CDZ Is empathy the key to this hate and division?

[Correll]

When the Left calls the Right racist, they destroy all attempts at empathy, from both sides.

So they control what you think and say?
.

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

 

[Mac1958]

When the Left calls the Right racist, they destroy all attempts at empathy, from both sides.

So they control what you think and say?

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

I do. But being falsely accused of something doesn't change my thoughts or behaviors.

Refusing to fully and accurately understand the other person's position is a choice. Misrepresenting and/or distorting the other person's position is a choice.

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.
.

 

[gtopa1]

One definition of "empathy" is: "the psychological identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another."

As I think about the deepening divisions in our country, and as I observe our strengthening proclivity for binary thought and a clear unwillingness to give an inch in political conversation, it occurs to me that an increasing lack of empathy may be at its foundation - both as a cause and an effect.

The less we communicate civilly, the more we distance ourselves from contrary thought and opinion, the less understanding we have of those with whom we disagree. It seems like we can in no way even understand the other person's perspective, that we tend to create immediate distortedcaricatures of it, and that gives us license to ignore/dismiss it out of hand.

Do we, or do we not, want to at least have an accurate understanding of, and appreciation for, another person's perspective on an issue before we respond?

Isn't there something potentially constructive or valuable, something we haven't thought about, somewhere within another person's perspective?

What stops us, do you suppose, from maintaining enough empathy for at least understanding and appreciating the view of someone who does not agree with us?

Three questions there. Let's see if we can put down our fists and dig a little.
.

Nah: humour.

Greg

 

[Correll]

When the Left calls the Right racist, they destroy all attempts at empathy, from both sides.

So they control what you think and say?

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

I do. But being falsely accused of something doesn't change my thoughts or behaviors.

Refusing to fully and accurately understand the other person's position is a choice. Misrepresenting and/or distorting the other person's position is a choice.

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.
.

I am not feeling much empathy from you, on this. I'm trying to. But I don't feel it.

 

[Mac1958]

When the Left calls the Right racist, they destroy all attempts at empathy, from both sides.

So they control what you think and say?

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

I do. But being falsely accused of something doesn't change my thoughts or behaviors.

Refusing to fully and accurately understand the other person's position is a choice. Misrepresenting and/or distorting the other person's position is a choice.

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.
.

I am not feeling much empathy from you, on this. I'm trying to. But I don't feel it.

I know.
.

 

[Correll]

When the Left calls the Right racist, they destroy all attempts at empathy, from both sides.

So they control what you think and say?

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

I do. But being falsely accused of something doesn't change my thoughts or behaviors.

Refusing to fully and accurately understand the other person's position is a choice. Misrepresenting and/or distorting the other person's position is a choice.

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.
.

I am not feeling much empathy from you, on this. I'm trying to. But I don't feel it.

I know.
.

No, I am not feeling empathy FROM you to me.


I think I have a very good grasp of what you are feeling and thinking.

 

[Mac1958]

So they control what you think and say?

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

I do. But being falsely accused of something doesn't change my thoughts or behaviors.

Refusing to fully and accurately understand the other person's position is a choice. Misrepresenting and/or distorting the other person's position is a choice.

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.
.

I am not feeling much empathy from you, on this. I'm trying to. But I don't feel it.

I know.
.

No, I am not feeling empathy FROM you to me.


I think I have a very good grasp of what you are feeling and thinking.

I've been called a racist here, many times. And an Islamophobe, and a homophobe, and all the other dishonest attempts to put me on the defensive and avoid my points.

This thread is not about race. It's about the refusal (and possible lack of ability) of both ends of the spectrum to practice honest empathy. I hope you'll stay on track.
.

 

[Correll]

Try to understand how it feels to be falsely accused of something.

I do. But being falsely accused of something doesn't change my thoughts or behaviors.

Refusing to fully and accurately understand the other person's position is a choice. Misrepresenting and/or distorting the other person's position is a choice.

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.
.

I am not feeling much empathy from you, on this. I'm trying to. But I don't feel it.

I know.
.

No, I am not feeling empathy FROM you to me.


I think I have a very good grasp of what you are feeling and thinking.

I've been called a racist here, many times. And an Islamophobe, and a homophobe, and all the other dishonest attempts to put me on the defensive and avoid my points.

This thread is not about race. It's about the refusal (and possible lack of ability) of both ends of the spectrum to practice honest empathy. I hope you'll stay on track.
.

My point was all about empathy.

 

[Mike Dwight]

Again, about empathy, I don't see any Choices since I'm 18, what a crappy way to die for 15 years. People decide you're a troublemaker And that you can't argue or persuade on the point And they're institutionally angry that you didn't, so rinse and repeat some sort of blame theory to pass my way, nothing was the matter. Nothing was the matter and they choose other pressure points to pretend they get to make a wage.

I was in a studygroup and I was only worried about meeting appearances and somehow I'm right here after telling everyone about it just that I'm in a studygroup and I don't know anything wrong or anything to report about it. Everyone make up fancy disguises that make me look like I Talked.

There Were no control mechanisms over socially controlling people ever. There Were no barriers to productive signing me on board to any economy. There is Carefully Created pinning me in a box to make sure no output of mine is possibly measurable

 

[sjay]

Like being stoned all the time...

Or at all. If you like,I can throw rocks at you.

Like being stoned all the time...

Or at all. If you like,I can throw rocks at you.

sparky means being high or drunk not actually being stoned

 

[Damaged Eagle]

I don't think Americans need to learn empathy. I think they need to focus on actual problems. Return to local problems. Right now, they talk much and do nothing.

More objectivity and a lot less subjectivity when defining and discussing the issues is what is required.

*****SMILE*****

 

[baileyn45]

As i've heard many times before, empathy makes horrible law. Structuring a law around one instance, ignores the millions of others that may be affected.

Like anything (and everything) else, we just love to take an idea and go too far with it, so I don't disagree.

But I'm not talking about actions based only and specifically on empathy. I'm not going that far. I'm just saying that if we refuse to accurately understand another person's opinion and perspective -- and that's exactly what we're doing, we're refusing -- then communication is lost; if communication is lost, we (a) our tribal instincts cause us to only hate other opinions more and more, and (b) chances of communication, collaboration and innovation go out the window.

I think we know this. I'll bet that, at some level, we know what we're doing to ourselves with this behavior. What I wonder is if our tribal & self-esteem impulses are stopping us from putting our fists down for even a moment and just thinking.

It appears that fundamental human empathy is now considered a weakness, on both ends of the spectrum. I'm pretty sure that's not a good idea.
.

In the broad discussion of this thread, I still don't like the concept of empathy. Now I don't mean I dislike empathy, but in broad discussions the emotional reactions empathy evokes often overrides any rational discussion. I think that what's going on at the southern border is a perfect example. People see children that in dire straights. Anyone with a conscious feels empathy. And yet I've got children within a couple miles of my home in Ohio in dire straights. They're not on TV so no one gives a damn. The obvious rational thought that maybe we should clean up our own mess first is lost because people feel empathy for the child at the border, even though that child is in dire straights because some adult has decided to drag them across a desert.

 

[Mac1958]

As i've heard many times before, empathy makes horrible law. Structuring a law around one instance, ignores the millions of others that may be affected.

Like anything (and everything) else, we just love to take an idea and go too far with it, so I don't disagree.

But I'm not talking about actions based only and specifically on empathy. I'm not going that far. I'm just saying that if we refuse to accurately understand another person's opinion and perspective -- and that's exactly what we're doing, we're refusing -- then communication is lost; if communication is lost, we (a) our tribal instincts cause us to only hate other opinions more and more, and (b) chances of communication, collaboration and innovation go out the window.

I think we know this. I'll bet that, at some level, we know what we're doing to ourselves with this behavior. What I wonder is if our tribal & self-esteem impulses are stopping us from putting our fists down for even a moment and just thinking.

It appears that fundamental human empathy is now considered a weakness, on both ends of the spectrum. I'm pretty sure that's not a good idea.
.

In the broad discussion of this thread, I still don't like the concept of empathy. Now I don't mean I dislike empathy, but in broad discussions the emotional reactions empathy evokes often overrides any rational discussion. I think that what's going on at the southern border is a perfect example. People see children that in dire straights. Anyone with a conscious feels empathy. And yet I've got children within a couple miles of my home in Ohio in dire straights. They're not on TV so no one gives a damn. The obvious rational thought that maybe we should clean up our own mess first is lost because people feel empathy for the child at the border, even though that child is in dire straights because some adult has decided to drag them across a desert.

Well, I'm trying to maintain a distinction between (a) having an honest and accurate understanding of another person's views, and (b) inserting emotion and acting on it. "Feeling" has nothing to do with this. It's about accurate knowledge.

My overall point is that I'm seeing less and less evidence that the ends of the spectrum really understand each other. Both have created these simplistic, shallow, hyperbolic caricatures of the other and appear to be content with that as fact.

We can't collaborate to fix or improve any complex problems when you have a distorted of your collaborators. One of the things that really concern me here is that I even have to say that. To me, that's just fundamental logic.

Instead of trying to improve things, we're more worried about "beating" the other "side". To me, that's just madness. I don't get it.
.

 

[Mac1958]

Do people here ever have to collaborate with someone at work on a project or complex task?

Can't you produce better work if you and your fellow collaborator accurately understand what each of you are saying during the process? Is there no give & take, no sharing of ideas, no learning, no creation of something new that wasn't there before? Does the end product suffer in quality if communication is garbled, inaccurate, distorted?

I'm not even sure how to ask these questions. It's a little chilling that I even HAVE to.
.

 

[SweetSue92]

I don't think Americans need to learn empathy. I think they need to focus on actual problems. Return to local problems. Right now, they talk much and do nothing.

Agreed 100%. Empathy is based on feelings. We are already too "feelings-based". I would go with respect instead. Enough with the empathy; it's too "soft". Empathy is based on feeling your feelings--and if I can't, you're out of luck.

Respect is not. It's a decision. I will respect you as a person, end of story.

 

[Mac1958]

I don't think Americans need to learn empathy. I think they need to focus on actual problems. Return to local problems. Right now, they talk much and do nothing.

Please take a look at post 74 and comment.
.

 

[SweetSue92]

Do people here ever have to collaborate with someone at work on a project or complex task?

Can't you produce better work if you and your fellow collaborator accurately understand what each of you are saying during the process? Is there no give & take, no sharing of ideas, no learning, no creation of something new that wasn't there before? Does the end product suffer in quality if communication is garbled, inaccurate, distorted?

I'm not even sure how to ask these questions. It's a little chilling that I even HAVE to.
.

That's not empathy. That's listening for understanding--communicating ideas, which is what SHOULD happen at work.

Empathy is feeling someone's feelings. Honestly. I don't want to feel all my coworker's feelings all the time. You can go ahead and call me unprofessional if you want; I just think that's strange, unseemly and odd.

 

[SweetSue92]

Do people here ever have to collaborate with someone at work on a project or complex task?

Can't you produce better work if you and your fellow collaborator accurately understand what each of you are saying during the process? Is there no give & take, no sharing of ideas, no learning, no creation of something new that wasn't there before? Does the end product suffer in quality if communication is garbled, inaccurate, distorted?

I'm not even sure how to ask these questions. It's a little chilling that I even HAVE to.
.

Here is empathy. Unless you're an actor or something, I contend this is not even appropriate at work, nor is it necessary. Again I think you're just talking about respect and good communication. Which is not empathy.

empathy
noun
em·pa·thy | \ ˈem-pə-thē \
Definition of empathy


1: the action of understanding, being aware of, being sensitive to, and vicariously experiencing the feelings, thoughts, and experience of another of either the past or present without having the feelings, thoughts, and experience fully communicated in an objectively explicit manneralso : the capacity for this

2: the imaginative projection of a subjective state into an object so that the object appears to be infused with it

 

[cnm]

Oh, right, empathy. It's not that hard, especially it if starts at the top...

 

[sparky]

Empathy seems like a fundamental human trait. In fact, isn't empathy something that usually separates us from the other animals?

In the respect that animals don't deny it like we do, yes

It appears that fundamental human empathy is now considered a weakness, on both ends of the spectrum. I'm pretty sure that's not a good idea.

No, but it beats reality

At the first hint of danger, a rat or a rabbit will run. Are we not any better than that at this point?

Not that i can see...

Personal responsibility is gone. Now, it's all the other guy's fault. And we're seeing the results.

Yes, quite apparent

This thread is not about race. It's about the refusal (and possible lack of ability) of both ends of the spectrum to practice honest empathy

Instead of trying to improve things, we're more worried about "beating" the other "side". To me, that's just madness. I don't get it.

ergo the conundrum Mac. IMHO we exist in a failed system where one would need to admit that sides no longer matter

That takes a lot more effort, honesty, empathy....

easier to be the scared rabbit...

~S~