How a Leader Responds to Americans Threatened

[mudwhistle]

Iraq is a perfect strategic location to operate in the ME.
That's why Iran wants us out of there.
That's why Obama got us out of there....at the behest of his Iranian advisers.

He never got us out.........unfortunately.

Nonsense. Once we left Iraq....

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

 

[pknopp]

He never got us out.........unfortunately.

Nonsense. Once we left Iraq....

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

 

[mudwhistle]

Nonsense. Once we left Iraq....

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

 

[pknopp]

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

He honored the agreement between Bush and Iraq. It's odd how people want to forget this. You can argue he shouldn't have but that is what he did.

 

[mudwhistle]

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

He honored the agreement between Bush and Iraq. It's odd how people want to forget this. You can argue he shouldn't have but that is what he did.

Bush agreed to keep 30,000 in Iraq.
My understanding is that Obama pulled them out and left a few advisers behind to fend for themselves.

 

[pknopp]

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

He honored the agreement between Bush and Iraq. It's odd how people want to forget this. You can argue he shouldn't have but that is what he did.

Bush agreed to keep 30,000 in Iraq.
My understanding is that Obama pulled them out and left a few advisers behind to fend for themselves.

Bush's agreement was for us to leave.

In 2008 the American and Iraqi governments signed the U.S.–Iraq Status of Forces Agreement. It included a specific date, 30 June 2009, by which American forces should withdraw from Iraqi cities, and a complete withdrawal date from Iraqi territory by 31 December 2011

Withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq - Wikipedia

 

[Circe]

Just what do you imagine US interests in Iraq to be?

We don't have interests in Iraq; we never did, after Kuwait was dealt with by George H.W. Bush pere.

And THAT is the problem. No interests, don't need the oil, get OUT.

Not quite. It's a small world today and what affects the ME affects our economy. While we are oil independent many of our trading partners are not. Moreover, there is a clear danger of a nuclear arms race in the ME and that could directly endanger us. Our interests are no longer narrow US interests but the interests of the whole world. The Europeans are useless and Russia under Putin is eager to fight above its weight and is behaving irresponsible, so if not for the US who is left to maintain some semblance of order in the world's hot spots? China? The UN. We would all like see our soldiers come home, but if they leave and it precipitates a nuclear arms race, what would they be coming home to?

I think that is a good, level analysis. My preference, as stated, is for simplicity: get out, with caveats that they'd better not allow ISIS or Iran to take over and be warlike toward us, or we'll bomb them. No troops: that does NOT work. Just bombs. But I agree with all you said, and nice point about Russia is fighting about its weight. Everywhere, everyway.

 

[Circe]

We aren't going to stop Iran from getting nukes. If needed China and Russia will supply them.

You surprise me: most people assume North Korea will supply them with nukes. However, it's not a bad analysis, IMO --- we see now (with the joint military exercises) that Iran, China, and Russia are now an Axis against us. So.....Yeah. Could happen, about the nukes, if Iran were crazy enough to be willing to take point in a casus bellum.

 

[Nostra]

Iraq is a perfect strategic location to operate in the ME.
That's why Iran wants us out of there.
That's why Obama got us out of there....at the behest of his Iranian advisers.

He never got us out.........unfortunately.

Nonsense. Once we left Iraq....

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

Barry Hussein says you are full of shit.

 

[Nostra]

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

He honored the agreement between Bush and Iraq. It's odd how people want to forget this. You can argue he shouldn't have but that is what he did.

The only thing that wasn't decided is the number of troops required to be in Iraq on an ongoing basis. That was the ONE thing Barry Hussein had to negotiate. He sucked at diplomacy, and was such a pussy he let the clown in Iraq send us packing. This led to the rise of Barry's "JV Team", ISIS.

Barry was a clusterfuck of epic proportions.

 

[pknopp]

We aren't going to stop Iran from getting nukes. If needed China and Russia will supply them.

You surprise me: most people assume North Korea will supply them with nukes. However, it's not a bad analysis, IMO --- we see now (with the joint military exercises) that Iran, China, and Russia are now an Axis against us. So.....Yeah. Could happen, about the nukes, if Iran were crazy enough to be willing to take point in a casus bellum.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

 

[Circe]

We aren't going to stop Iran from getting nukes. If needed China and Russia will supply them.

lol You have a very rich fantasy life. No one, not Russia or China or even the useless Europeans wants Iran to have nuclear weapons. Nor does Saudi Arabia or Egypt of any of the Sunni countries and Israel is prepared to go to any lengths necessary to prevent it. If the US finds it necessary to use military force to stop Iran from acquiring nukes, neither Russia or China will have any interest in going to war with the US to prevent it. Iran will never have nuclear weapons, the only question is, how badly damaged will Iran have to be before it accepts that fact.[/QUOTE]

You are a lot more optimistic than I am! I figure Iran will be threatening Chicago within a couple years. Excellent point, that Israel is really our best hope. I disagree, as I said earlier, that China or Russia would stop them getting nukes. Iran STARTING the war that they then continue might suit them very well. They are Axis allies now: doing military exercises together. That's huge.

Are we remembering that every prez has a war? It's not special, it's the almost inevitable norm. I think Trump has been very restrained, waiting for his second term. But if he doesn't start one, God forbid, like George W. Bush The Idiot did, our enemies will.

 

[pknopp]

He never got us out.........unfortunately.

Nonsense. Once we left Iraq....

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

Barry Hussein says you are full of shit.

I thought we had already made it clear that he had completely failed at nearly everything he did? With that the case, I should care what he said?

 

[Weatherman2020]

We aren't going to stop Iran from getting nukes. If needed China and Russia will supply them.

You surprise me: most people assume North Korea will supply them with nukes. However, it's not a bad analysis, IMO --- we see now (with the joint military exercises) that Iran, China, and Russia are now an Axis against us. So.....Yeah. Could happen, about the nukes, if Iran were crazy enough to be willing to take point in a casus bellum.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

Are you really that ignorant?

 

[pknopp]

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

He honored the agreement between Bush and Iraq. It's odd how people want to forget this. You can argue he shouldn't have but that is what he did.

The only thing that wasn't decided is the number of troops required to be in Iraq on an ongoing basis. That was the ONE thing Barry Hussein had to negotiate. He sucked at diplomacy, and was such a pussy he let the clown in Iraq send us packing. This led to the rise of Barry's "JV Team", ISIS.

Barry was a clusterfuck of epic proportions.

Complete withdrawal is clear.

 

[pknopp]

We aren't going to stop Iran from getting nukes. If needed China and Russia will supply them.

You surprise me: most people assume North Korea will supply them with nukes. However, it's not a bad analysis, IMO --- we see now (with the joint military exercises) that Iran, China, and Russia are now an Axis against us. So.....Yeah. Could happen, about the nukes, if Iran were crazy enough to be willing to take point in a casus bellum.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

Are you really that ignorant?

We will see won't we?

 

[Nostra]

Nonsense. Once we left Iraq....

We drew down the troops but we never got out. What happened was going to happen at some point no matter when we did that. Go ahead, have your candidate run on us wasting billions in Iraq for ever.

Obama got all of our combat troops out...then the Shiites started killing Christians and Sunnis. Left behind a few embassy personnel and guards....not enough to intervene. The only reason we know about this embassy attack is because the media hopes it will be Trump's Benghazi.

No, we left troops. We simply called them something else. The only issue I have with what happened at the embassy is the idea that we are even there at all..

They don't want us there. We can't explain why we are there so we shouldn't be there.

Barry Hussein says you are full of shit.

I thought we had already made it clear that he had completely failed at nearly everything he did? With that the case, I should care what he said?

Just pointing out you don't know WTF you are talking about, as usual.

 

[Circe]

China and Russia is not going to allow anything to get between Iran and their oil trade.

Subscribe to read | Financial Times

I'm probably one of the few here who could and did read the FT pink pages article. I find them too anti-American but hubby likes the market intel.

Israel can act any time they want. They don't want to, they want us to. Israel isn't interested in the retaliation from China and Russia.

Iran will have nukes.

Sure. Total agreement.

 

[Weatherman2020]

We aren't going to stop Iran from getting nukes. If needed China and Russia will supply them.

You surprise me: most people assume North Korea will supply them with nukes. However, it's not a bad analysis, IMO --- we see now (with the joint military exercises) that Iran, China, and Russia are now an Axis against us. So.....Yeah. Could happen, about the nukes, if Iran were crazy enough to be willing to take point in a casus bellum.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

It's not clear that N. Korea will ever get or develop nukes. Iran will.

Are you really that ignorant?

We will see won't we?

Go stick to the Arts and Crafts forum, ignoramus.

North Korea detonates third nuclear bomb test

 

[Nostra]

We left troops......but call them something else???

RLMAFAO!!!!

We call them "advisors". They are troops.

I used to be an "Advisor".
Advisors can be killed pretty easy when they're outnumbered.
Obama pulled out our combat troops.....at least that's what he took credit for.

He honored the agreement between Bush and Iraq. It's odd how people want to forget this. You can argue he shouldn't have but that is what he did.

Bush agreed to keep 30,000 in Iraq.
My understanding is that Obama pulled them out and left a few advisers behind to fend for themselves.

Bush's agreement was for us to leave.

In 2008 the American and Iraqi governments signed the U.S.–Iraq Status of Forces Agreement. It included a specific date, 30 June 2009, by which American forces should withdraw from Iraqi cities, and a complete withdrawal date from Iraqi territory by 31 December 2011

Withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq - Wikipedia

From your link:

Negotiations between the U.S. and Iraq for a new SOFA began in fall 2010. There were late-night meetings at the fortified compound of then Iraqi president, Jalal Talabani, and in video conferences between Baghdad and Washington. In June 2011, diplomats and Iraqi officials said that President Obama had told Prime Minister Maliki that he was prepared to leave up to 10,000 soldiers to continue training and equipping the Iraqi Security Forces (ISF). Mr. Maliki agreed, but said he needed time to line up political allies. Eventually, he gained authorization to continue talks with the U.S. on keeping troops in Iraq.[66] The Iraqi parliament returned from a recess in late November 2011 (shortly before the year-end withdrawal date) because of a concern that remaining U.S. troops would not be granted immunity by Iraqi courts. American field commanders were concerned about the Sadrist response if the troops remained and about Iraqi readiness for a transfer of power.[67]

In August 2011, after debates between the Pentagon, the State Department and the White House, the U.S. settled on the 3,000 to 5,000 troop number. An American official said intelligence assessments stated that Iraq was not at great risk of slipping into chaos in the absence of American forces, which was a factor in the decision.[66]

In October 2011, American officials pressed Iraqi leadership to meet again at President Talabani's compound to discuss the issue. This time the U.S. asked Iraq to take a stand on the question of immunity for troops, hoping to remove what had always been the biggest challenge. However, they misread Iraqi politics and the Iraqi public. Having watched the Arab Spring sweep across the region and still haunted by the traumas of this and previous wars, the Iraqis were unwilling to accept anything that infringed on their sovereignty.[66]

Iraqi leadership picked up on that sentiment quickly. As a result, they publicly said they would not support legal immunity for any American troops. Some American officials have privately said that pushing for that meeting—in essence forcing the Iraqis to take a public stand on such a controversial matter before working out the politics of presenting it to their constituents and to Parliament—was a severe tactical mistake that ended any possibility of keeping American troops past December 2011.[66]

After the pull out was announced, White House aides said the U.S. would keep its embassy in Baghdad and two consulates. They also said there will be about 4,000–5,000 defense contractors.[68]