Freedom of Religious Opinion? Not If You're Phil Robertson

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Was/is the bible used (by religious extremists) to justify slavery, segregation and anti miscegenation?

Is the bible used ( by religious extremists) to justify anti gay bigotry?

The answer to both questions is "yes". How is that a Strawman?

It's a strawman because you said I said something I didn't say. What you just stated here has nothing to do with what you said I said and I didn't say. If you don't know what a strawman is, it'd take you about 30 seconds to learn by typing "strawman fallacy definition" into Google.

You must really be fun to watch TV with. When they talk about Saddam Hussein, you say, OMG, he gassed his own people, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, the Bataan Death march, that was horrible, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, Attila plundered and murdered all those villagers, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, the Holocaust, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. You're a one trick pony, I can't take you seriously you comparing slavery and gay marriage.

The problem with the slavery, bible discussion is the implication Christianity is somehow responsible is not established just because some people used the bible to rationalize slavery. Anyone can misuse the Bible, it doesn't make Christianity responsible for their actions. Oddly you get this concept when you say all Muslims are not responsible for the actions of the fundamentalist radicals.

Nobody implied Christianity was responsible for any of those. You went there, nobody else.

Correct.

Christian dogma was misappropriated by those who wished to justify colonialism and slavery in the past just as it’s being misappropriated by those today hostile to civil liberties for gay Americans.

 

[Pogo]

And the question remains, why make that point other than to criticize Christianity? If you are not doing it to criticize Christianity, why are you making that point?

What the hell are you whining about now? Is this on some list of topics that dare not speak their names?

The original comment, referring to Phil Robertson's opinions, was:

Keep in mind, that slavery and segregation ALSO used to be "religious opinions".

Comparing that basis (religion) for both Robertson's homosexual comments and those used to justify slavery and racism

--- and you have proceeded to dance from "no they weren't, you're making up crap" to "Chrisitianism blamed for slavery" (hilarious Checkers speech impression btw ) to now whining that someone dared to find fault with Christianism.

First it was "false", then it was morphed to something entirely different, now it's "true but why does it have to be said out loud?"

You're all over the map here, dood.
Sorry, dude-of-indeterminate-gonads.

The original point stands as a comparison of the same basis for slavery, segregation and Robertson's comments. NONE of them need to be universal for the point to be made.

Can't answer the question, got it. There was of course no basis to state it except as a criticism. I guess by dancing and evading, you're in your way acknowledging that.

Uh -- you're the dancer here, Baryshnikov. What else can you call first denying the point, then changing it to a strawman point, then acknowledging the point while whining that it was made in the first place?

As just demonstrated to the sentient, the original basis was that some point out that Phil Robertson used a religious basis for his comments, and so did slavers and racists. That puts them in the same boat.

Shall we go back to "no they didn't" and start over?

 

[Gadawg73]

Would that be the origin of your bigotry against them?

My father worked for the College Entrance Examination Board from the early 60s to early 80s.
He and 2 others went to southern high schools that were giving the SAT and barring blacks from taking it. He told the principals and school boards there that if blacks could not take it then NO one would take the SAT at those schools.
Well documented during those times.
I grew up being called "****** lover" from 2nd grade through about my sophomore year in high school when all of a sudden I was 6'4" and 265 lbs. I played on the first integrated team at our high school.
My family has a history of treating everyone as equals and being vocal and active doing so for over 334 years now in this country.
You?

I have a similar background, but my parents grew up in the race wars of the south and started out as racists and bigoted against gays. I watched them change over time.

The difference is I don't blame christianity for the bigotry. The bigotry is a weakness of man. Jesus did not teach us to be bigots. IOW your experience led to your own personal bigotry against christians in general. My experience led to be being against bigotry of all kinds. Reverse bigotry/racism is not excusable any more than the bigotry that caused it.

Wrong, I am not bigoted against Christians or anyone else. I have never blamed Christianity for any bigotry. You have to make that up because you have no facts or evidence.
Disagreeing with someone that is a Christian does not make one a bigot.

What have I ever done to be "personally bigoted" against Christians?
BTW, I am a Christian.

 

[Seawytch]

It's a strawman because you said I said something I didn't say. What you just stated here has nothing to do with what you said I said and I didn't say. If you don't know what a strawman is, it'd take you about 30 seconds to learn by typing "strawman fallacy definition" into Google.

You must really be fun to watch TV with. When they talk about Saddam Hussein, you say, OMG, he gassed his own people, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, the Bataan Death march, that was horrible, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, Attila plundered and murdered all those villagers, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, the Holocaust, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. You're a one trick pony, I can't take you seriously you comparing slavery and gay marriage.

The problem with the slavery, bible discussion is the implication Christianity is somehow responsible is not established just because some people used the bible to rationalize slavery. Anyone can misuse the Bible, it doesn't make Christianity responsible for their actions. Oddly you get this concept when you say all Muslims are not responsible for the actions of the fundamentalist radicals.

Nobody implied Christianity was responsible for any of those. You went there, nobody else.

You were clearly going there, you just wanted the implication without being called on it. What about answering the question I asked? Why are you talking about Christianity being used to justify slavery and oppose gay government marriage other than to criticize Christianity? If that wasn't your point, why did you bring Christianity into it? You may proceed with your dodging and evasion now.

No Kaz, nobody was "clearly going there". Where people have been "going" is the obvious parallels between bigotries and their justifications.

It is not a condemnation of Christianity, but of extremist Christians. It is the extremists of the religion that use their religious texts to justify their bigotry...racism or anti gay.

 

[natstew]

It's a strawman because you said I said something I didn't say. What you just stated here has nothing to do with what you said I said and I didn't say. If you don't know what a strawman is, it'd take you about 30 seconds to learn by typing "strawman fallacy definition" into Google.

You must really be fun to watch TV with. When they talk about Saddam Hussein, you say, OMG, he gassed his own people, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, the Bataan Death march, that was horrible, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, Attila plundered and murdered all those villagers, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. OMG, the Holocaust, that's like the United States where gays do not have the right to the validation of government marriage. You're a one trick pony, I can't take you seriously you comparing slavery and gay marriage.

The problem with the slavery, bible discussion is the implication Christianity is somehow responsible is not established just because some people used the bible to rationalize slavery. Anyone can misuse the Bible, it doesn't make Christianity responsible for their actions. Oddly you get this concept when you say all Muslims are not responsible for the actions of the fundamentalist radicals.

Nobody implied Christianity was responsible for any of those. You went there, nobody else.

Correct.

Christian dogma was misappropriated by those who wished to justify colonialism and slavery in the past just as it’s being misappropriated by those today hostile to civil liberties for gay Americans.

They're not 'gay', they're queer.

 

[RKMBrown]

Wrong, I am not bigoted against Christians or anyone else. I have never blamed Christianity for any bigotry. You have to make that up because you have no facts or evidence.
Disagreeing with someone that is a Christian does not make one a bigot.

What have I ever done to be "personally bigoted" against Christians?
BTW, I am a Christian.

------------->>>>

Just because the groupies have a man crush on Robertson doesn't give him special status and he is under the exact same scrutiny as most all of us are with each and every employer. A & E were told by Robertson he would not be silenced so good for him. I do not agree with some of the things Robertson says but I admire him for telling them basically to go fuck themselves.
Well sort of . Willie and the rest of the brothers told him how easy it was dressing up make believe country with the ZZ Top beards and all staging the reality show pocketing 80 million in the process. Family told him to calm it down some long enough to make another 80 million. Phil agreed. And I do not fault them one bit for it as this is the free market and they were paid exactly what A & E contracted to pay them.
But the claims by the Christian Victim Association are bogus. This was all about sponsors selling their ads and protecting their market share.
Pro Business all the way.

To date no one has stopped Robertson from expressing his religious opinions any way he wants to.
Christian victim is a made up club.

Yeah you just like to "classify" massive groups of christians as telling people to go fuck themselves, and being money changers, groupies, liars, ... and all kinds of other vile shit you made up to support your bigotry against Christians in general.

 

[Pogo]

Wrong, I am not bigoted against Christians or anyone else. I have never blamed Christianity for any bigotry. You have to make that up because you have no facts or evidence.
Disagreeing with someone that is a Christian does not make one a bigot.

What have I ever done to be "personally bigoted" against Christians?
BTW, I am a Christian.

------------->>>>

To date no one has stopped Robertson from expressing his religious opinions any way he wants to.
Christian victim is a made up club.

Right there...

uh..... huh?

How in the world is that "bigotry"?

 

[RKMBrown]

Wrong, I am not bigoted against Christians or anyone else. I have never blamed Christianity for any bigotry. You have to make that up because you have no facts or evidence.
Disagreeing with someone that is a Christian does not make one a bigot.

What have I ever done to be "personally bigoted" against Christians?
BTW, I am a Christian.

------------->>>>

To date no one has stopped Robertson from expressing his religious opinions any way he wants to.
Christian victim is a made up club.

Right there...

uh..... huh?

How in the world is that "bigotry"?

How many Christians have to be CRUCIFIED before you'll recognize that Christians are no different than any of the other religious groups in history that have been attacked by opposing religious and a-religious groups? 1trillion?

Claiming that Christians are not being attacked and that it's a made up victimhood ... yeah you'd have to be a bigot to make that claim. Look at the not so subtle attacks he's made on christians in the other posts I quoted. The asshole is making out that the Robertson Family is a pile of shit, lying asshole fakes, that are just after money. One would have to be extremely bigoted against not just christians but southern people in general to make the vile statements he's made.

 

[Pogo]

------------->>>>



Right there...

uh..... huh?

How in the world is that "bigotry"?

How many Christians have to be CRUCIFIED before you'll recognize that Christians are no different than any of the other religious groups in history that have been attacked by opposing religious and a-religious groups? 1trillion?

Claiming that Christians are not being attacked and that it's a made up victimhood ... yeah you'd have to be a bigot to make that claim.

Do you not understand the meaning?

Full Definition of BIGOT

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

--

Calling out fake martyrdom is "bigotry"?

What's the title/topic of this thread?

 

[Pogo]

Look at the not so subtle attacks he's made on christians in the other posts I quoted. The asshole is making out that the Robertson Family is a pile of shit, lying asshole fakes, that are just after money. One would have to be extremely bigoted against not just christians but southern people in general to make the vile statements he's made.

Umm.... he IS a Southerner. And a Christian.

 

[RKMBrown]

uh..... huh?

How in the world is that "bigotry"?

How many Christians have to be CRUCIFIED before you'll recognize that Christians are no different than any of the other religious groups in history that have been attacked by opposing religious and a-religious groups? 1trillion?

Claiming that Christians are not being attacked and that it's a made up victimhood ... yeah you'd have to be a bigot to make that claim.

Do you not understand the meaning?

Full Definition of BIGOT

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

--

Calling out fake martyrdom is "bigotry"?

What's the title/topic of this thread?

What part of his quoted statements about the Robertsons and anyone that looks smells or acts like the Robertsons is confusing you? Where did you read "tolerance" for the Robertsons in his accusing them with religious and regional slurs on their character and anyone that may admire the Roberson family?

 

[tinydancer]

Geeze louise, this thread is still going?

Assholes vs vaginas and it's still going?

Not like we're on the edge of WWIII or anything But Phil is still up for being slammed for preferring a vagina over an asshole?

Cripes. No wonder the world is so screwed up.

 

[RKMBrown]

Yeah cause if you have a ZZ top beard you must be a piece of shit... Right there bigot against people with beards... this Gadawg73 is biggoted against so many different southern things I'm guessing he's one of those north eastern folk that look down on the south because they see themselves as members of a superior arian race ..

 

[RKMBrown]

Geeze louise, this thread is still going?

Assholes vs vaginas and it's still going?

Not like we're on the edge of WWIII or anything But Phil is still up for being slammed for preferring a vagina over an asshole?

Cripes. No wonder the world is so screwed up.

Well now we are including ZZ top beards... clearly he's to be ridiculed because of his beard too.

 

[Pogo]

How many Christians have to be CRUCIFIED before you'll recognize that Christians are no different than any of the other religious groups in history that have been attacked by opposing religious and a-religious groups? 1trillion?

Claiming that Christians are not being attacked and that it's a made up victimhood ... yeah you'd have to be a bigot to make that claim.

Do you not understand the meaning?

Full Definition of BIGOT

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

--

Calling out fake martyrdom is "bigotry"?

What's the title/topic of this thread?

What part of his quoted statements about the Robertsons and anyone that looks smells or acts like the Robertsons is confusing you? Where did you read "tolerance" for the Robertsons in his accusing them with religious and regional slurs on their character and anyone that may admire the Roberson family?

If you can read in less than billboard-size type, this for one:
>> A & E were told by Robertson he would not be silenced so good for him. I do not agree with some of the things Robertson says but I admire him for telling them basically to go fuck themselves. <<

Look, it's not even my quote but you're characterizing it as "bigotry" and you haven't made that case. You haven't even begun to. He sez Robertson is subject to the same rules we all are -- is that not the case?

 

[Pogo]

Yeah cause if you have a ZZ top beard you must be a piece of shit... Right there bigot against people with beards... this Gadawg73 is biggoted against so many different southern things I'm guessing he's one of those north eastern folk that look down on the south because they see themselves as members of a superior arian race ..

And where does he say this now?
Did you get into the mushrooms? Or is this just alcohol?

Btw the poster's from Georgia. Anyone who's read the thread knows that.

Wacko.

 

[RKMBrown]

Do you not understand the meaning?

Full Definition of BIGOT

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

--

Calling out fake martyrdom is "bigotry"?

What's the title/topic of this thread?

What part of his quoted statements about the Robertsons and anyone that looks smells or acts like the Robertsons is confusing you? Where did you read "tolerance" for the Robertsons in his accusing them with religious and regional slurs on their character and anyone that may admire the Roberson family?

If you can read in less than billboard-size type, this for one:
>> A & E were told by Robertson he would not be silenced so good for him. I do not agree with some of the things Robertson says but I admire him for telling them basically to go fuck themselves. <<

Look, it's not even my quote but you're characterizing it as "bigotry" and you haven't made that case. You haven't even begun to. He sez Robertson is subject to the same rules we all are -- is that not the case?

Yeah so why did you clip out all the biggoted, racist, anti-south, anti-christian comments?

Here let me show you what he did...

I admire Gadawg73 for his first statement. His ability to hide behind not so subtle bigoted comments by making a first statement praising them then following up with the "but" part where he then goes off and calls them scum of the earth is quite remarkable.

See you can quote my first sentence in that paragraph... and without reading the second sentence ... yeah, it's like that the paragraph means something entirely different when read in context.

 

[RKMBrown]

Yeah cause if you have a ZZ top beard you must be a piece of shit... Right there bigot against people with beards... this Gadawg73 is biggoted against so many different southern things I'm guessing he's one of those north eastern folk that look down on the south because they see themselves as members of a superior arian race ..

And where does he say this now?
Did you get into the mushrooms? Or is this just alcohol?

Btw the poster's from Georgia. Anyone who's read the thread knows that.

Wacko.

I quoted it dumb ass.

 

[Pogo]

Yeah cause if you have a ZZ top beard you must be a piece of shit... Right there bigot against people with beards... this Gadawg73 is biggoted against so many different southern things I'm guessing he's one of those north eastern folk that look down on the south because they see themselves as members of a superior arian race ..

And where does he say this now?
Did you get into the mushrooms? Or is this just alcohol?

Btw the poster's from Georgia. Anyone who's read the thread knows that.

Wacko.

I quoted it dumb ass.

Are you fucking drunk?
You quoted yourself. Sober up.

 

[RKMBrown]

And where does he say this now?
Did you get into the mushrooms? Or is this just alcohol?

Btw the poster's from Georgia. Anyone who's read the thread knows that.

Wacko.

I quoted it dumb ass.

Are you fucking drunk?
You quoted yourself. Sober up.

No dumb ass I quoted his comments, learn to fucking read.