I am not understanding why single payer would be bad

[blu]

the way I see it:

1) I want healthcare and pay for it already

2) Their be more "choice" in which doctors you can see since virtually all of them would enroll in the single payer system

3) Giving everyone preventive care early will save us millions in not having to treat them for cancer and other expensive illnesses

4) the single payer system wouldn't drop you for "pre-existing conditions" or any other nonsense they make up at the time like private insurers can

5) I would rather pay into a pool that helps other people in need rather than further enrich immoral millionaires that run the current insurance companies

what about any of these are bad and what would be so bad about single payer?

 

[California Girl]

I judge on my experience in Europe. Their system sucks.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I judge on my experience in Europe. Their system sucks.

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

 

[WillowTree]

I judge on my experience in Europe. Their system sucks.

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

Except for the dead ones.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

When you can explain to me why we still need: Rural Electrification Department, Tennessee Valley Authority, Farmers Home Administration, Department of Education that is an Epic Fail and Fannie and Freddie, two separate companies with almost the same identical mission, I'll start listening on how the Gubbamint should run Health Care.

Deal?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

If you eliminate competition and allow the government a monopoly you're inevitably inviting fraud, waste, and abuse. You're also likely to see, as in the UK's NHS, a larger amount of bureaucrats than actual doctors and nurses. Also, once you create this monstrosity it will be nearly impossible to get rid of or even attempt to reform in any way shape or form. Look at Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. If you even mention that those three programs are in need of some amount of reform the propagandists begin to attack.

 

[blu]

so besides the fact that governments' can't seem to manage it correctly, it is in theory a good idea?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I judge on my experience in Europe. Their system sucks.

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

Except for the dead ones.

The US ranks behind all those European countries in terms of life span, infant mortality, and nearly every other statistic as well.

 

[antagon]

I judge on my experience in Europe. Their system sucks.

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

i think that this is the case because of ignorance. europeans hold some ridiculous beliefs about our healthcare system, but fail to realize that their hospitals and the care available is substandard to what americans with private coverage have come to expect.

the only upside is the price at delivery, however, they're forced to pay for the system in taxes.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I judge on my experience in Europe. Their system sucks.

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

i think that this is the case because of ignorance. europeans hold some ridiculous beliefs about our healthcare system, but fail to realize that their hospitals and the care available is substandard to what americans with private coverage have come to expect.

the only upside is the price at delivery, however, they're forced to pay for the system in taxes.

Except it's not. There's no evidence to support that claim.

 

[Big Black Dog]

When you can explain to me why we still need: Rural Electrification Department, Tennessee Valley Authority, Farmers Home Administration, Department of Education that is an Epic Fail and Fannie and Freddie, two separate companies with almost the same identical mission, I'll start listening on how the Gubbamint should run Health Care.

Deal?

The government has proven that they can't run the Post Office and keep it within budget. They can't manage social security nor medicare and keep it in budget. They robbed the social security fund to pay for other crap rather then to use the money for what it was intended for. No government program has ever cost what they said it would cost and this includes Owe Bama Care. I'd rather not have the government dabbling into my personal life and to be policed by the IRS to ensure you have health care is a complete shocker. What else will the government police in your life? Sorry. This whole Owe Bama Care crap is just that - crap. They won't ever manage this any better than they have ever managed anything.

 

[antagon]

so besides the fact that governments' can't seem to manage it correctly, it is in theory a good idea?

i think that our hospitals and HMO system is superior to the government-run models, even if the governments can manage their objectives just fine.

i think that service for profit is preferrable to service for austerity, and its been my experience in holland and the UK that this key difference comes through in the level of care and service received in european hospitals. there's no need to get so exotic, however. you can get a taste at a county vs. private hospital right here in the states.

for the US, i dont see why we would want to do away with what we have in exchange for a single-payer system. with the latest legislation, i think the public/private approach looks even more promising than before.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

so besides the fact that governments' can't seem to manage it correctly, it is in theory a good idea?

i think that our hospitals and HMO system is superior to the government-run models, even if the governments can manage their objectives just fine.

i think that service for profit is preferrable to service for austerity, and its been my experience in holland and the UK that this key difference comes through in the level of care and service received in european hospitals. there's no need to get so exotic, however. you can get a taste at a county vs. private hospital right here in the states.

for the US, i dont see why we would want to do away with what we have in exchange for a single-payer system. with the latest legislation, i think the public/private approach looks even more promising than before.

A single payer system does not involve the Government running hospitals. Hospitals would still be privately controlled.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

When you can explain to me why we still need: Rural Electrification Department, Tennessee Valley Authority, Farmers Home Administration, Department of Education that is an Epic Fail and Fannie and Freddie, two separate companies with almost the same identical mission, I'll start listening on how the Gubbamint should run Health Care.

Deal?

The government has proven that they can't run the Post Office and keep it within budget. They can't manage social security nor medicare and keep it in budget. They robbed the social security fund to pay for other crap rather then to use the money for what it was intended for. No government program has ever cost what they said it would cost and this includes Owe Bama Care. I'd rather not have the government dabbling into my personal life and to be policed by the IRS to ensure you have health care is a complete shocker. What else will the government police in your life? Sorry. This whole Owe Bama Care crap is just that - crap. They won't ever manage this any better than they have ever managed anything.

"ObamaCare" is a sellout to insurance companies, not a single-payer system. There's no comparison.

 

[antagon]

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

i think that this is the case because of ignorance. europeans hold some ridiculous beliefs about our healthcare system, but fail to realize that their hospitals and the care available is substandard to what americans with private coverage have come to expect.

the only upside is the price at delivery, however, they're forced to pay for the system in taxes.

Except it's not. There's no evidence to support that claim.

treatments available here are not available in european single-payer systems like the NHS. this is not the case the other way around. the quality of a private hospital in the UK or in the US is clearly superior to any NHS facility -- newer and definately cleaner. brighter, better equipped. certainly, the time to service is shorter at a private hospital ER. the time between scheduling and operation for procedures is longer in NHS hospitals as well. the US leads medical research largely through private funding from private profits.

what evidence or experience do you have which makes you feel that these systems are at par with the private care in the US?

 

[SFC Ollie]

Really? They all seem to like it there.

Healthcare System Ratings: U.S., Great Britain, Canada

Except for the dead ones.

The US ranks behind all those European countries in terms of life span, infant mortality, and nearly every other statistic as well.

Yet every year our life expectancy rises......

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Except for the dead ones.

The US ranks behind all those European countries in terms of life span, infant mortality, and nearly every other statistic as well.

Yet every year our life expectancy rises......

And so does the rest of the worlds....
Google - public data

According to the CIA World Factbook in 2009, we're currently ranked 36th, in terms of life expectancy.

 

[antagon]

so besides the fact that governments' can't seem to manage it correctly, it is in theory a good idea?

i think that our hospitals and HMO system is superior to the government-run models, even if the governments can manage their objectives just fine.

i think that service for profit is preferrable to service for austerity, and its been my experience in holland and the UK that this key difference comes through in the level of care and service received in european hospitals. there's no need to get so exotic, however. you can get a taste at a county vs. private hospital right here in the states.

for the US, i dont see why we would want to do away with what we have in exchange for a single-payer system. with the latest legislation, i think the public/private approach looks even more promising than before.

A single payer system does not involve the Government running hospitals. Hospitals would still be privately controlled.

it would have to require control over costs of procedures and limitations or standardization of practices, even if the government were to let private hospitals handle the consumer end of the operation. the consequence will be similar to a directly-operated facility, except for the lame-duck middle man.

if we are going to abandon what we have going, why would we leave private hospitals to squeeze out a living in competition with public facilities? better we nationalize them in this misguided, backward-thinking scenario.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

i think that our hospitals and HMO system is superior to the government-run models, even if the governments can manage their objectives just fine.

i think that service for profit is preferrable to service for austerity, and its been my experience in holland and the UK that this key difference comes through in the level of care and service received in european hospitals. there's no need to get so exotic, however. you can get a taste at a county vs. private hospital right here in the states.

for the US, i dont see why we would want to do away with what we have in exchange for a single-payer system. with the latest legislation, i think the public/private approach looks even more promising than before.

A single payer system does not involve the Government running hospitals. Hospitals would still be privately controlled.

it would have to require control over costs of procedures and limitations or standardization of practices, even if the government were to let private hospitals handle the consumer end of the operation. the consequence will be similar to a directly-operated facility, except for the lame-duck middle man.

if we are going to abandon what we have going, why would we leave private hospitals to squeeze out a living in competition with public facilities? better we nationalize them in this misguided, backward-thinking scenario.

There are no public facilities in a single payer system. That's what you don't seem to be getting.

 

[SFC Ollie]

There is no reason to allow the government to control all our health care. That is nothing more than more big government. Besides Government health care isn't all that great, I've been under their thumb most of my adult life. Problems on top of problems.