Iran to retaliate over any US 'trouble' for Venezuela-bound ships

[Tom Paine 1949]

This post isn't about Venezuela or "socialism." But since others have raised the issue, mostly citing older articles, I would like to say that the collapse of oil production and the social and political crisis in Venezuela has deep roots. The issues of corruption, mismanagement, the use of oil resources and profits for public or private, domestic or International use, these were never simply reducible to the question of nationalization. The original nationalizations that created the PDVSA were done well before Chavez came on the scene. "Nationalization of oil" was technically far more total in ... Saudi Arabia!

The worsening of relations between the new government and Western oil companies occurred after the 2002 coup attempt against Chavez, after the great oil strike by anti-Chavez oil managers and workers leading to mass firings of old managers and "disloyal" professionals and skilled workers. At first Chavez was still able to raise standards of living for the poor through programs using oil funds (due to the high oil price at the time), but as the price fell, with increased corruption by new managers, further nationalizations and legal fights over compensation, and without sufficient reinvestment, the oil industry and national economy with it fell into steep decline by 2013 when Maduro became leader. The Trump Administration sanctions were the coup de grace, but Western oil companies were present in Venezuela (granted sanction exemptions) until early this year. CITGO, the last PDSVA moneymaker -- based right here in the U.S. -- was finally stolen from Venezuela and all its funds and resources put into receivership or handed over to the Guaido fake "government."

Even so, the Maduro regime has miraculously held on, partly because so many oppositionist supporters and so many middle-class people have left. If it survives through this next period, oil will probably mostly end up re-privatized. Already, PDSVA runs less than half of active operations, as private deals with (often annonymous) foreign firms have been signed allowing them autonomy and oil rights and physical oil as payment. The Iranian ships coming in with gasoline and spare parts are being paid for in Gold, since sanctions also victimize foreign firms like banks that enable normal payment operations. Lots of foreign actors, Russian, Iranian, Italian, but also American ones, stand ready to move in if the U.S. ever eases its sanctions:

To Survive, Venezuela’s Leader Gives Up Decades of Control Over Oil (Published 2020)

Faced with a severe economic crisis, the country’s leader, Nicolás Maduro, is letting foreign firms take over daily operations of its oil fields. It’s a break with core tenets of his socialist revolution.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I previously commented on the U.S. withdrawal of Patriot missile batteries and navy resources from the Persian Gulf, and the acceptance by Iran of a new essentially pro-U.S. Iraqi Prime Minister. There is reason to believe both sides have wisely stepped back from the brink. Now a new potential flashpoint has arisen. We can only hope that wiser heads in the White House and Pentagon will deter any completely unnecessary conflict.

Iranian President Hassan Rouhani warned on Saturday of retaliatory measures against the United States if Washington caused problems for tankers carrying Iranian fuel to Venezuela .... with the first expected to reach the country's waters on Sunday...

“If our tankers in the Caribbean or anywhere in the world face trouble caused by the Americans, they [the US] will also be in trouble," Rouhani said in a telephone conversation with Qatar's Emir....

"Iran will never initiate a conflict," Rouhani said. "We have always the legitimate right to defend our sovereignty and territorial integrity and to serve our national interests, and we hope that the Americans will not commit an error....

— Iran to retaliate over any US 'trouble' for Venezuela-bound ships

Largest oil reserves in the world and Maduro has to beg Iran for fuel.

What a loser.

No.

The Empire has heavy sanctions on Venezuela. This prevents them from selling their oil. It causes terrible hardships for the Venezuelan people, (then you idiots claim socialism doesn’t work) but the US MSM refuses to reports this. Probably because they are completely owned by the MIC and the Deep State.

Iran is trying to help Venezuela, in defiance of the Empire. I would expect Dumb Don to do something stupid and deadly. Then you dumb bastards will cheer the killing.

They stole foreign companies oil rigs and oil production equipment...........Didn't know how to use it AFTER STEALING IT...........printed currency to insolvency............and destroyed themselves..............

They did that to themselves...........if Iran gets bold.........they open Pandora's box as well........

Wrong. It was there oil.

WRONG......it's was NOT THEIR EQUIPMENT........

Doesn’t matter. IT’S THEIR OIL.

Yes it does MATTER...........they STOLE THE EQUIPMENT.........PERIOD......then didn't know how to use it.

Did they offer to pay for it......NOPE.......they STOLE IT.........SCREW THEM.

No they didn’t. The oil companies stole their oil.

The oil companies stole their oil.

Have you always been such a moron, or is it a recent injury that's to blame?
Foreign oil companies came in by agreement of the government.
And then the government voided the agreement and stole the equipment.
It worked out great, because oil production is down about 70% since Chavez
decided he could do things better than the foreign oil companies.

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

I previously commented on the U.S. withdrawal of Patriot missile batteries and navy resources from the Persian Gulf, and the acceptance by Iran of a new essentially pro-U.S. Iraqi Prime Minister. There is reason to believe both sides have wisely stepped back from the brink. Now a new potential flashpoint has arisen. We can only hope that wiser heads in the White House and Pentagon will deter any completely unnecessary conflict.

Iranian President Hassan Rouhani warned on Saturday of retaliatory measures against the United States if Washington caused problems for tankers carrying Iranian fuel to Venezuela .... with the first expected to reach the country's waters on Sunday...

“If our tankers in the Caribbean or anywhere in the world face trouble caused by the Americans, they [the US] will also be in trouble," Rouhani said in a telephone conversation with Qatar's Emir....

"Iran will never initiate a conflict," Rouhani said. "We have always the legitimate right to defend our sovereignty and territorial integrity and to serve our national interests, and we hope that the Americans will not commit an error....

— Iran to retaliate over any US 'trouble' for Venezuela-bound ships

Largest oil reserves in the world and Maduro has to beg Iran for fuel.

What a loser.

No.

The Empire has heavy sanctions on Venezuela. This prevents them from selling their oil. It causes terrible hardships for the Venezuelan people, (then you idiots claim socialism doesn’t work) but the US MSM refuses to reports this. Probably because they are completely owned by the MIC and the Deep State.

Iran is trying to help Venezuela, in defiance of the Empire. I would expect Dumb Don to do something stupid and deadly. Then you dumb bastards will cheer the killing.

They stole foreign companies oil rigs and oil production equipment...........Didn't know how to use it AFTER STEALING IT...........printed currency to insolvency............and destroyed themselves..............

They did that to themselves...........if Iran gets bold.........they open Pandora's box as well........

Wrong. It was there oil.

WRONG......it's was NOT THEIR EQUIPMENT........

Doesn’t matter. IT’S THEIR OIL.

Yes it does MATTER...........they STOLE THE EQUIPMENT.........PERIOD......then didn't know how to use it.

Did they offer to pay for it......NOPE.......they STOLE IT.........SCREW THEM.

No they didn’t. The oil companies stole their oil.

The oil companies stole their oil.

Have you always been such a moron, or is it a recent injury that's to blame?
Foreign oil companies came in by agreement of the government.
And then the government voided the agreement and stole the equipment.
It worked out great, because oil production is down about 70% since Chavez
decided he could do things better than the foreign oil companies.

In my opinion, this is the wrong way to describe the situation, and not true. Of course it is also not true that foreign oil companies always simply "stole their oil." Legal disagreements there certainly were. But court commercial disputes over contract terms and unwanted nationalizations and compensation were never as central as political disputes with the U.S. There were deep splits in Venezuelan society, corruption in traditional parties as well as amongst "Bolivarian revolutionaries," but Chavez (and Maduro too) had considerable popular support and won genuinely democratic elections (at least up to recently). The U.S. hated Chavez' and Maduro's open support to Cuba, Bolivia, etc. Some U.S. oil firms, like Chevron, long fought hard against U.S. pressure to leave Venezuela ... because their operations there were still profitable.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I previously commented on the U.S. withdrawal of Patriot missile batteries and navy resources from the Persian Gulf, and the acceptance by Iran of a new essentially pro-U.S. Iraqi Prime Minister. There is reason to believe both sides have wisely stepped back from the brink. Now a new potential flashpoint has arisen. We can only hope that wiser heads in the White House and Pentagon will deter any completely unnecessary conflict.

Iranian President Hassan Rouhani warned on Saturday of retaliatory measures against the United States if Washington caused problems for tankers carrying Iranian fuel to Venezuela .... with the first expected to reach the country's waters on Sunday...

“If our tankers in the Caribbean or anywhere in the world face trouble caused by the Americans, they [the US] will also be in trouble," Rouhani said in a telephone conversation with Qatar's Emir....

"Iran will never initiate a conflict," Rouhani said. "We have always the legitimate right to defend our sovereignty and territorial integrity and to serve our national interests, and we hope that the Americans will not commit an error....

— Iran to retaliate over any US 'trouble' for Venezuela-bound ships

Largest oil reserves in the world and Maduro has to beg Iran for fuel.

What a loser.

No.

The Empire has heavy sanctions on Venezuela. This prevents them from selling their oil. It causes terrible hardships for the Venezuelan people, (then you idiots claim socialism doesn’t work) but the US MSM refuses to reports this. Probably because they are completely owned by the MIC and the Deep State.

Iran is trying to help Venezuela, in defiance of the Empire. I would expect Dumb Don to do something stupid and deadly. Then you dumb bastards will cheer the killing.

They stole foreign companies oil rigs and oil production equipment...........Didn't know how to use it AFTER STEALING IT...........printed currency to insolvency............and destroyed themselves..............

They did that to themselves...........if Iran gets bold.........they open Pandora's box as well........

Wrong. It was there oil.

WRONG......it's was NOT THEIR EQUIPMENT........

Doesn’t matter. IT’S THEIR OIL.

Yes it does MATTER...........they STOLE THE EQUIPMENT.........PERIOD......then didn't know how to use it.

Did they offer to pay for it......NOPE.......they STOLE IT.........SCREW THEM.

No they didn’t. The oil companies stole their oil.

The oil companies stole their oil.

Have you always been such a moron, or is it a recent injury that's to blame?
Foreign oil companies came in by agreement of the government.
And then the government voided the agreement and stole the equipment.
It worked out great, because oil production is down about 70% since Chavez
decided he could do things better than the foreign oil companies.

In my opinion, this is the wrong way to describe the situation, and not true. Of course it is also not true that the oil companies were all simply exploiting "their oil." Legal disagreements there certainly were. Court disputes over contract terms and unwanted nationalizations were never as central as political disputes with the U.S., Chavez and Maduro's open support to Cuba, Bolivia, etc. Some U.S. oil firms, like Chevron, long fought hard against U.S. pressure to leave Venezuela because their operations were still profitable.

Court disputes over contract terms and unwanted nationalizations were never as central as political disputes with the U.S.,

I always thought the issue was more about Chavez ripping off his foreign partners to make up for the reduced production caused by his failure to reinvest in state owned facilities.

Political disputes with the US didn't come into play until after he fucked himself up.

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Yes, Commies are good at getting elected once and then amending the constitution
so they can never lose.

 

[gipper]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Yes, Commies are good at getting elected once and then amending the constitution
so they can never lose.

You don’t know anything about Venezuela. You’ve made that abundantly clear. Chavez and Madura were elected in fair elections. They never stole power, as you demented anti-commie freaks like to believe.


Hey look? There’s a commie under your bed. Get your gun and kill!

 

[TheParser]

Just read that the first Iranian tanker arrived at a Venezuelan port.

President Trump did not keep his promise to stop it.

No wonder neither American politicians nor foreign leaders are afraid of President Trump. They know that he will eventually back down in most cases.

 

[gipper]

Just read that the first Iranian tanker arrived at a Venezuelan port.

President Trump did not keep his promise to stop it.

No wonder neither American politicians nor foreign leaders are afraid of President Trump. They know that he will eventually back down in most cases.

Would you rather he have started another war?

 

[TheParser]

Just read that the first Iranian tanker arrived at a Venezuelan port.

President Trump did not keep his promise to stop it.

No wonder neither American politicians nor foreign leaders are afraid of President Trump. They know that he will eventually back down in most cases.

Would you rather he have started another war?

There would have been NO war if an American warship had ordered the Iranian ship to turn around.

The Iranians respect nations that stand up to them.

 

[Bleipriester]

The only thing that Iran would notice is their tankers going to the bottom after their keel is broken by a torpedo from one of our silent killers.

American heroes attacking civilian vessels? Making you proud?

You would never know and neither would Venezuela.

That would be nothing but terrorism and every good soldier would reject such an order.

How? They would never know what the orders were except the CO. Why do you think that is terrorism? They are violating sanctions.

The sanctions are not confirmed by the UN but unilateral terrorist measures of the Trump regime. Venezuela has the right to free trade. And even if such sanctions were justified, that would not justify sinking tankers, thus killing people and polluting the environment.

Sanctions are an act of war. Americans don’t know this because their media and ruling class are corrupt.

Ears was very good at imposing sanctions. Don is following in his footsteps. Anything for the benefit of the MIC.

Sanctions are an act of war.

Liar.

You might want to do some research of the subject, before exposing your ignorance.

Check this out Sanctions Are an Act of War – The Future of Freedom Foundation

So is taking our Embassy and holding our people hostage for over a year..........Was an act of War.

Putting mines in the water that hit U.S. ships.....is an Act of War. We should have smoked their asses a LONG TIME AGO..........would have saved the world a whole lot of trouble.

Now you come up with shit? Who besieged the Venezuelan embassy, cut off electricity and food?

 

[gipper]

Just read that the first Iranian tanker arrived at a Venezuelan port.

President Trump did not keep his promise to stop it.

No wonder neither American politicians nor foreign leaders are afraid of President Trump. They know that he will eventually back down in most cases.

Would you rather he have started another war?

There would have been NO war if an American warship had ordered the Iranian ship to turn around.

The Iranians respect nations that stand up to them.

You don’t know that. Pure speculation. Let’s avoid war by removing the act of war sanctions.

The Empire has heavy sanctions on Venezuela. This prevents them from selling their oil. It causes terrible hardships for the Venezuelan people, but the US MSM refuses to reports this. Probably because they are completely owned by the MIC and the Deep State.

Iran is trying to help Venezuela, in defiance of the Empire. I would expect Dumb Don to do something stupid and deadly. Then you dumb bastards will cheer the killing

 

[Bleipriester]

The only thing that Iran would notice is their tankers going to the bottom after their keel is broken by a torpedo from one of our silent killers.

American heroes attacking civilian vessels? Making you proud?

You would never know and neither would Venezuela.

That would be nothing but terrorism and every good soldier would reject such an order.

How? They would never know what the orders were except the CO. Why do you think that is terrorism? They are violating sanctions.

The sanctions are not confirmed by the UN but unilateral terrorist measures of the Trump regime. Venezuela has the right to free trade. And even if such sanctions were justified, that would not justify sinking tankers, thus killing people and polluting the environment.

the UN? LOL!

Your country agreed to their terms.

 

[gipper]

The only thing that Iran would notice is their tankers going to the bottom after their keel is broken by a torpedo from one of our silent killers.

American heroes attacking civilian vessels? Making you proud?

You would never know and neither would Venezuela.

That would be nothing but terrorism and every good soldier would reject such an order.

How? They would never know what the orders were except the CO. Why do you think that is terrorism? They are violating sanctions.

The sanctions are not confirmed by the UN but unilateral terrorist measures of the Trump regime. Venezuela has the right to free trade. And even if such sanctions were justified, that would not justify sinking tankers, thus killing people and polluting the environment.

Sanctions are an act of war. Americans don’t know this because their media and ruling class are corrupt.

Ears was very good at imposing sanctions. Don is following in his footsteps. Anything for the benefit of the MIC.

Sanctions are an act of war.

Liar.

You might want to do some research of the subject, before exposing your ignorance.

Check this out Sanctions Are an Act of War – The Future of Freedom Foundation

So is taking our Embassy and holding our people hostage for over a year..........Was an act of War.

Putting mines in the water that hit U.S. ships.....is an Act of War. We should have smoked their asses a LONG TIME AGO..........would have saved the world a whole lot of trouble.

Now you come up with shit? Who besieged the Venezuelan embassy, cut off electricity and food?

He’s a true believer in the US empire and imperialism. He thinks the US government can put it’s military wherever it’s wants and any nation that opposes this, the US government has every right to destroy, including murdering vast numbers of women and children.

That’s an imperialist in a nutshell.

 

[Bleipriester]

The only thing that Iran would notice is their tankers going to the bottom after their keel is broken by a torpedo from one of our silent killers.

American heroes attacking civilian vessels? Making you proud?

You would never know and neither would Venezuela.

That would be nothing but terrorism and every good soldier would reject such an order.

How? They would never know what the orders were except the CO. Why do you think that is terrorism? They are violating sanctions.

The sanctions are not confirmed by the UN but unilateral terrorist measures of the Trump regime. Venezuela has the right to free trade. And even if such sanctions were justified, that would not justify sinking tankers, thus killing people and polluting the environment.

Sanctions are an act of war. Americans don’t know this because their media and ruling class are corrupt.

Ears was very good at imposing sanctions. Don is following in his footsteps. Anything for the benefit of the MIC.

Sanctions are an act of war.

Liar.

You might want to do some research of the subject, before exposing your ignorance.

Check this out Sanctions Are an Act of War – The Future of Freedom Foundation

So is taking our Embassy and holding our people hostage for over a year..........Was an act of War.

Putting mines in the water that hit U.S. ships.....is an Act of War. We should have smoked their asses a LONG TIME AGO..........would have saved the world a whole lot of trouble.

Now you come up with shit? Who besieged the Venezuelan embassy, cut off electricity and food?

He’s a true believer in the US empire and imperialism. He thinks the US government can put it’s military wherever it’s wants and any nation that opposes this, the US government has every right to destroy, including murdering vast numbers of women and children.

That’s an imperialist in a nutshell.

Trump can also fart in his face. But not Biden.

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

So far, so good: Iranian fuel starts arriving in Venezuelan waters despite U.S. warning

[Of course, nothing is really “good” about the tragic situation in Venezuela.]

 

[eagle1462010]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Yes, Commies are good at getting elected once and then amending the constitution
so they can never lose.

You don’t know anything about Venezuela. You’ve made that abundantly clear. Chavez and Madura were elected in fair elections. They never stole power, as you demented anti-commie freaks like to believe.


Hey look? There’s a commie under your bed. Get your gun and kill!

Shut down Free Press........took others property for their own..........rigged the elections.......printed money to make it worth TP..............then starved the country when it went under........

Typical Tyrants screwing their own country for power........They did it to themselves.........they stole from the oil companies and no one is gonna help them after that.....

They made their bed........let them sleep in it.

 

[gipper]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Yes, Commies are good at getting elected once and then amending the constitution
so they can never lose.

You don’t know anything about Venezuela. You’ve made that abundantly clear. Chavez and Madura were elected in fair elections. They never stole power, as you demented anti-commie freaks like to believe.


Hey look? There’s a commie under your bed. Get your gun and kill!

Shut down Free Press........took others property for their own..........rigged the elections.......printed money to make it worth TP..............then starved the country when it went under........

Typical Tyrants screwing their own country for power........They did it to themselves.........they stole from the oil companies and no one is gonna help them after that.....

They made their bed........let them sleep in it.

When will you ever learn? It’s not our fucking government’s concern. Have you learned nothing from the multiple failed military interventions since Vietnam?

Why do you support the ruling class’ love of war? They get rich off it, you get nothing but a kick in the ass.

 

[eagle1462010]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Yes, Commies are good at getting elected once and then amending the constitution
so they can never lose.

You don’t know anything about Venezuela. You’ve made that abundantly clear. Chavez and Madura were elected in fair elections. They never stole power, as you demented anti-commie freaks like to believe.


Hey look? There’s a commie under your bed. Get your gun and kill!

Shut down Free Press........took others property for their own..........rigged the elections.......printed money to make it worth TP..............then starved the country when it went under........

Typical Tyrants screwing their own country for power........They did it to themselves.........they stole from the oil companies and no one is gonna help them after that.....

They made their bed........let them sleep in it.

When will you ever learn? It’s not our fucking government’s concern. Have you learned nothing from the multiple failed military interventions since Vietnam?

Why do you support the ruling class’ love of war? They get rich off it, you get nothing but a kick in the ass.

We aren't at War with Venezuela..............and we have been at War with Iran since 1979........We should have been allowed to stomp their ass a long time ago.........

Should have been done under Carter.

Venezuela fucked up................they did it to themselves.......not my problem

 

[gipper]

Well, I don’t entirely disagree. But we certainly supported the 2002 coup attempt! Certainly some companies like Exxon felt ripped off. There were lots of cases. I don’t know nearly enough to take sides in those economic disputes. You are right that under the Obama administration the political disputes, as with Cuba also, were less intense. I think the internal class and social conflicts are other really important aspects of the problem — U.S. elites had close ties to Venezuelan elites. Chavez scared the sh*t out of all the privileged classes. He was a more or less typical left populist caudillo. But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Personally, I think the U.S. should stay out of these kinds of problems as much as possible. It’s not like Chavez was, or Maduro is, invading us.

But he wasn’t a mass murderer. Elections continued.

Yes, Commies are good at getting elected once and then amending the constitution
so they can never lose.

You don’t know anything about Venezuela. You’ve made that abundantly clear. Chavez and Madura were elected in fair elections. They never stole power, as you demented anti-commie freaks like to believe.


Hey look? There’s a commie under your bed. Get your gun and kill!

Shut down Free Press........took others property for their own..........rigged the elections.......printed money to make it worth TP..............then starved the country when it went under........

Typical Tyrants screwing their own country for power........They did it to themselves.........they stole from the oil companies and no one is gonna help them after that.....

They made their bed........let them sleep in it.

When will you ever learn? It’s not our fucking government’s concern. Have you learned nothing from the multiple failed military interventions since Vietnam?

Why do you support the ruling class’ love of war? They get rich off it, you get nothing but a kick in the ass.

We aren't at War with Venezuela..............and we have been at War with Iran since 1979........We should have been allowed to stomp their ass a long time ago.........

Should have been done under Carter.

Venezuela fucked up................they did it to themselves.......not my problem

Yes we know. You love war. Ignorantly failing to understand war abroad means tyranny at home, to say nothing of the horrors of war.

Dupe!