Hillary won the popular vote ... so???

[Mac1958]

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
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Nowhere did I say anything about a "mandate." The post is about whether Democrats grasp basic logic or not. Obviously from this post, you don't since you wrote the second reply in the thread and completely whiffed on the subject.

The question is whether you actually believe your crap that voters knowing the rules were different would not have changed the results of the election. Do you grasp that? Or not? That is the question

I haven't seen Democrats saying what you claim.

Please provide a link and I'll be happy to look at it.
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You haven't seen Democrats claim that Hillary isn't the legitimate winner because she won the popular vote???



You'd cut in line in Jamestown to get the kool-aid first!!!!

Obviously you're lying. It's hysterical when leftists tell lies that if you are to be believed makes you look worse than just thinking you're a liar

So that was the point of the OP?

No, I've seen them say that Trump is not legitimate, that's correct.

That's how partisans are, on both ends.

You don't really think your "side" doesn't do the same?
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Libertarians are gerrymandering? Where are they doing that?

Another leftist idiot who can't process beyond not leftist = Republican.

That while you lecture Republicans you're smarter than they are because you aren't all black and white like they are. Leftists are totally black and white, as you demonstrate again.

As to your question, so explain how to say "Trump is not legitimate" isn't assuming what I point out in my op that we don't know how the election would have turned out if the rules were different???

I merely responded to your post. You're trying very hard to make something out of nothing.

Both ends now do everything they can to de-legitimize a President from the other party, because both ends have decayed into a party-over-country mentality.

If you want to just make this about one of the ends, you're free to do so. I made my comment. You don't have to like it.
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[depotoo]

Actually, it is not. It completely works, to keep only one populous region from determining an election

Nonsense. 30 out of 50 states voted for Trump. Only 20 voted for Hillary. One region can not decide for an entire country, thus why the electoral college was put in place.

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
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But then only a few states are making this decision. Only 12 states actually have the power to decide an Presidential election today.

The system is broken.

With a PR style system, no one area of the country would decide, the whole country would decide together as a democratic unit, rather than some kind of "you've got three votes, but you've only got one, but it doesn't matter because neither of you actually matter anyway, so fuck off" as exists right now.

 

[dannyboys]

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
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Ask the voters in small DEM states if they would prefer elections based on the popular vote.
YA RIGHT!

 

[Mac1958]

Obama carried only 26 states in 2012. Did you see the right constantly claiming he was illegitimate?

Of course, yes, with a different approach: His birth certificate.

Both sides, same game, different approaches.
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[Witchit]

He won, get over it!

Sure, with a little help from his Russian pals.

Oh, I know. I’m just done with them being fixated on her. She’s a private citizen, it’s been well over a year, who gives a flying fuck? In the words of the immortal Elsa “let it go.”

 

[depotoo]

No, you saw a select few claiming it, which started with Hillary’s people to begin with.

Obama carried only 26 states in 2012. Did you see the right constantly claiming he was illegitimate?

Of course, yes, with a different approach: His birth certificate.

Both sides, same game, different approaches.
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[kaz]

You hear this from leftists all the time. It's irrelevant because that isn't how Presidential elections are run according to the Constitution. But this thread isn't about that. This thread is about how it's still irrelevant because:

1) Voters know if their candidate has a chance in their State. There are tens of millions of Republicans in California, New York, Illinois, Massachusetts, Maryland and other deep blue States who knew Trump had no chance. And there are millions of Democrats in deep red States. Three million is a small margin, there is no way to know who would have shown up or how they would have voted if we had different rules. Many Republicans voted for Gary Johnson (I know many of them) or didn't show up. And many leftists voted for Jill Stein or didn't show up

2) Neither Hillary nor Trump would have run the campaign they did if the election had different rules. That was decisive in this election as Trump won because he focused more on the light blue States in the Midwest than Hillary. Something he'd have never done if the rules were the popular vote

So Democrats, are you just lying or are you actually so stupid you really don't grasp this?

No, it's not how the elections are run. It's how they SHOULD BE RUN.

Surely THE PEOPLE should have a say in who their leaders are. Rather than a political system.

Why should some people have more votes than others? Why should people in one state get a say on who the president is, while people in another state don't?

How is that fair, and how does that make democracy?

You're in the wrong thread. Nowhere did I take a position in the OP about how elections "should" be run. I disagree with you, but I'm not going to let you derail the thread.

My question is whether leftists know you are lying when you claim that Hillary would have won this election if the rules were changed ex-ante in this election. Do you? That is the question in this thread

Had the rules been different, then it depends on what the rules were.

If PR existed then I think Hillary would have had more chance because Trump simply wouldn't have stood a chance. It depends of course how PR would be implemented.

If it were PR in the House, with a Presidential election run off election, then they'd have been more viable candidates with each party choosing their own candidate, which wouldn't have been Trump unless he made his own party, and who'd have followed him?

Were the EC elected based on a proportional system, then people might start choosing other candidates.

It's a pretty pointless task saying "if the system were different..." well, what system? There are loads.

What is PR? I thought you meant PV in the first paragraph, but then the second paragraph would make no sense.

And you're reading a lot into the question that isn't there. The question is whether you realize that the rules affected the outcome or not. Do leftists know that the rules affected the outcome of the election and they are lying? Or do they not know that and leftists are stupid?

If you're talking about the Trump would have won, I'm a Six Sigma blackbelt, which means I'm a professional pollster. The point of the poll is for Democrats, not Trump supporters. So I gave Trump supporters a choice they would like to allow them to answer the poll but not effect the outcome of the point of the poll, Democrats.

I mean that in no negative way to Trump supporters. And I know Democrats don't have the intellectual honesty to answer the poll truthfully. So really that is the point of the poll, that all the leftists are admitting they are lying by not answering that the election wouldn't have been affected

 

[kaz]

No, you saw a select few claiming it, which started with Hillary’s people to begin with.

Obama carried only 26 states in 2012. Did you see the right constantly claiming he was illegitimate?

Of course, yes, with a different approach: His birth certificate.

Both sides, same game, different approaches.
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Yep, Hillary says all the time she was screwed because she won the PV. Just further admitting what a liar she is and how stupid and manipulable she knows Democrats are

 

[Weatherman2020]

Nonsense. 30 out of 50 states voted for Trump. Only 20 voted for Hillary. One region can not decide for an entire country, thus why the electoral college was put in place.

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
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It doesn't really matter to me, nor has it ever. He's the President, it is what it is.

More elections on the way soon enough.
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The EC gives a mandate because that's how we select a POTUS, and it was almost a landslide.

 

[kaz]

He won, get over it!

Sure, with a little help from his Russian pals.

Oh, I know. I’m just done with them being fixated on her. She’s a private citizen, it’s been well over a year, who gives a flying fuck? In the words of the immortal Elsa “let it go.”

Ah. I wondered about your initial response since you're a mindless leftist. Saying let it go wasn't something you're saying to Democrats and Hillary, it's what you're saying to the rest of us. They can keep saying they won the PV, we just need to stop answering their lies. Of course that's crap. We need to continue to address every Democrat lie

 

[Pete7469]

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
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Bullshit.

Hitlery only won the popular vote in the states that she won the electoral vote. She lost the popular vote in States like Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. The ghetto rats didn't show up because she is repulsive to everyone and they weren't part of her cult of personality. They were in the moonbat messiah's cult. So even though she won NY and commiefornia, securing huge numbers of mindless idiot votes as well as illegal alien votes, it wasn't enough to secure the electoral counts from all the states where Trump won the popular vote.

You're smart enough to understand this, I think you're letting your "moderate" ego get in the way because your lame ass horse shit the track.

 

[Mac1958]

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
.

Bullshit.

Hitlery only one the popular vote in the states that she won the electoral vote. She lost the popular vote in States like Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. The ghetto rats didn't show up because she is repulsive to everyone and they weren't part of her cult of personality. They were in the moonbat messiah's cult. So even though she won NY and commiefornia, securing huge numbers of mindless idiot votes as well as illegal alien votes, it wasn't enough to secure the electoral counts from all the states where Trump won the popular vote.

You're smart enough to understand this, I think you're letting your "moderate" ego get in the way because your lame ass horse shit the track.

Never claimed to be a moderate. Please see line 2 of my sig.

We'll see in November how this plays out. The GOP won in 2016 and has its chance to prove itself right now.
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[kaz]

She lost even though she received three million more votes. If the Republicans want to pretend that the EC vote gives them some kind of mandate, right in the face of the popular vote, that's up to them. You'd think they would realize that losing the popular vote should at least be a mitigating consideration, but that has not happened.

The next elections are coming up, and we'll see how that worked out for them.
.

Bullshit.

Hitlery only one the popular vote in the states that she won the electoral vote. She lost the popular vote in States like Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. The ghetto rats didn't show up because she is repulsive to everyone and they weren't part of her cult of personality. They were in the moonbat messiah's cult. So even though she won NY and commiefornia, securing huge numbers of mindless idiot votes as well as illegal alien votes, it wasn't enough to secure the electoral counts from all the states where Trump won the popular vote.

You're smart enough to understand this, I think you're letting your "moderate" ego get in the way because your lame ass horse shit the track.

Never claimed to be a moderate. Please see line 2 of my sig.

We'll see in November how this plays out. The GOP won in 2016 and has its chance to prove itself right now.
.

That's pretty funny coming from two leftists, you and Jake

 

[Pete7469]

Never claimed to be a moderate. Please see line 2 of my sig.

We'll see in November how this plays out. The GOP won in 2016 and has its chance to prove itself right now.
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It's how I perceive you.

Not relevant I suppose.

That said I don't believe the polls for a second. I don't believe all these leftist tools being bused around from moonbat rallies, to bed wetter gun grabbing parties represent the population's attitude at large. Everyone I know is doing better than the entire 8 years of that meat puppet faggot. I don't know anyone who gives a shit about Trump's tweets, believes there was any russian impact on the election, or gives a fuck if Putin, Stormy, 4 other whores, and Trump were jumping up and down on a bed pissing all over the place and having a turd fight in Moscow. I don't believe the polls that came out beginning on November 9th that gave Trump a 40% approval rating and largely haven't moved. There has been a sustained effort by the media to manipulate public opinion and I don't believe it works anymore.

I'm confident that the democrooks will lose more senate seats, the republicrats will keep the house.

I might be wrong, I'm in TX and moonbats are a small minority of loud mouthed malcontents that most people simply ignore. Maybe to our peril.

 

[Pete7469]

That's pretty funny coming from two leftists, you and Jake

I don't think Mac is a bed wetter. He's more liberal than I am but so are most people.

I'm about as hard core right wing as you can be without being a full blown anarchist.

Fakey is just a piece of shit.

 

[kaz]

Never claimed to be a moderate. Please see line 2 of my sig.

We'll see in November how this plays out. The GOP won in 2016 and has its chance to prove itself right now.
.

It's how I perceive you.

Not relevant I suppose.

That said I don't believe the polls for a second. I don't believe all these leftist tools being bused around from moonbat rallies, to bed wetter gun grabbing parties represent the population's attitude at large. Everyone I know is doing better than the entire 8 years of that meat puppet faggot. I don't know anyone who gives a shit about Trump's tweets, believes there was any russian impact on the election, or gives a fuck if Putin, Stormy, 4 other whores, and Trump were jumping up and down on a bed pissing all over the place and having a turd fight in Moscow. I don't believe the polls that came out beginning on November 9th that gave Trump a 40% approval rating and largely haven't moved. There has been a sustained effort by the media to manipulate public opinion and I don't believe it works anymore.

I'm confident that the democrooks will lose more senate seats, the republicrats will keep the house.

I might be wrong, I'm in TX and moonbats are a small minority of loud mouthed malcontents that most people simply ignore. Maybe to our peril.

I've been spending my time in blue and battleground States, Maryland, North Carolina and Florida. I'm seeing no one who wasn't a Hillary zombie switch to Democrat since the election. I see no support for the fake news claims of a blue wave at all.

I do see people who thought of Trump as scary before the election because of the constant demagoguery of the left get used to that Trump isn't insane and get tired of the constant leftist and fake news demagoguery. In other words, I see what you're seeing

 

[kaz]

That's pretty funny coming from two leftists, you and Jake

I don't think Mac is a bed wetter. He's more liberal than I am but so are most people.

I'm about as hard core right wing as you can be without being a full blown anarchist.

Fakey is just a piece of shit.

I have a hard time thinking of anyone who voted for Hillary as not a "bed wetter," and I see nothing from him that doesn't support the left. He can't even agree that Trump won the election and Democrats who say he didn't are full of shit. I can only speak for what I see

 

[mikegriffith1]

And, actually, if you count the votes cast for the third-party candidates, the center-right won the popular vote, not the center-left:

Trump -- 62,983,000
Johnson -- 4,500,000
McMullin -- 700,000
Castle -- 172,000
TOTAL -- 68,355,000

Clinton -- 65,853,000
Stein -- 469,000
TOTAL -- 66,322,000

This means that the center-right vote topped the center-left vote by more than 2 million votes: 68,355,000 to 66,322,000. That is encouraging.

One reason that Hillary lost in 2016 is that she got slightly fewer votes than Obama got in 2012: she received 65,853,000 vs. 65,915,000 for Obama. Trump, on the other hand, got over 2 million more votes than Romney got in 2012: he received 62,984,000 vs. 60,933,000 for Romney.

Moreover, not only did Trump beat Hillary in states won 30-20, but Trump buried Hillary in counties won: He won over 3,000 counties, while she won fewer than 200. Think about that: the county is the most basic political unit. Yet, Hillary won a majority of the votes in fewer than 200 counties out of over 3,200.

I might add that Republicans control 33 governorships. You can't gerrymander governors' races; they are based solely on the popular vote in the state. So a majority of the citizens in 33 states have elected a Republican as their governor.

And don't let anyone get away with the nonsense that Gary Johnson was closer to Hillary than Trump. Johnson campaigned on things like repealing Obamacare, supporting school vouchers, ending the right of public unions to collectively bargain for benefits, defending the Citizens United decision, repealing Dodd-Frank, repealing the birth control mandate for insurance, abolishing the Federal Reserve, cutting personal income taxes (including corporate taxes), ending the inheritance tax, ending Common Core, imposing huge cuts on federal spending, ending mandatory vaccinations, etc., etc.

 

[BrokeLoser]

A little off topic but I thought I should create visual value here and highlight who it is that actually voted for HRC.
This person:

This person:

This persons parents:

This filthy Antifa whore:

This positive contributing family on the tit:

These awesome dudes:

And any business owner or professional relying on welfare dollars and their best customer....The U.S. Government.
Please note, all shown and mentioned are Mexifornia’s FINEST...just ask Jerry ‘I love them’ Brown.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Since we've clearly established that CA Gov. Jerry Brown doesn't believe in following the rules, it's highly possible that many of the extra 2.8 million votes Hillary got after Trump won the election were illegally manufactured.

Yeah, there's also a possibility we could get slammed with a ten mile wide asteroid tomorrow and it's just as probable as your loony conspiracy theory.