil war thrust the empire into chaos, and more than 20 men took the throne in the span of only 75 years, usually after the murder of their predecessor. The Praetorian Guard—the emperor’s personal bodyguards—assassinated and installed new sovereigns at will, and once even auctioned the spot off to the highest bidder. The political rot also extended to the Roman Senate, which failed to temper the excesses of the emperors due to its own widespread corruption and incompetence. As the situation worsened, civic pride waned and many Roman citizens lost trust in their leadership.

 

[anynameyouwish]

An interesting parallel exists in modern times. Although the US was established less than 250 years ago, it may be going down in an accelerated fashion for many of the same reasons that brought about the collapse of the Roman Empire. Rome itself lasted for over a thousand years but its glory days as an empire began falling apart after about five hundred. Its resources were chronically stretched with a military presence in foreign districts designed to expand power and influence, not for the people of the empire but to ensure the continuation of Rome’s control authority.

Like Rome, America today is under the thumb of tolerated de facto foreign invasions mostly in the form of uncontrolled mass migrations turning its civilized territories into chaotic, lawless idiocracies. The US Deep State, like Rome’s leadership, is densely corrupted with the self-preservation of centrally planned bureaucracies designed to maintain a status quo unable to quickly and adequately respond to threats that can topple law and order, fail to preserve cultural traditions and ensure the peaceful interactions of its citizens.

The sycophantic alliance of America’s liberal press with the Deep State dovetails quite nicely with the laments of Juvenal, a first century Roman satirical poet who complains of “Bread and Circuses”. Roman plebian society was constantly distracted with promises of free food and entertainment for votes to keep established Roman leadership in place. As in the US the people of Rome began to feel they were owed a basic existence that became more extravagant over time.

The fourth Estate in America, Hollywood and much of the entertainment industry have become the right-hand man of the US Deep State. They are the circus aspect of smoke and mirrors in tandem with the Pretorian Guard (FBI, DOJ, NSA, FISA Courts and half of US Congress). When a leader emerged in Rome that resonated with the people this threatened a power shift from the Roman state to rank and file citizens, so assassination was a common regulating agent. Impeachment in the US today is a modern manifestation of assassination to save the state.

People an ocean away in the UK are aware that history repeats itself and they know that Rome died by suicide, not murder; they reject the state to save their country. Americans can save themselves as well because as Yogi Berra said: “It’s déjà vu all over again”. It doesn’t have to be that way.

I see one of 2 possibilities

1. there is a civil war

the police and military (forgetting that liberals paid for their salaries and training and are their family and neighbors) will quickly join forces with conservatives

millions of decent Americans are murdered by conservatives. (militia, police, military)

millions more are rounded up and systematically incinerated or gassed

conservatives take over the country and government

schools become conservative christian indoctrination centers

all speech NOT approved by the board of conservative christian censors will be banned and criminalized.

the Starts and Bars will be banned and burned and replaced with the confederate flag.

president for life Trump and Putin will announce that the USA is officially a puppet state of russia.

when Trump retires he will move to a large mansion in russia.

or

2. There is a civil war

the country splits up

blue states will try to remain as one unit (the USA) while red states will immediately join a NEW confederacy

most of the military become TRAITORS and , taking all of their weapons with them, they will join the confederacy

conservatives won't like living next door to LIBERAL USA so the confedRATcy will declare war on blue states, kill as many liberals as they can and then take over the blue states, rejoining all of the 50 states into the Conservative Christian ConfedeRATcy.


public schools become conservative christian indoctrination centers

all speech NOT approved by the board of conservative christian censors will be banned and criminalized.

president for life Trump and Putin will announce that the CCC of America is officially a puppet state of russia.

when Trump retires he will move to a large mansion in russia.

 

[iceberg]

Thanks ICEBERG:

Since we are talking about The Roman Empire:

For America's first 175 Years we had just 1 impeachment:

In our last 50 years we have had 3.

https://www.history.com/news/8-reasons-why-rome-fell

5. Government corruption and political instability

If Rome’s sheer size made it difficult to govern, ineffective and inconsistent leadership only served to magnify the problem. Being the Roman emperor had always been a particularly dangerous job, but during the tumultuous second and third centuries it nearly became a death sentence. Civil war thrust the empire into chaos, and more than 20 men took the throne in the span of only 75 years, usually after the murder of their predecessor. The Praetorian Guard—the emperor’s personal bodyguards—assassinated and installed new sovereigns at will, and once even auctioned the spot off to the highest bidder. The political rot also extended to the Roman Senate, which failed to temper the excesses of the emperors due to its own widespread corruption and incompetence. As the situation worsened, civic pride waned and many Roman citizens lost trust in their leadership.

that was the big one to me. others can sort of apply but our gov is out of control and forced people to pick sides.

left
right

invariably this means people put all issues in one side or the other and make them black, or white. we control guns. we don't control guns. we have a free media, we don't have a free media.

we've effectively killed the gray areas and normalized extreme behavior.

and that is 100% on us for allowing our government to get this far out of control.

 

[OldLady]

An interesting parallel exists in modern times. Although the US was established less than 250 years ago, it may be going down in an accelerated fashion for many of the same reasons that brought about the collapse of the Roman Empire. Rome itself lasted for over a thousand years but its glory days as an empire began falling apart after about five hundred. Its resources were chronically stretched with a military presence in foreign districts designed to expand power and influence, not for the people of the empire but to ensure the continuation of Rome’s control authority.

Like Rome, America today is under the thumb of tolerated de facto foreign invasions mostly in the form of uncontrolled mass migrations turning its civilized territories into chaotic, lawless idiocracies. The US Deep State, like Rome’s leadership, is densely corrupted with the self-preservation of centrally planned bureaucracies designed to maintain a status quo unable to quickly and adequately respond to threats that can topple law and order, fail to preserve cultural traditions and ensure the peaceful interactions of its citizens.

The sycophantic alliance of America’s liberal press with the Deep State dovetails quite nicely with the laments of Juvenal, a first century Roman satirical poet who complains of “Bread and Circuses”. Roman plebian society was constantly distracted with promises of free food and entertainment for votes to keep established Roman leadership in place. As in the US the people of Rome began to feel they were owed a basic existence that became more extravagant over time.

The fourth Estate in America, Hollywood and much of the entertainment industry have become the right-hand man of the US Deep State. They are the circus aspect of smoke and mirrors in tandem with the Pretorian Guard (FBI, DOJ, NSA, FISA Courts and half of US Congress). When a leader emerged in Rome that resonated with the people this threatened a power shift from the Roman state to rank and file citizens, so assassination was a common regulating agent. Impeachment in the US today is a modern manifestation of assassination to save the state.

People an ocean away in the UK are aware that history repeats itself and they know that Rome died by suicide, not murder; they reject the state to save their country. Americans can save themselves as well because as Yogi Berra said: “It’s déjà vu all over again”. It doesn’t have to be that way.

Fine. Move to England then.
Our country doesn't need people who believe the comic book version of the truth, anyway.

 

[The Original Tree]

Thanks ICEBERG:

Since we are talking about The Roman Empire:

For America's first 175 Years we had just 1 impeachment:

In our last 50 years we have had 3.

https://www.history.com/news/8-reasons-why-rome-fell

5. Government corruption and political instability

If Rome’s sheer size made it difficult to govern, ineffective and inconsistent leadership only served to magnify the problem. Being the Roman emperor had always been a particularly dangerous job, but during the tumultuous second and third centuries it nearly became a death sentence. Civil war thrust the empire into chaos, and more than 20 men took the throne in the span of only 75 years, usually after the murder of their predecessor. The Praetorian Guard—the emperor’s personal bodyguards—assassinated and installed new sovereigns at will, and once even auctioned the spot off to the highest bidder. The political rot also extended to the Roman Senate, which failed to temper the excesses of the emperors due to its own widespread corruption and incompetence. As the situation worsened, civic pride waned and many Roman citizens lost trust in their leadership.

that was the big one to me. others can sort of apply but our gov is out of control and forced people to pick sides.

left
right

invariably this means people put all issues in one side or the other and make them black, or white. we control guns. we don't control guns. we have a free media, we don't have a free media.

we've effectively killed the gray areas and normalized extreme behavior.

and that is 100% on us for allowing our government to get this far out of control.

This all started with The Cold War and The Soviet Union Promising us that they would take us down with Socialists & Communists & do it from the inside.

The Cold War never ended, it just Immigrated to The Democrat Party.

This is exactly what they are doing. 50 years ago, an asshole like AOC, Talib, Omar etc., these people not only would NEVER get elected, they would get their asses kicked in the streets, or shot, or hung for treason.

 

[The Original Tree]

An interesting parallel exists in modern times. Although the US was established less than 250 years ago, it may be going down in an accelerated fashion for many of the same reasons that brought about the collapse of the Roman Empire. Rome itself lasted for over a thousand years but its glory days as an empire began falling apart after about five hundred. Its resources were chronically stretched with a military presence in foreign districts designed to expand power and influence, not for the people of the empire but to ensure the continuation of Rome’s control authority.

Like Rome, America today is under the thumb of tolerated de facto foreign invasions mostly in the form of uncontrolled mass migrations turning its civilized territories into chaotic, lawless idiocracies. The US Deep State, like Rome’s leadership, is densely corrupted with the self-preservation of centrally planned bureaucracies designed to maintain a status quo unable to quickly and adequately respond to threats that can topple law and order, fail to preserve cultural traditions and ensure the peaceful interactions of its citizens.

The sycophantic alliance of America’s liberal press with the Deep State dovetails quite nicely with the laments of Juvenal, a first century Roman satirical poet who complains of “Bread and Circuses”. Roman plebian society was constantly distracted with promises of free food and entertainment for votes to keep established Roman leadership in place. As in the US the people of Rome began to feel they were owed a basic existence that became more extravagant over time.

The fourth Estate in America, Hollywood and much of the entertainment industry have become the right-hand man of the US Deep State. They are the circus aspect of smoke and mirrors in tandem with the Pretorian Guard (FBI, DOJ, NSA, FISA Courts and half of US Congress). When a leader emerged in Rome that resonated with the people this threatened a power shift from the Roman state to rank and file citizens, so assassination was a common regulating agent. Impeachment in the US today is a modern manifestation of assassination to save the state.

People an ocean away in the UK are aware that history repeats itself and they know that Rome died by suicide, not murder; they reject the state to save their country. Americans can save themselves as well because as Yogi Berra said: “It’s déjà vu all over again”. It doesn’t have to be that way.

Fine. Move to England then.
Our country doesn't need people who believe the comic book version of the truth, anyway.

Move to The Soviet Union. The American People do not need your divide and conquer strategy, and attempts to destroy us from the inside with your Socialist and Communist Traitors and Seditionists in The DemNazi Party.

 

[Oddball]

Thanks ICEBERG:

Since we are talking about The Roman Empire:

For America's first 175 Years we had just 1 impeachment:

In our last 50 years we have had 3.

https://www.history.com/news/8-reasons-why-rome-fell

5. Government corruption and political instability

If Rome’s sheer size made it difficult to govern, ineffective and inconsistent leadership only served to magnify the problem. Being the Roman emperor had always been a particularly dangerous job, but during the tumultuous second and third centuries it nearly became a death sentence. Civil war thrust the empire into chaos, and more than 20 men took the throne in the span of only 75 years, usually after the murder of their predecessor. The Praetorian Guard—the emperor’s personal bodyguards—assassinated and installed new sovereigns at will, and once even auctioned the spot off to the highest bidder. The political rot also extended to the Roman Senate, which failed to temper the excesses of the emperors due to its own widespread corruption and incompetence. As the situation worsened, civic pride waned and many Roman citizens lost trust in their leadership.

that was the big one to me. others can sort of apply but our gov is out of control and forced people to pick sides.

left
right

invariably this means people put all issues in one side or the other and make them black, or white. we control guns. we don't control guns. we have a free media, we don't have a free media.

we've effectively killed the gray areas and normalized extreme behavior.

and that is 100% on us for allowing our government to get this far out of control.

This all started with The Cold War and The Soviet Union Promising us that they would take us down with Socialists & Communists & do it from the inside.

The Cold War never ended, it just Immigrated to The Democrat Party.

This is exactly what they are doing. 50 years ago, an asshole like AOC, Talib, Omar etc., these people not only would NEVER get elected, they would get their asses kicked in the streets, or shot, or hung for treason.

The Cold War never ended, it just Immigrated to The Democrat Party.

The Soviet-style thugs have infiltrated the GOP as well...We know these people as the neoconservatives.