How Hillary can win - by playing the same old game - and how this liberates the liberals

emilynghiem

Constitutionalist / Universalist
Jan 21, 2010
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After listening in on a conference call with concerned Christians, regarding the meeting of Donald Trump Ben Carson and about 700 evangelical leaders,
it is becoming more clear to me why Hillary can win the election.

The conservatives and Christians are too divided.** Cruz is distancing himself from Trump, because of this sense that Clinton will win, and that aligning with Trump is a bad political/career move. (** the conservatives who don't support Trump will not compromise their values or principles to vote for him anyway, but the liberals who don't support Clinton will vote Democrat as their only choice even if it isn't going to get them what they want, that's the difference)

I thought over this and think this is how Clinton can win:
1. There are two lines of Republicans splitting away from Trump:
* the hardcore right (who will not support Clinton either) but bow out and will not support him publicly to help get votes for him.
* vs. SOME moderates who are criticized by other Republicans for going along with liberal agenda.
Clinton only has to kowtow to THOSE conservatives, and can make promises and sell out all she wants and
get that support.

2. She does not have to appease the far left Democrats and liberals supporting Sanders
because that is not the agenda that gets her elected. As always, the one who will vote for the Democrat anyway will do so, whether she breaks promises again or makes them at all!

In fact the more she ALIENATES the far left who are labeled socialist, the better she will do both with the mainstream voters, and particularly with the crowd that is ditching Trump and wants something conservative enough but not the far far socialist left.

So in other words,
* The more Clinton kowtows to the more liberal rightwing, that have alienated the traditional conservatives complaining these people and politicians have sold out the party, the better she does.

* The more Clinton distances herself from socialist Sanders and farther left progressive image,
the better she does.

She just has to keep selling out to the corporate mainstream buying out both parties and she can win!

3. Now how does this help the real liberals left out of the loop?
The left out left can finally wake up and realize they will never get their agenda through govt this way. This path will only lead to corporate cronyism that buys out both parties and gets hybrid/compromise legislation passed that satisfies nobody.

So it is finally possible that the left will quit trying to get what they want out of a losing game,
let their candidates win anyway playing the same old corporate and media games,
and finally decide to invest in their own solutions and quit relying on govt to deliver these.

The Greens and Libertarians also left out of the loop are in a similar position of
finding ways to implement programs directly and quit trying to go through govt to get anywhere.

So if all these left out liberals, libertarians, independents and fed up taxpayers pull out of the game, let it run the way it's going to anyway, and quit paying money attention or credence to the garbage that comes from pushing agenda back and forth in conflict where no good laws get passed that way, then maybe more people will become liberated, and find motivation and support to collaborate on solutions OUTSIDE of govt that is hijacked by this shellgame.

We can still vote, still lobby for and against policies, But just not rely on a losing game
that gets the best manipulator elected.

Trump may do better in the future, but Clinton has had several more seasons learning how to play these games and get the media and corporate buddy/interests covering up, so she may win on experience alone.

Not the reason to elect someone but that is what rises to the top.

The real work is on the grassroots level, so anyone left out of the loop may find themselves better off.
 
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Certainly a republican party that argues that we should deregulate , cut taxes on the wealthiest in our society that have hurt this country badly, and acting like we shouldn't maintain many things people care about is enough of a good reason to vote for Hillary.

The problem with the current republican ideals is they're backwards and don't sound very good to a new generation of people that believe in a America that can be so much better.
 
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Certainly arguing that we should deregulate , cut taxes on the wealthiest in our society that have hurt this country badly, and acting like we shouldn't maintain many things people care about is enough of a good reason to vote for Hillary.

The problem with the current republican ideals is they're backwards and don't sound very good to a new generation of people that believe in a America that can be so much better.

Dear Matthew you are mixing two different things
1. allowing corporate powers to get away with abusing tax dollars is one thing
(where your argument doesn't stand where Clinton and the Democrats have played the corporate interests over the taxpayers for their benefit also)
2. but there is nothing wrong with NOT wanting to depend on govt for welfare andbusiness
* where workers can own and manage their own programs themselves *

Even Sanders was pushing for worker-owned coops
and the Greens have pushed to set up independent schools and clinics that don't rely on govt
That is not a bad thing, but necessary for people to grow toward self-reliance sustainable management and EQUALITY instead of relying on "third parties" in power in charge of govt to manage for them. We'll never achieve equality by depending on govt.
This is common ground among the independents,
but as long as the groups remain divided and disempowered, the full potential of going at it independently has yet to be realized.

Matthew my point is neither the rightwing nor the leftwing unhappy with corporate BS politics is going to get what they want out of this election. The difference is the leftwing will go along with the BS anyway, as your post demonstrates, and get Clinton elected. While the rightwing is too principled and will sacrifice getting a conservative in by not voting at all; why? because the leftwing keeps depending on party politics even when it's nothing but lies and failure. And the rightwing position is NOT to depend on govt but run programs through churches and businesses anyway; so they will work on their own things outside of govt anyway in keeping with their conservative policies. While the left will continue to bog down govt with more BS because that is what their agenda is based on. Doing everything through govt even when this isn't going to work but just fill the agenda with corporate crap like ACA.
 
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Christianists are nazis. Trump is moderate. People don't want all that nazi shit again. We just want sanity.
 
Evangelical leader says Trump is ‘un-Christian,' endorses Clinton
Source: The Hill



June 21, 2016, 03:05 pm
Evangelical leader says Trump is ‘un-Christian,' endorses Clinton

By Tim Devaney



A top Evangelical leader on Tuesday called Donald Trump “un-Christian” and endorsed Hillary Clinton for president.


“Mr. Trump’s proposals are not just un-Christian — they’re un-American and at odds with the values our country holds dearest,” said Deborah Fikes, executive advisor to the World Evangelical Alliance, a global ministry organization that works with churches in 129 countries around the world.

.......................



..................
“As someone who has fought hard to counter China’s recent persecution of Christian minorities, I worry that allowing religious and ethnic intolerance here in American will undermine our ability to have a prayer of fighting it around the world.

“When candidates like Mr. Trump start sounding eerily similar to some of the worst global offenders, it’s time for some serious soul searching,” she added.

By contrast, Fikes called Clinton a “trustworthy” politician who is “embraced by many Evangelical sister churches.”................

Read more: Evangelical leader says Trump is ‘un-Christian,' endorses Clinton
 
She is trying to win by condemning Trump for the very things she is guilty of. It is an old trick that apparently still works on the ignorant and uninformed. Her speech in Columbus yesterday is a good example.
 
She is trying to win by condemning Trump for the very things she is guilty of. It is an old trick that apparently still works on the ignorant and uninformed. Her speech in Columbus yesterday is a good example.
Trump's entire career is chicanery , cheating hustling...that is why he has Four (4) Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits and cannot reveal his taxes...
 
She is trying to win by condemning Trump for the very things she is guilty of. It is an old trick that apparently still works on the ignorant and uninformed. Her speech in Columbus yesterday is a good example.
Trump's entire career is chicanery , cheating hustling...that is why he has Four (4) Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits and cannot reveal his taxes...
Yeah and Hillary is all about truth, fairness, and justice.
 
according to Death and Taxes:
In the court filing, “Defendant Trump” allegedly “initiated sexual contact with Plaintiff at four different parties. On the fourth and final sexual encounter with Defendant Trump, Defendant Trump tied Plaintiff to a bed, exposed himself to Plaintiff, and then proceeded to forcibly rape Plaintiff. During the course of this savage sexual attack, Plaintiff loudly pleaded with Defendant Trump to stop but with no effect. Defendant Trump responded to Plaintiff’s pleas by violently striking Plaintiff in the face with his open hand and screaming that he would do whatever he wanted.”

In the next section, she adds that “Immediately following this rape, Defendant Trump threatened Plaintiff that, were she ever to reveal any of the details of the sexual and physical abuse of her by Defendant Trump, Plaintiff and her family would be physically harmed if not killed.”

Donald Trump Accused of Rape in Federal Court Lawsuit
 
She is trying to win by condemning Trump for the very things she is guilty of. It is an old trick that apparently still works on the ignorant and uninformed. Her speech in Columbus yesterday is a good example.
Trump's entire career is chicanery , cheating hustling...that is why he has Four (4) Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits and cannot reveal his taxes...
Yeah and Hillary is all about truth, fairness, and justice.
Let me tell you something about "Trump Campaign Promises"...Donald Trump is a man who has in the past in the course of his business career put his promises in writing ...he still does not fulfill those written contractual; and documented Promises .....this is why he has Four Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits ....

Now what chance of fulfillment do campaign Promises written in the idiot wind coming off Trump's mouth have ...Zero ...less than zero
 
She is trying to win by condemning Trump for the very things she is guilty of. It is an old trick that apparently still works on the ignorant and uninformed. Her speech in Columbus yesterday is a good example.
Trump's entire career is chicanery , cheating hustling...that is why he has Four (4) Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits and cannot reveal his taxes...
Yeah and Hillary is all about truth, fairness, and justice.
Let me tell you something about "Trump Campaign Promises"...Donald Trump is a man who has in the past in the course of his business career put his promises in writing ...he still does not fulfill those written contractual; and documented Promises .....this is why he has Four Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits ....

Now what chance of fulfillment do campaign Promises written in the idiot wind coming off Trump's mouth have ...Zero ...less than zero
Glad you can SEE Trump's many foibles.

Can you SEE Hillary's many foibles?

Yeah...thought so.

Partisans...they are CRAZY!!!
 
She is trying to win by condemning Trump for the very things she is guilty of. It is an old trick that apparently still works on the ignorant and uninformed. Her speech in Columbus yesterday is a good example.
Trump's entire career is chicanery , cheating hustling...that is why he has Four (4) Business bankruptcies and 3500 law suits and cannot reveal his taxes...

Dear TyroneSlothrop the difference is that Trump admits
he's been in the business of buying out politicians and making deals all his life.

Clinton won't admit any such thing, and doesn't have to. Everyone knows that.
But as long as she runs as the Democrat, and "says all the right things" she'll get those votes.

The minority Black and Latino voters who have figured out that independence from govt is the way to go,
and will cross over and vote for Trump are REALLY in the minority, Trump has loyal Latino support from the independent types who don't want illegal immigrant criminals getting away with murder, but this crowd is alienated by the left and the media, similar to the exgays and others who don't tout the liberal agenda.
 
Christianists are nazis. Trump is moderate. People don't want all that nazi shit again. We just want sanity.

Dear The Great Goose unfortunately with the split between conservatives who will support Trump, and ones that won't, the farther right who will sit out of voting or the moderates who will vote for Clinton (or independents for Gary Johnson for that matter) don't have to be united to take votes away from Trump.

Supporters of Trump will become the new version of the Libertarians who can't get enough of a majority to get their candidate elected, but at least their candidate got into the media and pushes for govt to hear from that many people who aren't following along with the program as given. Sanders also is like a third party movement that will show there is a split and get coverage in the media, but not enough to win.

In the past, the third parties such as the Socialists at least got some AGENDA through govt, as with social security pushed by Socialists or workers benefits pushed by labor unions.

Trump may have influence on immigration and gun policies if he keeps rallying up people on all sides demanding to enforce American traditions. At best, if Trump can rally together all the independents including Sanders and Johnson people to get behind economic programs "outside of govt" these factions can still work toward what they want, but NOT through govt, and therefore won't affect the vote of people still depending on Clinton and Democrat politics.
The splitting off of independents HURTS Trump (while Hillary will get the votes anyway regardless what happens with runaway Sanders voters who will still cost Trump more votes) because these types can't unite and if they do it is all on reforms OUTSIDE of govt.

The majority of people "depending on govt" is still greater than the numbers of INDEPENDENT people, whose votes are split because of the nature of being independent and not relying on the Democratic candidate to keep riding on the coattails of federal govt for social programs.

Anyone who is SANE is not going to go along with any of this BS anyway,
we'll vote the best we can, but that vote is still going to be split compared to the people willing to play along!
 
he's been in the business of buying out politicians and making deals all his life.

Clinton won't admit any such thing, and doesn't have to. Everyone knows that.
But as long as she runs as the Democrat, and "says all the right things" she'll get those votes.

The minority Black and Latino voters who have figured out that independence from govt is the way to go,
and will cross over and vote for Trump are REALLY in the minority, Trump has loyal Latino support from the independent types who don't want illegal immigrant criminals getting away with murder, but this crowd is alienated by the left and the media, similar to the exgays and others who don't tout the liberal agenda.
Its the deals where he scams the every day folks like Trump University ...like not paying small businesses who have provided him with goods and services ...when is he going to admit that ? when is he going to admit he gets rich on cut throat chicanery ...Trump is not noble ...get that through your head..he is not virtuous ...he is a serial philanderer , has been accused of rape in sworn Court documents ...for God's sake LOL
 
he's been in the business of buying out politicians and making deals all his life.

Clinton won't admit any such thing, and doesn't have to. Everyone knows that.
But as long as she runs as the Democrat, and "says all the right things" she'll get those votes.

The minority Black and Latino voters who have figured out that independence from govt is the way to go,
and will cross over and vote for Trump are REALLY in the minority, Trump has loyal Latino support from the independent types who don't want illegal immigrant criminals getting away with murder, but this crowd is alienated by the left and the media, similar to the exgays and others who don't tout the liberal agenda.
Its the deals where he scams the every day folks like Trump University ...like not paying small businesses who have provided him with goods and services ...when is he going to admit that ? when is he going to admit he gets rich on cut throat chicanery ...Trump is not noble ...get that through your head..he is not virtuous ...he is a serial philanderer , has been accused of rape in sworn Court documents ...for God's sake LOL

Dear TyroneSlothrop
Regardless how much dirt you dig up on either Trump or Clinton,
this hurts Trump more than Clinton. Because the liberals who rely on govt regardless of
the corruption are going to vote for Clinton anyway.

Even if charges get thrown out or go nowhere (either those against Trump or charges against Clinton).
You are missing my point: No matter how bad the corruption of either candidate is,
it DOESN'T MAKE a difference. People who are split over this will NOT vote for Trump
but will either vote for Clinton or throw their vote away which is a vote for Clinton.

The independent votes will still be split, if NOT for the reasons you cite but for many other reasons too!
And this harms Trump but doesn't affect Clinton who's got the media, lawyers and liberals covering for her.
She can get away with murder, and will still get elected, while Trump gets dumped for any thing at all.
 

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