Here We Go Again!!

Orange_Juice

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2008
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Hold onto your ankles! When and where will this all end? :eusa_eh:

The first wave of Americans to default on their home mortgages appears to be cresting, but a second, far larger one is quickly building.

Homeowners with good credit are falling behind on their payments in growing numbers, even as the problems with mortgages made to people with weak, or subprime, credit are showing their first, tentative signs of leveling off after two years of spiraling defaults.

The percentage of mortgages in arrears in the category of loans one rung above subprime, so-called alternative-A mortgages, quadrupled to 12 percent in April from a year earlier. Delinquencies among prime loans, which account for most of the $12 trillion market, doubled to 2.7 percent in that time.

The mortgage troubles have been exacerbated by an economy that is still struggling. Reports last week showed another drop in home prices, slower-than-expected economic growth and a huge loss at General Motors. On Friday, the Labor Department reported that the unemployment rate in July climbed to a four-year high.

While it is difficult to draw precise parallels among various segments of the mortgage market, the arc of the crisis in subprime loans suggests that the problems in the broader market may not peak for another year or two, analysts said.

Defaults are likely to accelerate because many homeowners’ monthly payments are rising rapidly. The higher bills come as home prices continue to decline and banks tighten their lending standards, making it harder for people to refinance loans or sell their homes. Of particular concern are “alt-A” loans, many of which were made to people with good credit scores without proof of their income or assets.

“Subprime was the tip of the iceberg,” said Thomas H. Atteberry, president of First Pacific Advisors, a investment firm in Los Angeles that trades mortgage securities. “Prime will be far bigger in its impact.”

In a conference call with analysts last month, James Dimon, the chairman and chief executive of JPMorgan Chase, said he expected losses on prime loans at his bank to triple in the coming months and described the outlook for them as “terrible.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/04/business/04lend.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin
 
Anyone STUPID enough to have gotten a loan that has "adjustable" rates deserves the trouble they are having. Balloon payments are another one of those really STUPID ways to buy a house.

Now I know the conventional wisdom was if you planned to sell in 5 years it was ok to buy houses with these idiotic payment plans. But guess what? Anyone with half a brain should have considered what happens when the market crashes.

I personally have a 30 year FIXED loan. The only thing that changes is insurance and property tax. No guess work or Voodoo market crap to worry about. One saved no "Interest" with the other loans when now they are stuck with them and can not unload or refinance them. That is called speculation. Lots of people got sucked in to speculating on the Housing Market. No different then if they were sucked into the Stock Market and lost their shirt, well except then they would only lose what they invested and not be stuck with ever increasing payments they can not make.
 
Anyone STUPID enough to have gotten a loan that has "adjustable" rates deserves the trouble they are having. Balloon payments are another one of those really STUPID ways to buy a house.

Now I know the conventional wisdom was if you planned to sell in 5 years it was ok to buy houses with these idiotic payment plans. But guess what? Anyone with half a brain should have considered what happens when the market crashes.

I personally have a 30 year FIXED loan. The only thing that changes is insurance and property tax. No guess work or Voodoo market crap to worry about. One saved no "Interest" with the other loans when now they are stuck with them and can not unload or refinance them. That is called speculation. Lots of people got sucked in to speculating on the Housing Market. No different then if they were sucked into the Stock Market and lost their shirt, well except then they would only lose what they invested and not be stuck with ever increasing payments they can not make.

What's your position on the Housing Bill, and the other bail-outs that have taken place so far?

Taking into consideration of course, what the alternative probably would be, i.e. an economic collapse, most likely.
 
Anyone STUPID enough to have gotten a loan that has "adjustable" rates deserves the trouble they are having. Balloon payments are another one of those really STUPID ways to buy a house.

Now I know the conventional wisdom was if you planned to sell in 5 years it was ok to buy houses with these idiotic payment plans. But guess what? Anyone with half a brain should have considered what happens when the market crashes.

I personally have a 30 year FIXED loan. The only thing that changes is insurance and property tax. No guess work or Voodoo market crap to worry about. One saved no "Interest" with the other loans when now they are stuck with them and can not unload or refinance them. That is called speculation. Lots of people got sucked in to speculating on the Housing Market. No different then if they were sucked into the Stock Market and lost their shirt, well except then they would only lose what they invested and not be stuck with ever increasing payments they can not make.

States are losing tax revenues because companies are leaving the country or leaving their states, so even though property values are going down, states and cities are raising taxes. If you lost your job and could only find another job that paid half what you were making and this happens, you could lose your home because you can't afford the taxes.

Just admit the GOP fucked up and the economy sucks. McCain admitted it in a speech I heard him make on CNN. It was funny, well not really funny, but he said, "when you lose your job, I'm going to....." WHEN? Not IF?

I have a 15 yr mortgage and I put 20% down to avoid the insurance. I'm about 4 years from having my place paid off. And even though the value of my home went down $30K, I will still make $17K if I sell it. Minus what i still owe of course. But it sucks that I could have sold it and made $47K profit at one point. The GOP sucks!
 
We survived the 29 crash.

Look what we got out of it, too. Ironically, what we got out of it is something that is contributing to TODAY'S problems.

Now, instead of the crash happening BEFORE more socialism is instilled, it's being done pre-emptively. We can't win for losing.
 
States are losing tax revenues because companies are leaving the country or leaving their states, so even though property values are going down, states and cities are raising taxes. If you lost your job and could only find another job that paid half what you were making and this happens, you could lose your home because you can't afford the taxes.

Just admit the GOP fucked up and the economy sucks. McCain admitted it in a speech I heard him make on CNN. It was funny, well not really funny, but he said, "when you lose your job, I'm going to....." WHEN? Not IF?

I have a 15 yr mortgage and I put 20% down to avoid the insurance. I'm about 4 years from having my place paid off. And even though the value of my home went down $30K, I will still make $17K if I sell it. Minus what i still owe of course. But it sucks that I could have sold it and made $47K profit at one point. The GOP sucks!

So one can assume that since a lot of the housing speculation occurred on the Democrats watch in both houses of Congress that you actually blame the Democrats?

Retard.
 
Look what we got out of it, too. Ironically, what we got out of it is something that is contributing to TODAY'S problems.

Now, instead of the crash happening BEFORE more socialism is instilled, it's being done pre-emptively. We can't win for losing.

an ounce of prevetion or a pound of cure? Take your pick. The Conservative "die in the ditchers" don't have any idea of what they would be getting into if we just let the global economy go in the toilet. Hitler came to power in the depression. That's just one example.
 
an ounce of prevetion or a pound of cure? Take your pick. The Conservative "die in the ditchers" don't have any idea of what they would be getting into if we just let the global economy go in the toilet. Hitler came to power in the depression. That's just one example.

You don't have any idea what the repercussions are going to be for this intervention. You think the international community is going to suck the US teet forever?

Your narrow minded view of the whole situation is what is REALLY scary. You can't look past the immediate "relief" far enough to see the writing on the wall.

I'm sure my children will thank you for the debt you advocated passing along to them.
 
You don't have any idea what the repercussions are going to be for this intervention. You think the international community is going to suck the US teet forever?

Your narrow minded view of the whole situation is what is REALLY scary. You can't look past the immediate "relief" far enough to see the writing on the wall.

I'm sure my children will thank you for the debt you advocated passing along to them.

Fair enough. The debt is going to be bad, no doubt. As a suggestion I think increasing the levels of taxation on upper income Americans to pay for this mess would be a good idea. And since tax cuts have given us a lot of the debt we have now it only seems fair
 
Fair enough. The debt is going to be bad, no doubt. As a suggestion I think increasing the levels of taxation on upper income Americans to pay for this mess would be a good idea. And since tax cuts have given us a lot of the debt we have now it only seems fair

You are aware Democrats think 60k a year is UPPER income?
 
Hold onto your ankles! When and where will this all end? :eusa_eh:

The first wave of Americans to default on their home mortgages appears to be cresting, but a second, far larger one is quickly building.

Homeowners with good credit are falling behind on their payments in growing numbers, even as the problems with mortgages made to people with weak, or subprime, credit are showing their first, tentative signs of leveling off after two years of spiraling defaults.

The percentage of mortgages in arrears in the category of loans one rung above subprime, so-called alternative-A mortgages, quadrupled to 12 percent in April from a year earlier. Delinquencies among prime loans, which account for most of the $12 trillion market, doubled to 2.7 percent in that time.

The mortgage troubles have been exacerbated by an economy that is still struggling. Reports last week showed another drop in home prices, slower-than-expected economic growth and a huge loss at General Motors. On Friday, the Labor Department reported that the unemployment rate in July climbed to a four-year high.

While it is difficult to draw precise parallels among various segments of the mortgage market, the arc of the crisis in subprime loans suggests that the problems in the broader market may not peak for another year or two, analysts said.

Defaults are likely to accelerate because many homeowners’ monthly payments are rising rapidly. The higher bills come as home prices continue to decline and banks tighten their lending standards, making it harder for people to refinance loans or sell their homes. Of particular concern are “alt-A” loans, many of which were made to people with good credit scores without proof of their income or assets.

“Subprime was the tip of the iceberg,” said Thomas H. Atteberry, president of First Pacific Advisors, a investment firm in Los Angeles that trades mortgage securities. “Prime will be far bigger in its impact.”

In a conference call with analysts last month, James Dimon, the chairman and chief executive of JPMorgan Chase, said he expected losses on prime loans at his bank to triple in the coming months and described the outlook for them as “terrible.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/04/business/04lend.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin

And this is all GOOD news! we need to purge the market of this foolishness. Houses are STILL to EXPENSIVE, even after the falls of the last several months, in places like California, Arizona, Florida, the northeast, they need to fall by at least another 30% to even get close to reality.

The idiots who bought these places at the prices they paid and morons who loaned them money are getting what they deserve. A kick in the groin. And that is a GOOD thing for this country.
 
And this is all GOOD news! we need to purge the market of this foolishness. Houses are STILL to EXPENSIVE, even after the falls of the last several months, in places like California, Arizona, Florida, the northeast, they need to fall by at least another 30% to even get close to reality.

The idiots who bought these places at the prices they paid and morons who loaned them money are getting what they deserve. A kick in the groin. And that is a GOOD thing for this country.

I totally agree. I'm prepared to face the economic consequences of cleansing this market, so people will learn to never be so foolish again.
 
I totally agree. I'm prepared to face the economic consequences of cleansing this market, so people will learn to never be so foolish again.

Increases in standards of living need to be based on real and substantive increases in technology, business processes, productivity and so on....
 

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