HNN Poll: 61% of Historians Rate the Bush Presidency Worst

[whitehall]

How do you get to be a "historian"? Write an article? Teach a class? Accept federal grants? Since there is no official title of "historian" in the rarified world of academia or liberal media how do they determine who is an official historian?

 

[rdean]

What will not change about Bush

1. He blundered in his decision to invade Iraq on bogus intelligence
2. He sat like a deer in the headlights as the economy crashed
3. He openly engaged in torture
4. He ignored Katrina

In the minds of Kool-Aid drinkers and sheeple - yes your right.

On your "points".
1) Congress also voted to go to war, this "bogus" intelligence "fooled" also the Prime Minister of Great Britian, France and ultimately the U.N.
2) The economy crashed 3 months before his Presidency en) He did nothing no other President has not done, including Obama.
4) Your opinion on this shows your true ignorance and blind partisanship in who/what really failed in this human disaster.

1. Congress authorized Bush to go to war, the decision to pull the trigger was Bush's and Bush's alone. He was advised by UN security inspectors to hold off the invasion. He pulled the trigger before inspectors proved there were no WMDs

2. The economy crashed in August 2007. Bush denied it was crashing until 3 months before his presidency ended

3. He openly engaged in torture and held prisoners indefinitely with no charges and no rights to face their accusers

4. He did nothing as Americans struggled and begged for food and medical supplies. He had the helicopters to provide relief but allowed beaurocracy to hold them up while he declared "Brownie, your doing a heck of a job"

And Republicans think Obama is just like Bush? The hate is deep. They swear it's not about race, but race is the only thing that could account for hatred this deep.

 

[MikeK]

There was no "bogus" intel. That's an insult to our US Intelligence Agencies and the agents in the field. After Desert Storm, is there any thinking person anywhere in the world that believe we just "turned our back on Iraq and walked away"?????????

No one turns their back on an enemy you just knocked down. It's stupid beyond words to even consider that. We knew exactly what was in Iraq. The only one who didn't, apparently, was George Bush.

Bush thought he was making the "big decision". Typical right wing ideology. They "imagine" how something should happen based on "gut feeling" and "common sense". Does anyone really believe Bush understood anything about the Middle East? Bush really thought he would transform the Middle East, bring them democracy. Instead of them throwing shoes, he expected flowers and bits of hard candy.

He just assumed they want what we want. Well they didn't. There is no "America Appreciation Day". There is only, "Death to America" and worse, Iraq, by constitution is a right wing theocracy. The women are now "enslave" under Islam trapped in Burkas and the American right is so fucking stupid, they think women lived like that under Saddam. No one is saying Saddam was good, but he certainly was better than what we did and how we ruined that country for probably generations.

And Bush did things no other president has ever done. He fought two wars and cut taxes. Insane.

And he used to bully pulpit to get what he wanted. YOU ARE WITH US OR WITH THE TERRORISTS. The slime. Typical Republican leader.

I think you've given Bush too much credit in believing he was actually making those decisions.

The man is a simple-minded egotist who has trouble forming and expressing comprehensible thoughts without scripting. He has failed in every previous endeavor in his life and his presidency was in fact an empty suit that did exactly what it was told by the kingmakers who positioned him. Bush didn't know or understand why he was doing any of the things he did, such as invading Iraq, nor did he care. He was having fun being ". . . the decider guy."

The main difference between George W. Bush and Ronald Reagan is Reagan was a bit smarter and he was a pretty good actor. Bush is just a barbaric dunce who looks good in a blue suit.

 

[MikeK]

And Republicans think Obama is just like Bush? The hate is deep. They swear it's not about race, but race is the only thing that could account for hatred this deep.

I agree. I think racial hatred drives a significant percentage of right-wing political hostility.

 

[Mr.Owl]

A Pew Research Center poll released last week found that the share of the American public that approves of President George W. Bush has dropped to a new low of 28 percent.

An unscientific poll of professional historians completed the same week produced results far worse for a president clinging to the hope that history will someday take a kinder view of his presidency than does contemporary public opinion.

In an informal survey of 109 professional historians conducted over a three-week period through the History News Network, 98.2 percent assessed the presidency of Mr. Bush to be a failure while 1.8 percent classified it as a success.

Asked to rank the presidency of George W. Bush in comparison to those of the other 41 American presidents, more than 61 percent of the historians concluded that the current presidency is the worst in the nation’s history. Another 35 percent of the historians surveyed rated the Bush presidency in the 31st to 41st category, while only four of the 109 respondents ranked the current presidency as even among the top two-thirds of American administrations.

At least two of those who ranked the current president in the 31-41 ranking made it clear that they placed him next-to-last, with only James Buchanan, in their view, being worse. “He is easily one of the 10-worst of all time and—if the magnitude of the challenges and opportunities matter—then probably in the bottom five, alongside Buchanan, Johnson, Fillmore, and Pierce,” wrote another historian.

The reason for the hesitancy some historians had in categorizing the Bush presidency as the worst ever, which led them to place it instead in the “nearly the worst” group, was well expressed by another historian who said, “It is a bit too early to judge whether Bush's presidency is the worst ever, though it certainly has a shot to take the title. Without a doubt, it is among the worst.”

History News Network | Because the Past is the Present, and the Future too.

Here's why.....

 

[iamwhatiseem]

What will not change about Bush

1. He blundered in his decision to invade Iraq on bogus intelligence
2. He sat like a deer in the headlights as the economy crashed
3. He openly engaged in torture
4. He ignored Katrina

In the minds of Kool-Aid drinkers and sheeple - yes your right.

On your "points".
1) Congress also voted to go to war, this "bogus" intelligence "fooled" also the Prime Minister of Great Britian, France and ultimately the U.N.
2) The economy crashed 3 months before his Presidency en) He did nothing no other President has not done, including Obama.
4) Your opinion on this shows your true ignorance and blind partisanship in who/what really failed in this human disaster.

1. Congress authorized Bush to go to war, the decision to pull the trigger was Bush's and Bush's alone. He was advised by UN security inspectors to hold off the invasion. He pulled the trigger before inspectors proved there were no WMDs

2. The economy crashed in August 2007. Bush denied it was crashing until 3 months before his presidency ended

3. He openly engaged in torture and held prisoners indefinitely with no charges and no rights to face their accusers

4. He did nothing as Americans struggled and begged for food and medical supplies. He had the helicopters to provide relief but allowed beaurocracy to hold them up while he declared "Brownie, your doing a heck of a job"

1) Not wasting my time.
2) In 2007 things were stirring, but to say that the irresponsible and corrupt policies for the last 30 years is Bush's fault and/or he could do ANYTHING to stop it is..well...stupid.
3) Everyone of these things Obama is still doing, only difference is we now contract Egypt and others to do the torture for us...get a clue.
4) Not wasting my time, again as with RDean - your obvious lack of knowledge and/or preconceived desire to blame it all on Bush is...well...stupid.

 

[Nate]

a pew research center poll released last week found that the share of the american public that approves of president george w. Bush has dropped to a new low of 28 percent.

An unscientific poll of professional historians completed the same week produced results far worse for a president clinging to the hope that history will someday take a kinder view of his presidency than does contemporary public opinion.

In an informal survey of 109 professional historians conducted over a three-week period through the history news network, 98.2 percent assessed the presidency of mr. Bush to be a failure while 1.8 percent classified it as a success.

asked to rank the presidency of george w. Bush in comparison to those of the other 41 american presidents, more than 61 percent of the historians concluded that the current presidency is the worst in the nation’s history. Another 35 percent of the historians surveyed rated the bush presidency in the 31st to 41st category, while only four of the 109 respondents ranked the current presidency as even among the top two-thirds of american administrations.

at least two of those who ranked the current president in the 31-41 ranking made it clear that they placed him next-to-last, with only james buchanan, in their view, being worse. “he is easily one of the 10-worst of all time and—if the magnitude of the challenges and opportunities matter—then probably in the bottom five, alongside buchanan, johnson, fillmore, and pierce,” wrote another historian.

The reason for the hesitancy some historians had in categorizing the bush presidency as the worst ever, which led them to place it instead in the “nearly the worst” group, was well expressed by another historian who said, “it is a bit too early to judge whether bush's presidency is the worst ever, though it certainly has a shot to take the title. Without a doubt, it is among the worst.”

history news network | because the past is the present, and the future too.

what were the other 39% thinking?

wtf!?!? Historians my ass! Are they completely ignoring what ole U.S. Grant "accomplished" in his two terms?

 

[MeBelle]

Rass leans right

And PEW leans toward???
I view Rass as the lesser of evils.

 

[rightwinger]

In the minds of Kool-Aid drinkers and sheeple - yes your right.

On your "points".
1) Congress also voted to go to war, this "bogus" intelligence "fooled" also the Prime Minister of Great Britian, France and ultimately the U.N.
2) The economy crashed 3 months before his Presidency en) He did nothing no other President has not done, including Obama.
4) Your opinion on this shows your true ignorance and blind partisanship in who/what really failed in this human disaster.

1. Congress authorized Bush to go to war, the decision to pull the trigger was Bush's and Bush's alone. He was advised by UN security inspectors to hold off the invasion. He pulled the trigger before inspectors proved there were no WMDs

2. The economy crashed in August 2007. Bush denied it was crashing until 3 months before his presidency ended

3. He openly engaged in torture and held prisoners indefinitely with no charges and no rights to face their accusers

4. He did nothing as Americans struggled and begged for food and medical supplies. He had the helicopters to provide relief but allowed beaurocracy to hold them up while he declared "Brownie, your doing a heck of a job"

1) Not wasting my time.
2) In 2007 things were stirring, but to say that the irresponsible and corrupt policies for the last 30 years is Bush's fault and/or he could do ANYTHING to stop it is..well...stupid.
3) Everyone of these things Obama is still doing, only difference is we now contract Egypt and others to do the torture for us...get a clue.
4) Not wasting my time, again as with RDean - your obvious lack of knowledge and/or preconceived desire to blame it all on Bush is...well...stupid.

I don't care if you waste your time or not. These are the key issues that will define Bush's legacy. Right now, how Bush responded to the challenges given to him will rank him as the worst President in modern history and possibly the worst of all time

History may soften the impact of some of his decisions but he will still be accountable for the key decisions in his presidency that lead the country to the brink of collapse as well as tied us up in unwinnable wars for ten plus years

 

[MeBelle]

No partisan polls here:
April 2011
A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 53% of Likely U.S. Voters say the nation’s current economic problems are due to the recession which began under the Bush administration. Thirty-nine percent (39%), however, believe Obama's policies are to blame.
Consistent with past findings, 86% of Democrats blame the recession which began under the Bush administration, while 73% of Republicans blame Obama’s policies. Among voters not affiliated with either political party, 52% say the problems started under Bush, while 32% point their finger at Obama.

Most Voters Still Blame Bush Recession for Bad Economy - Rasmussen Reports™

June/July 2011
Update: 49% Blame Bad Economy on Bush's Recession, 44% on Obama's Policies
A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 49% of Likely U.S. Voters now blame the bad economy on the recession which began under the Bush administration. Forty-four percent (44%) blame the economic problems on Obama's policies. That's the narrowest the blame gap has been since October of last year.

49% Blame Bad Economy on Bush's Recession, 44% on Obama's Policies - Rasmussen Reports™
Bush is down 4% and Obama is up 5%!
Give it a few more months and perhaps they will be tied!

You are saying rasmussen is not biased? Seriously.

Are you an idiot or something?

I am not an idiot, nor do I resort to name calling.
I showed another side to "polling'. Polling which still shows Obama is ahead of Bush, btw.
Isn't debate what mature people have in common?

 

[rightwinger]

And Republicans think Obama is just like Bush? The hate is deep. They swear it's not about race, but race is the only thing that could account for hatred this deep.

I agree. I think racial hatred drives a significant percentage of right-wing political hostility.

I think racial hatred only plays a very small role in how Obama is treated by Republicans. This is what Republicans do. They do it to all Democrats and have been working the formula for 25 years.

If anything, they hold off a little on Obama because he is black. There is a line they cannot cross and it affects their propaganda. If Hillary had been elected President, they would have treated her much worse. They had the hate machine all geared up for Hillary and ended up with Obama

 

[MeBelle]

Rasmussen's Polling Stirs Bias Debate

Rasmussen Polls Were Biased and Inaccurate; Quinnipiac, SurveyUSA Performed Strongly - NYTimes.com

Why it's increasingly difficult*to take Rasmussen polls seriously | Media Matters for America

Rasmussen Was Biased

Rasmussen's Daily Prez Approval Index: misleading and biased | Unreadable Nixters's Blog


and so on and so on..

Rasmussen not biased and truthful? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

And so on:

The following list ranks the 23 organizations by the accuracy of their final, national preelection
polls (as reported on pollster.com).
1. Rasmussen (11/1-3)**
1. Pew (10/29-11/1)**
2. YouGov/Polimetrix (10/18-11/1)
3. Harris Interactive (10/20-27)
4. GWU (Lake/Tarrance) (11/2-3)*
5. Diageo/Hotline (10/31-11/2)*
5. ARG (10/25-27)*
6. CNN (10/30-11/1)
6. Ipsos/McClatchy (10/30-11/1)
7. DailyKos.com (D)/Research 2000 (11/1-3)
8. AP/Yahoo/KN (10/17-27)
9. Democracy Corps (D) (10/30-11/2)
10. FOX (11/1-2)
11. Economist/YouGov (10/25-27)
12. IBD/TIPP (11/1-3)
13. NBC/WSJ (11/1-2)
14. ABC/Post (10/30-11/2)
15. Marist College (11/3)
16. CBS (10/31-11/2)
17. Gallup (10/31-11/2)
18. Reuters/ C-SPAN/ Zogby (10/31-11/3)
19. CBS/Times (10/25-29)
20. Newsweek (10/22-23)

http://www.fordham.edu/images/acade...ccuracy in the 2008 presidential election.pdf

Who the hell is this ONE GUY...who came up with this pdf file? Seriously, please try again.

Costas Panagopoulos, Ph.D.

Did you happen to read the brief text?

For all the derision directed toward pre-election polling, the final poll estimates were not
far off from the actual nationwide voteshares for the two candidates. On average, preelection
polls from 23 public polling organizations projected a Democratic advantage of
7.52 percentage points on Election Day, which is only about 1.37 percentage points away
from the current estimate of a 6.15-point Obama margin in the national popular vote.
Following the procedures proposed by Martin, Traugott and Kennedy (see Public Opinion
Quarterly, Fall 2006, pp. 342-369) to assess poll accuracy, I analyze poll estimates from
these 23 polling organizations. Four of these polls appear to have overestimated McCain
support (indicated with a * below), while most polls (17) overestimated Obama strength.
Pre-election projections for two organizations’ final polls—Rasmussen and Pew—were
perfectly in agreement with the actual election result (**).
The following list ranks the 23 organizations by the accuracy of their final, national preelection polls (as reported on pollster.com).

Or bother to check on pollster.com?

 

[MeBelle]

1. Congress authorized Bush to go to war, the decision to pull the trigger was Bush's and Bush's alone. He was advised by UN security inspectors to hold off the invasion. He pulled the trigger before inspectors proved there were no WMDs

2. The economy crashed in August 2007. Bush denied it was crashing until 3 months before his presidency ended

Gee, why is that when the Dems had a strong hold on both houses?
From 2003
"These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''
The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago. . . .
The plan is an acknowledgment by the administration that oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- which together have issued more than $1.5 trillion in outstanding debt -- is broken. A report by outside investigators in July concluded that Freddie Mac manipulated its accounting to mislead investors, and critics have said Fannie Mae does not adequately hedge against rising interest rates.
Despite the attempt to curb the waste, fraud, and abuse, some Democrats were not on board. Barney Frank really looks like a genius on this one. And this guy was the ranking member on the Financial Services Committee

3. He openly engaged in torture and held prisoners indefinitely with no charges and no rights to face their accusers

I suppose if we all nicely asked the alleged conspitors of 9/11 to please tell the truth, surely they will comply.

4. He did nothing as Americans struggled and begged for food and medical supplies. He had the helicopters to provide relief but allowed beaurocracy to hold them up while he declared "Brownie, your doing a heck of a job"

Yup, Bush summoned Katrina himself. No fault was put on the then Gov of LA, who refused to call in the National Guard.

1) Not wasting my time.
2) In 2007 things were stirring, but to say that the irresponsible and corrupt policies for the last 30 years is Bush's fault and/or he could do ANYTHING to stop it is..well...stupid.
3) Everyone of these things Obama is still doing, only difference is we now contract Egypt and others to do the torture for us...get a clue.
4) Not wasting my time, again as with RDean - your obvious lack of knowledge and/or preconceived desire to blame it all on Bush is...well...stupid.

I don't care if you waste your time or not. These are the key issues that will define Bush's legacy. Right now, how Bush responded to the challenges given to him will rank him as the worst President in modern history and possibly the worst of all time

History may soften the impact of some of his decisions but he will still be accountable for the key decisions in his presidency that lead the country to the brink of collapse as well as tied us up in unwinnable wars for ten plus years

What will not change about Bush

1. He blundered in his decision to invade Iraq on bogus intelligence
2. He sat like a deer in the headlights as the economy crashed
3. He openly engaged in torture
4. He ignored Katrina

In the minds of Kool-Aid drinkers and sheeple - yes your right.

On your "points".
1) Congress also voted to go to war, this "bogus" intelligence "fooled" also the Prime Minister of Great Britian, France and ultimately the U.N.
2) The economy crashed 3 months before his Presidency en) He did nothing no other President has not done, including Obama.
4) Your opinion on this shows your true ignorance and blind partisanship in who/what really failed in this human disaster.

1. Congress authorized Bush to go to war, the decision to pull the trigger was Bush's and Bush's alone. He was advised by UN security inspectors to hold off the invasion. He pulled the trigger before inspectors proved there were no WMDs
Wrong! Saddam ordered the UN inspectors OUT!
2. The economy crashed in August 2007. Bush denied it was crashing until 3 months before his presidency ended.
Repeat:
From 2003
"These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''
The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago. . . .
The plan is an acknowledgment by the administration that oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- which together have issued more than $1.5 trillion in outstanding debt -- is broken. A report by outside investigators in July concluded that Freddie Mac manipulated its accounting to mislead investors, and critics have said Fannie Mae does not adequately hedge against rising interest rates. Despite the attempt to curb the waste, fraud, and abuse, some Democrats were not on board. Barney Frank really looks like a genius on this one. And this guy was the ranking member on the Financial Services Committee
3. He openly engaged in torture and held prisoners indefinitely with no charges and no rights to face their accusers
Right, after 9/11. Obama is still working on that one.
4. He did nothing as Americans struggled and begged for food and medical supplies. He had the helicopters to provide relief but allowed beaurocracy to hold them up while he declared "Brownie, your doing a heck of a job"

See above.

And Republicans think Obama is just like Bush? The hate is deep. They swear it's not about race, but race is the only thing that could account for hatred this deep.

I agree. I think racial hatred drives a significant percentage of right-wing political hostility.

And the race card gets thrown again! Who threw it? The race card is a strawman.

 

[SFC Ollie]

And Republicans think Obama is just like Bush? The hate is deep. They swear it's not about race, but race is the only thing that could account for hatred this deep.

I agree. I think racial hatred drives a significant percentage of right-wing political hostility.

And I think that you are both fucking idiots.

 

[MeBelle]

Not sure if I have gotten the hang of multi quoting yet...I'm still a N00B!!
LOL

 

[iamwhatiseem]

1. Congress authorized Bush to go to war, the decision to pull the trigger was Bush's and Bush's alone. He was advised by UN security inspectors to hold off the invasion. He pulled the trigger before inspectors proved there were no WMDs

2. The economy crashed in August 2007. Bush denied it was crashing until 3 months before his presidency ended

3. He openly engaged in torture and held prisoners indefinitely with no charges and no rights to face their accusers

4. He did nothing as Americans struggled and begged for food and medical supplies. He had the helicopters to provide relief but allowed beaurocracy to hold them up while he declared "Brownie, your doing a heck of a job"

1) Not wasting my time.
2) In 2007 things were stirring, but to say that the irresponsible and corrupt policies for the last 30 years is Bush's fault and/or he could do ANYTHING to stop it is..well...stupid.
3) Everyone of these things Obama is still doing, only difference is we now contract Egypt and others to do the torture for us...get a clue.
4) Not wasting my time, again as with RDean - your obvious lack of knowledge and/or preconceived desire to blame it all on Bush is...well...stupid.

I don't care if you waste your time or not. These are the key issues that will define Bush's legacy. Right now, how Bush responded to the challenges given to him will rank him as the worst President in modern history and possibly the worst of all time

History may soften the impact of some of his decisions but he will still be accountable for the key decisions in his presidency that lead the country to the brink of collapse as well as tied us up in unwinnable wars for ten plus years

Not even close to the worst.
Anyone who thinks he is the worst of all time simply doesn't know or want to include historical perspective.
Not to defend Bush (I also believe he was not a good President obviously) - but what few takes into account with the WMD thing - is that they HAVE found plenty of evidence of WMD's and traces thereof during our occupation of Iraq. However, the MSM is not interested in reporting anything that disputes their personal opinion of Bush either.
As time goes by and partisan hatred for the man dies down - and after all of the evidence is known - we may see that he was right all along.
Now - as to how he managed the war...well that is an entirely different thing, his handling of the war is at least as bad as Johson's administration of the Vietnam war.

 

[rightwinger]

1) Not wasting my time.
2) In 2007 things were stirring, but to say that the irresponsible and corrupt policies for the last 30 years is Bush's fault and/or he could do ANYTHING to stop it is..well...stupid.
3) Everyone of these things Obama is still doing, only difference is we now contract Egypt and others to do the torture for us...get a clue.
4) Not wasting my time, again as with RDean - your obvious lack of knowledge and/or preconceived desire to blame it all on Bush is...well...stupid.

I don't care if you waste your time or not. These are the key issues that will define Bush's legacy. Right now, how Bush responded to the challenges given to him will rank him as the worst President in modern history and possibly the worst of all time

History may soften the impact of some of his decisions but he will still be accountable for the key decisions in his presidency that lead the country to the brink of collapse as well as tied us up in unwinnable wars for ten plus years

Not even close to the worst.
Anyone who thinks he is the worst of all time simply doesn't know or want to include historical perspective.
Not to defend Bush (I also believe he was not a good President obviously) - but what few takes into account with the WMD thing - is that they HAVE found plenty of evidence of WMD's and traces thereof during our occupation of Iraq. However, the MSM is not interested in reporting anything that disputes their personal opinion of Bush either.
As time goes by and partisan hatred for the man dies down - and after all of the evidence is known - we may see that he was right all along.
Now - as to how he managed the war...well that is an entirely different thing, his handling of the war is at least as bad as Johson's administration of the Vietnam war.

Historians judge you on the challenges you faced as president and how you responded to those challenges. No doubt, with the 9-11 attacks, Bush faced severe challenges. However, his chosen course of action in response to those attacks will be judged poorly.

Afghanistan was an appropriate response to 9-11. Bush's initial execution was exceptional. However, diverting the war on terror to attack Iraq was a major strategic blunder. His diversion of troops allowed Bin laden, Al Qaida and the Taliban to escape. It also allowed the Taliban to reestablish control in much of the country

Iraq was never about WMDs. That was the scare tactic Bush cooked up to justify an invasion. He bet that if he invaded, he would find his WMDs...he lost
Iraq was about nation building. Bush had a vision that if he established solid democracies in Iraq and Afghanistan, countries like Iran and Syria would fall like Democratic dominos.

History will view Bush badly because he completely misjudged the political and social realities in those countries. His simplistic "They will treat us a liberators" ended up costing 4000 soldiers their lives

 

[whitehall]

Actually the sentence "61% of historians rate Bush presidency worst" is dishonest. Of course every historian in the world wasn't polled. The lazy media should have worded it honestly and said "of the selected "historians" polled, 61% rate....". The fact that 39% of "historians" don't rate Bush the worst president after 8 years of non-stop propaganda is actually a tribute to the Bush administration.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

Iraq was never about WMDs. That was the scare tactic Bush cooked up to justify an invasion. He bet that if he invaded, he would find his WMDs...he lost

Iraq was about nation building. Bush had a vision that if he established solid democracies in Iraq and Afghanistan, countries like Iran and Syria would fall like Democratic dominos.

[...]

Bush invaded Iraq for the same reason his father initiated Desert Storm. Kuwait was Saddam Hussein's intended staging area for invading Saudi Arabia. Operation Desert Storm was conducted on behalf of H.W. Bush's close friends, the Saudi Royal Family. And George W. Bush's invasion of Iraq was conducted for the same reason.

Instead of purging Hussein from Kuwait, I personally believe Bush-1 should have supported Hussein in invading Saudi Arabia. Had he done that we would be in the catbird seat today, paying .50 a gallon for premium gas. But the political and economic situations we have today are what the Bush dynasty has given us.

And those criminal bastards walked away smiling -- which is the main reason why I believe Obama is a Republican Trojan Horse.

 

[MoistTrout]

I think it's a waste of time to apply historical perspective to something that ended just two and a half years ago, but I will put in my two cents on a thing or two.

There is a lot of finger pointing pertaining to the economy. Bush gets blame, Obama gets blame, and the fact of the matter is neither of them is responsible for the fall of the economy. They are both at fault in their response to it.'

With Bush you had the tale of two polcies. After the 9/11 attacks, Bush got it right. While Democrats knee jerk reaction was to roll back tax cuts, Bush knew that was the wrong thing to do. Those attacks could have crippled the economy, but Bush handled it well and it turned into nothing more than a temporary set back and by 2004 the economy was booming.

At the end of his two terms, Bush got it wrong. The housing bubble burst, and much like the dotcom bubble at the end of the Clinton administration it hit the economy. A bigger bubble meant a bigger burst that affected more people, and the response was corporate bailouts and small stimulus packages that barely gave a burp to the economy.

Obama takes office and not only continues doing the same thing he does more of it. The bailouts became bigger and there were more of them. To top it off, there were pork filled stimulus packages that didn't stimulate anything and other outragous spending.

What's really funny is the biggest problems we have domestically and economically that stem from the Bush administration are his most liberal policies (immigration, education, spending) but there is still this insistance that Bush was a "right wing extremist".

Worst ever? Nah. I don't even know if it's feasible to compare every president to the other. But I will say Carter is still the worst in my lifetime. Ask me again in 2013 and I might have a new low bar, but we'll have to wait and see.