How much should health care cost? Should it cost anything?

[Bern80]

That's what I would like to know. Because the more liberal support and arguments you read for Obamacare or single payer or UHC, it seems that the left doesnt' really want health care to cost less, they want it to cost nothing to the consumer. That concept needs to be addresssed. Tackling the cost to the consumer and lowering it has one set of possible solutions. Making it cost nothing or something government funded through taxes requires another set of solutions.

So out with it libs. Is health care something you should pay directly for? Or is it something government should provide through taxes?

 

[WillowTree]

 

[WillowTree]

XXXXXX


this is just a test.. yes,, the XXXXXXX word is still allowed even though it has been **** in my sig line. Kerry On.

 

[Old Rocks]

There are many ways to pay for a Health Care system. Differant ways in Britian, Germany, Switzerland, Japan, and Taiwan.

Nobody is suggesting that it does not have to be paid for. In fact, were we to have a real system, it would cost me less than the insurance I now have. For more information;

FRONTLINE: sick around the world | PBS

In none of the democracies are there citizens going bankrupt because of medical bills. That is our privilege alone of all the western democracies.

 

[Bern80]

In none of the democracies are there citizens going bankrupt because of medical bills. That is our privilege alone of all the western democracies.

Nope, just their governments.

And you didn't answer the question. Should it be paid for through taxes and government administered or should indiivudals have to pay for the medical services they require?

 

[Old Rocks]

XXXXX


this is just a test.. yes,, the XXXXX word is still allowed even though it has been **** in my sig line. Kerry On.

Ah, Widdo Willyo, no one should try to improve your classyness.

 

[urdrwho]

But you didn't answer the question. How much should it cost?

I'm a 58 year old man, have a 17 year old kid and a policy that I pay $280 a month for insurance. I do not expect to go to the Dr and pay him $20 and the insurance pay the remainder. I can and should pay my doctor visit the same as my parentd and the same as their parents did.

let me digress. When I say the insurance pay the remainder what I am saying is that you are paying for me. Since insurance is a social compact where the risk is spread among the people belonging to the same insurance company, you would be the one paying the remainder of the doctors visit.

So if I can pay my Dr...why should I expect you to pay but that is what many American's want....someone else to pay.

Today I was reading about a couple that are suing over Obama Care. Their pleading is that "accord*ing to their complaint, “the immediate reduction of long-term purchasing power” is a legal injury to them “directly resulting from the unconstitutional individual mandate and penalty.

On March 27, they began shopping for a new automobile. Their $450-a-month disposable income only allowed them to afford a five year financing plan.

Four days earlier, President Barack Obama signed the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. The “individual mandate” of the law requires citizens to purchase health insurance or be financially penalized through their income tax returns. The XXXXXX contend that mandate means their disposable income must be directed toward insurance premiums instead of a new car.”

I agree with their legal pleading but the purchase of a car is more important than paying for health insurance.

I have always thought there are two discussions and they get blurred. One is health care and the other is health insurance. What I hear is people complaining about the cost of health insurance but call it health care. I rarely hear or read of someone complaining because they had to pay $1,500 for the ultra sound and why does it cost so much or why does my doctor charge $150 for an office visit. Normally when they complain it is about the cost of insurance.

Health insurance pays for health care. So I think we need to discuss the two as separate issues and Obama Care does nothing to stem health care costs. He masterfully blurred the two discussions under one umbrella - health insurance.

 

[WillowTree]

XXXXX


this is just a test.. yes,, the XXXXX word is still allowed even though it has been **** in my sig line. Kerry On.

Ah, Widdo Willyo, no one should try to improve your classyness.

I'm not the one who said it. sorry your ass fails again.

 

[Bern80]

But you didn't answer the question. How much should it cost?

I'm a 58 year old man, have a 17 year old kid and a policy that I pay $280 a month for insurance. I do not expect to go to the Dr and pay him $20 and the insurance pay the remainder. I can and should pay my doctor visit the same as my parentd and the same as their parents did.

let me digress. When I say the insurance pay the remainder what I am saying is that you are paying for me. Since insurance is a social compact where the risk is spread among the people belonging to the same insurance company, you would be the one paying the remainder of the doctors visit.

So if I can pay my Dr...why should I expect you to pay but that is what many American's want....someone else to pay.

Today I was reading about a couple that are suing over Obama Care. Their pleading is that "accord*ing to their complaint, “the immediate reduction of long-term purchasing power” is a legal injury to them “directly resulting from the unconstitutional individual mandate and penalty.

On March 27, they began shopping for a new automobile. Their $450-a-month disposable income only allowed them to afford a five year financing plan.

Four days earlier, President Barack Obama signed the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. The “individual mandate” of the law requires citizens to purchase health insurance or be financially penalized through their income tax returns. The XXXXXX contend that mandate means their disposable income must be directed toward insurance premiums instead of a new car.”

I agree with their legal pleading but the purchase of a car is more important than paying for health insurance.

I have always thought there are two discussions and they get blurred. One is health care and the other is health insurance. What I hear is people complaining about the cost of health insurance but call it health care. I rarely hear or read of someone complaining because they had to pay $1,500 for the ultra sound and why does it cost so much or why does my doctor charge $150 for an office visit. Normally when they complain it is about the cost of insurance.

Health insurance pays for health care. So I think we need to discuss the two as separate issues and Obama Care does nothing to stem health care costs. He masterfully blurred the two discussions under one umbrella - health insurance.

I think you're right. I think if we want solutions to this people need to start thinking outside the box. First by letting go of the notion that insurance is the only de facto way to pay for health care in a free market.

But again to have that discussion there has to be consensus first that individuals should finance their own health care.

 

[editec]

What is your life worth, Bern80?

Out with it, lad , tell us exactly what it's worth.

Is it worth every cent you have?

Even if it leaves you bankrupted?

My guess is that to you it is.

That, FYI, is why normal market considerations are meaningless when it comes to health care issues and policies.

When was the last time you shopped around for heart by pass surgery?

 

[RDD_1210]

Do you really think that liberals want totally free healthcare? Is that even possible? One way or another it is going to be paid for by us. The question is how to we go about paying for it? Do we pay through insurance companies who take part of what we pay and put it in their pocket for profit? Or do we pay for it through non-profit means where you have no middle man who needs to turn a profit for shareholders?

 

[RDD_1210]

Let me ask this question -

If someone goes to an ER at a hospital, they are not refused treatment, who should be paying for that?

 

[syrenn]

That's what I would like to know. Because the more liberal support and arguments you read for Obamacare or single payer or UHC, it seems that the left doesnt' really want health care to cost less, they want it to cost nothing to the consumer. That concept needs to be addresssed. Tackling the cost to the consumer and lowering it has one set of possible solutions. Making it cost nothing or something government funded through taxes requires another set of solutions.

So out with it libs. Is health care something you should pay directly for? Or is it something government should provide through taxes?

Have you ever hear the terms: You get what you pay for and nothing in life is free?

Nothing in life is free. Someone always pays for it. It may be great for some not having to pay for any health care, but trust me, someone IS paying for it. Not them of course and that is all they care about.

I laugh when we have strikes here and the sticking point is how much their copay will go up. Fine, please don't pay your copay and pay the entire cost of the bill. Works for me.

So whine about copays. Boohoo they go up. Copays are a fraction of the true cost of medical care and services.

I am SICK of the whining about health care. Pay for it.

Should government pay for your health care. In my opinion NO.

 

[Bern80]

What is your life worth, Bern80?

Out with it, lad , tell us exactly what it's worth.

Is it worth every cent you have?

Even if it leaves you bankrupted?

My guess is that to you it is.

That, FYI, is why normal market considerations are meaningless when it comes to health care issues and policies.

When was the last time you shopped around for heart by pass surgery?

That's kind of my point in asking the question ed (which you didn't answer)? The fact that you didn't answer it proves my point. Cost controlling solutions, even ones that proclaim to control costs like Obamacare, are irrelevant if what people really think is that health care is too valuable to put any price tag on. That's why the question should your health care be publicly funded or privately funded by you needs to be answered first. None of you libs seem to want to fess up.

 

[Bern80]

Let me ask this question -

If someone goes to an ER at a hospital, they are not refused treatment, who should be paying for that?

The patient. Now answer my question.

 

[RDD_1210]

Let me ask this question -

If someone goes to an ER at a hospital, they are not refused treatment, who should be paying for that?

The patient. Now answer my question.

Ummm.....What if they can't? hence why they don't have insurance to begin with.

 

[Bern80]

Do you really think that liberals want totally free healthcare? Is that even possible? One way or another it is going to be paid for by us. The question is how to we go about paying for it? Do we pay through insurance companies who take part of what we pay and put it in their pocket for profit? Or do we pay for it through non-profit means where you have no middle man who needs to turn a profit for shareholders?

ANY private business needs to turn a profit RDD. Even if you were paying your doctor and the hosipital directly. They still need to make a profit. But that's the only way to eliminate the middle man. Even if all health care was funded through tax collection there's still a middle man; government.

 

[mudwhistle]

That's what I would like to know. Because the more liberal support and arguments you read for Obamacare or single payer or UHC, it seems that the left doesnt' really want health care to cost less, they want it to cost nothing to the consumer. That concept needs to be addresssed. Tackling the cost to the consumer and lowering it has one set of possible solutions. Making it cost nothing or something government funded through taxes requires another set of solutions.

So out with it libs. Is health care something you should pay directly for? Or is it something government should provide through taxes?

 

[Bern80]

Let me ask this question -

If someone goes to an ER at a hospital, they are not refused treatment, who should be paying for that?

The patient. Now answer my question.

Ummm.....What if they can't? hence why they don't have insurance to begin with.

Then you work something out with the hospital to pay for it over time if you have to.


Now answer my question.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Let me ask this question -

If someone goes to an ER at a hospital, they are not refused treatment, who should be paying for that?

The person that went to the ER.

If they have ins, the ins pays the lion share.

If not they can set up a payment plan.