I was at a party with a bunch of Doctors last night....

[geauxtohell]

BUT ignorant people don't care... they think it will be FREE! They are glad those EVIL profiteering insurance companies will be out of business!

When the REALITY is because of Medicare we have had escalating health care insurance costs!

Tell me why would ANY insurer pay 6,000% more then necessary for a service?
Would they stay in business?
Medicare does and gladly !
Those of you that don't believe me.. tell me what city you live in and I guarantee that the largest hospital OVERCHARGES Medicare a minimum of 100% or MORE and in some cases 6,000% MORE then the cost of services!
But most of you ignorant people won't take the time and THAT's why we have Obamacare!
The majority of IGNORANT people making opinons based on biased LIES.. i.e. there have never been 50 million uninsured for example is the most common lie!

I once saw a trauma where the patient had a really difficult airway. The doctor couldn't get the tube in. Finally, they had to call in the pros from the insurance company.

Those insurance guys are the only thing that kept that patient alive......................

 

[geauxtohell]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

I suggest you hang out with real doctors instead of pretend ones then.

http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/images/files/DPMA_SurveyResults.pdf

The Doctor Patient Medical Association recently released a doctor survey about Obamacare. Here are the Overall Conclusions:

Almost unanimous that medicine is on the wrong track, and overwhelmingly blame the government; highest numbers ever opting out of Medicare or refuse Medicaid; corporate medicine (including hospital and insurance companies) is intentionally trying to destroy private practice; believe direct payment by patients will restore accountability & patient control (absolutely true -skyrocketing costs due to divorce between those utilizing the system and the true financial impact); want to restore autonomy, elimination of government involvement, increased patient responsibility and free market reforms are solutions.

The left likes to drag out phony stats pretending the US has one of the worst health care systems but it is phony. Our system is responsible for 95% of all medical advancements and innovation in the world with no close second which is then shared globally, nearly always with zero strings attached. This means once Obamacare finishes destroying our system, it won't just be Americans who lose out, so will the rest of the world.

I suggest you read the thread and find out why "Doctors and Patients" is full of dookie.

BTW, I contacted them and pointed out that their survey was bunk due to a massive selection bias. They had no good answer.

Strange that EM doctors were virtually unrepresented in that poll, huh? Strange that outpatient clinical practice represented 80% of the respondents while hospital based doctors were 11%, huh? Strange that Family Medicine had the highest response rate, huh?

It's almost like they picked the doctors most likely to give them the response they wanted.

Which they did.

Try and keep up, slappy.

And take the time to analyze your own poll before you lecture me about phony stats. The methodology behind that "survey" is so poor is laughable. Anyone with a semester of statistics would laugh at it.

 

[geauxtohell]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

WOW! You must really believe that most everyone on this board is a big an idiot as you are, really.
Let's examine this a little, a very little, someone making nearly a million dollars a year is willing to give up all that money and education because they might have to work with a bill from congress. Now really.
Take your windbag bullshit somewhere else and try and sell it.

Another dipshit who couldn't be bothered to read the entire post.

And, btw, a "million dollars a year"? Really?

 

[Harry Dresden]

In other words, the insurance company didn't dictate jack shit. You obviously don't understand the meaning of "dictate."

if Kaiser said no to everything ....WHO did the dictating?.....look up the word....maybe your Right-Wing corrupted Brain might get the meaning...
here it is from a Dictionary.....

a : to issue as an order
b : to impose, pronounce, or specify authoritatively.....
now i will ask again.....if Kaiser said no to everything.....were they not DICTATING an order to the Doctors?......

But the point is, Kaiser was NOT dictating everything. Kaiser was stating what they, Kaiser, would pay for under the terms of their own policy. If you didn't like whatever restrictions your contract with them imposed, you are now free to purchase different, more friendly insurance, or buy what you need on your own. It is no different for me or any of the millions of other Seniors on Medicare. The government strictly dictates what we can or cannot have and what it will pay for what we get. And a whole lot of that makes absolutely no sense at all..

Under a totally government controlled program, you will have no such options because all other options will be eliminated. And if you do not think that is where Obama is headed with this, you haven't been paying attention. Once government has the ability to issue the payments, it has the ability to call all the shots re your medical care.

And anybody who thinks government is more competent to do that than is the private sector is probably pretty close to being a fool.

so if you have something seriously wrong.....KAISER WILL VETO EVERYTHING BECAUSE...."ITS NOT COVERED?"....well i was always told ..."if you have the Flu,Kaiser is fine,if you have something serious....your gonna die".....found that out.....

 

[GoneBezerk]

I had dinner with a doctor last night and she talked about the shortage of doctors especially in her primary care field and the flood of patients coming because of this crap.

Also, the costs of medicine because lawyers can sue the shit out of doctors and hospitals over anything, another pie of shit caused by Democraps.

I brought up Democraps blocking competition between insurance companies across state lines, another example of driving up costs to destroy the system.

Once people can't see doctors or have to wait a month to see them along with increased premiums, Obamination will finally be seen as the Evil One that we on the right see today.

 

[Harry Dresden]

In other words, the insurance company didn't dictate jack shit. You obviously don't understand the meaning of "dictate."

if Kaiser said no to everything ....WHO did the dictating?.....look up the word....maybe your Right-Wing corrupted Brain might get the meaning...
here it is from a Dictionary.....

a : to issue as an order
b : to impose, pronounce, or specify authoritatively.....
now i will ask again.....if Kaiser said no to everything.....were they not DICTATING an order to the Doctors?......

To dictate is when force is used, like pointing a gun at your head, to set the terms of a contract. If you are free to go elsewhere, then the terms haven't been dictated. The terms of Obamacare are dictated. Private insurance isn't.

Bri.....i dont see in any definition i looked at were they say the word FORCE.....

Dictate....to issue as an order.....Kaiser's orders to the Doctor were....she has something seriously wrong.....it might cost a few bucks....sorry we cant cover it....and that is basically what we got out of their rejection......luckily big bad Blue Shield was not as fucked....and till this day they dont bat an eye at whatever the Doctor wants to do.... big difference in those two Companies....in my experience anyway....

 

[Foxfyre]

if Kaiser said no to everything ....WHO did the dictating?.....look up the word....maybe your Right-Wing corrupted Brain might get the meaning...
here it is from a Dictionary.....

a : to issue as an order
b : to impose, pronounce, or specify authoritatively.....
now i will ask again.....if Kaiser said no to everything.....were they not DICTATING an order to the Doctors?......

But the point is, Kaiser was NOT dictating everything. Kaiser was stating what they, Kaiser, would pay for under the terms of their own policy. If you didn't like whatever restrictions your contract with them imposed, you are now free to purchase different, more friendly insurance, or buy what you need on your own. It is no different for me or any of the millions of other Seniors on Medicare. The government strictly dictates what we can or cannot have and what it will pay for what we get. And a whole lot of that makes absolutely no sense at all..

Under a totally government controlled program, you will have no such options because all other options will be eliminated. And if you do not think that is where Obama is headed with this, you haven't been paying attention. Once government has the ability to issue the payments, it has the ability to call all the shots re your medical care.

And anybody who thinks government is more competent to do that than is the private sector is probably pretty close to being a fool.

so if you have something seriously wrong.....KAISER WILL VETO EVERYTHING BECAUSE...."ITS NOT COVERED?"....well i was always told ..."if you have the Flu,Kaiser is fine,if you have something serious....your gonna die".....found that out.....

No, the point I am making is that Kaiser insures a very small slice of the pie. If you find Kaiser not to your likiing , you can change insurance companies or pay out of pocket. You have the choice to do that. Kaiser cannot tellyou that you cannot get the treatment you want someplace else. Kaiser can only dictate what it will and will not pay. It cannot dictate the treatment you get through somebody else.

Once we have a single payer system, however, and the government controls it all, you will have no choice and no option to opt out. The government will be able to tell you that you cannot get the treatment you want someplace else unless you leave the country to get it.

 

[uscitizen]

But the point is, Kaiser was NOT dictating everything. Kaiser was stating what they, Kaiser, would pay for under the terms of their own policy. If you didn't like whatever restrictions your contract with them imposed, you are now free to purchase different, more friendly insurance, or buy what you need on your own. It is no different for me or any of the millions of other Seniors on Medicare. The government strictly dictates what we can or cannot have and what it will pay for what we get. And a whole lot of that makes absolutely no sense at all..

Under a totally government controlled program, you will have no such options because all other options will be eliminated. And if you do not think that is where Obama is headed with this, you haven't been paying attention. Once government has the ability to issue the payments, it has the ability to call all the shots re your medical care.

And anybody who thinks government is more competent to do that than is the private sector is probably pretty close to being a fool.

so if you have something seriously wrong.....KAISER WILL VETO EVERYTHING BECAUSE...."ITS NOT COVERED?"....well i was always told ..."if you have the Flu,Kaiser is fine,if you have something serious....your gonna die".....found that out.....

No, the point I am making is that Kaiser insures a very small slice of the pie. If you find Kaiser not to your likiing , you can change insurance companies or pay out of pocket. You have the choice to do that. Kaiser cannot tellyou that you cannot get the treatment you want someplace else. Kaiser can only dictate what it will and will not pay. It cannot dictate the treatment you get through somebody else.

Once we have a single payer system, however, and the government controls it all, you will have no choice and no option to opt out. The government will be able to tell you that you cannot get the treatment you want someplace else unless you leave the country to get it.

Waah! They are taking our treatments away!

They will pry my treatment from my cold dead fingers.

 

[Unkotare]

Everything obama is doing can be undone. How long it will take and how much suffering there will be are the only questions. Greece and Japan once had their socialistic leaders. Now they are trying to undo the damage. Japan may, Greece may not.

What the hell are you talking about? The current ruling party in Japan is as left wing as our democrat party - at least, and they're trying to push through a huge tax increase right now.

 

[frazzledgear]

You're right. It is the American Medical Society. My bad. But is that a nonpartisan enough group for you?

You have GOT to be kidding, right? The vast majority of doctors think the AMA has ABANDONED their interests and is nothing but a political organization shilling for the left. The AMA does NOT represent the opinions of doctors, the vast majority of whom OPPOSE Obamacare. Which is why only 17% of all doctors even bother to join it! Some doctors suggest the AMA change its name to something more fitting -like NEA. No organization that only represents 17% of the population can claim to speak for ANYONE but itself. And the AMA does NOT speak for doctors because it doesn't represent doctors.


Doctors And AMA Split Over Contentious Issue Of ObamaCare - Forbes

Next time that liar Obama opens his mouth claiming he is a "tax cutter" remember this -along with the fact that Obamacare includes 21 new taxes not even mentioned on this chart -and 12 of them will smack the middle class right between the eyes. Life as government owned property where we must obey govt or be punished is the fundamental change Obama promised -and is the only promise he really intends to deliver.

 

[Freewill]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

My opinion, the name tells you what it will do. Affordable care is the stated goal of the liberal left, the result, as always, will be the exact opposite.

Since you are going into the business can you tell me how this will reduce the overall expenditure in the medical field? Lower drug costs? Lower co pays? If so then have doctors been ripping us off all these years? Or are the costs going to be transferred to someone else and the doctors will just become richer? I think the latter, the overall cost will balloon and the Medical industry will become even richer. The increase in patient demands will naturally not cause an increase in quality of care. Hope I am wrong.

 

[Foxfyre]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

My opinion, the name tells you what it will do. Affordable care is the stated goal of the liberal left, the result, as always, will be the exact opposite.

Since you are going into the business can you tell me how this will reduce the overall expenditure in the medical field? Lower drug costs? Lower co pays? If so then have doctors been ripping us off all these years? Or are the costs going to be transferred to someone else and the doctors will just become richer? I think the latter, the overall cost will balloon and the Medical industry will become even richer. The increase in patient demands will naturally not cause an increase in quality of care. Hope I am wrong.

The one thing that you cannot find in all those pages of the ACA is the cost of the program. Yes, the government will certainly impose payment caps on every pill, every office visit, every xray, every procedure, every bandaid. What is not addressed is that those caps are often unrelated to the cost of providing the pill, etc. Do the pharmaveutical companies, medical suppliers, hospitals and doctors eat the difference? Yes, sometimes they do, but more often they simply jack up the costs to those with private insurance thus ever driving up the cost of private insurance.

If Obama should be successful in driving us into a singler payer system in which government controls all the payments, it still will not be addressing the costs. So now there is one of three choices, all unappealing. More and more doctors quit, more and more emergency rooms and suppliers go out of business - OR - the government pays what they have to in order for people to continue to provide the service and either drives the deficit into the stratosphere - OR- tax all of us who pay taxes a whole bunch more to make up the difference.

If the government had just stayed out of it in the first place, market forces would have struck a much more affordable balance for everybody. There would still be people who choose not or cannot afford insurance coverage, but there likely would have been no more than we have today anyway. But you cannot add the tens of millions who currently say they cannot afford insurance to the system without somebody somewhere paying the bill.

 

[boilermaker55]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

WOW! You must really believe that most everyone on this board is a big an idiot as you are, really.
Let's examine this a little, a very little, someone making nearly a million dollars a year is willing to give up all that money and education because they might have to work with a bill from congress. Now really.
Take your windbag bullshit somewhere else and try and sell it.

Another dipshit who couldn't be bothered to read the entire post.

And, btw, a "million dollars a year"? Really?

For someone who touts oneself as a prolific reader, you have so much to learn. Let me use your tone of response. Numbnuts.
If you think you have this great affinity for being such a researcher and you harbor nothing but the truth. Try looking up some salaries of Dr. then get back to me stupid fuck.
And while you are at it, try making up some other fucking lie that your pea-brain can concoct and give us another laugh. Moron.
See how easy it is to insult someone as stupid as you.

 

[blimpo]

83% of doctors said they would seriously consider leaving medicine.

About like teacher turnover with all the new crap hoisted on them..

 

[MuadDib]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

AS with most people YOU have NO idea how health finances work but I do as I started a company that everyday helps at least 10,000 times a DAY health care providers know if they will be paid by Medicare! So I have access that YOU and many others don't!

The FACT is Obamacare was a tax but if Obamacare had been HONESTLY presented to the 6 votes JUST 6 that it passed by, IT would NOT have passed because most of the people that voted YES DIDN"T understand there were 21 NEW taxes being raised in Obamacare!
If they knew that some of the YES votes would have been NO!

The FACT that Obamacare will as Obama wants DESTROY 1,400 health insurance companies over time. Putting 400,000 people out of work AND eliminating over $100 billion a year in Federal/State/Local and property taxes!
Where will that $100 billion come from?

Finally MOST of those people that voted yes and I know YOU for sure think there were 50 million "uninsured"... THERE ARE NOT!!!
10 million are not citizens says the Census Bureau!
14 million are covered by Medicaid but said they were not and they are counted!
Finally now 17.5 million that for the majority NeVER added ONE cent to the $60 billion in
what hospitals call "uncompensated" services!
YET these people were counted.
So truly less then 8 million are in need of insurance... AND everyone of those doctors would agree.. One of the reason health insurance has increased more is the $600 billion a year in duplicate tests, specialist referrals anything these doctors do to protect their butts from lawsuits!
Tell you what you ask everyone of those doctors if they would favor a 10% tax on lawyers as Obamacare taxed tanning salons and the $10 billion of lawyers $100 billion income would have provided insurance for the truly UNINSURED!
They would love it!

Feel better?

I have some idea of how "health finances" work. I am probably one of the few posters on here that knows how the ICD 9 system works.....

The nice thing about being a physician is that I don't have to question my utility in the patient-care loop.

I can certainly imagine that some of the more tangential personnel, middle men, and ancillary people (Insurance) are sweating right now.

ICD-9 has 18,000 diagnostic codes and nobody understands how it works. They've had to delay the implementation of ICD-10 with 48,000 diagnostic codes because nobody's ready for it.

 

[Unkotare]

83% of doctors said they would seriously consider leaving medicine.

About like teacher turnover with all the new crap hoisted on them..

Ah, like the crap you "deal with on a daily basis"? LOL

 

[frazzledgear]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

I think you are full of shit, I don't think you are a doctor based on your assertion you haven't talked to ANY who are the least bit concerned about Obamacare -topped with the truly moronic statement that no one knows what it will do. What a stupid JOKE! OF COURSE THEY KNOW. Most doctors dread what's coming and a huge percent are planning on early retirement or a career change.

Have you bothered to read that piece of shit? I suggest you do that -every one of those 2400 pages. By the time you hit page 10 you will realize the bill is majorly INCOMPLETE -because this piece of shit includes regulations that announce are to be spelled out in detail in later publications. Which causes a huge problem for businesses, hospitals, medical centers, nursing homes, institutions etc. given those regulations affect them -but it doesn't tell them what those regulations are going to be, what it will take to comply or how they are supposed to comply. Just that there is a buttload of them coming down the pike right at 'em.

A journalist with US News reported the first set of published regulations applied to just the first SIX PAGES of the bill and that first set was 429 pages long. Do you understand that? 429 pages of REGULATIONS that apply just to the first SIX pages of this piece of shit bill. The pages of regulations are many times LONGER than this piece of shit bill! In reality this bill is more than 170,000 pages once all the massive REGULATIONS are included! By comparison, the US tax code which everyone knows is a ridiculously complicated piece of shit in need of drastic overhaul -"just" 13,000 pages long. The US Constitution is just 16 pages long. Imagine that -it only took 16 pages to set up what was at the time a completely experimental system of government -but 2400 pages to write up the myriad kickbacks and payoffs to Democrat supporters and special interests. And 170,000 to essentially destroy ...everything. Let's not pretend on this one, ok? NO Republican input whatsoever which is also part of the reason it got no Republican votes at all. NO brakes, NO self control and MASSIVE PAYOFFS to Democrat supporters in exchange for their support for this piece of shit. This bill is NOT intended to make health care affordable! It is intended to make Democrat supporters and money launderers RICH.

Did you take ANY math in school honey? You can't cover 30,000,000 more people, cover pre-existing conditions, keep adults on their parents' insurance until age 26 -and end with "affordable" anything. Now we know what it is that STUPID, lying ass skank Pelosi didn't want anyone to see until after it had been rammed down our throats against our will. 21 NEW taxes that will start kicking AFTER the election -how thoughtful of that manipulative fucking liar, huh? And 12 of them will hit the middle class right between the eyes starting Jan. 2013 -AFTER the election because Obama didn't want that to bite him in the ass before securing his re-election.

So you really want to pretend all the doctors you claim to know are just too fucking stupid to figure out they are getting the short end of the stick on this thing and lawyers ONCE AGAIN insure THEY make out like the thieves they really are? Really?

Most doctors are intelligent enough to know that nothing good happens when government inserts itself between them and their patients. Whoever foots the bill really holds the power -and government intends that power will be IT -not the patient. Even though it is taxpayers really stuck with the tab, since government has included itself as middleman, it will be government wielding control and making life and death decisions for.........us. I wouldn't allow my neighbor on the next block to make my medical decisions but let's pretend a faceless bureaucracy really gives a shit about you, huh? As a "doctor" you must be aware that the reason doctors have been abandoning private practice as unaffordable is because of GOVERNMENT, right? Forced to hire people who bring zero extra dollars into their practice -just to handle the never ending paperwork, massively increasing their overhead while government keeps cutting their reimbursements -combined with the skyrocketing malpractice insurance -also thanks to fucking lawyers. Businesses add people whose productivity brings in MORE money to the business -but not true with the medical field where doctors and hospitals are forced to hire thousands of people to just shuffle government paperwork. And that isn't even counting the fact the average Medicaid bill submitted by doctors and hospitals gets rejected five times -and many doctors just don't bother filing it at all. And now increasing numbers are refusing to accept Medicaid patients since they are guaranteed to get screwed out of payment.

This bill fully intends to result in the destruction of private insurance companies with people forced onto Medicaid rolls -which is why they tried to strong arm states to raise taxes and then order them how to spend it. Except SCOTUS got that one partially right -the federal government has no authority to insert itself into state governments and order them to function as their puppet. Maybe you really don't know this -but the federal government belongs to the states, it is supposed to be subservient to the states with the exception of the enumerated powers given to it under the Constitution. State governments do NOT belong to the federal government. There is actually a REASON we are called the United STATES of America and not the People's Republic of America. So that was a blatant attempt to be the total game changer, stripping states of their sovereignty under the Constitution and forcing all states to become subservient to federal government -which is already on a power trip intent on laying claim to any and all powers and rights it can strip from we the people and the states.

Career politicians have done more damage to this nation than ANY other group and I am a firm believer now in term limits for all elected offices, not just the Presidency. No one should be allowed to enrich themselves at the public trough the way these fuckers have. Career politicians constantly seek to expand and entrench their power, constantly write new laws and regulations to justify their outrageous salaries and benefits they voted for themselves. They become corrupt egomaniacs convinced that merely getting elected has imparted magical powers on them and THEY know how to run any industry, run any segment of the economy -far better than the experts who do it for a living. I wouldn't allow that skank Pelosi to mow my lawn much less take over MY health care decisions and anyone who would is a moron. The people Pelosi insults and calls "freeloaders" aren't freeloaders. They are typically young, healthy single adults with no children and at the age where no health insurance is actually a sound financial judgment. That's right -NOT having health insurance really can be a SOUND FINANCIAL JUDGMENT. The vast majority of people in this group don't NEED health care and are NOT "freeloaders" getting health care because they typically don't utilize the system AT ALL! The reason Pelosi and her cronies NEED these people to get insurance -is they are the ones they intend to stick with the bill. They NEED their MONEY whether young, healthy adults who don't utilize the system want it or not -and the expected bill for that will be $1200 a MONTH. Of course they are unlikely going to be able to afford it -and either pay a "tax" at the end of the year or forced onto Medicaid rolls. Once people have insurance, they tend to view health care as "free" and go to see doctors for things they wouldn't bother if they had to pay for it directly out of pocket. They glut the system and we know this is true from the experiences of other nations. And that forces people who actually NEED health care to wait longer to be seen and their medical condition typically worsens and becomes more difficult to treat and eventually mortality rates for conditions still dropping in this country -start to rise again. Just as they are in the UK for all sorts of things from stroke, breast and prostate cancer, complications of diabetes and on and on. People are now being denied curative treatment in the UK when government decides they just aren't worth the cost. INSURANCE does NOT equal "quality medical care". Government run health care forces government to DISCRIMINATE against its own citizens -and people like stupid skank Pelosi are itching to force our government to do so as well. The problem with government run systems is that it encourages people who don't NEED health care to overutilize the system. So you can see a doctor for "free" to tell you that you have a cold and it will go away by itself in 10-14 days. But you will be denied treatment when you NEED it and denied even if it means forcing you to endure a lower quality of life -when the entire point of health care is to restore the individual to as near normal as possible and to improve the quality of life if they can't. NOT under a government system though -it becomes bastardized to be a system that exists primarily for those who don't need it and denied at the time you need it the most. Obama OPENLY said he wanted to change it to just such a system -one that existed for the purpose of keeping HEALTHY people healthy. In spite of the fact preventative health care is a lying ass crock of shit that is impossible. Going to the doctor when healthy will NOT keep you healthy and is a provable waste of precious resources! Doctors are trained to recognize and treat disease based on YOUR symptoms and signs of disease. With the exception of just a couple of conditions like glaucoma, it is IMPOSSIBLE for them to know you are sick before YOU DO! So what is Obama REALLY saying when he said he wanted to fundamentally change our system to one that existed for the purpose of keeping healthy people healthy instead of treating sick people? FIGURE IT OUT!

In spite of liberal LIES, exaggerations and distortions -the US had the best medical system in the world, our poor, unlike the poor of the world -have free medical care paid for by the 50% who pay federal income taxes and who are getting ready to take it in the shorts big time very soon. Our system is responsible for 95% of all medical advancements which it then shares with the entire world. With no close second. Kiss it good-bye. It won't just be Americans who suffer for this but the rest of the world as well.

I bet you help propagate some of the easily dis-proven lies about the US medical system -you know bullshit like claims that 33 countries have lower infant mortality rates than the US. Do you REALLY believe that? Especially given the fact the US is the nation that leads the world in infant survival of extreme prematurity. Do you even know where that lying ass piece of shit statistic comes from? Because if you are a DOCTOR, you would know this one. All nations self report and how they determine what qualifies as part of their morbidity and mortality rates is up to them. There is not only no uniform counting method in place, there is no way of enforcing one even if it did exist and no verification. Unlike the US and a couple of other countries, it is their governments that provides these statistics, the least reliable source for it -because what government wants to "brag" about suck ass stats, huh? In the case of infant mortality rates, any child in the US who dies in the first 12 months following birth is counted as part of our infant mortality rate. Any child who takes even one breath after birth, regardless of gestational age, is counted as a live birth. So even though a child born at 20 weeks has nearly 0 chance of survival, if it takes a single breath before dying -it becomes part of our infant mortality rates. Most countries -especially in the southern hemisphere and former Soviet satellites -count deaths only in the first three months following birth, some count for six months and a couple of European countries count the first nine months. The US has the longest counting period of any nation. Many countries only count as a live birth a baby born after 30 weeks -because any child born earlier isn't going to survive in their country anyway. Most count as a live birth a child born at 26 or 28 weeks or later. Who do you think is going to have a "higher" infant mortality rate then? In reality ours is the most ACCURATE but it is NOT 34th lowest. If someone is going to have an extremely premature baby -are they going to want to have it HERE or do ya really think they figure their kid has the best shot in Singapore instead? If every nation used the identical counting period which they never will, the US would have the 1st or 2nd lowest infant mortality rate in the world. That we have the longest counting period in the world and still come in at 34 tells you everything you really need to know about our infant mortality rate.

Obamacare wasn't just poorly written, poorly thought out and rammed through against the will of the vast majority while the reprehensible details of this piece of shit monstrosity were deliberately kept from the public. It is the biggest piece of TRASH produced by Congress in decades. You have to be truly mentally impaired to believe it will ever do anything but wreak havoc across the nation -because it will. And DOCTORS were the first to realize that.

By the way, anytime you hear a Democrat insist the mandate isn't really a "tax" but a penalty or whatever, remember something. SCOTUS ruled it is ONLY Constitutional as a tax. They are trying to hide that fact but it's true -it is ONLY constitutional as a tax. So if Democrats are going to insist it isn't a tax -that means they are agreeing it isn't constitutional either. They do NOT get it both ways on this one.

 

[BDBoop]

Ranging from those who are starting on July 1st (like me) to those who have practiced for a few years to those that have practiced for a decade.

All anyone could talk about was ACA and it wasn't good.

The more experienced doctors were already making plans to leave medicine. I heard comments along the line of "this is the end of medicine." "The system is going to implode." "You will basically be working for peanuts in an environment that is going to be rife with litigation and no shields." "Your only hope is for Romney to win and get rid of this monstrosity, otherwise you should leave now."

Actually, I didn't hear any of this. I didn't hear anything good or bad about the ACA. Most people seemed unconcerned.

I believe they are unconcerned because no one knows what the true effect* of ACA is going to be. I had a good laugh at my local conservative talker guy trying to articulate what he thought this would do to patient care. He sounded like an idiot, because the things he was saying made absolutely no sense to someone familiar with patient care.

ACA could indeed be disastrous policy. It could also be great policy. I just don't know. And I don't think you, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, or Ed Schultz do either.

*Meaning the effect on health care delivery in this country and not the effect on individual tax payers in regard to cost.

I think you are full of shit, I don't think you are a doctor based on your assertion you haven't talked to ANY who are the least bit concerned about Obamacare -topped with the truly moronic statement that no one knows what it will do. What a stupid JOKE! OF COURSE THEY KNOW. Most doctors dread what's coming and a huge percent are planning on early retirement or a career change.

Have you bothered to read that piece of shit? I suggest you do that -every one of those 2400 pages. By the time you hit page 10 you will realize the bill is majorly INCOMPLETE -because this piece of shit includes regulations that announce are to be spelled out in detail in later publications. Which causes a huge problem for businesses, hospitals, medical centers, nursing homes, institutions etc. given those regulations affect them -but it doesn't tell them what those regulations are going to be, what it will take to comply or how they are supposed to comply. Just that there is a buttload of them coming down the pike right at 'em.

A journalist with US News reported the first set of published regulations applied to just the first SIX PAGES of the bill and that first set was 429 pages long. Do you understand that? 429 pages of REGULATIONS that apply just to the first SIX pages of this piece of shit bill. The pages of regulations are many times LONGER than this piece of shit bill! In reality this bill is more than 170,000 pages once all the massive REGULATIONS are included! By comparison, the US tax code which everyone knows is a ridiculously complicated piece of shit in need of drastic overhaul -"just" 13,000 pages long. The US Constitution is just 16 pages long. Imagine that -it only took 16 pages to set up what was at the time a completely experimental system of government -but 2400 pages to write up the myriad kickbacks and payoffs to Democrat supporters and special interests. And 170,000 to essentially destroy ...everything. Let's not pretend on this one, ok? NO Republican input whatsoever which is also part of the reason it got no Republican votes at all. NO brakes, NO self control and MASSIVE PAYOFFS to Democrat supporters in exchange for their support for this piece of shit. This bill is NOT intended to make health care affordable! It is intended to make Democrat supporters and money launderers RICH.

Did you take ANY math in school honey? You can't cover 30,000,000 more people, cover pre-existing conditions, keep adults on their parents' insurance until age 26 -and end with "affordable" anything. Now we know what it is that STUPID, lying ass skank Pelosi didn't want anyone to see until after it had been rammed down our throats against our will. 21 NEW taxes that will start kicking AFTER the election -how thoughtful of that manipulative fucking liar, huh? And 12 of them will hit the middle class right between the eyes starting Jan. 2013 -AFTER the election because Obama didn't want that to bite him in the ass before securing his re-election.

So you really want to pretend all the doctors you claim to know are just too fucking stupid to figure out they are getting the short end of the stick on this thing and lawyers ONCE AGAIN insure THEY make out like the thieves they really are? Really?

Most doctors are intelligent enough to know that nothing good happens when government inserts itself between them and their patients. Whoever foots the bill really holds the power -and government intends that power will be IT -not the patient. Even though it is taxpayers really stuck with the tab, since government has included itself as middleman, it will be government wielding control and making life and death decisions for.........us. I wouldn't allow my neighbor on the next block to make my medical decisions but let's pretend a faceless bureaucracy really gives a shit about you, huh? As a "doctor" you must be aware that the reason doctors have been abandoning private practice as unaffordable is because of GOVERNMENT, right? Forced to hire people who bring zero extra dollars into their practice -just to handle the never ending paperwork, massively increasing their overhead while government keeps cutting their reimbursements -combined with the skyrocketing malpractice insurance -also thanks to fucking lawyers. Businesses add people whose productivity brings in MORE money to the business -but not true with the medical field where doctors and hospitals are forced to hire thousands of people to just shuffle government paperwork. And that isn't even counting the fact the average Medicaid bill submitted by doctors and hospitals gets rejected five times -and many doctors just don't bother filing it at all. And now increasing numbers are refusing to accept Medicaid patients since they are guaranteed to get screwed out of payment.

This bill fully intends to result in the destruction of private insurance companies with people forced onto Medicaid rolls -which is why they tried to strong arm states to raise taxes and then order them how to spend it. Except SCOTUS got that one partially right -the federal government has no authority to insert itself into state governments and order them to function as their puppet. Maybe you really don't know this -but the federal government belongs to the states, it is supposed to be subservient to the states with the exception of the enumerated powers given to it under the Constitution. State governments do NOT belong to the federal government. There is actually a REASON we are called the United STATES of America and not the People's Republic of America. So that was a blatant attempt to be the total game changer, stripping states of their sovereignty under the Constitution and forcing all states to become subservient to federal government -which is already on a power trip intent on laying claim to any and all powers and rights it can strip from we the people and the states.

Career politicians have done more damage to this nation than ANY other group and I am a firm believer now in term limits for all elected offices, not just the Presidency. No one should be allowed to enrich themselves at the public trough the way these fuckers have. Career politicians constantly seek to expand and entrench their power, constantly write new laws and regulations to justify their outrageous salaries and benefits they voted for themselves. They become corrupt egomaniacs convinced that merely getting elected has imparted magical powers on them and THEY know how to run any industry, run any segment of the economy -far better than the experts who do it for a living. I wouldn't allow that skank Pelosi to mow my lawn much less take over MY health care decisions and anyone who would is a moron. The people Pelosi insults and calls "freeloaders" aren't freeloaders. They are typically young, healthy single adults with no children and at the age where no health insurance is actually a sound financial judgment. That's right -NOT having health insurance really can be a SOUND FINANCIAL JUDGMENT. The vast majority of people in this group don't NEED health care and are NOT "freeloaders" getting health care because they typically don't utilize the system AT ALL! The reason Pelosi and her cronies NEED these people to get insurance -is they are the ones they intend to stick with the bill. They NEED their MONEY whether young, healthy adults who don't utilize the system want it or not -and the expected bill for that will be $1200 a MONTH. Of course they are unlikely going to be able to afford it -and either pay a "tax" at the end of the year or forced onto Medicaid rolls. Once people have insurance, they tend to view health care as "free" and go to see doctors for things they wouldn't bother if they had to pay for it directly out of pocket. They glut the system and we know this is true from the experiences of other nations. And that forces people who actually NEED health care to wait longer to be seen and their medical condition typically worsens and becomes more difficult to treat and eventually mortality rates for conditions still dropping in this country -start to rise again. Just as they are in the UK for all sorts of things from stroke, breast and prostate cancer, complications of diabetes and on and on. People are now being denied curative treatment in the UK when government decides they just aren't worth the cost. INSURANCE does NOT equal "quality medical care". Government run health care forces government to DISCRIMINATE against its own citizens -and people like stupid skank Pelosi are itching to force our government to do so as well. The problem with government run systems is that it encourages people who don't NEED health care to overutilize the system. So you can see a doctor for "free" to tell you that you have a cold and it will go away by itself in 10-14 days. But you will be denied treatment when you NEED it and denied even if it means forcing you to endure a lower quality of life -when the entire point of health care is to restore the individual to as near normal as possible and to improve the quality of life if they can't. NOT under a government system though -it becomes bastardized to be a system that exists primarily for those who don't need it and denied at the time you need it the most. Obama OPENLY said he wanted to change it to just such a system -one that existed for the purpose of keeping HEALTHY people healthy. In spite of the fact preventative health care is a lying ass crock of shit that is impossible. Going to the doctor when healthy will NOT keep you healthy and is a provable waste of precious resources! Doctors are trained to recognize and treat disease based on YOUR symptoms and signs of disease. With the exception of just a couple of conditions like glaucoma, it is IMPOSSIBLE for them to know you are sick before YOU DO! So what is Obama REALLY saying when he said he wanted to fundamentally change our system to one that existed for the purpose of keeping healthy people healthy instead of treating sick people? FIGURE IT OUT!

In spite of liberal LIES, exaggerations and distortions -the US had the best medical system in the world, our poor, unlike the poor of the world -have free medical care paid for by the 50% who pay federal income taxes and who are getting ready to take it in the shorts big time very soon. Our system is responsible for 95% of all medical advancements which it then shares with the entire world. With no close second. Kiss it good-bye. It won't just be Americans who suffer for this but the rest of the world as well.

I bet you help propagate some of the easily dis-proven lies about the US medical system -you know bullshit like claims that 33 countries have lower infant mortality rates than the US. Do you REALLY believe that? Especially given the fact the US is the nation that leads the world in infant survival of extreme prematurity. Do you even know where that lying ass piece of shit statistic comes from? Because if you are a DOCTOR, you would know this one. All nations self report and how they determine what qualifies as part of their morbidity and mortality rates is up to them. There is not only no uniform counting method in place, there is no way of enforcing one even if it did exist and no verification. Unlike the US and a couple of other countries, it is their governments that provides these statistics, the least reliable source for it -because what government wants to "brag" about suck ass stats, huh? In the case of infant mortality rates, any child in the US who dies in the first 12 months following birth is counted as part of our infant mortality rate. Any child who takes even one breath after birth, regardless of gestational age, is counted as a live birth. So even though a child born at 20 weeks has nearly 0 chance of survival, if it takes a single breath before dying -it becomes part of our infant mortality rates. Most countries -especially in the southern hemisphere and former Soviet satellites -count deaths only in the first three months following birth, some count for six months and a couple of European countries count the first nine months. The US has the longest counting period of any nation. Many countries only count as a live birth a baby born after 30 weeks -because any child born earlier isn't going to survive in their country anyway. Most count as a live birth a child born at 26 or 28 weeks or later. Who do you think is going to have a "higher" infant mortality rate then? In reality ours is the most ACCURATE but it is NOT 34th lowest. If someone is going to have an extremely premature baby -are they going to want to have it HERE or do ya really think they figure their kid has the best shot in Singapore instead? If every nation used the identical counting period which they never will, the US would have the 1st or 2nd lowest infant mortality rate in the world. That we have the longest counting period in the world and still come in at 34 tells you everything you really need to know about our infant mortality rate.

Obamacare wasn't just poorly written, poorly thought out and rammed through against the will of the vast majority while the reprehensible details of this piece of shit monstrosity were deliberately kept from the public. It is the biggest piece of TRASH produced by Congress in decades. You have to be truly mentally impaired to believe it will ever do anything but wreak havoc across the nation -because it will. And DOCTORS were the first to realize that.

By the way, anytime you hear a Democrat insist the mandate isn't really a "tax" but a penalty or whatever, remember something. SCOTUS ruled it is ONLY Constitutional as a tax. They are trying to hide that fact but it's true -it is ONLY constitutional as a tax. So if Democrats are going to insist it isn't a tax -that means they are agreeing it isn't constitutional either. They do NOT get it both ways on this one.

No really.

 

[koshergrl]

You didn't read his post.

 

[BDBoop]

Of course not.

Is there a rule I don't know about, whereby we have to read every bit of drivel that anybody spits out?

I didn't think so.